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fraggle
Filled with the code of Doom


Posts: 7728
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Hi,

You may remember a thread a week or two ago about the possibility of creating a free doom iwad, remaking everything in the wad from scratch. Well, we've been working on it for around a week and a half now and we already have almost half the floor textures and a fifth of the wall textures done.

This is mainly to ask for help and contributions towards the wad. At the moment we are concentrating on the textures (although we have a small handful of sprites). In the future we will also need replacement levels, graphics, sprites, sounds and music, so if you can help with any of those please let us know.

The URL:

http://fraggle.despayre.ath.cx/freedoom/

I should mention that this is not like a normal TC. Anyone can contribute as much or as little as they like. Personally I would like this wad to show the many talents of the people in this community.

Old Post 07-18-01 16:05 #
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Sephiroth
O o
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Posts: 3858
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i will see if i can find any of my personal doom textures on disk that i can give u. I really would like to see this project completed. This is not a TC it is a FREE DOOM GAME!! come on people lets contribute. sadly i had more but my system crashed a week ago but i still have some on disk.

Old Post 07-18-01 16:27 #
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Jon
Freedoom Bloke


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I must stress that artists-to-be read the info file on the freedoom site before they start work- too many submitted textures are going to have to be rejected and replaced because the guidelines haven't been followed.

Old Post 07-18-01 16:54 #
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Lüt
Administrator


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Hm... Zaldron got carried away with Millennium and ended up retexturing the whole game, maybe you guys could wait a while until we release those textures.

Old Post 07-18-01 17:28 #
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sirgalahadwizar
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Hey guys, i wanna contribute.

What are the guidelines for say, a monster?
Does it have to follow the doom frames system or can there be extra frames that the current doom does not use (or new entities, liek a sprite named "devlz2z8").

What the hell port are you guys using for this thing anyway?

And i would really want to amke a new palette for this "freedoom" because i found that the original doom palette was way too restrictive... will there be multiple palettes for use in conjunction with 16-bit video modes, or is it going to be a monopalette operation?

Old Post 07-18-01 18:05 #
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Liam
the Bard formerly known as the Bard


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I'm busy working on my own megawad. I need a good midi composer.

Old Post 07-18-01 18:15 #
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fraggle
Filled with the code of Doom


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What are the guidelines for say, a monster?
Does it have to follow the doom frames system or can there be extra frames that the current doom does not use (or new entities, liek a sprite named "devlz2z8").


You can add as many new frames in as you want, but the monster must be totally new (ie. no imps, cacodemons or cyberdemons etc. as they are owned by id unfortunately :( )



What the hell port are you guys using for this thing anyway?



We arent tied to any one port, we are only replacing the original wad. Free Port (eg. legacy, prboom) + free iwad = totally free game. If you want to use port features I suggest you limit yourself to boom features.



And i would really want to amke a new palette for this "freedoom" because i found that the original doom palette was way too restrictive... will there be multiple palettes for use in conjunction with 16-bit video modes, or is it going to be a monopalette operation?


cph has done the playpal and colormap lumps already. We want compatibility with existing pwads, so we have to stick with the doom palette. We are advising texture and graphic artists to work in 16 bit and convert as this may enable us to do a 16-bit color version of the wad later on if ports are made to support it.

Thanks for the interest and support!

Old Post 07-18-01 18:24 #
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sirgalahadwizar
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I can re-do your switches to look aobut 10x as good as the ones you have on your site... actually this goes for lights, computer screens, and all textures in general.

I would be happy to work on textures for you guys, while i probably wouldn't come up with many new textures (i might do skies - i have bryce 4 and it makes for an outstanding sky scene maker), i can *******ly do post-production or even re-vamp work on existing textures (i jsut hope too many people dont get their ass in a bunch over me borrowing thier stuff and modifying it).

In addition (my terms), I will only provide the actual image of the texture(s) in question, mostly in bmp -256 color format already in a doom palette-soluble color set. I have never made textures for doom because im not a mapeditor, and thus i dont know how to work with wintex (or any other program) to make textures work in a wadfile (because theres more to it than simply creating a lump and inserting gfx into it - ill let you guys deal with the alignment and all that post-production lump jazz).

and as i take it from the patch production hints text file, you guys are going to be using some kind of port very closly related to the original doom port (like zdoom and boom are)... and you do know that the texture limitations for names that you are imposing are totally unneccicary - seeing as you will in no way be able to include actual doom levels in your freedoom project (unless it's a episode 1 remake)... because episode 2, 3, 4 and all of the doom2 levels are all commercial material - you have to pay to get those (ie: if you are using those levels i damn you to hell).

Old Post 07-18-01 18:25 #
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fraggle
Filled with the code of Doom


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In addition (my terms), I will only provide the actual image of the texture(s) in question, mostly in bmp -256 color format already in a doom palette-soluble color set.


We are using the gif format for texture submissions. You can submit bmps but it makes my job harder as I have to convert them :).



i dont know how to work with wintex (or any other program) to make textures work in a wadfile (because theres more to it than simply creating a lump and inserting gfx into it - ill let you guys deal with the alignment and all that post-production lump jazz).



We have this all arranged. I am building at least one wad daily using deutex. The latest wad is available for download on the website.



and as i take it from the patch production hints text file, you guys are going to be using some kind of port very closly related to the original doom port (like zdoom and boom are)... and you do know that the texture limitations for names that you are imposing are totally unneccicary - seeing as you will in no way be able to include actual doom levels in your freedoom project (unless it's a episode 1 remake)... because episode 2, 3, 4 and all of the doom2 levels are all commercial material - you have to pay to get those (ie: if you are using those levels i damn you to hell).


We are aiming for compatibility with existing pwads - when finished you should be able to play Doom 2 pwads without the IWAD file - this is why we are recreating the original textures. We may include some extra textures for the new levels. As for the levels, all of them will be totally new levels, not based on the originals at all.

Old Post 07-18-01 18:39 #
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DeePTeam
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Not sure what was meant, but one can make "imps" etc from SCRATCH no sweat. It just has to be original work, not a modification of an existing graphic.

To illustrate further: if an artist paints a picture (which is then his and can't be "copied" by electro/mechanical means), it's perfectly OK for another artist to sit down and paint exactly the same picture. That 2nd picture now belongs to the 2nd artist.

Old Post 07-18-01 18:47 #
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Lüt
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Here's some of Zaldron's textures I mentioned: comparison image

He's doing this for pretty much all the Doom2 textures, so if these work we'll be happy to contribute them (around October-ish).

Old Post 07-18-01 18:49 #
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fraggle
Filled with the code of Doom


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Not sure what was meant, but one can make "imps" etc from SCRATCH no sweat. It just has to be original work, not a modification of an existing graphic.

To illustrate further: if an artist paints a picture (which is then his and can't be "copied" by electro/mechanical means), it's perfectly OK for another artist to sit down and paint exactly the same picture. That 2nd picture now belongs to the 2nd artist.


I'm only telling you what I know. I emailed John Carmack to ask about the legality of this project and he told me that we can make the iwad, but it must not contain imps, cyberdemons, bfgs etc. I don't know if you remember the Generations Quake TC, which was stopped for containing characters from id games?

Old Post 07-18-01 18:52 #
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sirgalahadwizar
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Yeah, i do aobut the same thing Lut.

Remastering or "resampling" an image in the conventional sense.

...and no, makingn completly new sprites (ie, getting into your paint program and freehanding them) is very hard to do.

I made a new sprite of the player guy except he's blue and has chainmail on.. and it took me a very long time (aobut 3 hours) to complete just frames A-F (i havent started work on the death or pain sequences yet). And this was a modified version of the player character - it would take at least 4-5x as long to make a completly new entity (from scratch, using only a paint program of some sort).

Old Post 07-18-01 18:55 #
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Arioch
not arioch


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I've brought this up before, but Generations was cancelled because it used data from shareware Quake 1 with only a few minor conversions to Quake 2 data format.



SOG, a reincarnation of Generations, uses the same Doom-styled resources FROM Generations, plus some MD2s contributed by Edmundo Bordeau and the like, and totally replaced the Quake resources, and it's still alive and kicking, they are soon to release yet a third version for general consumption.

Old Post 07-18-01 18:56 #
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Jon
Freedoom Bloke


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We can't use ID's likenesses or anything which might constitute intellectual property breach. Sprites will be the hardest and biggest job.

Old Post 07-18-01 19:56 #
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Arioch
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Jon I do think you're being way too restrictive.



Yes, we need interpretations of the original graphics more than just flat-out pixel-by-pixel remakes. But no, they do need to bear some semblance to the original art.



Sprites are another thing. Enemy behavior isn't, so we can do pretty much what we like with how the monsters look -- for example the demon can be remade into a classic demonic form with claw or sword attacks, instead of a pink bull gorilla type monster, and still behave in pretty much the same manner.

Old Post 07-18-01 20:01 #
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sirgalahadwizar
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...or at least the small ones. Stuff like fireballs, missiles, impacts (maybe not explosions) i can tackle with ease. I wish i had my deathtc mod online right now, it's a good example (as a matter of fact i'd prolly transplant some of my own stuff into this project).

Old Post 07-19-01 04:42 #
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Zaldron
Sex Cauldron


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I gotta recreate 400+ textures for Millenium, and then all the ones in DooM 2, including flats.

If you guys wanna use some of them, I guess is ok, afterall, it's just some MAX/Photo tweaking. It's been more like fun to me than anything else.

Old Post 07-19-01 04:46 #
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AngelOfDeath
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So are you rebuilding the levels from scratch.
Or are you Changing the existing levels from doom2.wad

Old Post 07-19-01 05:22 #
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Linguica


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I gotta recreate 400+ textures for Millenium, and then all the ones in DooM 2, including flats.
Err what?

Old Post 07-19-01 09:06 #
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deathz0r
Bitch fuckin' stole me chaingun!


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i can make levels with just using BOOM features quite easily. a couple of levels from UAC Ress (phobos warehouse #42, abandoned passageway, escape from zaswitika (the newer screenies, noth the outdated ones) ) show a bit of my talent, but if i really put thought into it, i could make quite some impressive levels (especially boss levels).

Old Post 07-19-01 09:19 #
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mmnpsrsoskl
Spasmolytic


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hey fraggle i would be happy to help out, and i am gonna start by making some floor/ceiling flat texture thingoes.

Old Post 07-19-01 10:07 #
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Lüt
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I gotta recreate 400+ textures for Millenium, and then all the ones in DooM 2, including flats.
Err what?
Zaldron's my bitch.

Actually, I just asked him to help texture some buildings in the last level and he ended up redoing the whole game.

(Don't ask me.)

Old Post 07-19-01 10:14 #
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Jon
Freedoom Bloke


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So are you rebuilding the levels from scratch.
Or are you Changing the existing levels from doom2.wad


I really shouldn't be answering this but we are building levels from scratch.

Old Post 07-19-01 10:25 #
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Zaldron
Sex Cauldron


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Zaldron's my bitch.


That's the best compliment I heard, EVER. ;)

Old Post 07-19-01 17:05 #
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sirgalahadwizar
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So, there are new levels. At least that gives it a sense of credibility.

Dont ask for levels from me unless you want them in bryce 4 format (.br4 - totally incompatable with doom, possibly even Quake series dispite the 3d/brush interface).

Oh, and I think there sohuld be new monsters too.

Old Post 07-19-01 18:33 #
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Lüt
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There will be new monsters, or else it won't work as an IWAD.

Old Post 07-19-01 18:48 #
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Zaldron
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Making new levels...mmmh, direct upgrades from the originals or new ones? Because I'm seeing a lot of "foxing" potential here. Remember, DooM's still being sold.

Old Post 07-19-01 19:04 #
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Arioch
not arioch


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I was hoping that we wouldn't modify the level names and such, but remake the levels in sort of the same way Chris Lutz is making P:AR ... in other words, as they really should look. Any thoughts?



[14:34] *** [topic/#freedoom] Flats(%): 50 || Patches(%): 25

[14:34] *** [set by] fraggle at [Thu Jul 19 10:28:12 2001]

Old Post 07-19-01 19:16 #
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Lüt
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I was hoping that we wouldn't modify the level names and such, but remake the levels in sort of the same way Chris Lutz is making P:AR ... in other words, as they really should look. Any thoughts?
I'm up for at least one map like that.

Old Post 07-19-01 20:01 #
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