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Piper Maru
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Will this be completed before Doom 4?!

Old Post 08-18-13 03:41 #
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Caffeine Freak
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Average said:
I know this is for vanilla D3 but will it work with the BFG edition? I have no idea where my retail copy of D3 is!


I don't think so, last I knew, all the modding tools had been removed from the BFG edition. I don't even see how we could port over if we wanted to.


Piper Maru said:
Will this be completed before Doom 4?!


Is that a rhetorical question?

Old Post 08-18-13 06:35 #
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DooM_RO
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Oculus Rift implementation might not require Doom 3 BFG after all. Vireio Perception is an opensource software that makes the oculus work with other games. Perhaps Vanilla Doom 3 could also be adapted for modding purposes? Please take this into consideration, I would really like to play Phobos with the Rift when it comes out.

Old Post 08-18-13 16:04 #
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Shaviro
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DooM_RO said:
I've already read that :P, very interesting but I wish I could see a before/after comparison shot. How long do you expect this phase to last, is it reasonable to expect a release this year?


Well a shot might come up one of these days :P
As for this year, no. Definitely not. We're trying for next year, but we're not that focused on release dates really. I used to think we just had to release around 2008, because 4 years of development time would be crazy. Then when we kinda restarted the thing in 2009, Doom3 was already antiquated and completely out of influence, so all we had to worry about was Doom4. You'd want to ride on the Doom hype surrounding that. Well, now nobody can be completely certain we are ever going to see that, so.

All in all we're just trying to make the best mod we can and while none of us wants to work on the project forever and keep rehashing things, we don't feel any pressure to rush a release. Doom3 couldn't possibly become any less important than it is now, Doom4 isn't around to "invalidate" our work with a supirior Doom vision. We're taking our time and doing it right. Also, we're currently just 3 guys so it takes some time :)


Average said:
I know this is for vanilla D3 but will it work with the BFG edition? I have no idea where my retail copy of D3 is!


Well, they did release the source code for the BFG version, but we don't have the manpower to perform anything like that. Ideally we'd want the mod to be out for Doom3, Doom3+RoE (only possible configuration right now) and Doom3 BFG, but that's unrealistic right now.


Avoozl said:
I guess this mod will most likely be short, hopefully as long as the RoE expansion.


I guess we could guarantee 6 hours of playtime, but that always goes awry ;)


Piper Maru said:
Will this be completed before Doom 4?!


What, do you know when Doom 4 comes out? :D

Joking aside, it's tempting to say yes, but I don't know when either project comes out so it's anybody's guess. I could certainly forgive anyone for thinking that a project that's been going for 9 years (discounting the 2009 change) isn't likely to come out. It is though. No doubt. We've come very far.

Old Post 08-19-13 10:09 #
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DooM_RO
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Yeah, D3 is kinda irrelevant now but what if you could get Id do support you? They could possibly make it a free downloadable on their site or even an official xpac if you both agree. I know it sounds hard but if you're persistent enough you might get their support. If you can't reach them by e-mail, you could try at Quakecon (and give them a CD of your mod if it's already out or a pre-release if not). I think they would have reason to support you because the Doom brand - although legendary - is kind of fading these days so if they supported you they would get free publicity. If even that doesn't work, you could show it to as many people as possible at BYOC or try to reach a few gaming magazines/sites to spread the word.

Old Post 08-19-13 10:38 #
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Shaviro
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News. Screenshots. Progress!

Old Post 09-17-13 16:33 #
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Archi
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Glad to see progress. I'm still looking forward to this.

Old Post 09-17-13 16:47 #
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Touchdown
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Indeed. Keep up the good work out there. I could use a quality DOOM 3 mapset.

Old Post 09-17-13 17:40 #
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Chris Hansen
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Looks absolutely fantastic. I'm rooting for you!

Old Post 09-17-13 17:54 #
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DooM_RO
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Wow, this is quite astounding, I wish I had the capabilities to help you somehow.I've always wanted to learn how to map for Doom 3. Sadly, I am only just working on my first Doom map, and the scope of it is quite huge for a beginner map but it's coming along slowly but surely. I am quite stuck at the moment. If you want, I can send you an early version of it for some critique.

You said you wanted more people, but the surprising thing is that not a whole lot of Doomworlders know about this mod.You'd be surprised how few people here actually know about this. Maybe you could e-mail some of the more known and motivated modders here?Even if they don't or can't join your team, they could still spread the word. They'd had more luck at spreading the word about this than a lesser known newbie mapper such as myself would.

There is a lot of talent here, but again, the Doom 3 section is, somewhat understandably, a bit ignored. Another thing you could do is maybe take part in a Doom Radio episode to talk about the mod, post more in the news section, or make a promotional video. A devblog as a recruiting tool is only as good as how many people read it.

I do have some criticism though. While I appreciate your strive for a greater sense of realism, I am not quite sure what to think of some of the changes. Take the first and third screenshots for instance: yes, they do look more realistic but they also look a bit more bland at the same time. They had a very colorful and Doom 1 feel to them which I find a bit lacking in the new versions. I do find the changes in the last 3 screenshots great!Don't get me wrong I still love the new versions but I think the older ones were a bit more interesting.

PS Could we please have higher res versions of the screenshots?

Old Post 09-17-13 18:14 #
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Shaviro
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Thanks for the nice words!


DooM_RO said:
Sadly, I am only just working on my first Doom map, and the scope of it is quite huge for a beginner map but it's coming along slowly but surely. I am quite stuck at the moment. If you want, I can send you an early version of it for some critique.


What kind of map is it? Doom1?


You said you wanted more people, but the surprising thing is that not a whole lot of Doomworlders know about this mod.You'd be surprised how few people here actually know about this. Maybe you could e-mail some of the more known and motivated modders here?Even if they don't or can't join your team, they could still spread the word. They'd had more luck at spreading the word about this than a lesser known newbie mapper such as myself would.


We have something more substantial in the works for a "recruitment hook". This time we just wanted to mention that we're accepting help. As for Doomworld, I don't know if the talent here is all that interested in Doom3/mods :)


I do have some criticism though. While I appreciate your strive for a greater sense of realism, I am not quite sure what to think of some of the changes. Take the first and third screenshots for instance: yes, they do look more realistic but they also look a bit more bland at the same time. They had a very colorful and Doom 1 feel to them which I find a bit lacking in the new versions. I do find the changes in the last 3 screenshots great!Don't get me wrong I still love the new versions but I think the older ones were a bit more interesting.


It's all the about the balance between it looking cartoony and it looking dull. Most of the assets given to us by Doom3 are dull/bland, so if we create something too colorful it'll clash with everything else. Our main vision for this is to drag Doom3 a little in the direction of classic doom, but we want to keep within the realm of realism. We want this because we wish to create areas that look like something and we don't want an exaggerated or charicatured look.
There is still a lot of color in our scenes, but abandoning the sort of naive approach and embracing regular color theory is the price to pay for a more whole experience :)


PS Could we please have higher res versions of the screenshots?


There'll be high-res screenshots of some of these areas later on. 4k like the ones we've released previously :)

Old Post 09-17-13 19:15 #
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DooM_RO
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Shaviro said:
Thanks for the nice words!



What kind of map is it? Doom1?




Yes, it is a map for Doom 1. The main focus of the map is to make the place feel as atmospheric as possible and more believable while using only stock and E1 textures and no zdoom features because I think it is beneficial for my detailing as it forces me to be creative with shapes. I am sorely missing some Doom 2 textures though.

Problems I have noticed is that making layouts comes very hard to me and making the rooms feel less like corridors is also a challange but I am very pleased with how my detailing is coming. I am aiming for a style that is not too flowery but pleasant to look at.

If you are interested, I will PM you a link.



Shaviro said:


We have something more substantial in the works for a "recruitment hook". This time we just wanted to mention that we're accepting help. As for Doomworld, I don't know if the talent here is all that interested in Doom3/mods :)

[/B]


Trying wouldn't hurt. The high quality of your mod could at least determine them to spread the word.



Shaviro said:
It's all the about the balance between it looking cartoony and it looking dull. Most of the assets given to us by Doom3 are dull/bland, so if we create something too colorful it'll clash with everything else. Our main vision for this is to drag Doom3 a little in the direction of classic doom, but we want to keep within the realm of realism. We want this because we wish to create areas that look like something and we don't want an exaggerated or charicatured look.
There is still a lot of color in our scenes, but abandoning the sort of naive approach and embracing regular color theory is the price to pay for a more whole experience :)



There'll be high-res screenshots of some of these areas later on. 4k like the ones we've released previously :) [/B]


Weeeelll, I am still not 100% convinced. After all, this is a video game, it does not have to be hyper-realistic, I think authenticity is more important. Just look at Battlefield 3 or Call of Duty, they are by no means realistic but they are more than authentic enough to make you believe in the world.

In fact, I think that Doom 3 suffered from a similar problem. They wanted to make the world as realistic as possible but because of that, the areas ended up looking samey - even when they changed textures and colors in Alpha Labs, Enpro, Recycling or Delta Labs. Something tells me they were conscious of this but didn't know how to handle it. Please note that I am not suggesting that your mod could end up boring or bland.

I guess the area in the third picture I regret the most being changed, it REALLY looked like Doom 1 but modernized.

I think sacrificing a bit of realism for more interesting environments would make the mod better (especially considering that this is Doom) but I'm sure you know better, this is just my opinion.

Old Post 09-17-13 19:46 #
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Marnetmar
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I loved reading about Phase 2, keep up the good work!

A little criticism, though...

This shot looks good and all but...Why are the trim and tiles pink?

While this area may have been more simplistic before I think the architecture was much more sleek and pleasing to the eye. Now it looks like a flooded futuristic barn with door trim that cuts off at the platform. Perhaps there's something in between that could be achieved?

Don't get me wrong, this is leagues beyond anything I could do but I'm a bit nitpicky anyway :P

Last edited by Marnetmar on 09-18-13 at 01:29

Old Post 09-18-13 01:22 #
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DooM_RO
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I'm curious, did you make this devblog in part to see the reaction to the before/after areas? If so, my opinion stands the same: the new areas are definitely more realistic, but the old ones were more interesting to look at.

It makes me really sad that the mod is largely ignored, even on Doomworld, the word should definitely be spread but how? Maybe some of the more important doomworlders would like to sponsor this, this should have already had KDIZD levels of attention.

Old Post 09-20-13 18:46 #
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Marnetmar
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I think part of it is that Doom 3 isn't widely praised among the gaming community and is also very difficult to make modifications to, so people tend to ignore it.

Old Post 09-20-13 20:28 #
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DooM_RO
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Well yeah, but since this is the only high quality Doom-style mod for Doom 3, I think it deserves the attention.

Old Post 09-20-13 20:44 #
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Shaviro
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DooM_RO said:
I'm curious, did you make this devblog in part to see the reaction to the before/after areas? If so, my opinion stands the same: the new areas are definitely more realistic, but the old ones were more interesting to look at.


Nope. The devblog is about what we're currently working on and the images are there to illustrate what processes we are going through. Like it says right before the images start :) For this it has served its purpose well with positive (and some constructive) feedback.

Old Post 09-25-13 07:11 #
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Waffenak
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Ending was surprising indeed, was that the scrapped mastermind model in action? Is there story you can brief to me in a nut shell? I haven't heard from this mod before I saw this thread.

Old Post 10-21-13 21:29 #
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Marnetmar
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Hey, if you guys are planning on having a Baron of Hell...

http://firstpersonshooters.net/Games/-=franchise=-/Doom/Movie/images/concept%20art/DOOM%20DEVILDESIGN2.jpg

Old Post 11-26-13 02:38 #
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Doominator2
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Cant wait to try this out

Old Post 12-02-13 03:33 #
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DooM_RO
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Now that Black Mesa is getting on Steam as a result of the Greenlight initiative, have you considered doing the same? How about asking important DW members to make a campaign for the mod before its release? A Doom radio interview? Asking a game review site (like PC Gamer) to spread the word? All of these could generate quite a lot of buzz.

Old Post 12-07-13 20:26 #
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Avoozl
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I don't know if I like the idea of a mod being paid for.

Old Post 12-07-13 23:26 #
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DooM_RO
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As far as I know, greenlit games can be free. I would gladly pay 15-30 dollars for this if it ends up on Steam. Mods of this caliber deserve it.

EDIT: Might also be a good idea to ask Total Biscuit to cover this, considering he did a Brutal Doom video.

Old Post 12-08-13 08:40 #
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Avoozl
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But why does it have to be only downloaded from steam?

Old Post 12-08-13 10:31 #
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Julian


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I made this video a long time ago with old screenshots of the project. There's some stunning hell stuff in the end.

Old Post 12-08-13 13:30 #
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Shaviro
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Marnetmar said:
Hey, if you guys are planning on having a Baron of Hell...


Sadly we are no longer in a positiong where we can create new monsters. Very nice art though :)


Marnetmar said:
Now that Black Mesa is getting on Steam as a result of the Greenlight initiative, have you considered doing the same? How about asking important DW members to make a campaign for the mod before its release? A Doom radio interview? Asking a game review site (like PC Gamer) to spread the word? All of these could generate quite a lot of buzz.


Well, do any of the "important DW members" care about the project? That is basically where the challenge lies ;)
As for steam greenlight, haven't thought about that at all. An interview would be great. As would TotalBiscuit or a PC magazine (we were actually featured in one years ago). Right now we are working on something that would hopefully help us and act as a stepping stone for these kind of things. We have a lot of nice screenshots, several walls of text and a small teaser trailer, but we need something more substantial to show.

Julian: Yeah remember that one :)
Some really nice concepts and early work in there. We have come a long way since then though :O

Old Post 12-08-13 13:45 #
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DooM_RO
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Some of the hell shots are a little rough but 2:50 is amazing!

Do you mind if I take some inspiration from the shot in 0:36 for my first Doom map? I had a demonic ruin in mind for a zone and this is roughly what I imagined.

Old Post 12-08-13 15:18 #
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BlackFish
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Looking forward to this. Will this be taking advantage of newer hardware in any way? (Higher res textures, higher poly usage, etc).

Old Post 12-08-13 16:11 #
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Shaviro
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DooM_RO: Go right ahead :)


BlackFish said:
Looking forward to this. Will this be taking advantage of newer hardware in any way? (Higher res textures, higher poly usage, etc).


Almost all new textures are in double resolution as far as I can recall. Some textures are intentionally blurry though. Stuff like magazine papers, personal photographs etc. The levels themselves are of a higher complexity than the original levels. Doom3 levels were about 12k brushes whereas Phobos levels are ranging from 30-45k. So far.

Old Post 12-08-13 17:39 #
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DooM_RO
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Which means that levels like that would not have been possible in 2004, right? How much better do you think the game could have been in 2004? Do you think the lack of variety was due to laziness, due to Id being a small company or due to hardware restrictions?

Old Post 12-08-13 18:06 #
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