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Glaice
formerly Mr. Chris


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http://store.steampowered.com/app/9050/

Yes, you have to buy the inferior BFG Edition, buy the Id Superpack for $99 or hunt down a physical copy on Ebay/Amazon/etc.

Anyone else find this a bit suspicious? I did do a search showing it $19.99 but only the $99.99 choice being on the page. I find this option quite alienating for those who do not want to buy the BFG Edition at all after seeing all the flak and lashback Id is getting.

The moment they pull this shit with Doom and Doom 2 (which has not been affected on their store pages on Steam), then all hope is lost with Id at least for me.

Last edited by Glaice on Oct 20 2012 at 05:12

Old Post Oct 20 2012 04:55 #
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Sodaholic
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Mr. Chris said:
after seeing all the flak and lashback Id is getting.

Just a bunch of whiny shits grasping at straws for reasons for why "OMG ID JUMPED THE SHARK".

Yes, the changes made to the original Doom 1 and 2 kinda suck, but I doubt they had very much choice in the matter. It was either comply with Germany and the Red Cross Association, or don't release the game. I will concede that they did a pretty half assed job with editing the Wolfenstein content, they could've done much better, and the pill graphic is pretty poorly drawn.

This does suck that they're not selling the original by itself anymore, this actually is something to get mad about, unlike the people who can't shut up about how much they hate id and their newer products.

Old Post Oct 20 2012 05:06 #
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Glaice
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One of those "whiny shits" also includes me, mind you..

I don't think completely censoring the Wolfenstein maps EXCEPT for Germany was necessary and the entire Red Cross shenanigans is bullshit for completely other reasons as well.

Old Post Oct 20 2012 05:14 #
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Fuzzyfireball
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Wooow. What a bullshit move.

Fuck your BFG edition, let people have a choice!

Edit: Looks like Final Doom met the same fate.

Double: No longer get Master Levels with Doom 2.

Last edited by Fuzzyfireball on Oct 20 2012 at 10:39

Old Post Oct 20 2012 08:00 #
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DoomUK
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You make it sound like the original version of Doom 3 basically isn't available any more, à la the original versions of Star Wars. It sucks for people who only have Steam as an option for buying games, but you can still buy brand new physical copies of it.

As for Final Doom, we're talking about a 16-year-old game. Steam only made it convenient to procure a (legal) copy of it, but it's not impossible to find a standalone copy elsewhere.

Last edited by DoomUK on Oct 20 2012 at 09:20

Old Post Oct 20 2012 09:12 #
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Sodaholic
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Wow, Final Doom and Master Levels too? What the fuck? Not cool. I think we can rule out Valve doing this, since they wouldn't want to do anything against their wished or anything without their permission. They were probably just following orders. id probably approved of this, but it's possible that Zenimax and/or Bethesda have a hand in this as well, and may have well even been the instigators.

Old Post Oct 20 2012 09:31 #
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Fuzzyfireball
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DoomUK said:
You make it sound like the original version of Doom 3 basically isn't available any more, à la the original versions of Star Wars. It sucks for people who only have Steam as an option for buying games, but you can still buy brand new physical copies of it.

As for Final Doom, we're talking about a 16-year-old game. Steam only made it convenient to procure a (legal) copy of it, but it's not impossible to find a standalone copy elsewhere.

I barely use Steam, but this is still shitty for the people that do use it. It makes no sense and it seems very greedy to me.

Master levels used to come with Doom 2, $10. Now you only get Doom 2 and Master Levels is standalone. Now you gotta pay $99 if you want it? Same with Final Doom and Doom 3. Can't wrap my head around this decision at all.

Edit: Also, Final Doom is $20 on their website, that's still a pretty shitty deal.

Last edited by Fuzzyfireball on Oct 20 2012 at 10:02

Old Post Oct 20 2012 09:39 #
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Caffeine Freak
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Ultimate Doom and Doom 2 are still available as stand alone. I would think this was a way of getting customers new to the Doom series to buy the BFG edition, but if so, it makes no sense to take off Final Doom and Master levels, as they aren't included in the BFG edition. So really, I would *think* they would do the reverse, and take Ultimate Doom and Doom 2 off the list and leave the other two.

This really isn't making sense. But hopefully, they'll re-appear once the BFG edition has been out a while and the price goes down a little.

Old Post Oct 20 2012 10:15 #
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Gez
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This is lousy. Most of the criticism against BFG Edition could be brushed off with "at least it doesn't replace the original game"; but by no longer selling it, it sorta does.

Killing off the Doom Pack Complete was dumb too.

And I can't explain the removal of Final Doom and Master Levels from sale. They're not even included in BFG edition.

Old Post Oct 20 2012 10:28 #
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Fuzzyfireball
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I didn't even realize Doom pack was removed. What a shame this is becoming...

Old Post Oct 20 2012 10:37 #
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DoomUK
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Fuzzyfireball said:
I barely use Steam, but this is still shitty for the people that do use it. It makes no sense and it seems very greedy to me.

I use Steam regularly, and it's not the end of the world if I can't find something on there. There's an overreaction going on in here that needs to be tempered.

Old Post Oct 20 2012 10:38 #
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Sodaholic
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DoomUK said:
I use Steam regularly, and it's not the end of the world if I can't find something on there. There's an overreaction going on in here that needs to be tempered.

Thing is, it's the intent that counts, not how much damage they've actually managed to do that can't be easily circumvented, so id is still clearly in the wrong. Their primary channel of distribution these days is Steam, and it's very clear what their intent is; forcing the player to buy the BFG edition to raise sales for that instead of the cheaper and older alternatives. id wants to force sales of the newer product that just went gold because they have to answer to their publisher, Zenimax won't be pleased if one of their underling's games aren't selling as well as they promised, since that cuts down on their profits.

I absolutely hate that they're doing this, but there is some rationale behind it. I wish they wouldn't resort to doing this shit to meet the expectations of Zenimax, but it's business, unfortunately.

Last edited by Sodaholic on Oct 20 2012 at 14:10

Old Post Oct 20 2012 11:31 #
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Avoozl
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I would think Bethesda is deciding all this, I highly doubt John Carmack would willingly do this if it were up to him.

Old Post Oct 20 2012 13:16 #
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printz
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Did you seriously NOT see this coming? The name "BFG Edition" sounds very marketable, and unfortunately the things that got removed or "improved" were not popular among the idiot crowd. Thanks for invalidating my reasons for preferring Doom 3, jerks [not necessarily Doomworld in particular]. Now I have to look like an old fart that uses a version no longer in sales to justify why I like Doom 3. I wonder if this bfg edition release would have been averted if "No rest for the living" didn't exist.

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Old Post Oct 20 2012 14:07 #
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Gez
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Doom 3 and Resurrection of Evil aren't on the id store either.

Old Post Oct 20 2012 14:15 #
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printz
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Newest here is Quake 1, so yeah.

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Old Post Oct 20 2012 14:40 #
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Badboy
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for the record, with german ip on http://store.steampowered.com/app/9050/ i can buy single doom 3. it says "Gewaltgemindert: Gewaltgeminderte Version - nur auf Deutsch verfügbar". Translated "less violent, only in german language". oh boy.

Old Post Oct 20 2012 15:02 #
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hardcore_gamer
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Ugh, this sounds a bit like what George Lucas did with Stars Wars where he forces anyone who wants to buy Star Wars to buy the special edition.

I don't get the point of this.

Is there any reason for why they decided to remove the original from STEAM besides "cus we want you to play ze best version"???

Old Post Oct 20 2012 16:56 #
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Glaice
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I'm glad I got Final Doom and Master Levels way before this because this move just pisses me the hell off. What the fuck.

Tell me, what use is it supporting Id (and Bethesda) anymore?

Old Post Oct 20 2012 17:03 #
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kristus
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It's still available here.
EDIT: My mistake, it's only available in a package.

Old Post Oct 20 2012 17:21 #
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Gez
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hardcore_gamer said:
Is there any reason for why they decided to remove the original from STEAM besides "cus we want you to play ze best version"???

It's not entirely removed; but it's now only included in a $100 compilation package.

The idea was probably that in doing so, it wouldn't compete with the BFG edition. It's artificial, because all the people who would have bought the normal Doom 3 now are instead forced to get the BFG edition, and it'll help make it look like the BFG edition was more successful than it truly was.

Old Post Oct 20 2012 17:38 #
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Whoo
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Times like this make me glad I still have the Doom Collector's Edition from 2003, as well as my copy of Doom 3.

Old Post Oct 20 2012 18:05 #
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Enjay
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Whoo said:
Times like this make me glad I still have the Doom Collector's Edition from 2003, as well as my copy of Doom 3.

In the not too distant future, when all software and access to it is controlled remotely and electronically and people never have their own hard copy, if a software distributor wants to change the software that you use, they will be able to do so whether the user wants it to happen or not.

Old Post Oct 20 2012 18:35 #
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chungy
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Gez said:
The idea was probably that in doing so, it wouldn't compete with the BFG edition. It's artificial, because all the people who would have bought the normal Doom 3 now are instead forced to get the BFG edition, and it'll help make it look like the BFG edition was more successful than it truly was.

Which seems silly to me, as I find it hard to believe there's a great number of people that have wanted Doom 3 over the past 8 years, yet never bought it.

Still, I suppose new players being curious what the original was like is a valid reason.

Enjay said:
In the not too distant future, when all software and access to it is controlled remotely and electronically and people never have their own hard copy, if a software distributor wants to change the software that you use, they will be able to do so whether the user wants it to happen or not.

Already happening, but moreso to the point, the implications for the future can be even more disasterous.

Old Post Oct 20 2012 19:42 #
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phi108
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Enjay said:
If a software distributor wants to change the software that you use, they will be able to do so whether the user wants it to happen or not.


It's happened with valve's Source engine games, and I hate them for it. Broken mipmapping and other graphical errors plague Half Life 2 since they updated the engine to a newer version (plus many mods were broken), while the old engine ran flawlessly. I could have avoided it by checking "never keep this game up to date", but that wouldn't have lasted, especially not on a 2nd computer. They don't understand how to correctly handle updates.

Old Post Oct 20 2012 19:57 #
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Eris Falling
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I got Doom Pack Complete just two months ago. Pretty close call.

I'm sure £76/$100 is great for what you get, but that was really a giant middle finger from whoever had this idea, to which I send one back.

And in my case, I can't even run most of the stuff

Computer does not run Doom 3 (another one does, thankfully), so all id tech 4 games can be ruled out by that logic. So can Rage for that matter.

If id tech 4 doesn't run at all, then I can be pretty guaranteed id tech 3 will be pretty poor. 2 might be ok.

and there will be Steam Users who didn't get the Doom Pack Complete, and have a similar technical situation. Is that sort of price really worth it, then?

Old Post Oct 20 2012 21:28 #
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Gez
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You can still get Heretic + Hexen Collection, though.

Old Post Oct 20 2012 21:54 #
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Fuzzyfireball
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The more I think about it, the more it makes sense they want people to focus on BFG Edition and only BFG Edition.

You can't upset the master with poor sales and wasted money...

Old Post Oct 20 2012 22:40 #
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Caffeine Freak
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Imagine that everyone, a business is actually doing something to help get more of a return on a new product. Shit's far out.

And while I don't like it either, I'm not surprised by it.

Like I said, I'd imagine most of these products will re-appear in the Steam store after BFG edition has been out a while. Hopefully, anyways.

Old Post Oct 21 2012 00:14 #
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Caffeine Freak
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Also:

Avoozl said:
I would think Bethesda is deciding all this, I highly doubt John Carmack would willingly do this if it were up to him.

Carmack doesn't have much of a hand on the business aspect of id. More likely that it's Bethesda and/or people like Todd Hollenshead calling these shots.

Old Post Oct 21 2012 00:27 #
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