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DooMAD
Bitcoin IS a religion.


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hardcore_gamer said:
I personally think your reactions are completely overblown.


By all means feel free to move here and suffer through it. I personally don't trust this government's motives. I see this newly built infrastructure as steps to something bigger; the means to an end. The more vague and sweeping legislation they bring in, the less freedom we'll have. Not just on the internet, but in everyday life too (as pointed out in my previous links).

Old Post 07-29-13 20:06 #
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Technician
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DooMAD said:
By all means feel free to move here and suffer through it.
Iceland is pulling the same shit.


hardcore_gamer said:
I don't want porn to be banned, but I completley disagree with the idea that the internet should be some kind of a lawless international water where people can just do as they please with there being no effects from bad behavior.
People should be accountable for hurt feelings, eh?

Last edited by Technician on 07-29-13 at 20:38

Old Post 07-29-13 20:33 #
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Springy
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Technician said:
Iceland is pulling the same shit.

Looks like Hardcore_Gamer will be out of a Hardcore_Wank then.[/LameJoke] In all seriousness though; this is just complete internet censorship, I mean what sort of damage does it cause to a person? Nothing. Parents have the right to parental controls over the internet in order to prevent their children from viewing the videos so I fail to see how it should be considered for a ban. Is it only Britain and Iceland following this? Edit: Mind you though, there is a good cause to this which will prevent child pornography from appearing. As I heard that this was triggered due to the April Jones case so I can definitely see why this ban came to fruition.

Last edited by Springy on 07-29-13 at 22:12

Old Post 07-29-13 22:00 #
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Technician
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Springy said:
Edit: Mind you though, there is a good cause to this which will prevent child pornography from appearing. As I heard that this was triggered due to the April Jones case so I can definitely see why this ban came to fruition.
Except anyone with half a brain knows this won't stop the digital distribution of child pornography, at all.

Old Post 07-29-13 22:18 #
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Springy
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Technician said:
Except anyone with half a brain knows this won't stop the digital distribution of child pornography, at all.

Very true. There will still be a way of distribution. For example pirated software; even though most ISP's ban sites like that there is still a way to get to said sites.

Old Post 07-29-13 22:21 #
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Technician
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Springy said:
Very true. There will still be a way of distribution. For example pirated software; even though most ISP's ban sites like that there is still a way to get to said sites.
No, I mean their current plan of action is so pedestrian it isn't even going to effect the current way of distribution.

This is just black listing and profiling.

Old Post 07-29-13 22:26 #
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fraggle
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hardcore_gamer said:
I don't want porn to be banned, but I completley disagree with the idea that the internet should be some kind of a lawless international water where people can just do as they please with there being no effects from bad behavior.

Except this has nothing to do with enforcing the law. There's nothing illegal about looking at pornography (as long as it's of consenting adults). This is about a centralised authority imposing its own narrow moral ideals upon the populace.


While it is true that some kind of a "internet police" could be abused, that same thing also applies to conventional police. If we accept the existence of a conventional police even though it can sometimes be abused, there are aren't really any good arguments against an internet police. Thus I am fairly supportive of the government being able to regulate the internet.
There isn't even a need for an "internet police" because the conventional police already exist and have the power to enforce laws. In terms of actual police powers, if Cameron was serious about enforcing law on the Internet, he wouldn't be cutting funding to CEOP.

And, it bears pointing out: the censorship infrastructure that Cameron wants to impose is not even being promoted as a tool for law enforcement. It's literally just there to try to cover things up that certain right wingers think is "icky". This proposal is the worst kind of bad politics: ineffective, heavy-handed edicts from people who are clearly technologically illiterate, disregard for widespread industry objections, and no supporting evidence or reasoning. At best it's a desperate attempt to gain support from tabloid newspapers, at worst it's a deliberate attempt to put systems in place to suppress the Internet.


Springy said:
Edit: Mind you though, there is a good cause to this which will prevent child pornography from appearing. As I heard that this was triggered due to the April Jones case so I can definitely see why this ban came to fruition.
I'm pretty sure the majority of child abuse images nowadays are probably being shared on anonymity networks like Tor. This does nothing to stop that from taking place. If there are sites on the open Internet distributing that material, censoring it is not the solution to the problem: the servers hosting it should be being identified and shut down. Covering it up with a censorship system like this is actually a pretty ridiculous response.

Old Post 07-29-13 23:35 #
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hardcore_gamer
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fraggle said:
There's nothing illegal about looking at pornography (as long as it's of consenting adults).


Porn has never been legal in Iceland. Before people had widespread access to the internet the only way anyone could get porn in Iceland was by smuggling it from foreign countries. The people who argue for a ban on internet porn in Iceland argue that the state would merely be enforcing a ban that is already in place, and while I don't personally feel porn should be illegal they technically aren't wrong.


As much as I hate to admit it, unless the porn laws in Iceland are changed people here are technically breaking the law whenever they visit a porn site and thus it's pretty much the only real legal excuse the government needs to shut down access to these sites. Things aren't made any better by the fact that there is actual real widespread support here for porn to stay banned.

Its also important that you guys understand that unlike most western nations Iceland has never been very liberal when it comes to pornographic material. Strip clubs are illegal here, and I remember there being a case some years ago where some guy tried to start a porn company/studio even in spite of the ban but changed his mind both because of the social backslash and because the police confronted him about it.

Thankfully, the police and the state currently haven' been able to or simply haven't been arsed to go through the effort required to block internet porn, but this has more to do with the fact that the government is spending its time on other more important things instead.

Old Post 07-30-13 01:48 #
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Technician
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hardcore_gamer said:
Porn has never been legal in Iceland. Before people had widespread access to the internet the only way anyone could get porn in Iceland was by smuggling it from foreign countries. The people who argue for a ban on internet porn in Iceland argue that the state would merely be enforcing a ban that is already in place, and while I don't personally feel porn should be illegal they technically aren't wrong.


As much as I hate to admit it, unless the porn laws in Iceland are changed people here are technically breaking the law whenever they visit a porn site and thus it's pretty much the only real legal excuse the government needs to shut down access to these sites. Things aren't made any better by the fact that there is actual real widespread support here for porn to stay banned.

Its also important that you guys understand that unlike most western nations Iceland has never been very liberal when it comes to pornographic material. Strip clubs are illegal here, and I remember there being a case some years ago where some guy tried to start a porn company/studio even in spite of the ban but changed his mind both because of the social backslash and because the police confronted him about it.

Thankfully, the police and the state currently haven' been able to or simply haven't been arsed to go through the effort required to block internet porn, but this has more to do with the fact that the government is spending its time on other more important things instead.

The more I read about Iceland the less appealing it becomes.

Old Post 07-30-13 02:24 #
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Clonehunter
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Thank God I'm not in Britain losing all of my Princess Leia and Catwoman Nudes

Old Post 07-30-13 04:18 #
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Sokoro
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hardcore_gamer said:


Porn has never been legal in Iceland. Before people had widespread access to the internet the only way anyone could get porn in Iceland was by smuggling it from foreign countries. The people who argue for a ban on internet porn in Iceland argue that the state would merely be enforcing a ban that is already in place, and while I don't personally feel porn should be illegal they technically aren't wrong.


As much as I hate to admit it, unless the porn laws in Iceland are changed people here are technically breaking the law whenever they visit a porn site and thus it's pretty much the only real legal excuse the government needs to shut down access to these sites. Things aren't made any better by the fact that there is actual real widespread support here for porn to stay banned.

Its also important that you guys understand that unlike most western nations Iceland has never been very liberal when it comes to pornographic material. Strip clubs are illegal here, and I remember there being a case some years ago where some guy tried to start a porn company/studio even in spite of the ban but changed his mind both because of the social backslash and because the police confronted him about it.

Thankfully, the police and the state currently haven' been able to or simply haven't been arsed to go through the effort required to block internet porn, but this has more to do with the fact that the government is spending its time on other more important things instead.



Looks like an another case of a place on the beautifull Earth to be infected by fáviti humans.

And it is not about porn, from the first link which DooMaD posted, it seems that they want to block websites just because they have forum? what is this BS? Most of the websites on the internet have their forum, imo. And there are many helpfull forums on the internet, forums where people help each other to fix their infected website, or forums where people discuss their favorite hobby, (like this doomworld), etc.

This whole blocklist is garbage. Your goverment is terrorizing your country.

Last edited by Sokoro on 07-30-13 at 17:09

Old Post 07-30-13 13:22 #
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TimeOfDeath
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In Canada they show nudity on over-the-air / broadcast / terrestrial tv channels. Hook up an antenna to your tv and you've got free high-def nudity! I hope the US starts doing that soon.

Old Post 07-30-13 15:04 #
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dew
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we get tits on tv after 22:00 when all the brats are asleep. the society of czech republic is on the brink of moral collapse, of course.

Old Post 07-30-13 17:45 #
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fraggle
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hardcore_gamer said:
Porn has never been legal in Iceland. Before people had widespread access to the internet the only way anyone could get porn in Iceland was by smuggling it from foreign countries. The people who argue for a ban on internet porn in Iceland argue that the state would merely be enforcing a ban that is already in place, and while I don't personally feel porn should be illegal they technically aren't wrong.

As much as I hate to admit it, unless the porn laws in Iceland are changed people here are technically breaking the law whenever they visit a porn site and thus it's pretty much the only real legal excuse the government needs to shut down access to these sites. Things aren't made any better by the fact that there is actual real widespread support here for porn to stay banned.

Its also important that you guys understand that unlike most western nations Iceland has never been very liberal when it comes to pornographic material. Strip clubs are illegal here, and I remember there being a case some years ago where some guy tried to start a porn company/studio even in spite of the ban but changed his mind both because of the social backslash and because the police confronted him about it.

The law in your country is wrong and civilly disobeying it is justified. Nothing you've said here justifies censoring the Internet; Iceland should be fixing its outdated laws, not making them worse than they already are.

Old Post 07-30-13 18:12 #
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geo
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I wonder if porn restriction will result in marriages or rapes.

China bans things...

Some republican running for governor of Virginia wants to ban oral sex >> http://www.ctvnews.ca/politics/repu...l-sex-1.1380291

Old Post 07-30-13 18:14 #
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hardcore_gamer
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geo said:


Some republican running for governor of Virginia wants to ban oral sex >> http://www.ctvnews.ca/politics/repu...l-sex-1.1380291



I can't imagine that a person who wants to ban blowjobs will be getting many votes.

I am not sure how he intends to enforce the ban either.

Old Post 07-30-13 19:07 #
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DoomUK
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All I can say is that I deeply regret voting for the Conservative party in the last elections.

By all means, castigate me for this. I deserve it.

Old Post 07-30-13 19:11 #
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hardcore_gamer
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DoomUK said:
All I can say is that I deeply regret voting for the Conservative party in the last elections.

By all means, castigate me for this. I deserve it.



What made you vote for them to begin with?

Old Post 07-30-13 19:32 #
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Gez
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geo said:
Some republican running for governor of Virginia wants to ban oral sex >> http://www.ctvnews.ca/politics/repu...l-sex-1.1380291

Because they are "crimes against nature" and "in a natural-law-based country, it's appropriate to have policies that reflect that."

Someone should give him some documentaries about animal sexuality, so as to redefine his conception of what is "natural law" and what is "against nature". This would be a good start. But even without looking into the sordid TMI of creepy-crawlies, anal and oral sex have been copiously documented among a number of mammals, from apes to bats.

The astounding thing with social conservatives is how, every time they say something, they are so completely and utterly wrong. It's like they are incapable of saying something that isn't instantly debunked by just looking outside of the Bible for a couple seconds.

Old Post 07-30-13 19:35 #
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hardcore_gamer
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Gez said:

The astounding thing with social conservatives is how, every time they say something, they are so completely and utterly wrong. It's like they are incapable of saying something that isn't instantly debunked by just looking outside of the Bible for a couple seconds.



This may be true for America but don't go around claiming all social conservatives everywhere are stupid.

I personally consider myself a social conservative, and yet I don't want porn or oral sex banned.

Old Post 07-30-13 20:05 #
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Maes
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Gez said:
The astounding thing with social conservatives is how, every time they say something, they are so completely and utterly wrong. It's like they are incapable of saying something that isn't instantly debunked by just looking outside of the Bible for a couple seconds.


Aaaaaand surprise surprise, that's why Islam appears in general more "successful" in becoming totally dominant over any country where it gains significant support: its policy is that "There are no other books besides the Qu'ran, typography shouldn't exist, and the Arab language, the only True Language, should be used to write down the Word of Allah, and nothing else". Guess why most Islamic states had a ban on typography until the early 20th century....

Old Post 07-30-13 20:37 #
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geo
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hardcore_gamer said:


I can't imagine that a person who wants to ban blowjobs will be getting many votes.

I am not sure how he intends to enforce the ban either.



Yeah its like laws against driving barefoot.... How do you know???

On the plus side though in cases of oral rape, this just means an extra charge. But an extra charge is like following a shooting with a stabbing.

At least bans against porn.... your ISP knows. I've had 2 friends get busted for downloading movies illegally. The ISP knows all!

Old Post 07-30-13 20:38 #
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Maes
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geo said:
At least bans against porn.... your ISP knows. I've had 2 friends get busted for downloading movies illegally. The ISP knows all!


The ISP couldn't care less about knowing what you do (which means investing time and money in surveillance software and personnel to sort through "red alerts" and investigate the most "interesting" cases), but, alas, performing surveillance for CERTAIN types of traffic is FORCED upon them by the majors and copyright enforcement firms, just like keeping records/copies of (selected) captured data traffic is imposed upon them by the government/police for "potential later use", often for an indeterminate amount of time. No complying? Then bye-bye ISP license, simple as that.

Old Post 07-30-13 20:46 #
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geo
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Maes said:


The ISP couldn't care less about knowing what you do (which means investing time and money in surveillance software and personnel to sort through "red alerts" and investigate the most "interesting" cases), but, alas, performing surveillance for CERTAIN types of traffic is FORCED upon them by the majors and copyright enforcement firms, just like keeping records/copies of (selected) captured data traffic is imposed upon them by the government/police for "potential later use", often for an indeterminate amount of time. No complying? Then bye-bye ISP license, simple as that.



Oh I know your ISP couldn't care less. But they could care more. Having 2 friends get their ISP shut off until they were forced to call in and have the ISP say we know you're downloading movies illegally now stop it means they're looking.... or someone is looking and told the ISP.

Old Post 07-30-13 21:04 #
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Maes
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They are obliged to look and report specific cases (e.g. use of uTorrent or eDonkey protocols, downloading from an index of "known bad" sites etc.) and required to report. It's really no different than paying the block's snitch to be your "eyes and ears".

Of course, as soon as someone develops a new super-encrypted or hardly traceable protocol, the surveillance software must be updated to cope with it, in a constant mouse & mousetrap game. The appearance of a new protocol might stall whoever is watching until it's completely reversed engineered or decrypted (there must be a sizeable quantity of "sphinx" and "ghost" traffic on the Web, with unknown specifications, final destination, and encryption status, which can baffle even entities such as the NSA, at least for a while).

Last edited by Maes on 07-30-13 at 21:27

Old Post 07-30-13 21:22 #
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darknation
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DoomUK said:
All I can say is that I deeply regret voting for the Conservative party in the last elections.

By all means, castigate me for this. I deserve it.

yeah you should have voted lib dem.

Old Post 07-30-13 22:36 #
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hardcore_gamer
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darknation said:
yeah you should have voted lib dem.


While there are a lot of dumb conservatives, I feel that liberals are even dumber.

Sure its annoying when some dumb conservative talks about how porn should be banned, but at least they don't (in my country anyways) want to throw millions of our welfare money into immigrants and foreigners on the bases that its the "right thing to do" at the same time our hospitals can't even afford to pay its staff.

It really makes me rage to hear these stupid dipshits insist that I am a racist who doesn't care about people when I tell them that our welfare state should not be importing more people who need to use welfare. If they care about people then how about making sure that our own hospitals are actually run properly and aren't starved for money BEFORE we start to throw money at people who don't even live here?

And that's not even mentioning how stupid it is that they just feel it is normal that foreigners should feel entitled to welfare money in the first place. Why don't they just expect them to get a job like everybody else?

Say what you want about the annoying social conservatives, at least they are (typically) at least semi-competent when it comes to the things that matter the most (economy).

Old Post 07-31-13 01:50 #
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Clonehunter
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Liberals and COnservatives have become equally retarded.

As such we should cast every member of the senate into a grand Presidential Porno titled "Weener Smacking Wanks Playing Presi"

Old Post 07-31-13 04:09 #
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grouchbag
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GOOD FOR THEM!

Old Post 07-31-13 06:35 #
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hex11
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Maes said:

Of course, as soon as someone develops a new super-encrypted or hardly traceable protocol, the surveillance software must be updated to cope with it, in a constant mouse & mousetrap game.



That's why I do all my shady stuff on gopher - it confuses the hell out of everyone. ;-)

OTOH, might not be too long before people start setting up local BBS type systems again, but using wireless, optical, and/or direct wired links (over their own copper or fiber) all outside the prying eyes of telcos, ISPs, and the fedz. And of course, sneakernet and such. As the old saying goes: "don't underestimate the bandwidth of a station wagon full of backup tapes driving down the highway at 70mph." ;-)

Old Post 07-31-13 07:17 #
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