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fraggle
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Linguica said:
Hyena you moronic pile of donkey shit, you wouldn't know a good levelset if it jumped out of your monitor and attempted to bite off your microscopic dick. Arctic Wolf is an amazing partial conversion and you spend multiple paragraphs spouting diarrhea about how you can't figure out how to make the Dehacked patch function. Maybe if your inbred reptilian brain had a few more sparking neurons you would realize that the problem was with your inability to properly type commands and not with one of Laz's greatest masterpieces. Why don't you put your mongoloid face through a plate glass window and spare us all your dim-bulb attempts at reviewing. Not recommend playing it? I do not recommend you continue to breathe, you witless idiot.
This, my friends, is a quality flame.

Old Post 01-26-03 19:06 #
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Hyena
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Linguica said:
Hyena you moronic pile of donkey shit, you wouldn't know a good levelset if it jumped out of your monitor and attempted to bite off your microscopic dick. Arctic Wolf is an amazing partial conversion and you spend multiple paragraphs spouting diarrhea about how you can't figure out how to make the Dehacked patch function. Maybe if your inbred reptilian brain had a few more sparking neurons you would realize that the problem was with your inability to properly type commands and not with one of Laz's greatest masterpieces. Why don't you put your mongoloid face through a plate glass window and spare us all your dim-bulb attempts at reviewing. Not recommend playing it? I do not recommend you continue to breathe, you witless idiot.


Let me tell you something, oh fearless leader. I followed the instructions that came with the text file down to the letter, and I tested it in multiple doom engines and got exactly the same result.
I didn't do this half-assed. Maybe this is an update to the original Arctic Wolf but that has a bug that the original did not, but that's why I said it's unplayable "in its present state"

I'll leave alone your little deusf thing last week, by the way.

Old Post 01-26-03 19:39 #
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mewse said:


nice "review" jackass, this is only the biggest release that /newstuff has seen this week, you've practically dismissed it with your crummy 3 lines. i spit on you.



1. It had a big-ass update on doomworld, it doesn't need a little review.
2. Everything that needs to be said about it was said in the big-ass update.
3. I said it was amazing. What else do you want?
4. This review has the largest number of screenshots this week.

Old Post 01-26-03 19:41 #
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Ed
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Hyena said:


First of all, "The Satan Complex" is such a weird name that I don't even need to make fun of it.



/me listens to Velvet Acid Christ - Satan Complex #42

:P

Old Post 01-26-03 19:45 #
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Ichor
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I remember playing Sin City way back when ZDoom first started using slopes. It could have been an early beta version though, but I distinctly remember most of the architecture, which helped me get through it all. I was beginning to worry when I got down to four shells and no bullets, but that quickly changed to relief once I hit that switch and that plasma gun and cell packs appeared. It was easy after that.

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Old Post 01-26-03 20:21 #
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Hyena
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Ichor: You should review!

Old Post 01-26-03 21:43 #
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UAC PR Dept.
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Someone screwed up. In Arctic Wolf(which is a few years old if I remember correctly), the knife/switch bug was fixed long, long ago. The latest version on Laz' site is fixed, and you can even download the patch there.

WTF? Why would he upload this now?

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Old Post 01-27-03 07:32 #
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Mordeth
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I played Arctic Wolf a few years ago, without problem. Except for me dying a lot. Excellent conversion, btw. We want more!

Old Post 01-27-03 08:47 #
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Grazza
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UAC PR Dept. said:
WTF? Why would he upload this now?
Presumably he didn't. There have been a number of instances in recent weeks of someone uploading other people's wads, and quite often wrong or unauthorized versions.

Old Post 01-27-03 14:03 #
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icemann
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I agree with Ling 100% on Arctic Wolf. I was COMPLETELY shocked with the crap review that Hyena gave of Arctic Wolf, as I`d played it a few years back and didn`t have the slightest problem whatsoever with it, and even if I had had problems, common sense would have told me to go to the website of the author to see if there were bug fixes to fix with whatever bug I`d been experiencing since its a fucken TC for gods sake, not a normal everyday wad, obviously your lacking the common sense to do something like that Hyena.

And not one mention was made as to the quality of the new graphics, sounds, enemies, weapons, and of the levels themselves.

Time to get a new reviewer Doomworld, cause that was a very fucked up review of easily the best TC so far released for doom2 to date. And when a reviewer spends his entire review of a wad, tc or whatever just complaining about dehacked patches, when he should be actually reviewing the LEVELS, its an easy way to see how bad a reviewer they are.

And trying to make out like batman doom was better is just laughable. Yeah its a bloody good TC, but next to Arctic Wolf, and the Wolfendoom TCs ingeneral its an ant next to an elephant.

Old Post 01-27-03 14:16 #
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Hang on now. Hyena followed the instructions in the file as distributed, and encountered serious problems. Basically, he reviewed what was in newstuff, which seems fair enough for a newstuff reviewer.

OK, if he had realized this was not an authorized and complete version, then perhaps he would have visited the TC's homepage and found the patch, but I find it difficult to fault him for that. When you find a TC from 1999 being redistributed in 2003, it is quite natural to assume that it is the complete and final version.

Old Post 01-27-03 15:02 #
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myk
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Heh, given the recent similar discussion one could think some jerk uploaded it just to cause this. Otherwise we can imagine some dork uploading it because he thought "oh hey, how come this is not in doomsearch?" (Maybe this is somehow related to the recent thread on icy flats... not that I'm pointing a finger at anyone posting there, just the existence of such a thread as a trigger.) And of course forgetting the patch and not considering that the WAD has its home page and that it hasn't been uploaded to idgames for a couple of reasons, including the fact that it uses lots of resources from other games (namely Wolf3D, of course, but doesn't it use Duke3D stuff as well?)

Haven't played anything new yet, but I guess I'll give Empyre a chance and try his WAD, notwithstanding the description... and the screenshots, he did request constructive criticism on another thread, after all.

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Old Post 01-27-03 15:21 #
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pritch
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I'm getting a tad fucked off with the constant abuse our reviewers are getting each week.

If you have also spent a lot of time reviewing each and every newstuff submission on previous occasions (Linguica etc.) then maybe you're entitled to say something, but if you're a fat lazy fuckface who just expects his perfect newstuff reviews to be delivered to him perfectly the way he likes it, and then insults the crap out of teh reviewer when his subjective opinions happen to differ, I'm going to start losing my patience pretty damn soon.

Constructive criticism is one thing, being a wang is quite another. Think about it please.

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Old Post 01-27-03 15:35 #
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Ed
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http://www.3ddownloads.com/showfile.php3?file_id=7293

Christ, Laz released this two some odd years ago.

Old Post 01-27-03 15:49 #
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myk
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pritch, that is sensible, and I pretty much agree. I personally prefer not to flame the reviewers (although I did get overly carried away postingwise last time with the discussion at hand, probably needlessly repeating myself and whatnot.) But what you say also loses some weight when the reviewer is overly harsh with the mappers, who have also spent a lot of time and energy on the maps... usually quite more than the reviewer spent on the reviews.

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Old Post 01-27-03 15:49 #
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Grazza
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myk said:
Haven't played anything new yet, but I guess I'll give Empyre a chance and try his WAD, notwithstanding the description... and the screenshots, he did request constructive criticism on another thread, after all.
I took a quick look at it, and while it has undeniable newbie characteristics, I don't think it deserved such a slamming. I went into it thinking NM should be a breeze, and got a nasty shock. With an improved monster population, these would be pretty decent maps. Or Empyre could just claim that they were "designed for NM". Anyway, he should certainly continue mapping.

Old Post 01-27-03 15:58 #
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icemann
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Pritch: I`m not the type to abuse a reviewer here normally ever. I`ve been coming to this site for a fair few years now and had NEVER flamed a reviewer before. But in this case I made an exception due to the reasons I already mentioned above, which I`m not going to re-type as you can simply scroll up and re-read them if you didn`t get the point I was getting at. When a reviewer isn`t doing their job properly you bloody well let them know, otherwise it continues.

If someone did a review of Doom and said in their review "It's an ok game but since I have a 386 PC it ran slow as anything, which is totally unacceptable and so its a crap game" without mentioning anything of the game itself, the gameplay, the music etc, you`d be REALLY PISSED OFF, if you read that as a review at a site you went to regulary, as its obviously a very poorly done review. And so you`d go to the forums and flame the prick or at the very least complain in some way or form, which is what I`ve done.

If you do a poorly done review, your going to get flamed, and its as simple as that Pritch. Now you may not like that, and you have my permission to go cry to your mother if you don`t like it, but thats just what happens in these cases.

OOH DEAR, I HOPE I'M NOT GOING TO BE SARCY WITH PRITCH AGAIN, BECAUSE I KNOW HE WON'T LIKE IT AND I MIGHT GET MORE THAN I BARGAINED FOR!!

Old Post 01-27-03 16:48 #
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Hyena
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icemann said:
I agree with Ling 100% on Arctic Wolf. I was COMPLETELY shocked with the crap review that Hyena gave of Arctic Wolf, as I`d played it a few years back and didn`t have the slightest problem whatsoever with it, and even if I had had problems, common sense would have told me to go to the website of the author to see if there were bug fixes to fix with whatever bug I`d been experiencing since its a fucken TC for gods sake, not a normal everyday wad, obviously your lacking the common sense to do something like that Hyena.

And not one mention was made as to the quality of the new graphics, sounds, enemies, weapons, and of the levels themselves.

Time to get a new reviewer Doomworld, cause that was a very fucked up review of easily the best TC so far released for doom2 to date. And when a reviewer spends his entire review of a wad, tc or whatever just complaining about dehacked patches, when he should be actually reviewing the LEVELS, its an easy way to see how bad a reviewer they are.

And trying to make out like batman doom was better is just laughable. Yeah its a bloody good TC, but next to Arctic Wolf, and the Wolfendoom TCs ingeneral its an ant next to an elephant.



Arctic Wolf was UNPLAYABLE! If it has a good flow and perfect difficulty and great sprites and architecture, it's all moot if you can't play the damn wad.
The knife deselect is a major bug that makes it next to impossible to enjoy the wad. Also, forcing the player to switch patches half-way through the wad is something that most doomers are not going to have the patience for.

Maybe you played a version a few years back that didn't have a crippling bug that works on every engine I test it on, but in any case it's not the player's responsibility to fix a bug in the author's wad. Common sense my ass. My job is to review what is uploaded to the archive.

And, you know what? Every week I consider quitting newstuff because there's always some prick who gives me a hard time for the work I spent all week on. What the hell is the point in doing the community a service if people are going to throw it in your face?

As for authors spending more time and effort on their wads than I do on my reviews:
1. The people who make wads like this do it for themselves and hopefully to get a few fans who enjoy it. They don't have any obligations to the community. If they decide they don't want to put any more effort in, they don't have to.
2. Authors do not have deadlines. One week to do all these reviews is always very constricting, and I always end up putting the finishing touches on at the last minute. This means putting careful thought into everything I write so I get exactly the meaning across that I'm trying to, even though some people get offended before they even read a whole sentence. It also means I have to play through twenty or so maps, take screenshots, sift through screenshots, pick ones worth keeping, go back and retake screenshots because there's an imp fireball in the way of the nice looking guard tower, and keep replaying them because I keep dying.

So frankly, let Doomworld get themselves a new reviewer. Maybe you can be the next reviewer. You try telling people that a wad isn't any good and see how they appreciate your honesty.

In the words of Linguica: Get off my internet.

Old Post 01-27-03 19:02 #
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Hyena
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icemann said:
If someone did a review of Doom and said in their review "It's an ok game but since I have a 386 PC it ran slow as anything, which is totally unacceptable and so its a crap game"


The 386 is the reviewer's problem. The bug in Arctic Wolf is not.

Old Post 01-27-03 19:05 #
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myk
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That seems reasonable, Hyena. If you're not having fun and feel peeved at the replies you get, there's no point doing it. But anyway, I bet you're not doing it anymore cause of more important matters taking up your time, not because some dude complained.

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Old Post 01-27-03 19:21 #
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The Ultimate DooMer
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[an_attempt_to_get_this_thread_on_topic]

The Sin City wads were pretty cool. Great architecture and scripting etc. and use of ZDoom features. A bit easy for me (especially when you're in the middle of HR) but apart from that it's great, and another wad that shows why ZDoom is the best port.

[/an_attempt_to_get_this_thread_on_topic]

Old Post 01-27-03 19:43 #
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Hyena
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I'm not quite quitting. But I don't have much motivation to stay.

Old Post 01-27-03 20:11 #
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Hyena
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Ultimate DooMer said:
[an_attempt_to_get_this_thread_on_topic]

The Sin City wads were pretty cool. Great architecture and scripting etc. and use of ZDoom features. A bit easy for me (especially when you're in the middle of HR) but apart from that it's great, and another wad that shows why ZDoom is the best port.

[/an_attempt_to_get_this_thread_on_topic]



Well put. But I wouldn't say Zdoom is the *best* port. Definitely one of the best.

Old Post 01-27-03 20:19 #
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Use3D
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Hyena said:
I'm not quite quitting. But I don't have much motivation to stay.


Sheesh, you're right about Arctic wolf, you already said you were pressed for time on these reviews, and whoever uploaded Arctic fucked up by not including the files needed to make it work right. The fact still stands, we all played it, we know it's a good tc, so people like icemann can just shut up and slag off.

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Old Post 01-27-03 20:20 #
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Job
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The plus (and general idea) to having wads reviewed is so that you have a general concept of what kind of map you're downloading before even doing so. And even though reviews are supposed to be objective, anyone, I repeat anyone, who reviews a game/wad/book/play/what have you, will be somewhat subjective. People will bring that into the mix. That's just how it works. Anyone who disagrees with that is being an irrational fuckhat. Point is, you can't blame the reviewer because he/she is being a little less than god-like in their perspective. You'd do the same thing, even to a fraction of a degree, if you tried to review, despite your best efforts. So give them a break. It's just a flaw inherent in the system of reviews that we've come to rely upon. Don't bitch about it (or flame the reviewers) unless you can come up with a better way to give people an idea of what they're downloading, because it won't always happen to be the case that everyone will have a common view of the merits or flaws of a map or whatever is being reviewed.

Old Post 01-27-03 20:30 #
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myk
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Redundant and relatively pointless, Vulg@r: The "bitching" will go away once we accept that the bitching (either as part of a review, or on the reply thread... we're all human and we all do that sort of thing once in a while) is bound to show up here or there in one degree or another.

Consider this too, the WADs are new. Here we found something significant; that the TC was uploaded inappropiately. That's a significant find. Last time we had the oppoortunity to discuss DEUSF applicability and functionality, also instructive in a way, now we might know more about how to deal with the matter.

We possibly expect too much of the comments thread. At least there is discussions of some sort, and once in a while discussions about gameplay or design pop up. But you gotta let those come as they may, and not expect too much as the WADs are relatively unknown to us.

Hyena, you make maps too, you know it's not always easy to edit. So if you think of it, authors aren't in a very different sitation (in respect to reviewers.) Even fans will get carried away sometimes, when they feel identified.

And I'm not telling you to change anything you do (the reviewing) just encouraging you not to get annoyed at the replies. I mean, there were some replies that kind of attacked you, but there were also ones that understood the matter of the TC and even brought info that made sense in relation to your review (the fact that the file was missing an important fix.)

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Old Post 01-27-03 20:49 #
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Job
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I agree with you, Myk. There needs to be an atmosphere that is more tolerant of other views and patient as well. I guess if no one can agree in the end, it comes down to tolerance being key.

Old Post 01-27-03 20:54 #
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Hyena
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myk said:
Redundant and relatively pointless, Vulg@r: The "bitching" will go away once we accept that the bitching (either as part of a review, or on the reply thread... we're all human and we all do that sort of thing once in a while) is bound to show up here or there in one degree or another.

Consider this too, the WADs are new. Here we found something significant; that the TC was uploaded inappropiately. That's a significant find. Last time we had the oppoortunity to discuss DEUSF applicability and functionality, also instructive in a way, now we might know more about how to deal with the matter.

We possibly expect too much of the comments thread. At least there is discussions of some sort, and once in a while discussions about gameplay or design pop up. But you gotta let those come as they may, and not expect too much as the WADs are relatively unknown to us.

Hyena, you make maps too, you know it's not always easy to edit. So if you think of it, authors aren't in a very different sitation (in respect to reviewers.) Even fans will get carried away sometimes, when they feel identified.

And I'm not telling you to change anything you do (the reviewing) just encouraging you not to get annoyed at the replies. I mean, there were some replies that kind of attacked you, but there were also ones that understood the matter of the TC and even brought info that made sense in relation to your review (the fact that the file was missing an important fix.)



I have no disrespect for mappers. In fact every time I write a bad review I hope I see more improved wads from the same authors.
The fact is that if whoever uploaded the Arctic wad had play-tested it a little they could have saved some players a lot of grief. If I hadn't said anything, probably about twenty or so people would be here complaining that the stupid knife thing is screwing up. And many others wouldn't even say anything, but just play it once, delete it and move on to other wads.

I think I prevented more grief from potential downloaders than grief I caused for one Irate fan.
By the way, saying Arctic Wolf is an elephant to an ant compared to Batman Doom might be accurate. You know, if we're talking about a dwarf elevant and a giant killer ant that destroys cities.

Old Post 01-27-03 21:06 #
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I'm not sure what everyone is getting upset about, I mean, the reviewer reviews what is given to him. Releasing something with bugs that render it unplayable is generally considered bad, though obviously this is an error on the part of whoever decided to upload this. Generally though if I come across a wad that doesn't work properly I'll delete it because I have better things to do really, regardless of it being Arctic Wolf or not.

Anyway, quit with the retarded flaming. The reviewer's opinion isn't law, and you are allowed to formulate your own opinions on the maps that differ from those of the reviewer, you know. God forbid someone else dislike something that you like, you goddamn babies.

Old Post 01-27-03 22:10 #
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rf`
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UAC PR Dept. said:
Someone screwed up. In Arctic Wolf(which is a few years old if I remember correctly), the knife/switch bug was fixed long, long ago. The latest version on Laz' site is fixed, and you can even download the patch there.

WTF? Why would he upload this now?


Wait, weren't you banned?

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Old Post 01-27-03 22:23 #
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