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hardcore_gamer
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Which levels from Final Doom (TNT and PLUTONIA) do you consider to be best?

Personally I like Human BBQ and Hunted a lot.

You?

Old Post 11-08-12 16:06 #
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Chex Warrior
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Mount Pain from TNT has to be my favorite of all time.

Old Post 11-08-12 16:07 #
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fraggle
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Evilution MAP04 (Wormhole) made for an interesting concept map, I thought. MAP31 and the whole Egyptian pyramid theme thing was quite interesting too.

Old Post 11-08-12 16:13 #
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Eris Falling
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I like the concept of Wormhole, but I still hate the level itself.

Lunar Mining Project and Deepest Reaches come to mind in terms of favourites, but having only fully played their PSX Counterparts I'd have to check this.

None of Plutonia's levels REALLY stand out for me. I don't mind Odyssey of Noises is alright, but idk..all the levels seem too similar for my liking. Just my opinion though.

Old Post 11-08-12 16:22 #
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fraggle
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I'm not a fan of Plutonia either (mainly because it exceeds my skill level) but MAP32 is great just for its sheer insanity. Watching speedruns of it is always entertaining.

Old Post 11-08-12 16:47 #
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darkreaver
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All of Plutonias maps except for map01, map11 and map26.
I will have to think about TNT a little

Last edited by darkreaver on 11-12-12 at 19:50

Old Post 11-08-12 16:53 #
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LkMax
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I would have to play trhough it again to remember... I would say TNT map "Wormhole" and Map 31 indeed and Plutonia Map 29.

Old Post 11-08-12 17:16 #
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SFoZ911
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Anti-Christ

Old Post 11-08-12 17:57 #
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Feniks
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As for Evilution, I remember I absolutely loved Stronghold (map09) and also liked Central Processing (map20), Lunar Mining Project (map23) and a couple others.

I recently started replaying Plutonia again, and I can say that The Twilight (map15) is probably my favourite now. Everything about the map is excellent, its design, it's relatively short but not simple, challenging but far from unfair and all these secrets... I liked Caged (map04) very much too, also, The Sewers (map28) stood out in my mind. Generally speaking, I like Plutonia all the way through, some failed music choices are its only flaw, I think. But I love the music for map21, definitely.

Edit: I must admit I never liked Wormhole. I don't know why a lot of people seem to enjoy it thoroughly.

Old Post 11-08-12 18:47 #
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Daiyu_Xiaoxiang
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For TNT:

Map13 - Fun map to deal with the cyber-friend, and an atmospheric music which is one of my favourite in Final Doom.
Map18 - Ah the mill, my favourite map of TNT. This map is so beautiful!
Map20 - Challenging and long, I love the design and music.
Map27 - Fun to SSG the imps! :)

For Plutonia:

Map21 - Rockets spam!
Map28 - I love the music, I love the sewers!

TNT is fun, the music are nice and most maps are beautiful. Most plutonia's map are ugly, too much brown, also poor choice of music.

Old Post 11-09-12 01:33 #
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Rizera
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TNT - Mount Pain (MAP27)
Plutonia - Odyssey Of Noises (MAP29).

__________________
You are very welcome to watch my Doom speed demos: http://www.youtube.com/user/1ntru

Old Post 11-09-12 08:12 #
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Processingcontrol
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Both IWADs have lots of good ones. My favorites include:

TNT:

Map06 - Very atmospheric, lots of cool architecture
Map09 - Neat layout and fun gimmick
Map13 - Same as Map06, but with even more memorable areas
Map14 - I love the whole way the whole back-and-forth layout is implemented

Plutonia:

Map11 - Archviles + maze = awesomeness (screw the haters)
Map12 - Possibly the best map in any of the IWADs. The whole thing looks amazing and the monster placement is pretty much perfect

Old Post 11-11-12 05:11 #
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Avoozl
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TNT:

MAP01
MAP06
MAP10
MAP13
MAP16
MAP20
MAP32

Plutonia:

MAP04
map15
MAP29

Last edited by Avoozl on 11-13-12 at 01:25

Old Post 11-11-12 06:32 #
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LkMax
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Processingcontrol said:
Plutonia:
Map11 - Archviles + maze = awesomeness (screw the haters)[/B]

Despite my hate towards the excessive use of archviles on Plutonia I actually thought this map was interesting. Wouldn't put it in my favorites list though and wouldn't want to play more of this kind of map. It's basically just a maze - on the classic, literal way (a bunch of walls and dead ends).

Old Post 11-12-12 01:04 #
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EvilNed01
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MAP15 Dead Zone from TNT and the city level (MAP29) from Plutonia.

Old Post 11-12-12 08:33 #
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Snakes
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Evilution:
Map01 - Sweet berserker fun!
Map06 - Great atmosphere and the large room is pretty cool
Map09* - Asterisk because this is mostly demo-related, the NM runs for this level are INSANE
Map13 - Good looks, fun gameplay
Map15 - No looks, awesome gameplay
Map18 - Casala goodness
Map20 - Sense of adventure, the wire-fences are excused
Map31 - Neat theme and well-made

Plutonia: Just in general. Map04 and Map27 are probably my stand-outs, though.

Old Post 11-12-12 16:30 #
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darkreaver
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I`m going to have to mention Plutonia map06 specifically. Probably one of my all time fav maps. And, yes, the music helps =)

Old Post 11-12-12 19:46 #
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Technician
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fraggle said:
Evilution MAP04 (Wormhole) made for an interesting concept map, I thought. MAP31 and the whole Egyptian pyramid theme thing was quite interesting too.
I have still yet to find that blasted yellow key. Tomorrow's another day.

Old Post 11-12-12 22:48 #
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LkMax
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Technician said:
I have still yet to find that blasted yellow key. Tomorrow's another day.

Do you know there's a bug preventing the player from getting the yellow key on the "catacomb" area due to it being marked as "multiplayer"? There's a 'fix' called TNT31.wad on the TNT site IIRC.

PS: Yes, it's on their website: http://www.teamtnt.com/bugfixes.htm

Old Post 11-13-12 01:05 #
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Dragonsbrethren
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I have still yet to find that blasted sarcasm detector. Tomorrow's another day.

Old Post 11-13-12 01:36 #
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LkMax
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Dragonsbrethren said:
I have still yet to find that blasted sarcasm detector. Tomorrow's another day.

*Looks at Technician registered date*
*Thinks about last reply and the possibilities*
Uh... Umm... whatever. =P
My name is not Sheldon Cooper BTW.

Old Post 11-13-12 10:37 #
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MajorRawne
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Sorry for the epic post; food for thought, maybe?

I have only played the PC version through once about 10 years ago, although I do own it and the Master Levels. Not being turned on by Revenant and Chaingunner spam, I'd have to say that (as usual) I preferred the PSX version.

For that version, here are my favourites, in order:

1. Vesperas: Beautiful to look at with the new sky texture, the Toxin Refinery music is enchanting and there are some nice views in this level. It looks and plays differently from anything in Doom/Doom 2 on the PSX.

2. Crater: Despite being mildly dumbed down with more basic architecture than the PC original and no Hell Barons, plus miles of empty corridors, this map evokes a strange, lonely atmosphere that works so well for the PSX port. There's a secret slime fall which my friends and I couldn't get our heads around - we thought it had to be a special area hiding bonuses. One downfall of Romero's style is that you don't get a good view, it has to be an area where you can go, so you can't stare at it and wonder what it would be like to get there.

3. Minos: A terrific exploration map, sinister and creepy with extremely unnerving music (think the wind roaring down pitch-black tunnels in the bowels of Hell). You can skip most of this map, which is weird, but it's very good to explore and the tension in the Hell Knight/Crusher room is unbearable since you can't save in-game. I'm actually working on a tribute map, working title Theseus, using the Plutonia textures.

4. Canyon: I just like this level. It's fun to explore, it's tough without being too hard and like most of the Final Doom maps, it's very different to the original levels, helping to kick FDoom off in its own direction.

5. Geryon: The disturbing and unsettling music is not the only distinctive thing about this map. I was still getting used to the beautiful night sky texture when this map loaded up. It should by rights be frustrating as gameplay is not entirely linear but it just plays really well with some nice views.

6. System Control: The only PSX map that gives you a berserk pack straight away and expects you to gib your way through a map. Nice. And the music track is one of the best of the PSX port.

To provide balance: I HATED all the Plutonia maps, they were too complex and very difficult for me back then (and probably still today). Heck was also pretty bad as it was too long, somewhat confusing compared to the more standard maps and just... no, not for me at all. Oh, and my friends and brother generally agreed with my assessment of the maps, so it would be interesting to hear from other PSX Doomers.

Old Post 11-18-12 16:09 #
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Feniks
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The only complex Plutonia maps are Impossisble Mission, Tombstone, Bunker, The Sewers and Odyssey of Noises. Unsurprisingly, most of them were made by Dario. Milo's levels were much more straightforward on average.

Also, I'm pretty curious what is considered the hardest Plutonia map today. Though Go 2 It is no doubt a worthy candidate, there's NO way it can be harder than Realm, The Temple of Darkness or Caughtyard. Try playing map25 from scratch, for example...

On the other hand, I found some Plutonia maps I used to have problems with surprisingly easy now. Like, I breezed through Anti-Christ even without any invul sphere; The Death Domain, NME, Caged or The Twilight no longer pose any real challenge for me either, compared with my struggles back in the day.

Last edited by Feniks on 11-18-12 at 17:31

Old Post 11-18-12 17:25 #
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Dragonsbrethren
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Rawne: PSX Plutonia isn't even worth mentioning, so much of the map set was cut. PSX Final Doom is a huge disappointment overall; I really don't believe that most of the cut maps were pounding on the hardware too much.

---

I've made it perfectly clear in the past that I'm not a fan of TNT. Some of the earlier maps definitely have a good Doom feel, though. MAP01, MAP02 (barring that dumb jump), MAP03, MAP04 is a personal favorite for its gimmick even though it's a pretty weak map overall. It's a shame the map set later goes down the route of having maps too big for their own good and lots of dumb "realism" in place of gameplay oriented designs. (I can't help but wonder how much worse it was during development, if this is what id let get published).

Plutonia is godly by comparison. MAP02 holds a special place for being the level that taught me that water is just another sector in Doom (why I didn't figure this out on my own is baffling in hindsight, since Doom's water is nothing special, unlike, say, Quake). Can't say I'm a fan of the dumb way you have to raise the bridge, though. No idea how I ever figured that out on my own. If it had been a switch texture back there, I wouldn't take any issue with it. The two MAP29 tributes, while not my favorites at first, have really grown on me after I came to appreciate that map.

Old Post 11-18-12 19:18 #
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MajorRawne
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I'll end up playing the PC version again I suppose. "Complex" was in relation to the original Doom maps, though by today's standards some of them are comparatively simple.

It said on the back of the PSX boxed set that there were 2 30-level episodes, which is false advertising. It was never made clear why the first game had 59 levels on the disc including a super-secret level (Club Doom) and the second only had 30. It probably was disappointing for fans of the original as so much content was cut.

Are there any in-depth interviews from id Software about PSX Final Doom?

Old Post 11-18-12 20:08 #
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DoomUK
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TNT Map12 and Map25 have always been favourites of mine.

Old Post 11-18-12 20:31 #
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Xaser
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Dead Zone, Mill, Shipping/Respawning, Speed, Tombstone, Bunker, and Odyssey of Noises. Also props to Steel Works and Wormhole for conceptual awesomeness even if execution is iffy in parts (as is the norm in TNT :P ).

[EDIT] Also Go 2 It. How the hell did I forget that one? D:

Old Post 11-18-12 21:18 #
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darkreaver
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As for Evilution, my favorites are map13 and map20. Both maps also use my fav midis. Awesome.

Old Post 11-18-12 22:15 #
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CorSair
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From Plutonia (what hits instantly in mind):
Hunted: When I first played this, adrenaline run through my veins, waiting arch-vile to pop up. Still gives me shivers when I play through it. Wish there would be more like these...
Odyssey of Noises: I don't know what it is that gives good feel when I play through this. Not the most detailed, or beautiful of the deck, but still...
The final secret level, which I don't remember: What a bitch level. Yet, I am probably insane, but I want to play it through every time I start playing Plutonia again. :)

There are lot of other levels, but overall, these are most memorable ones.

And from Evilution... Maybe it's better to cut out the bad ones. The endgame levels left me empty when I was done with Administration Center. Wormhole is cool idea, but doesn't play well.
But the most interesting ones for me are: Mill, Shipping/Respawn, Deepest Reaches, Nukage Process. Those maps have quite fond memories for me.


.:edit:.

Technician said:
I have still yet to find that blasted yellow key. Tomorrow's another day.


LkMax said:

Do you know there's a bug preventing the player from getting the yellow key on the "catacomb" area due to it being marked as "multiplayer"? There's a 'fix' called TNT31.wad on the TNT site IIRC.

PS: Yes, it's on their website: http://www.teamtnt.com/bugfixes.htm


Holy smoly... I always thought that I always did something wrong, thus I had to cheat the level through. O__o

Old Post 11-18-12 22:29 #
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Foodles
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played through TNT recently, surprised map17 (Storage area, or something similar) and map28 (Heck) haven't been mentioned, I do enjoy those levels.

Old Post 11-18-12 23:58 #
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