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eternal slumber
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Posts: 219
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Layout: 100%
Gameplay: 100%

Gameplay will be like my other maps.
Degrassi chicks are hot!

http://timeofdeath.wrvids.com/doom/degrassi8.jpg
http://timeofdeath.wrvids.com/doom/degrassi7.jpg
http://timeofdeath.wrvids.com/doom/degrassi6.jpg
http://timeofdeath.wrvids.com/doom/degrassi5.jpg
http://timeofdeath.wrvids.com/doom/degrassi4.jpg
http://timeofdeath.wrvids.com/doom/degrassi3.jpg
http://timeofdeath.wrvids.com/doom/degrassi2.jpg
http://timeofdeath.wrvids.com/doom/degrassi1.jpg

Last edited by eternal slumber on 11-16-11 at 16:22

Old Post 09-08-11 22:18 #
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esselfortium
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Um... "interesting" title..

Map itself looks impressive; I like the enormous scale and winding designs that wrap around each other.

edit: Ah, that's better :P

Last edited by esselfortium on 09-08-11 at 23:14

Old Post 09-08-11 22:52 #
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The Green Herring
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Yeah, ToD, I'm sure this is going to be a nice level (albeit quite a hard one,) but, uh, you might want to change the title. This isn't 32in24, y'know. ;p

EDIT: I see you've done it already. That was quick!

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Last edited by The Green Herring on 09-08-11 at 23:14

Old Post 09-08-11 22:55 #
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Phobus
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Interesting! I envisage slaughter, for some reason :P

Old Post 09-08-11 23:21 #
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eternal slumber
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Aw, I even thought of a story for it. But ok, I'll just call it Degrassi. :)


spoiler - highlight to read:

You wake up and find yourself in a long hallway full of lockers. "Is this a school?" you think to yourself. You start walking around and notice the school is full of hot 18-24 year old girls. All of a sudden you see Nina Dobrev. You start walking towards her to get a bit closer and you see she's talking to Cassie Steele and Miriam MacDonald. "This is incredible", you think to yourself, "am I at Degrassi? ...how is this possible?" You continue walking towards them to ask them what's going on when a girl walks right into you. But, she doesn't hit you, she walks right through you. "Did that just happen?" you think to yourself. You finally reach the trio and ask them what's going on, but they ignore you. You raise your voice, but they still won't acknowledge you. You then try to tap on Nina's shoulder, but your hand goes right through her body, like you were a ghost. "What the hell is happening?" you say to yourself. You start running towards anybody you see and move your hand through their body, but it's almost as if everybody's a ghost... or you're a ghost. You walk back over to the trio and start taking off your clothes but they still don't see you. You figure, "while I'm invisibe around these hot girls, it would be a great time to masturbate". So you spend the next hour following those hot Degrassi girls around while masturbating. All of a sudden, Nina, Miriam and Cassie head to the gym changerooms for P.E. class. "Oh my dear god" you say to yourself, "this will be glorious". As they undress, you are about ready to explode, so you begin to climax. But, as you look down and expect to see semen, instead you see a pixelated green fog coming out of your penis. "Ahhhh!" you scream, and within seconds you find yourself in an abstract-looking red cavern with lava. There is a winding staircase with what looks to be monsters on it, but they're looking away from you. You realize you have a pistol in your hand and now your heart begins to sink. You begin to realize what you must do...

Old Post 09-08-11 23:36 #
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Phobus
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Right... I'd stick to mapping if I were you.

Old Post 09-08-11 23:38 #
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Joshy
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Hahaha, silly story, but still, haha.

Map's looking epic. Looking forward to it.

Old Post 09-09-11 05:09 #
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j4rio
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That takes care of intermission text.

Old Post 09-10-11 01:48 #
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Processingcontrol
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Looks like we have a story for the text-file! :)

Old Post 09-10-11 17:17 #
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eternal slumber
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The new area is a map I made a few months ago that I didn't finish, so I changed sector/linedef tags and rotated/pasted it into degrassi. I still haven't placed any monsters yet, but the gameplay is about 75% planned in my head.

Btw, there are 3 mandatory sr50 jumps on UV (only on UV, they are easier sr40 jumps on lower difficulties). They're not hard, you just gotta sr50 and line up the jump properly and you'll make it everytime. Peeps aren't gonna hate on me for that, are they?

http://timeofdeath.wrvids.com/doom/degrassi9.jpg

Old Post 09-21-11 19:00 #
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DeathevokatioN
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As Joshy said this map looks badass, that story is quite epic as well haha.

Old Post 09-21-11 20:19 #
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Processingcontrol
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eternal slumber said:
Peeps aren't gonna hate on me for that, are they?

Yes they will. Get those jumps the fuck out of there.

Old Post 09-21-11 21:47 #
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[WH]-Wilou84
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eternal slumber said:
3 mandatory sr50 jumps on UV

It's nice to have you on board, and this layout looks cool, but please get rid of those. This is Community Chest 4, have mercy :)

Old Post 09-21-11 22:03 #
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Mithran Denizen
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I only use a SR50-conducive config for about 40% of the time I play, and from what I gather, there are plenty of people who don't even know how to do it at all. While I don't really care either way, I envision enough people bitching about your map being unfinishable that you should perhaps make the SR50 stuff non-mandatory.

Old Post 09-21-11 22:33 #
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Processingcontrol
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I don't think SR50 should even be used for secrets. It breaks maps in the original doom, and it may even break some of the maps in this project. You should at least change it to SR40, which I think most people do naturally.

Old Post 09-21-11 22:58 #
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eternal slumber
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Aw, you guys are no fun. The sr50 jumps are only on UV. :P

SR50 is mega easy. Line up the jump diagonally, like if you are strafe running (doom2.wad map03 secret area). Now hold down ALT, then press up arrow and left/right arrow at the same time. OMG you are sr50'ing! :D

Old Post 09-21-11 23:44 #
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Processingcontrol
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eternal slumber said:
SR50 is mega easy. Line up the jump diagonally, like if you are strafe running (doom2.wad map03 secret area). Now hold down ALT, then press up arrow and left/right arrow at the same time. OMG you are sr50'ing! :D


I always use ALT to strafe; "," and "." are too awkward to use.

Old Post 09-22-11 00:01 #
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yellowmadness54
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this looks amazing!

Cant wait for the finished result.

Old Post 09-22-11 00:26 #
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Phobus
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I have to admit, I never fully understood what SR50 and SR40 were, or what the difference was. As I've been using eternal slumber's described technique as a way to get around maps faster for years anyway, I think I can handle it.

Old Post 09-22-11 10:27 #
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DooMer 4ever
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Mandatory SR50 jumps doesn't sound like a good idea to me. I'd guess mostly just speedrunners use it and majority of casual players either never use it or don't even know how it works.

Then again, I have a feeling the difficulty level of this level might be well over what a casual Doom player can handle anyway... :D

Old Post 09-22-11 10:42 #
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RjY
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Ultimately it is up to the author, since it is his time he is giving freely to make maps for the rest of us. If he wants to put in strafe50 jumps on UV, that is his prerogative.

I suggest if he does keep the jumps, that a note be added to the final text file pointing out the necessity of strafe50 jumps in the map, possibly with a link to a page that explains the term (e.g. http://doomwiki.org/wiki/Straferunning)


Processingcontrol said:
Yes they will. Get those jumps the fuck out of there.
The tone of this post is a strong argument for keeping them in.

Old Post 09-22-11 15:08 #
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Phml
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SR50 jumps bore me ; actually, make that most jumping puzzles (including traditional IoS fights), but SR50 is especially bad as it requires the highest level of precision as well as of metagaming, whereas other jumping puzzles designed with normal forward speed in mind can be made easier through SR40/SR50/wallrunning/rocketjumping.

It can be hard in the same way that pixel hunting in oldschool adventure games is challenging... Through the limitations of improper feedback and controls. It doesn't bring value, just frustration, and ultimately breaks immersion ; you're done being a marine fighting demons in hell, you're a player object trying to optimize movement in a game engine by looking at texture pixels and exploiting engine bugs. You're running through an obstacle course designed to challenge your skills rather than playing a video game designed to entertain you.

I find difficulty that comes from overcoming shortcomings to be generally pointless. If I want to play with a handicap, I can just tie one hand behind my back, close one eye, play keyboard only. Plenty of options that don't require making the game less enjoyable for other players who just want to wind down and shoot stuff.

Obviously some people will disagree, obviously some people have a blast doing that stuff, but then, is is all that appropriate or even needed for a community project supposed to reach most doomers? This being a ToD map it's likely to be difficult and filled to the brim with monsters, which will already make a fair amount of people run away, and adding a few tricky jumps to that almost seems like trying to purposefully trim down the audience even further. The author is free to do as he wishes, and so are the players, by not playing or dismissing the map if they dislike it, by voicing concern if certain features are guaranteed to lessen their enjoyment of the map significantly.

Not that I really have a say or a conclusion, I'm merely using the occasion to jump on a soapbox and rationalise why I really dislike jumping in Doom - as in Doom/Boom without mouselook ; advanced source ports that allow more freedom with the perspective aren't as bad, although the complete lack of body feedback and weird physics remain significant hurdles to an enjoyable experience.

Do those 3 SR50 jumps, or even the SR40 ones on lower difficulties, truly add value to the map? That is the one question that should be asked. The issue is going to be divisive, regardless of how right or wrong people who dislike it may or may not be. If it's critical or even important to the map flow and absolutely couldn't be changed for anything else, maybe it ought to stay in, but if it's there just because, there would seem to be little point to having these jumps at all.

As an aside, the Doom2 Map03 secret jump can be done by running forward relatively easily. An example of an acceptable jump in my book. ;)

Last edited by Phml on 09-22-11 at 16:15

Old Post 09-22-11 16:02 #
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j4rio
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I loathe jumping, so keep em.

Old Post 09-22-11 16:20 #
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eternal slumber
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I think I'll put in a switch that makes the jumps easier (no sr50), but pressing the switch will require backtracking and take more time than just sr50'ing the jumps.

EDIT: I didn't see your post Phml. About whether the jumps add value to the map: for me it does cuz I like jumping in Doom :) Sure, the jumps could be replaced with a bridge or something, but I wanted to have a couple jumps in the map just for fun.

EDIT2: I always thought you had to press forward/turn/strafe direction/strafe on to do SR50, but yesterday I just did forward/turn/strafe on and it kinda felt like sr50. Is there a way to see what the player speed is? Like the vid_fps and idmypos commands in zdoom?

Last edited by eternal slumber on 09-22-11 at 16:50

Old Post 09-22-11 16:20 #
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RjY
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Phml: I think removing the jumps would be exactly the kind of "defanging" you were fearing a couple of weeks ago ;-)

Good post, though. If ToD's plan to add a switch works out, the jumps essentially become a speedrunning shortcut, which seems fair enough.

Old Post 09-22-11 21:05 #
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Phml
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It can certainly be read that way. "Everyone who drives faster than me is a maniac, everyone who drives slower than me is an idiot" and all that. ;)

I don't think my two positions are incompatible, although my wording might have been unfortunate - I was mostly worried about the monster count and difficulty of fights being toned down to a point that it might make gameplay less interesting, seeing as ToD's usual maps are almost always fantastic on that front. Several people have expressed disinterest with CC3 Map29, which is my own favorite from the CC series, and I spoke with that in mind.


I think I'll put in a switch that makes the jumps easier (no sr50), but pressing the switch will require backtracking and take more time than just sr50'ing the jumps.



Sounds like a perfectly reasonable solution. :)

Old Post 09-22-11 22:32 #
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Hirogen2
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eternal slumber said:
Aw, you guys are no fun. The sr50 jumps are only on UV. :P

SR50 is mega easy. Line up the jump diagonally, like if you are strafe running (doom2.wad map03 secret area). Now hold down ALT, then press up arrow and left/right arrow at the same time. OMG you are sr50'ing! :D


How does it map to WASD+mouselook?

Old Post 09-23-11 17:48 #
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eternal slumber
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W + A or D + ALT (strafe on) + slowly move mouse right or left at a constant speed

Old Post 09-23-11 20:41 #
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Hirogen2
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Overloading the mouse with both look and strafe complicates the matter of course, which is probably why nobody likes doing SR50 natively. (prboom-plus has a SR50 cheat, though.)

Old Post 09-24-11 11:22 #
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eternal slumber
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Some people use right mouse button for strafe-on, I use left alt with SZXC (my thumb on left alt). It might be easier to line up the jump first with mouse, then press all necessary keys with keyboard-only at the same time.

I've been working on the map the past several nights instead of rehearsing music. I have to finish a few small areas, add the final puzzle, change the linedefs in the ending mansion/museum, then start placing things and playtest.

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Old Post 09-26-11 18:13 #
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