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Ralphis`
Loser


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GO WADAUTHOR

Old Post 09-02-01 20:09
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deep
as in Deepsea


Posts: 1066
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Posting someone's email material is not illegal in most countries, when you sent your msg via electronic media, it is longer your property, and is the sole property of the recipient

You are 100% incorrect. I KNOW this for certain.

It is exactly the same a regular mail. On top of that you missed my "copyright" note.

I have no idea about other countries, but the US has some pretty strict privacy laws.

Old Post 09-02-01 20:10
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Julian


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Julian, personally I do not post private messages. I feel that it violates in implicit trust, which is conveyed in choosing to use a private email rather than a forum post.

I know that there are wildly varying opinions re: this, but my own feelings are that if I had written a personal email, I wouldn't want it posted in a forum. To do so, IMO, indicates either a lack of perception, or a disdain for others, either of which tend to, over time, hinder effective coexistence w/ people, be they coworkers, family, etc.

That's just my 2¢.


I have to say I never did before. This practice is obviously not the best way to gain a good reputation and I tend to agree with your statements about it. But I felt like this thread would be VERY instructive on how some persons can act a contemptuous way.
I'm really sorry to hurt your feelings, I didn't mean to. I hope you understand my reasons and that it won't change the way you perceive me too much.

Old Post 09-02-01 20:17
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Ralphis`
Loser


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Go Wadauthor!

Old Post 09-02-01 20:24
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Ralphis`
Loser


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Go Wadauthor!

Old Post 09-02-01 20:28
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deep
as in Deepsea


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But I felt like this thread would be VERY instructive on how some persons can act a contemptuous way.
I'm really sorry to hurt your feelings, I didn't mean to. I hope you understand my reasons and that it won't change the way you perceive me too much.

That this even crossed you mind as the right thing to do, is so OFFBASE that again I refer to the fact that you are French. Don't react and LISTEN!

Before you again jump out of your skin, it means that there are DIFFENCES between a French culture/mores and American standards. As I explained earlier, I'm from NEDERLAND originally and am quite aware of cultural interpretations.

That you AGAIN call me contemptuous is quite hurtful and quite needless. Is that the way your brain justifies your actions? Accuse the other person of things they don't intend with your own misguided interpretations?

What you should realize is that your actions are quite deceitful in American terms (and illegal). That you violated the implicit trust in an email goes without saying.

Why exactly couldn't you try to read with an open mind? What is the message topic? Was I trying to flame you with the email? Or was I trying to explain something? What is the content of the email? Was that dissin or explaining? If I was trying to flame you, why wouldn't I do that through the whole email. THINK!!!

Every time you reply it's as if you understand perfectly what I'm saying - which of course is in the negative sense - and totally ignore my plea that you are misunderstanding. Who know better what I mean - your or I? Why would I bother trying to explain?

There is only one way for you to correct this. Let's see what you are made of Julian.

Old Post 09-02-01 20:30
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Ralphis`
Loser


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Go Wadauthor!

Old Post 09-02-01 20:31
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Ralphis`
Loser


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leave me alone lüt

Old Post 09-02-01 20:32
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Lüt
Administrator


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NO. You really ASSUME way too much here.
I already said, what difference do the assumptions make? We know the order of events. My initial "assumption" was that you wanted a response from Julian on the comments you made, and indeed that was the truth.

The French thing was actually just a way of explanation. It can be interpreted either way. If one READS it with an open mind it's becomes such. But if one is determined to read negative things in everything then that's the way it becomes. Clearly you belong in the latter.
I dunno, if it wasn't your intent you sure said it like it was. It's not just how I read it - see that everybody else read it the same way. You're saying that French people as a group have major issues understanding English. Which is true for anybody who doesn't have English as their first language.

The French to you was because I was pissed.
So this time it was an insult.

Like you guys are all so proper and prim. Please give that scene a rest.
Not sure where you get that, so ditto on your "you misunderstood my use of 'French'" argument. You must be reading some people's attitudes wrong.

Why I have to explain this is sort of weird. JULIAN is the one that did the UNETHICAL and ILLEGAL actions here bud. Why not address those?
I already did, but here:

Your email address is in your profile. You complained about that being shown, but if you really wanted it to be private, you would have checked the "keep email private" box.

Julian's email is posted, which is obviously fine by him.

You wrote a rather insulting first paragraph, which after reading, I'd be embarassed to have it posted here if it had been mine. So you win on that small portion.

The rest was from the comment thread, which you had already made public.

I guess it's a small problem, but like fod said, once it ends up in somebody else's hands, you have no idea what they'll do with it, and there aren't really any laws preventing it. You can twist the old constitution and it's amendments in multiple ways. A recent court ruling in the US said basically what fod said before, that when it gets to the other end, you have no reason to expect any privacy. I personally don't post private emails on the ethical ground, but if you wanna get legal, that's a different issue. Only a small part of his original post is what I'd call unethical by my standards. But I'm not one to force my standards on other people.

Old Post 09-02-01 20:36
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Naked Snake
HAHA I AM A FAG AND I CAN'T CHANGE THIS TITLE ANYMORE


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leave me alone lüt


Lüt can I bother him instead?

Old Post 09-02-01 20:38
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fraggle
Filled with the code of Doom


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bah, typical dutch, they're all racists :P

Old Post 09-02-01 20:39
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Ralphis`
Loser


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fraggle unban me from #doom.

Old Post 09-02-01 20:40
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fodders
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The "fair use" exemption to (U.S.) copyright law was created to allow things such as commentary, parody, news reporting, research and education about copyrighted works without the permission of the author.


I think this falls under commentary and parody? Don't you?

Old Post 09-02-01 20:47
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deep
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The "fair use" exemption to (U.S.) copyright law was created to allow things such as commentary, parody, news reporting, research and education about copyrighted works without the permission of the author.

I think this falls under commentary and parody? Don't you?

NOPE. You can't post a PRIVATE email. It's gone through the courts. When I say I know 100%, I know 100%.

If you go to the Delphi forum, you'll find an explanation somewhere in their legalese that explains that you can't even take a POST from one forum and post it in another. However, if he had taken my "raw" post and used it here, that would have been acceptable. But not with my apparently botched explanation and not with him clearly tainting the whole thread right up front. Quite unprofessional.

I love this "fishing" stuff. It's always the dictionary first, then some other quote trying to interpret LEGAL words. Legal terms are called "words of art" for a reason. They don't mean what laymen like you and I, think they mean.

Old Post 09-02-01 20:56
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Naked Snake
HAHA I AM A FAG AND I CAN'T CHANGE THIS TITLE ANYMORE


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Julian, est ce que tu parles la francais bien?

Old Post 09-02-01 20:57
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Lüt
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But not with my apparently botched explanation and not with him clearly tainting the whole thread right up front.
Unless he edited your message, he didn't do any tainting. He didn't even take a side. He just said "Here is what I received from the Deepsea coder in my mail box. He is talking about the comment thread that followed the news of Deepsea release on DW. I will not make any comment about this. Just read and make your own opinion." Just straight-out facts, nothing else besides the message you wrote.

Old Post 09-02-01 21:02
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Julian


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Julian, est ce que tu parles la francais bien?

Bien sûr :)

Old Post 09-02-01 21:02
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Lüt
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Dang it Julian, I've been on IRC the last two days now, get yer lurfy ass in there :P

Old Post 09-02-01 21:03
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Naked Snake
HAHA I AM A FAG AND I CAN'T CHANGE THIS TITLE ANYMORE


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I dont. Heh.

Old Post 09-02-01 21:05
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tom
Green Marine


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talking of private email, i and a few others have read one particular email in which jv admits that the only reason he continues posting is because he enjoys twisting peoples words to provoke a reaction. this is commonly known as trolling, and jv would in this case be considered a troll. by replying to him you are "feeding the troll", drawing more attention to him - which is what he wants, probably also to draw more attention to his overpriced product as well. he's demonstrated many times that he isn't interested in any sensible debate, only twisting peoples words against them. aside from everything else he isn't even very good at it. :)

Old Post 09-02-01 21:10
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deep
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what difference do the assumptions make? We know the order of events.

Assumptions form the basis of an argument. The assumption of WHY I wrote is critical. One can't just assume anything and think it doesn't matter. I'm chuckling when I read that.

My initial "assumption" was that you wanted a response from Julian on the comments you made, and indeed that was the truth.

PRIVATELY - I expected an opportunity to try to explain some more. I would have realized I misstated and would have apologized for my poor phrasing.

I dunno, if it wasn't your intent you sure said it like it was. It's not just how I read it - see that everybody else read it the same way.

SHIT. If somebody GIVES an interpretion up front that is obviously tainted, guess what follows. Simple psychology. If you show a film of vacationing in Australia and then ask respondents to ask where they want to go for a vacation guess what they answer. These are simple human response facts.

You're saying that French people as a group have major issues understanding English. Which is true for anybody who doesn't have English as their first language.


That's right. The other is called an innuendo. Not exactly an insult.

Trying to explain things away won't work lut. It's illegal period. Once you cross a legal barrier you cross it. Once you cross an ethical barrier you cross it.


Your email address is in your profile.

Are ducks and fowl the same thing? Are horses and cows? How about chickens and eggs? Randomly looking for excuses doesn't change my assertion.

You wrote a rather insulting first paragraph, which after reading,

Only if you read it with bad intent - Julian clearly tainted the whole thing. Tainted posts are always followed by similar posts. If I wanted to flame him - which is what you imply - why did I bother sending a "body" that is trying to explain? You guys really get me by ignoring that part of the post.

and there aren't really any laws preventing it

Ignorance is no excuse. Yes there are. You cannot post EMAILS PERIOD. It's called a privacy issue.

Fodders little quote notwithstanding, he's wrong. That was a copyright thing anyway. Needless to say, which one of you here is in a "professional" reviewer or parody writer capacity? Or University research center? Anyone? Mmm, that's what those terms apply to.

Old Post 09-02-01 21:10
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Lüt
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jv admits that the only reason he continues posting is because he enjoys twisting peoples words to provoke a reaction.
Heh, like we all didn't know that ;)

Old Post 09-02-01 21:13
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deep
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he didn't do any tainting. He didn't even take a side.

Oh please. Let's not pretend everyone is stupid here.

I will not make any comment about this. Just read and make your own opinion.

OK, what exactly does that mean? I know what that means and so do you. It's an underhanded method of tainting.

For CHRISTS SAKE, why did he post it if it wasn't tainted. Do I have to paint a picture for you?

He posted it because he thought it was oh so nice. LOL. Here - it's obvious he meant to be hurtful:

VERY instructive on how some persons can act a contemptuous way.

Come again lut? He didn't take any sides? You are being less and less credible.

Old Post 09-02-01 21:17
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Julian


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Dang it Julian, I've been on IRC the last two days now, get yer lurfy ass in there :P


Channel? Server? Can't wait :)

Old Post 09-02-01 21:18
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deep
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talking of private email, i and a few others have read one particular email in which jv admits that the only reason he continues posting is because he enjoys twisting

This is sad to read, because that particular one is to ONE person. So you have betrayed his trust by doing so. Thanks for the heads up.

Sure sometimes. This is QUITE different. Those are posts where people start with "I like the control" argument and then when I show they have no control, they say, well, it's blah and so on and so forth.

But it's not trolling though. Trolling is constantly looking for things in all sorts of posts. So Lut is a troll and so are LOTS of posters here by that definition.

he's demonstrated many times that he isn't interested in any sensible debate, only twisting peoples words against them.

Total BULL. I twist the words in the sense that I show that what they write can't be true. That's what a sensible debate is all about. It NEVER happens here because of fabrications like yours.

And btw, that is quite COMMON in these arguments. How abou that!

Old Post 09-02-01 21:26
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deep
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Only a small part of his original post is what I'd call unethical by my standards.

That's all I'm looking for. Thanks.

Crossing the line is crossing the line.

It's unethical by any MATURE standard.

Old Post 09-02-01 21:29
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fodders
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That was a copyright thing anyway.


Of course it was a bloody copyright thing, it was you that brought copyright into it!

. On top of that you missed my "copyright" note

Old Post 09-02-01 21:32
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tom
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troll you are and troll you forever shall be. enough said

Old Post 09-02-01 21:39
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deep
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of course it was a bloody copyright thing, it was you that brought copyright into it!

Did you note my explanations? Nobody here qualifies as a professional which is what that alluded to. Look up what "words of art" mean.

Yes there are 2 issues. One is copyright and the other is privacy. Of the 2, the privacy one is the most serious.

Old Post 09-02-01 21:40
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fodders
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Nowhere in the fair use exemption does it mention "professional"

Old Post 09-02-01 21:42
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