The card that will make Doom 3 take it in the ass

Behold! The Sapphire ATI Radeon 9800 Pro! This is the card I'll be picking up. Comes with the full version of RTCW and Soldier of fortune 2 as well! BOOYAH grandma, booyah...

Yada yada, all about the graphics, whatever.

AndrewB said:

Yada yada, all about the graphics, whatever.

People weren't kidding when they said your a fuckin idiot.

Uh, did you really need to start a new thread to tell us that you're getting yet another new and better video card?

Alientank said:

People weren't kidding when they said your a fuckin idiot.

Same core as the original model, without as good a heatsink ;). I like the card though im not fuckin with you. its just the same though.

sniperfrommars1 said:

Same core as the original model, without as good a heatsink ;). I like the card though im not fuckin with you. its just the same though.

MMMMMM nope.

1) F-buffer

2) Different cache design

3) 2.1 versions of pixel shaders and smoothshader.

heh... the Radeon 9800pro... that was a disappointment. A marginal performance jump over the 9700pro.

Alientank said:

People weren't kidding when they said your a fuckin idiot.

That comment wasn't justified, not at all m8...

Radeon 9800 offers the following improvements, both in the software and the hardware aspects over Radeon 9700:

1. F-Buffer
2. Better cache design (not sure exactly what they did over there, but i think they refined it a bit).
3. Better drivers (you won't notice a big difference with R9700, unless you have the 9800).
4. Higher core/memory clock speeds.

The Smooth shader you pointed out is nothing worth mentioning... the version is still 2.0, nothing except F-Buffer was added to the package, and calling them 2.1, just because of the F-Buffer is a bit unfair, considering that they're not part of the DX9 specifications.

The next generation of GPUs would bring PS/VS 3.0 support to the table, but contrary to what many think, PS/VS 3.0 specifications are defined in the DX9 specs, so basically NV40/R400 will all comply fully to the specifications put up by DX9.

DX10 is supposed to come out together with Microsoft's next-gen OS, codenamed Longhorn, slated to be released in 2005 and would unify both the pixel/vertex processing together (i.e. unified instruction model, etc).

Don't get me wrong, first, support for PS/VS 3.0 is needed and afterwise, optimisations should take place as well, but in the long run, only NV50/R500 would target DX10, considering that it's barely in the design table yet...

Dima said:

That comment wasn't justified, not at all m8...

Radeon 9800 offers the following improvements, both in the software and the hardware aspects over Radeon 9700:

1. F-Buffer
2. Better cache design (not sure exactly what they did over there, but i think they refined it a bit).

What was changed is the Z-cache design. Basically bigger and more efficient.

AndrewB said:

Yada yada, all about the graphics, whatever.

Hey AndrewB, why don't you shut your mouth until you actually PLAY Doom 3. You're always bitching about the gameplay WITHOUT EVEN PLAYING IT. You're ignorant and bothersome, and my feeling is if that you don't like Doom 3, don't post in the Doom 3 sections anymore. I think the only reason you post in here is because you know that you're annoying people, you're a troll disgused as a goody-two-shoes. Everything you say is either :

A) Negative
OR
B) Stupid

I've never seen you say anything positive and some things you say are pretty lame, like how game developers need more limits. In case you didn't know, they're still pretty limited by many things, such as how games now require a top-notch system to run. Not everyone has a fast and powerful computer, some people are still stuck on systems that can barely run Quake 2. Also, they are limited to the fact that not everyone has a DVD-Drive, so they have to release their games on many CDs (IMO, Doom 3 should be shipped in two versions, one would be a DVD and the other would be multiple CDs). Anyway, in closing, AndrewB, if you don't like Doom 3, then please don't post in the portion of these forums dedicated to it.

Alientank said:

MMMMMM nope.

1) F-buffer

2) Different cache design

3) 2.1 versions of pixel shaders and smoothshader.

FOr those dumbasses who havent tried the card heres the scoop. It does alot of things, ALOT better than the 9700. Its really good at pixel, shading, is extremely easy to overclock, and runs like a sumbitch. The 9700 was a great card. the 9800 owns it's ass. I dont know of any program that actually exploits the cards capabilities. It sure runs the hell out of the alpha of doom, so it should smoke, the final as well. So that was kind of his point was it not? ANd to add Im merely adding to what alientank said. This is a tech discussion, not some bullshit flamebait

well scratch the 9700 for me then, im-a gettin the 9800. probably. oh god i dont know what to get.

My GF4 Ti4280 will do just fine

sniperfrommars1 said:

Its really good at pixel, shading,

There is no pixel, and then shading. I think you mean pixel shading

BBG said:

Hey AndrewB, why don't you shut your mouth until you actually PLAY Doom 3. You're always bitching about the gameplay WITHOUT EVEN PLAYING IT. You're ignorant and bothersome, and my feeling is if that you don't like Doom 3, don't post in the Doom 3 sections anymore.

THE GAME ISNT OUT YET GENIUS!

So its ok for everybody else to say the game is gonna be fantastic without playing it, but if you have doubts you must be "negative" or a "troll"

Since when is doomworld.com a site for people who like doom and everything even remotley related to it? So all of the sudden anyone with anything negative to say about anything isnt allowed on a forum where its discussed?

Wobbo said:

THE GAME ISNT OUT YET GENIUS!

So its ok for everybody else to say the game is gonna be fantastic without playing it, but if you have doubts you must be "negative" or a "troll"

Since when is doomworld.com a site for people who like doom and everything even remotley related to it? So all of the sudden anyone with anything negative to say about anything isnt allowed on a forum where its discussed?

I think what he was getting at was don't insult something you don't even know much about or have given a chance before. If you couldn't figure that out, your a moron.

Alientank said:

I think what he was getting at was don't insult something you don't even know much about or have given a chance before. If you couldn't figure that out, your a moron.

What, he isn't allowed to have an opinion?

Alientank said:

There is no pixel, and then shading. I think you mean pixel shading

I did. Too much mountain dew makes my typing suck ;).

gatewatcher said:

What, he isn't allowed to have an opinion?

He's allowed to have an opinion, I'm allowed to question it.

I've seen benchmarks where the 9800 runs 15-20% faster than the 9700 (IIRC it's even higher in Q3), so don't let the fact that the name is only 100 higher fool you :)

Im clocking mine at 450 mhz, with no artifacts, and stock, heatsink, with just air cooling. Its a beautiful thing.

BBG said:

AndrewB is bad.

Wow! I never thought id see BBG freak out like that.

Even though im a firm NV30 hater, I have to say the fastest card to run the alpha atm is the FX 5800 Ultra, not that I reccomend it. Remember its doing the game in 32bit {EDIT: its doing it in 16, not 32} precision for the shaders, as well as various driver hacks im sure (You say to yourself, why waste time on an alpha, well some sites use it as a bench, and nvidia does like driver hacks). I'd take the full ARB2 path myself, where the 9800 Pro & 9700 Pro completly own everything else.

On topic,
Congrats on your card, you'll enjoy it :D

Goat well scratch the 9700 for me then, im-a gettin the 9800. probably. oh god i dont know what to get.

Depends when your buying the card. If its at this moment, I'd get a 9700 Pro, unless you have the money..then go for the 9800 Pro. Else, wait for ATI's enhanced R350, due out a bit after NV35 I'd suspect (This summer).

acording to my source its only a 9700 pro with difernt drivers
http://216.239.39.120/translate_c?hl=de&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&langpair=de%7Cen&u=http://www.dark-tweaker.com/9700softwaremod.htm&prev=/language_tools

Radea` said:

Even though im a firm NV30 hater, I have to say the fastest card to run the alpha atm is the FX 5800 Ultra, not that I reccomend it. Remember its doing the game in 32bit {EDIT: its doing it in 16, not 32} precision for the shaders, as well as various driver hacks im sure (You say to yourself, why waste time on an alpha, well some sites use it as a bench, and nvidia does like driver hacks). I'd take the full ARB2 path myself, where the 9800 Pro & 9700 Pro completly own everything else.

On topic,
Congrats on your card, you'll enjoy it :D

Depends when your buying the card. If its at this moment, I'd get a 9700 Pro, unless you have the money..then go for the 9800 Pro. Else, wait for ATI's enhanced R350, due out a bit after NV35 I'd suspect (This summer).

Try turning some AA and AF on, the fx5800 ultra slows down BIG time, 9800 pro doesn't. Also, the 9800 pro is going to stay near performance until you start cranking up the detail levels, that's when it can truely stretch it's wings and show off it's power over all other cards. I'm not getting the R350, because those cards are NOT going to be out this summer, expect a fall/winter release. They haven't even gotten the 256 mb 9800 pro out yet. I will be picking up my 9800 pro in a few months when I build my pc. Right now I'm trying to find a company with a 2100+ tbred B AIUHB I need that stepping.

Alientank, I know all about it. But since Doom3 has a special NV30 mode for 16bit shaders, it stays above the R300/350 all the time (Well, as long as the NV30 isnt the AA methods that actually remove jaggies...see 8XS, which doesnt run quite too well). Sure, its only by about .5FPS when 4X FSAA is used, but im just pointing out the fact that the FX is a tad faster, even if its about 3 FPS more in the best case.

Again, I'd stress the fact that the 5800U is a POS, and I would not recommend it for anything, unless you want to run color-wheel demos demonstrating theoretical AF quality ;).

I'm not getting the R350, because those cards are NOT going to be out this summer, expect a fall/winter release.

Excuse me? R350 is a 9800/Pro. R350 will also be the 9900/Pro. Your thinking of the R400.

The R350 has the following over the R300:

1. F-buffer
2. hardware refinements (better yields)
3. redesigned AA/AF engine
4. Better driver path, soon to be eliminated (R300 & R350 will run same path) when the CATALYST 3.3's make it through WHQL

[Edit]
I'll also stress the fact, again, that If you run ARB2 on both cards (In Doom), the R300 & R350 perform at about twice the speed of an FX, without FSAA & AF even. The lead only lengthens after that.

[Edit 2]
As well 4X FSAA ATI vs. 4X FSAA nVIDIA isnt a comparison. ATI's method actually removes jaggies.

Also, I'll congratulate you on your purchase yet again, the best card there is ;).

Radea` said:

Alientank, I know all about it. But since Doom3 has a special NV30 mode for 16bit shaders, it stays above the R300/350 all the time (Well, as long as the NV30 isnt the AA methods that actually remove jaggies...see 8XS, which doesnt run quite too well). Sure, its only by about .5FPS when 4X FSAA is used, but im just pointing out the fact that the FX is a tad faster, even if its about 3 FPS more in the best case.

Again, I'd stress the fact that the 5800U is a POS, and I would not recommend it for anything, unless you want to run color-wheel demos demonstrating theoretical AF quality ;).


Excuse me? R350 is a 9800/Pro. R350 will also be the 9900/Pro. Your thinking of the R400.

The R350 has the following over the R300:

1. F-buffer
2. hardware refinements (better yields)
3. redesigned AA/AF engine
4. Better driver path, soon to be eliminated (R300 & R350 will run same path) when the CATALYST 3.3's make it through WHQL

[Edit]
I'll also stress the fact, again, that If you run ARB2 on both cards (In Doom), the R300 & R350 perform at about twice the speed of an FX, without FSAA & AF even. The lead only lengthens after that.

[Edit 2]
As well 4X FSAA ATI vs. 4X FSAA nVIDIA isnt a comparison. ATI's method actually removes jaggies.

Also, I'll congratulate you on your purchase yet again, the best card there is ;).

You said what I didnt feel like typing. let morons beleive what they want. lol. The 9800 gets an overclock without artifacts, almost a hundred mhz higher than the 9700. Hows that for different?

Radea, I meant the R400, fucked it up there.

AndrewB said:

Yada yada, all about the graphics, whatever.

I'm sorry, but this is too much. I mean, what else could you want out of the video card you are about to buy? Seriously man, do they pay you to act in such an idiotic way?

I'd have to agree, Graphics are the whole point of a video card in case you haven't noticed AndrewB.

AlienTank: Awesome card :D. Although the Hercules video card looks very damn cool as well. It's on a Blue board, with a blue fan and Blue lights on top of the fan making it glow. Damn cool.