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VinceDSS
Senior Member

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I dont particularly like TNT (except a few maps), so don't count on me for this one :D

Also TNT has quite bigger maps than plutonia, so I wonder how long it would take. 4 hours ?

12-09-07 01:09 #

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DeDo
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myk said:
Never_Again recorded the 1st episode, but I don't remember if he said he was aiming for a full game movie.

Yea I remember that run. I was just about finishing my own ep1 max but his was faster so I moved to other things after he posted it.

Hm, if noone did it yet and noone's attempting it I think I'll try to do something about it. Not sure yet, I'll give it a proper thought after I finish playing Cchest3.

12-09-07 11:29 #

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VinceDSS
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Good luck man :D

TNT is quite crowded and missing a monster can be easy if you don't double check or play a little slower.

Map30 is quite tough as well, I never could do it reliably, unlike pl30.

12-09-07 16:00 #

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DeDo
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Thanks :)
IF I decide to start working on it I'll need to somehow track my progress to keep me motivated heh. The fact that I have no idea how long it could take isn't helping either. My Plutonia ep1 run took me about 2 months but that one was my first demo ever so I hope I improved atleast a tiny bit to make it faster. :D

Map30 is quite tough as well, I never could do it reliably, unlike pl30.

Yea, this could be a problem. I was never particulary good with these maps. But if it comes to that I'll have to figure something out how to do it.

12-09-07 21:14 #

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VinceDSS
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speaking of old compet-n players, is anybody still in touch with john rimmer?

He was working on a map for project of mine, the project has picked up again but I cant seem to be able to find him.

I got his starter of map that looks great and would like to know where I could contact him.

12-15-07 21:04 #

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myk
patron mod of ugly ducklings and black sheep

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VinceDSS said:
speaking of old compet-n players, is anybody still in touch with john rimmer?

Heh, he posted more than once today.

12-15-07 22:48 #

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VinceDSS
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thanks !!!

12-16-07 03:13 #

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Never_Again
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myk said:
Never_Again recorded the 1st episode, but I don't remember if he said he was aiming for a full game movie.

That demo was part of preparation for the full max run. I didn't record for a couple years afterwards, only really picked it up again this year.

VinceDSS said:
Also TNT has quite bigger maps than plutonia, so I wonder how long it would take. 4 hours ?

The fartherst I got so far is map23, and yeah, the time is abysmal - three hours and a half.

VinceDSS said:
TNT is quite crowded and missing a monster can be easy if you don't double check or play a little slower.

That's quite true. prBoom+ comes in very handy for practicing here. Still, once you record the final run with the vanilla, it's a gamble.

VinceDSS said:
Map30 is quite tough as well, I never could do it reliably, unlike pl30.

I don't find TNT's map30 all that hard. The main difficulty with TNT is its enormous length and, as you correctly observed, tricky 100% kills. BTW, I haven't seen it discussed, but it seems like two monsters are unreachable on map15: they the Caco and PE behind the north-east wall. This is usually masked with the kills of Arch Vile-resurrected monsters, I think Eugene Kapustin was the first to notice it. It may be possible to maneuver another Caco or a Lost Soul to a position above these two sleepers and (hope to) hit them with a blast wave from a rocket, but that's not something I would recommend trying to pull of in a max TNT run. =)
Well, it's damn good to see the subject come up. Good luck, DeDo!
[edit: spelling]

12-17-07 16:05 #

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DeDo
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Thanks. :)

The fartherst I got so far is map23, and yeah, the time is abysmal - three hours and a half.

Was this back then or are you doing it now? I couldn't read it out from what you wrote. Should you be this far in I won't step in, the demo is all yours. If you aren't doing it anymore then I'll try to do it.

Also, if I continue with it, I may have a little problem. I use winXP so I can't use sound in doom2.exe but without it I can't do a max run. If I use dosbox, I can't increase the mouse sensitivity above 9 and that's too low for me so I can't play like that either. I'm currently unable to get win98 for this. Is there anything I can use to either get the sound working(without making the game choppy as hell) or increasing the sensitivity in Dosbox?
Worst case scenario I'll do it in prboom+ on doom2.exe compatibility but I won't be able to upload it to compet-n that way.

12-17-07 19:19 #

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Grazza
Quaerere Verum

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I don't see how Dosbox makes any difference to setting the mouse sensitivity - just edit the first line of default.cfg as normal.

12-17-07 20:03 #

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myk
patron mod of ugly ducklings and black sheep

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DeDo said:
If I use dosbox, I can't increase the mouse sensitivity above 9 and that's too low for me so I can't play like that either. I'm currently unable to get win98 for this. Is there anything I can use to either get the sound working(without making the game choppy as hell) or increasing the sensitivity in Dosbox?

For convenience, you can apply this hack to the executable, that changes Doom's internal mouse sensitivity to a range of 0-127, instead of 0-9. To apply the patch, you need CRACK.EXE, that's included in the Doom+ hack package. Use DOOM II's executable in this case, instead of Final DOOM's. As you may know, either is valid for a TNT or Plutonia run at COMPET-N.

12-17-07 20:16 #

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Never_Again
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DeDo said:Was this back then or are you doing it now? I couldn't read it out from what you wrote. Should you be this far in I won't step in, the demo is all yours. If you aren't doing it anymore then I'll try to do it.

The results are as of this week. I'd like to be the first to do it, but that may happen in a week or a year. This run is more of a test of endurance and perseverance rather than mad skills (otherwise it would have been done years ago). I may be able to complete it in a week, or in a year. It's not easy to play the same set of maps day in day out, for at least four-five hours a day. I don't want to be a dog in the manger, I want to see it done more than to see my name on it.

DeDo said:Also, if I continue with it, I may have a little problem. I use winXP so I can't use sound in doom2.exe but without it I can't do a max run. If I use dosbox, I can't increase the mouse sensitivity above 9 and that's too low for me so I can't play like that either. I'm currently unable to get win98 for this.

You can get it on e-Bay for under $10 shipped. Win98 is your best bet, everything else is going to be much laggier.

DeDo said:Worst case scenario I'll do it in prboom+ on doom2.exe compatibility

You mean -complevel 4. You can practice on prBoom+ while waiting for your Win98 copy.

12-17-07 21:02 #

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myk
patron mod of ugly ducklings and black sheep

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Never_Again said:
You mean -complevel 4.

Yeah, though 2 will do as well, as Doom2 -file tnt.wad demos are also allowed*.

* Because early on people didn't know the CFG autorun would work using the Final DOOM engine... it does, but with another value, that was discovered later (29, which in turn works for any Doom engine).

12-17-07 21:39 #

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DeDo
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Grazza said:
I don't see how Dosbox makes any difference to setting the mouse sensitivity - just edit the first line of default.cfg as normal.

Actually, as I just found out, what makes the difference is whether I play in fullscreen or in a window. Fullscreen mode kills the sensitivity and I have to set it to 40 or so to get it to behave like with 15 in a window. Funny.

Myk, you're a lifesaver, that sensitivity hack is great, I can finally play around with it without quitting the game everytime. Thanks a lot. :)

Never_Again said:
The results are as of this week. I'd like to be the first to do it, but that may happen in a week or a year. This run is more of a test of endurance and perseverance rather than mad skills (otherwise it would have been done years ago). I may be able to complete it in a week, or in a year. It's not easy to play the same set of maps day in day out, for at least four-five hours a day. I don't want to be a dog in the manger, I want to see it done more than to see my name on it.

Yeah, I want to see it done too, wanted for a long time. I'm still re-learning the first episode so you're far better of than me. :)
Not to mention that after practicing in prboom+ it will take a while to get used to doom2.exe again. It feels a bit different, I'm too used to prboom+, so I'm not so accurate and my movement sucks more than usual. :D

Anyway it's great to hear that you're so far in, really looking forward to seeing it, I have no doubt that you'll be the first person to do it.
One more question, do you skip the secret levels or are you doing them too?

12-17-07 22:34 #

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VinceDSS
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Never_Again said:
I may be able to complete it in a week, or in a year. It's not easy to play the same set of maps day in day out, for at least four-five hours a day.

The plutonia run took me more than a month trying everyday a couple times. I was unemployed back then, which helps a lot :D

I already knew the routes when I started recording with doom2.exe , but it took a while to get the full run, and also got a couple incomplete runs on the way :D

12-18-07 01:30 #

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Never_Again
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DeDo said:Yeah, I want to see it done too, wanted for a long time.

Then you may find this 2001 discussion on rec.games.computer.doom.playing interesting.

DeDo said:Anyway it's great to hear that you're so far in, really looking forward to seeing it, I have no doubt that you'll be the first person to do it.

Thank you for the vote of confidence, but I'm afraid that just the day I finish it Xit Vono (who will have happened to catch the flu the week before) may feel bored cooped up home sick enough to try it. :P

DeDo said:One more question, do you skip the secret levels or are you doing them too?

Of course, the secret levels must be done as well, that's the rules. I wouldn't want to skip them anyway, "Pharaoh" is one of the prettiest DOOM levels.

12-18-07 05:45 #

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Never_Again
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VinceDSS said:The plutonia run took me more than a month trying everyday a couple times.

That's very interesting. Your Plutonia max run is one of the greatest demo achievements of all time! Two hours and a half with such fierce opposition takes some serious stamina. How did you feel when recording and when you finished it?
I've been working on this TNT run since last summer, and only got as far as map23 (and map31 on vanilla). A couple of years ago I heard that Sedlo was working on it, I thought it would have been done by now.

VinceDSS said:I was unemployed back then, which helps a lot :D

Haha! I know the feeling - you have plenty time for recording sessions, but your mind is often too busy with problems quite different from how to tackle map30 ... ^_^

VinceDSS said:I already knew the routes when I started recording with doom2.exe , but it took a while to get the full run, and also got a couple incomplete runs on the way :D

Did you record it in California, and the 'puter wasn't yours and you had no sound?

12-18-07 05:53 #

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Never_Again
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myk said:
Because early on people didn't know the CFG autorun would work using the Final DOOM engine... it does, but with another value, that was discovered later (29, which in turn works for any Doom engine).

Yeah, that's what Adam H. told me six years ago. :P

12-18-07 06:01 #

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VinceDSS
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Never_Again said:
That's very interesting. Your Plutonia max run is one of the greatest demo achievements of all time! Two hours and a half with such fierce opposition takes some serious stamina. How did you feel when recording and when you finished it?
I've been working on this TNT run since last summer, and only got as far as map23 (and map31 on vanilla). A couple of years ago I heard that Sedlo was working on it, I thought it would have been done by now.

Haha! I know the feeling - you have plenty time for recording sessions, but your mind is often too busy with problems quite different from how to tackle map30 ... ^_^

Did you record it in California, and the 'puter wasn't yours and you had no sound?

I was quite happy when I got it. After all, it was and is still the longest demo :D At least until you complete your run :D

It wasnt easy but It is still easier than pulling a 30nm or e4nm.

Long demos have always been my thing, always liked making movies, in any skill, category and even coop.

The 30plmax was recorded in France on my old trusty pentium 200 with win98 and SB16 sound :) , but I had practiced and learnt the routes while I was still in california.

Came back to cali in may-06.

12-18-07 06:36 #

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Eugene
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Never_Again said:
but it seems like two monsters are unreachable on map15: they the Caco and PE behind the north-east wall.

Not sure that I found it myself. I believe I've read about this somewhere. If I recall correctly on the old Ledmeister's site. May be in �fast or uv old FD demopacks.

Never_Again said:
This is usually masked with the kills of Arch Vile-resurrected monsters, I think Eugene Kapustin was the first to notice it. It may be possible to maneuver another Caco or a Lost Soul to a position above these two sleepers and (hope to) hit them with a blast wave from a rocket, but that's not something I would recommend trying to pull of in a max TNT run. =)

I tried this one back in the times of recording of the ev15 max demo. I recall the same situation on pl27, It's only theoretically possible to kill the chain-gunner reviving archie.

Never_Again said:
The fartherst I got so far is map23, and yeah, the time is abysmal - three hours and a half.

I'd like to watch this demo.

12-24-07 19:45 #

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VinceDSS
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I think you can upload an incomplete movie to the compet-n ? or is it just for nightmare ?

12-24-07 20:26 #

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Eugene
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At least some incomplete coop max movies can be found on C-N.

12-24-07 21:32 #

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Never_Again
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Eugene said:
Not sure that I found it myself. I believe I've read about this somewhere. If I recall correctly on the old Ledmeister's site. May be in �fast or uv old FD demopacks.

The demopaks don't mention it. Most likely you saw the discussion on r.g.c.d.help.

Eugene said:
I tried this one back in the times of recording of the ev15 max demo.

Did you succeed? I tried it in God Mode with idclip, no-clipping required to quickly clamber to the top of the tall pole with the Invisibility, so that the floaters come up to your level; otherwise they just stay down and there is no way to get them up there over the two sleeping monstars. I managed to wake up the Caco once; after about a half-hour I gave up.

Eugene said (about my 23-map max run of TNT):
I'd like to watch this demo.

Maybe I'll put it up on my page. I'm kind of reluctant to, I'd rather do it when the whole run is complete. Well, let's say that if I don't manage the complete max run by March, I'll post the closest attempt.

In the meantime, here is something to tide you over until then: the second-episode UV Max run of TNT! :D

edit: demo URL corrected: the Compet-N's /incoming won't accept uploads anymore, so I'm posting it on my own page.
edit2: demo name corrected and re-uploaded with updated TXT file - thanks, emailking! URL updated accordingly.
edit3: shortened the filename to observe the 8+3 DOS limit - thanks, myk! - re-uploaded again

Last edited by Never_Again on 01-02-08 at 06:21

12-30-07 22:59 #

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xit-vono
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Well, it's too bad that compet-n incoming doesn't accept new demos anymore. I think we really need to find a way to get compet-n back up an running, so if anyone has any ideas let me know. I just did a nightmare demo for requiem map15 to the secret exit, so I think that leaves just 4 left (plus map15 normal exit).

12-31-07 07:00 #

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DeDo
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Never_Again said:

In the meantime, here is something to tide you over until then: the second-episode UV Max run of TNT! :D

Woo a late christmas present. :D
Thanks a lot for this, I hoped you'll do this as a part of your max attempts. :)

Happy new year everyone!

12-31-07 09:27 #

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myk
patron mod of ugly ducklings and black sheep

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Good job, Never_Again! You got some big maps to max out, for sure.

By the way, from what I know COMPET-N's incoming directory has a maximum capacity, to eliminate abuse and spamming. I believe it got filled up, as has happened at least once in the past (where admins expanded it some more to accommodate more demos).

12-31-07 09:30 #

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Opulent
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Posts: 2093
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fixed:
http://competn.doom2.net/incoming/compet-n/?M=D

7127ev11.zip and rn15s854.zip uploaded.

12-31-07 22:57 #

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emailking
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Posts: 138
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File is named wrong. The demo is 111 minutes 27 sec. Not 1 hr. 11 min 27 sec.

01-01-08 03:14 #

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Eugene
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Never_Again said:
The demopaks don't mention it. Most likely you saw the discussion on r.g.c.d.help.

Seems Ledmeister found the bug.

Never_Again said:
Did you succeed?

I had no luck. I didn't try it hard though.

Never_Again said:
In the meantime, here is something to tide you over until then: the second-episode UV Max run of TNT! :D

Great endurance! It was always a problem for me to play an episode without speeding up and messing up then.

01-01-08 19:16 #

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Searcher
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Really nice job.

Indeed it is really tough to stay focused on the map(s) for over an hour and not forget to push for both time and completeness. You handled it and made it look easy, which of course, it is not. Well Done!

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01-02-08 00:49 #