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Carnevil
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Gez said:


This is a stroke of evil genius. Get all the achievement hunters busy making maps for you.


BRB, editing achievement! :P

Old Post 01-13-14 13:22 #
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Ragnor
I do see the humour in a mod sneakily changing my title


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I like that achievements can be edited. If a dev makes a really bad decision on one, it can be changed, reomved etc. Nothing like Quake 4 on 360 with the requirement to literally be the best player in the world to get all 1000 points..

Old Post 01-14-14 09:59 #
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Carnevil
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They probably can be on the 360 as well, but a). Once the game is done, the developers probably don't care, b). It used to cost a ton of money to release any sort of patch on consoles. I think that's changed and it's now free to do so, but there's a good reason console games used to not get any/many updates after release.

Old Post 01-14-14 11:06 #
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Shaviro
Team Future Chief


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Carnevil said:
By the way, I came across this video which I found to be pretty interesting. It's something we discussed in the previous Wrack thread in regards to silent protagonists.


Interesting video yes, but I'm not so sure about the conclusion. As a viewer of a movie you need to have a main character you can relate to for you to be properly immersed into the storytelling. So of course they are going to be in a neutral or generic/common zone. Neo and Luke aren't in any extreme of the spectrum, they are in the center grey area of personalities. That doesn't mean they're empty husks at all. You would never relate to an empty husk. The "same expression" thing is a bit of a stretch as well. Luke's face in the Empire clip is completely different from his face when Ben is murdered or when he discovers his torched home on Tatooine. Just because an actor doesn't go all Nicholas Cage on his part doesn't mean he's an empty husk without any character traits or doesn't have any valuable input to the movie other than simply being there for you to follow. You relate to these characters because they are in relatable positions. Main characters aren't simply empty vessels for the viewer. They are comparable people with comparable traits which allow you to become them. It's all a worthless exercise if they don't have an arc though as when they grow, you grow with them.

As for video games, you're not presented with one or more characters that you may or may not relate to; you are explicitly placed in the shoes of a character. Some games have a clear separation of action and character story while others strive for letting you shape the story (or at least the direction and flair). In the first category we have something like Max Payne where you basically have no influence of what happens in the story. You relate to Max and then steer him through some obstacles in order to see what happens next. Some shooters have done the same. Jedi Knight being one example. Other shooters go for the silent protagonist approach in the hopes that you will feel *you* are the main character. I've always felt this is a misunderstanding of storytelling in general. It has always been about having characters to relate to and then becoming them.

I would say the silent protagonist approach worked for Half-Life 1 because of the very scarce character cast. Not a whole lot of people to interact with, but from there on it has started to become silly and even illusion breaking. Games like Half-Life 2 felt stupid when people around you had long monologues, carefully crafted to avoid any input from Gordon. In Doom3 they one up this by showing the main character several times, but since he never says anything or acts at all we never really give a crap about him because he essentially doesn't exist - leaving the player disconnected from the world. It worked fine in classic Doom when nobody was around to interact with, but it's stupid beyond all reasoning when the doomguy encounters Swann and Campbell behind a glass pane, but doesn't say anything or hammer his fists on the glass to get their attention.

I guess a silent protagonist can work, but you have to be very careful how you craft it. Information should ideally come to you in ways other than monologues from other characters. If you do encounter other characters there should probably be some way to interact with them and if you have no voiceover for the player or selectable dialogue, one way to interact could be through your choices. Black Mesa has a part where a guy in a stall asks for toiletpaper. You can then throw a roll into that stall and he'll thank you. This is more of a gag than anything, but it illustrates how you can establish the link to other characters and the world without adding speech.

Old Post 01-14-14 11:59 #
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Carnevil
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Sorry Shaviro, but I don't have anything intelligent to add to what you just said :(

Anyway, we've got the trailer for the next update! This one features full mod support through Steam Workshop. I have a feeling that you guys will recognize the first mod to be added there! :)



Enjoy!

Old Post 01-16-14 18:15 #
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Ragnor
I do see the humour in a mod sneakily changing my title


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Carnevil said:
They probably can be on the 360 as well, but a). Once the game is done, the developers probably don't care, b). It used to cost a ton of money to release any sort of patch on consoles. I think that's changed and it's now free to do so, but there's a good reason console games used to not get any/many updates after release.


They can be edited on the One freely, and very rarely, on the 360 lists (Its against a big policy to do that, so its only critical stuff or a name change)

And yeah, used to be a $40000 fee for any patches after the very first one, thank god Minecraft ended that practice. Theres still the long slow certification process, but at least devs arent bleeding money whenever they make a bug that needs critical fixing. Sony used to have similar practices as well

Old Post 01-16-14 22:08 #
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Shaviro
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Nice mod! ;)

Anyway, don't worry about that. It's just another rant on game storytelling. It's extremely difficult to do proper storytelling in a fps. I can imagine the silent protagonist will work fine for Wrack. Not a lot of ingame dialogue, right?

Old Post 01-17-14 11:29 #
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Carnevil
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Shaviro said:
Nice mod! ;)


Now that's a pun I could have used for the update name! Where were you when I was racking (!!!) my brain yesterday trying to come up with something? :P


Shaviro said:

Anyway, don't worry about that. It's just another rant on game storytelling. It's extremely difficult to do proper storytelling in a fps. I can imagine the silent protagonist will work fine for Wrack. Not a lot of ingame dialogue, right?


Yeah, I hear you, and it is. Exposition can't go on for very long because people want to get to playing, and then you run the risk of rushing things, and blah blah. What's worse is that so many people want to pigeonhole it as an "oldschool FPS" so they don't even give it a chance because "Doom didn't have a story!"

There's not that much dialogue, and no one-liners or anything while playing. I think it all works - just needs some refining.

Old Post 01-17-14 21:45 #
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kristus
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Personally, I wouldn't mind an option to just skip all of the story all the time in games like Wrack and it's like. Yeah you can skip cutscenes/story bits by hitting a key. But I don't even want to be reminded that there is a story. Because I really could not care less about story, and being reminded of it only annoys me.

Now there are of course games that I don't feel like that about. But those games are having a lot more effort put into the story. Games like System Shock (1-2), Deus Ex, Shadowrun Returns. Those are games that got a rich deep story to tell, and that makes it meaningful (and they all deal with the protagonist in different ways, SS got silent, Deus Ex got a more or less predefined and Shadowrun is more into role playing). In games like Half Life and and Doom3 the story mostly just serve to piss me off because it's so useless that there's no reason to bother with it and it just gets in the way.

Old Post 01-17-14 23:00 #
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geo
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HL2 can't skip the story. I never gave a fuck about it. Since everything is told in game.... can't skip it.

Knee Deep in the Dead seems to be the big selling point of this new update.

Old Post 01-18-14 12:50 #
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kristus
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heh, yeah that's the worst when you got NPCs holding you hostage while they spout exposition.

Old Post 01-18-14 16:24 #
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geo
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Til I took an arrow through the knee.

RPGs are big on dialog, but I play RPGs for the game of chess that they are. I never actually pay attention to dialog until I've sank a few hours into a game.

Old Post 01-18-14 16:46 #
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Carnevil
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Update is out!

http://www.wrackgame.com/img/updates/GetYourModOn_thumb.png

Tons of new modding support in this one - including full Steam Workshop support! Submitting/updating your maps and mods is done through WrackEd (which has a really nice interface for doing so), and playing stuff you subscribe to through Wrack is a breeze! Really excited about this one, as I think this is going to really get things going. There's already some cool mods up, including a new HUD, and of course, Knee-Deep in the Dead!

Old Post 01-20-14 19:54 #
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kristus
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Tried running that Kneedeep mod just to test. But when I set it up in the workshop menu it said I should startt a new game and it would load. But it didn't.

EDIT: Apparently you have to restart the game after.

Old Post 01-20-14 22:51 #
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sgtcrispy
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Odd, I tried it and it did say you had to restart the game.

Old Post 01-21-14 02:03 #
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Carnevil
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I'll probably have some sort of popup menu telling you that you have to restart upon selecting a mod.

Old Post 01-21-14 04:58 #
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Lizardcommando
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Damn, every time those update emails get sent out, I'm always too late to get one of those activation codes :(

Old Post 01-21-14 06:51 #
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Carnevil
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I know some of you have been wanting more in terms of rocket jumping and verticality, so I think you'll be pleased to know that...

Old Post 01-30-14 16:22 #
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Krispy
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Please give more rocket ammo!

Old Post 01-30-14 17:34 #
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Carnevil
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There's plenty of it on that new level. Is it level 6 that you feel doesn't have enough?

Old Post 01-31-14 04:10 #
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Krispy
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Naw, I'm just excited to start using the rocket jump :D
If you already accounted for all the extra ammo usage, good job.

Old Post 01-31-14 06:13 #
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Carnevil
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Yeah, there's plenty of it. It's a bonus level, so there's all sorts of treasure, max. armor/health bonuses, ammo, etc.

Old Post 01-31-14 08:39 #
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Krispy
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Say, Carn, I didn't notice any changing lighting, like the flashing lights in doom (or maybe I missed it). Do you plan on incorporating atmospheric stuff like that?

Old Post 01-31-14 21:58 #
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Carnevil
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There's definitely some dynamic lighting going on. A good example is the start of level 2 which has the two spinning lights. There are also some blinking lights, but that's fairly subtle. It's hard to do *too* much with it since dynamic lighting isn't shadowed (too much of a performance hit), but certainly we can do more. It's somewhat slipped my mind pretty much since level 5 so I'll see what I can do about getting some more of this going on.

Old Post 02-01-14 01:34 #
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Carnevil
I fail it.


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Update is out! :D

http://www.wrackgame.com/img/updates/FallIntoDarkness_thumb.png

This one introduces a brand new level, as well as the Blast Guard - an artifact that permanently gives you rocket jumping powers! Now you can blast yourself around at will without taking too much damage - opening up new areas and possibilities. Also, Krispy, I did some lighting work on L6 to make it more dynamic. I think it helps.

Enjoy!

Old Post 02-03-14 14:28 #
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Carnevil
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Hey, anyone remember this thing? Wasn't it called Rack or Crack or something? I forgot.

Anyway, here's "Decality!" As you may have guessed, it adds decals!

Old Post 02-14-14 16:55 #
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Carnevil
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I'm a bit late on this (sorry!), but here's our latest update... Decality!

http://www.wrackgame.com/img/updates/Decality_thumb.png

The decals really add a huge amount to the game (as you can see from that shot). Had I known the impact was going to be that great, I would have gotten them in sooner. Seeing all this destruction left in your wake really makes your actions much more satisfying!

In addition to this we also got our official Steam Workshop launch! The Workshop should now be fully visible to the public, so feel free to browse through it. To celebrate, it's 25% off for the next week!

Old Post 02-19-14 07:46 #
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geo
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Decals always add a lot to making something look different and not samey. Good stuff, the simple decal addition should go a long way. Add some cyber punk graffiti too. The simple clean textures help a lot too. Its all good stuff.

Old Post 02-19-14 15:11 #
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Carnevil
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Finally finished the trailer for our next update "Look Into My Eye". This one adds a new level and a new boss! We're almost done! :D

Enjoy!

Old Post 03-01-14 12:17 #
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Carnevil
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Hey, guess what? There's a new level to play and a new boss to fight! We also somehow managed even more gore. I think we have a fetish or something. Anyway, it's all in our latest update, called...

http://www.wrackgame.com/img/updates/LookIntoMyEye_thumb.png

Old Post 03-04-14 12:04 #
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