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Szymanski

Posts: 979
Registered: 08-00

Jonathan said:
Bits look good, like when he's falling down the hole, and the fight in the stadium, but overall the art direction is very uninspiring. I've said it before, but when the original Duke was often bright and cartoonish, why were they making DNF so drab?

Its been rumoured the stadium fight is taken from a Duke Nukem 3D arcade cabinet at the start of the game. Large sections look to have placeholder textures, I assume it was thrown together pretty quickly.

05-10-09 17:32 #

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exp(x)

Posts: 2226
Registered: 04-04

TheeXile said:
So they were going for the "look down and see your own feet" approach? Meh.

Duke Nukem 3D meets Trespasser

05-10-09 18:29 #

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SoM
azerty YAY!

Posts: 266
Registered: 03-02

Honestly, they should have finished and released the game they had based on the Quake2 engine so many years ago. From the footage I've seen it looked pretty good! Then after releasing one game, they could have released another duke game which met their technological demands, made tons more money and still been in business.

05-10-09 18:29 #

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Zaldron
Sex Cauldron

Posts: 9916
Registered: 08-00

TheeXile said:
So they were going for the "look down and see your own feet" approach? Meh.

What the hell is wrong with this?

05-10-09 20:23 #

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bardcat
Mini-Member

Posts: 71
Registered: 06-02

Snarboo said:
3 minutes of game footage has been leaked. Most of it are level tests and animation renders, but what little there looked pretty badass.

that looks like, ridiculously fun. fuck 3drealms for not completing this.

05-10-09 21:03 #

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Jonathan
I am not a leet hax0r :(

Posts: 667
Registered: 05-00

Szymanski said:
...thrown together pretty quickly.

12 years

05-10-09 21:06 #

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Vegeta
I don't "POST WAREZ, POST WAREZ!" anymore

Posts: 2635
Registered: 02-02

Nice

05-10-09 22:05 #

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Gez
Why don't I have a custom title by now?!

Posts: 6454
Registered: 07-07

SoM said:
Honestly, they should have finished and released the game they had based on the Quake2 engine so many years ago. From the footage I've seen it looked pretty good! Then after releasing one game, they could have released another duke game which met their technological demands, made tons more money and still been in business.

Of course, that footage was 100% scripted scene and 0% actual gameplay.

I think their problem is that they created and recreated assets endlessly, but never actually made a game -- you know, levels and game balance.

05-10-09 22:53 #

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SoM
azerty YAY!

Posts: 266
Registered: 03-02

Gez said:

Of course, that footage was 100% scripted scene and 0% actual gameplay.

I think their problem is that they created and recreated assets endlessly, but never actually made a game -- you know, levels and game balance.

Yeah I understand but the fact is they would still be in a better situation now if they had just released the ultra-scripted linear-fest.

05-10-09 23:27 #

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TheeXile
Haha owned

Posts: 631
Registered: 02-09

Zaldron said:

Not really, there were some unfinished/cautionary hooks to something called MegaTexture in early id Tech 4, something that wasn't fleshed out until Quake Wars came out, but the mechanism is pretty much limited to terrain meshes, whereas id Tech 5 uses it everywhere (that being terrain meshes, static brushes, and dynamic models).

I just found out there's a version of Torque (*shudder*) with similar technology, apparently. Though yeah it's terrain-only, so it's not really the same.

Zaldron said:

What the hell is wrong with this?

Nothing's wrong. It's just a bit of superfluous, unoriginal novelty.

Last edited by TheeXile on 05-11-09 at 02:04

05-10-09 23:39 #

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Gez
Why don't I have a custom title by now?!

Posts: 6454
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TheeXile said:
Nothing's wrong. It's just a bit of superfluous, unoriginal novelty.

Not seeing your feet isn't the pinnacle of originality either.

05-11-09 00:20 #

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TheeXile
Haha owned

Posts: 631
Registered: 02-09

Gez said:

Not seeing your feet isn't the pinnacle of originality either.

But if it was something that contributed to the 12 year development time, I could probably have lived without it.

Meh. The whole project clearly made a mess of its priorities to begin with.

05-11-09 02:03 #

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Zaldron
Sex Cauldron

Posts: 9916
Registered: 08-00

It's more of a given these days, kind of like... I don't know, manual reloading, iron sights, crouching. Things that were novel once but now can't live without them unless the main gimmick somehow takes its absence into consideration.

05-11-09 03:38 #

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lupinx-Kassman
Senior Member

Posts: 1249
Registered: 10-06

Personally I prefer to be able to see your own feet as opposed to feeling like a pair of ghostly arms hovering along corridors. What would it really take away from anyway?

05-11-09 03:44 #

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Cutman
Junior Member

Posts: 216
Registered: 05-05

Zaldron said:
I don't know, manual reloading, iron sights, crouching. Things that were novel once but now can't live without them unless the main gimmick somehow takes its absence into consideration.

Stick a cover system on that list.

05-11-09 14:25 #

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caco_killer
Senior Member

Posts: 1075
Registered: 01-05

lupinx-Kassman said:
Personally I prefer to be able to see your own feet as opposed to feeling like a pair of ghostly arms hovering along corridors. What would it really take away from anyway?

It would take away absolutely nothing. It's just a minor detail.

05-11-09 14:47 #

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Mancubus II
Purple is not a breakfast color

Posts: 1806
Registered: 02-03

TheeXile said:
But if it was something that contributed to the 12 year development time, I could probably have lived without it.

Meh. The whole project clearly made a mess of its priorities to begin with.

I highly doubt that's the case - UE3 probably makes this much more feasible. When you're playing a character with no name and it's supposed to be you then MAYBE it's ok not to see the rest of the body, but when you're playing a character WITH a name, you are embodying him and should these days be able to see the damn body! It's 2009, this is not something that should be considered novelty; it should be considered the norm, part of an FPS.

I'm always for more sitting/laying down/seeing the body etc in the first person view.

05-11-09 16:52 #

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Torn
google is your master

Posts: 2738
Registered: 07-02

exp(x) said:

Duke Nukem 3D meets Trespasser

But in trespasser it wasn't feet you could see. HEHE! :P

05-11-09 19:43 #

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exp(x)

Posts: 2226
Registered: 04-04

Torn said:
But in trespasser it wasn't feet you could see. HEHE! :P

Haha, yeah. I was so mesmerized by the cleavage when I installed Trespasser that I didn't notice the game sucked.

05-11-09 20:24 #

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Pirx
Member

Posts: 522
Registered: 11-04

exp(x) said:

Haha, yeah. I was so mesmerized by the cleavage when I installed Trespasser that I didn't notice the game sucked.

yeah, it was pretty much the only good part that game had. but anyway, while being able to see your feet or whatever is not 100% novelty or a priority, i think it's a nice touch that adds to the immersion of the game. duke3d could take a leak though, now you could look down while doing it.

dnf's failure is another example of how people should go for the next thing, not try to re-invent the wheel. 3dr could have released a kickass game in 2001 using the unreal/ut engine and be at the 6th instalment now.

05-11-09 20:38 #

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Necros20
Junior Member

Posts: 190
Registered: 12-07

At least Daikatana was eventually released.

05-11-09 21:17 #

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Ed
Senior Member

Posts: 1007
Registered: 07-01

John Romero's image isn't nearly as tarnished as the heads of 3D Reams. Daikatana was a fiasco that resulted in a lousy game that in the end generated more lulz than anything else. Duke Nukem Forever is the Titanic set sail with no rudder into a vast and unforgiving tar pit, set ablaze and left to burn for twelve agonizing years. Eventually sinking quietly into the night and taking countless careers with it.

If Romero stepped back into the spotlight and started to develop mainstream titles again I don't think Daikatana would completely put me off from it. I wouldn't trust George Broussard to program a Tetris clone for wrist watch.

05-12-09 04:00 #

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Snarboo
Forum Staple

Posts: 2068
Registered: 09-04

John Romero's image wasn't just tarnished by the terribleness of Daikatana, however. It was also destroyed by the mismanagement of Ion Storm and the various shenanigans that came from it such as the terrible ad campaign. His career has effectively been ruined. He hasn't worked on anything of note within the last 10 years, and that doesn't look to be changing.

I won't argue that George Broussard didn't mismanage 3DR into oblivion, but he's actually kept mum about it, making it hard to speculate as to what the hell happened. 3DR was also smart enough to work on other titles while DNF was cooking, such as various Duke spinoffs, Shadow Warrior, Max Payne and Prey. The latter two were pretty successful, Max Payne creating a real franchise that made a lot of money for 3DR and also spawned a (terrible) movie, while a sequal to Prey is in development with Scott Miller's Radar Group.

I'd say most of the talent behind DNF's current incarnation won't have trouble finding work if the leaked material is anything to go by. It's pretty impressive. As for George Broussard, who knows, but he was less a rockstar like Romero and more of just a manager.

05-12-09 08:00 #

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TheeXile
Haha owned

Posts: 631
Registered: 02-09

I think the problem is when they built Duke 3d they had a clear, distinct goal in mind: Make a Doom killer. When that was done, however, they had no clear, distinct goal for DNF. They had instead an implicit obligation for a sequel and an overwhelming expectation for its quality placed upon them. No wonder they failed.

Last edited by TheeXile on 05-12-09 at 13:18

05-12-09 08:23 #

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LogicDeLuxe
Member

Posts: 628
Registered: 08-03

TheeXile said:
Make a Doom killer.

Shouldn't the obvious sequel a Quake killer, then? Followed by an Unreal killer and so on?

05-12-09 09:28 #

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GreyGhost
a ghost... only grey

Posts: 5186
Registered: 01-08

They did that with the last two engine changes, so the logical next step was a Duke killer - oops.

05-12-09 13:04 #

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printz
CRAZY DUMB ZEALOT

Posts: 6126
Registered: 06-06

I really want John Romero to skip his shame and release another shooter with main character's face at the status bar and taunting messages at exit. A potential Doom 4 killer, heh.

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05-12-09 15:18 #