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wesleyjohnson
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Posts: 486
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Pain Elemental idea:
This seemed to be a good idea, but the more I think about it, the more feel it has been done before.

Pain Elemental as a ball cage with flaming heads bouncing around in it.
It has an opening that a flaming head gets out of once and awhile.
One of the flaming heads can be steering it and can provide the face and focus point of which way it is facing and what its attention is focused upon.

When the Pain Elemental dies, I suppose it is going to create bloody goop like everything else, so the ball cage will have to be fleshy, or something that bleeds.

What do you think ? Sound familiar ?

Old Post 08-17-11 21:21 #
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Clonehunter
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I don't think the PE should have a static death frame or whatever. It should just disappear and leave nothing behind. Otherwise, that sounds kinda cool. And no. It doesn't sound familiar at all.

Old Post 08-18-11 03:35 #
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wesleyjohnson
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Started on making such a Pain Elemental, as described.
Leaning to a more disorganized frenzy ball, with a barely visible containment network. That can reasonably disappear when it dies.
It will also be quick to draw, because there are no static details that have to agree in all the frames.

When the Doom2 Pain Elemental dies, it explodes into thin air;
3 flaming heads; no corpse.
It appears from game info that a vile can resurrect a Pain Elemental.
How does it do that without a corpse? Anyone ever see that?

Old Post 03-27-12 20:19 #
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Gez
Why don't I have a custom title by now?!


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The only way in which a pain elemental can resurrect is if it is crushed as it dies. Then the crushing function changes the state of the pain elemental mobj to that of the crushed gibs.

That means that the only way in which pain elementals can be resurrected is as ghost monsters (at least in vanilla).

Old Post 03-27-12 21:24 #
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printz
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Gez said:

That means that the only way in which pain elementals can be resurrected is as ghost monsters (at least in vanilla).

Marine's worst nightmare.

__________________
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Old Post 03-27-12 22:06 #
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wesleyjohnson
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Using GIMP to produce PNG sprites (which are then converted to ppm).
The idea that this could be quick and simple because it would just be a flaming head furball, has been proven wrong.

Try 1: lacked depth, like poster board

Try 2: Gave it depth using size and blur, but freedom of movement of all those heads makes it look like one head with large frantic orange hair.

Try 3: Have plotted position of seven heads for every frame, with size, direction, and amount of blur.
Has too much blur (heads merge into one orange blur), too much open space, bits of ball mesh is being removed by GIMP alpha threshold. Efforts to protect mesh is giving overspray artifacts.

Try 4: Ball mesh preforms merged with unblurred copy to protect them against final alpha threshold operation.
Gave ball mesh some emphasis (which shows up as thickness) to give it depth. Increased size of secondary heads and much less blur on them.

Try 5: Moved some head farther apart because they keep impinging on each other. Death sequence changed to burning mesh with most of the heads going into some yellow/black portal hole.
(As this is source of an indefinite number of heads, either they are cloning in there, or else the ball implements a portal that brings in more heads).

Last edited by wesleyjohnson on 04-11-12 at 20:52

Old Post 04-05-12 20:10 #
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wesleyjohnson
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New Mesh Ball Pain Elemental (Version 5) has been submitted to FreeDoom incoming.

It has a green metal mesh ball containing seven flaming heads.
One head is reddish and is most prominent.
Attacks by the reddish head working its way through the mesh.
Dies with the green mesh burning in green flames, the reddish head burning, and the rest being sucked into a black/yellow portal.

This is to replace the placeholder red thing, which has many missing frames.
This copies the existing flaming heads heavily, so please do not decide to be changing those heads to some other color now.


Also available here:

Last edited by wesleyjohnson on 05-25-12 at 02:22

Old Post 04-11-12 19:58 #
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gnudist
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Tried this out with -merge. Certainly better than having "graphic not yet done" pop up whenever I encounter that cyclops jellyfish elemental thing.

Old Post 04-14-12 23:23 #
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wesleyjohnson
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Thank You, to the mysterious person who has committed the new Pain Elemental to the GIT.

Old Post 04-18-12 21:18 #
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RjY
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Posts: 802
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Yes, I forgot the common courtesy of letting you know that it was in. Sorry about that.

Anyway though, I love this thing. A twisted conglomerate of tortured souls, fused together by some hideous process... or just wrapped in chicken wire!

Old Post 04-19-12 15:45 #
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sgtcrispy
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Hmm, that first death frame looks familiar...

http://i.imgur.com/CVaMC.png

Old Post 05-24-12 07:13 #
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fraggle
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Oh, for the love of...

Wesley, you've been contributing to this project long enough that surely you know the rules by now and how serious we are about not using copyrighted material?

This is now going to need to be carefully removed, possibly erased from the git history as we've had to do with other copyright violations in the past.

I'm hoping that it was just those couple of sprites in the death animation. Please confirm that this is the case and that you have not used copyrighted material in any of the other sprites you have submitted (or indeed, any of your other contributions in general).

Seriously not cool.

Old Post 05-24-12 17:19 #
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gnudist
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fraggle said:
Oh, for the love of...

Wesley, you've been contributing to this project long enough that surely you know the rules by now and how serious we are about not using copyrighted material?



Don't you mean "inproperly licensed material"?

Under copyright law anything fixed is automatically copyrighted, including any and all material in freedoom.(last I checked you don't place FD stuff in the public domain, you use a copyright license)

Still Wesley, what were you thinking? The whole point of this project is to have legally reuseable/shareable content. Ripping restricted content defeats that purpose.

Old Post 05-24-12 20:43 #
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wesleyjohnson
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All my sprites are hand drawn from scratch.
The pain elemental uses seven copies of the FreeDoom flaming head in it.
As that is the FreeDoom flaming head, I assumed it was reasonable to use in another FreeDoom sprite that spouts flaming heads.
I pulled those flaming heads out of the 0.7 FreeDoom wad.
No material from outside of FreeDoom has been used.

Are you claiming that it is a copyright violation to use the FreeDoom flaming head in another FreeDoom sprite.
Seriously, Really ??
Doesn't FreeDoom have the copyright to its own flaming heads ??

Are you telling me the FreeDoom flaming heads are identical to some other copyrighted flaming head.

I have no idea what wads those frames are from, and probably have never seen them before. Please identify your sources.

There is little choice for flames. Every death frame generally breaks out into flame. There are only 3 choices, Red, Yellow, or Green.
With flaming heads, red and yellow don't work because the heads are already flaming red and yellow, so it has to be green if it is to be seen.

I do not consider this to be a reasonable accusation.
Take a better look. Identify the source of your other flaming head.
I will review the sources of my flaming heads. I suggest you review the source of yours.

Last edited by wesleyjohnson on 05-24-12 at 23:38

Old Post 05-24-12 23:07 #
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sgtcrispy
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wesleyjohnson said:
All my sprites are hand drawn from scratch.
The pain elemental uses seven copies of the FreeDoom flaming head in it,
but as that is the FreeDoom flaming head, I assumed it was reasonable to use in another FreeDoom sprite that spouts flaming heads.
I pulled those flaming heads out of the 0.7 FreeDoom wad.

Are you telling me the FreeDoom flaming heads are identical to some other copyrighted flaming head.

I have no idea what wads those frames are from, and probably have never seen them before. Please identify your sources.

Just because it has some black dots in it and some green flames, does not make it a copy.

There is little choice for flames. Every death frame generally breaks out into flame. There are only 3 choices, Red, Yellow, or Green.
With flaming heads, red and yellow don't work because the heads are already flaming red and yellow, so it has to be green if it is to be seen.

I do not consider this to be a reasonable accusation.
Take a better look.



I opened up the doom2.wad freedoom wad in xwe to go through it and see what visual changes were made.

Grabbed it from nongnu.org/freedoom


http://i.imgur.com/MbfdB.pngThat single skull is from Doom not Freedoom. O_O
http://i.imgur.com/xOoiD.png
http://i.imgur.com/ynVBa.pngwith Freedoom Skull Flare

Last edited by sgtcrispy on 05-25-12 at 00:27

Old Post 05-24-12 23:37 #
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wesleyjohnson
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My apologies. I found contaminating flaming heads in my directory of FreeDoom flaming head frames, that was prepared for this pain elemental.
As there are apparently no FreeDoom flaming head frames of those frame numbers (no death sequence), the contamination was not noticed.
There was no intent at any time to use anything but FreeDoom flaming heads in the creation of this pain elemental.

This directory was prepared to have only FreeDoom flaming heads, converted to png format. I do not know how the contaminating frames got in there (in ppm format).
The contamination appeared 3 days before making the pain elemental death frames, by file timestamp.

Only 3 frames of the pain elemental appear to have been contaminated.
These frames h0, i0, j0, have been replaced with frame k0, and submitted to incoming as johnson_pain_5b.zip.

I am destroying any files containing the contamination.

I cannot erase the file johnson_pain_5.zip from incoming.

The speedy share file appears to be gone.

Anyone having a copy of the this pain elemental, please destroy your copy.

I apologize for the trouble this will cause everyone.

Old Post 05-25-12 02:44 #
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fraggle
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Okay, sounds like it was an honest mistake then. Not to worry, we'll get it reverted and the offending frames removed.


Only 3 frames of the pain elemental appear to have been contaminated.
These frames h0, i0, j0, have been replaced with frame k0, and submitted to incoming as johnson_pain_5b.zip.

This is good to know. Do you want to recreate those frames so that we can replace the bad ones?

Old Post 05-25-12 11:27 #
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