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WildWeasel
Resident Castlevania Super-Fanboy


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Come to think of it, considering that this guy's posting history consists of this gem of a thread, I think the real question should be whether we can prove that this man has capability of sentient thought.

Old Post 07-26-13 05:42
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Ralphis
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I tried to find proof that the SNES cheats don't exist, but instead the only thing I was able to prove in my search was that the_bookman is a loud mouth dumbass and you can view that proof here: Click for proof

Old Post 07-26-13 06:00
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Platinum Shell
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He's just some troll that's getting way more attention than he needs.

Old Post 07-26-13 06:04
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WildWeasel
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Platinum Shell said:
He's just some troll that's getting way more attention than he needs.

Yes, but can you prove that?

Old Post 07-26-13 06:06
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Marnetmar
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This is amazing, my life now has meaning.

Old Post 07-26-13 06:09
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Platinum Shell
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WildWeasel said:

Yes, but can you prove that?



Well, your post about his history does. "faggy options"? I think that says enough in itself.

Old Post 07-26-13 06:16
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BloodyAcid
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Ralphis said:
I tried to find proof that the SNES cheats don't exist, but instead the only thing I was able to prove in my search was that the_bookman is a loud mouth dumbass and you can view that proof here: Click for proof
Unless you're the developer of that search function, I'm afraid I can't accept black (well, blue) and white text as solid evidence. What baseless conjectures this community's spewing.


Platinum Shell said:
Well, your post about his history does. "faggy options"? I think that says enough in itself.
I'm pretty sure WW's post was a jab at the OP.

Old Post 07-26-13 06:17
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Platinum Shell
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My point still holds, though.

Old Post 07-26-13 06:19
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WildWeasel
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I really need to start using "=P" more often so people realize when I'm trying to be silly.

Old Post 07-26-13 06:24
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hex11
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Antroid said:
I remember trying some cheat-like feature of ZSNES in the snes doom, which consisted of finding a specific memory adress and freezing it forever.
...
I found only one memory adress that corresponded to the value of that parameter, and when I froze it, I found out that it was the value for the HUD number and not the actual parameter itself



That simply means you haven't dug deep enough. :-) If you control the hardware, no piece of code can resist you forever, and this is especially true when the hardware is virtual, running via an emulator where it's so easy to stop, save states, examine memory, etc. Keep hacking and see what other code runs when you get hurt, when you die. If the emulator has a built-in disassembler, that can make your life easier than just looking at hex numbers. Find the function that gets called when you die, and make sure it doesn't get called. Put some NOP's in place of the call or something. Maybe then it will crash if health goes under 0, so then you have to fix that too.

Old Post 07-26-13 10:21
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Springy
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the_bookman said:
Now, if such cheat codes do not exist for SNES version of Doom, I want proof that they dont exist. Dont just say "well if the snes version of doom had them, they would have been discovered by now".

Why this line? You obviously know cheats don't exist for the port by basically saying that. So what if it has no cheats? Just play the fucking game.

Old Post 07-26-13 13:38
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Avoozl
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To my knowledge only the GBA version has cheats. :P

Old Post 07-26-13 13:40
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Antroid
Senior Member


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hex11 said:

That simply means you haven't dug deep enough. :-)



I certainly did not, but I have a vague recollection of only one value corresponding reliably to the number displayed in the hud (zsnes has some kind of memory search function for tracking that), so my guess was that the actual real parameter number was maybe in some other format or something so it didn't really have the same value as the number displayed for our eyes.

In any case I always liked the slightly harder nature of the snes version so I didn't really want to cheat very much. I realize that it's impossible for it to be impossible to find that value and lock it.

Old Post 07-26-13 14:45
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buttspit
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Antroid said:
In any case I always liked the slightly harder nature of the snes version so I didn't really want to cheat very much. I realize that it's impossible for it to be impossible to find that value and lock it.


Really? Usually, people say the SNES version is easier, especially nightmare mode; don't get me wrong, the visuals definitely give people a hard time.

So going by the thread starter's logic, let's all become widespread skeptics and question the existence of cheats for hundreds of thousands of video games. Because, you know, nobody has proven that no (additional) cheats exist for those games.

Old Post 07-26-13 15:19
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Antroid
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buttspit said:
Really? Usually, people say the SNES version is easier, especially nightmare mode; don't get me wrong, the visuals definitely give people a hard time.


That's strange, I always thought it was harder. The movement is way choppier (plus you get stuck on walls a lot), the monsters are faster (zombiemen are more accurate as well I think), there's no infighting, no saves in the middle of a map, no way to instantly select a weapon (sure you can pause and scroll through them before unpausing but who the hell remembers to do that). And some episodes are outright impossible to access on lower difficulty levels.

Old Post 07-26-13 15:58
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joe-ilya
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BloodyAcid said:

WAREZ UR PRUF????



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zh7R...=youtu.be&t=44s

Old Post 07-26-13 16:01
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buttspit
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Antroid said:


That's strange, I always thought it was harder. The movement is way choppier (plus you get stuck on walls a lot), the monsters are faster (zombiemen are more accurate as well I think), there's no infighting, no saves in the middle of a map, no way to instantly select a weapon (sure you can pause and scroll through them before unpausing but who the hell remembers to do that). And some episodes are outright impossible to access on lower difficulty levels.



There are a few gameplay elements that make things easier in SNES Doom. For one, the hitscan weapons are very "accurate"; no matter how far you are from enemies, the pistol and chaingun don't lose accuracy and the shotgun does full damage. Even if your aim is nowhere near dead center of the monster (like at the tip of their arm/leg), the shotgun does full damage. Monsters aren't alerted by using any weapon, only if they see you. This allows you to clear a room of demons at a slow pace if you want; or, for example, if you peer around a corner and see the fidgeting hand of an imp, 1 shotgun blast will kill it.

The rocket launcher is nightmarish in strength. I once killed 2 Barons in 3 rockets when they were close together; another time, 3 Cacodemons in 1 rocket. The Plasma Rifle is also much stronger now.

Nightmare mode doesn't have respawning monsters. Also, you get used to swapping weapons while the game is paused the more you play. I tend to do it a lot in tough situations. Another cool feature is when you die or restart a certain level: you retain all the weapons and ammo you had when you reached that level.

The difficulty limit was a strange move by Williams, because all difficulties for all 3 episodes are actually implemented, they just dummied them out in the North American and PAL versions (you can still access them by game genie/action replay codes).

Old Post 07-26-13 16:23
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Antroid
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I dunno then, but I definitely have way more trouble in SNES doom (playing Doom 1 on PC I have no trouble at all basically, but the snes doom can still catch me off-guard). I definitely remember thinking very differently about the RL before playing actual PC doom, snes doom made it feel like a way too dangerous a weapon to almost ever use. But wow if Nightmare really doesn't have respawning monsters, I gotta go beat SNES doom on nightmare sometime. I never even tried that.

Old Post 07-26-13 16:48
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PinkDemon666
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The idea that Doom for SNES may have codes that have managed to remain undiscovered for over 18 years might not be so far fetched.

Mortal Kombat Trilogy for the Nintendo 64 is a great example of this. MKT for N64 came out in 1996 but the Ultimate Kombat kode(UKK) wasnt discovered until 2007! Prior to 2007, the only way to unlock Khameleon and Human smoke was through the cheat menu. The conventional wisdom of the MK community (like we have here the doom community) was that the ultimate kombat kode didnt exist and the screen asking for it was just an artifact left over from development that never got fully implemented. The MK community went far enough to the point that it was explaining away a clue that hinted at the code's very existence, the screen that asks for the code. The logic behind the widely held belief that the UKK didnt exist was essentially exactly what the_bookman mentions, "If it existed, it would have been found it by now". It does seem like a very intuitive line of reasoning but it is fallacious however.

What is interesting about the N64 UKK case is that the code was equally difficult to figure out as the UKK codes for PSX MK3 and sega Saturn UMK3 codes, you just had to try all 1 million combinations. Apparently people did put that effort in because the codes for PSX and sega Saturn were quickly discovered within a month after their release. So the only way to explain why it took so long for the N64 case was that for some odd reason no one bothered to look for it until 2007.

Old Post 07-26-13 18:11
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buttspit
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Well, I think Wildweasel's point about burden of proof is really appropriate. Bottom line is if Bookman isn't convinced that there are no cheats, he should verify it himself.

Old Post 07-26-13 18:56
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WildWeasel
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buttspit said:
Well, I think Wildweasel's point about burden of proof is really appropriate. Bottom line is if Bookman isn't convinced that there are no cheats, he should verify it himself.

Yeah, really. I think he should enlist the help of people at TCRF, since they seem to really specialize in finding stuff that has laid dormant in game cartridges for nearly a decade.

Old Post 07-26-13 19:34
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Quasar
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Last year or the year before, a debug code was found in the Super Metroid ROM, via reverse engineering.

While entering the Golden Torizo room in Lower Norfair, holding a certain combination of buttons on the control pad (you'll have to forgive me for not knowing the combo, and look it up yourself) will set your inventory state to include all items you'd normally have up to that point, which is everything in the game except the Screw Attack, which is your reward for defeating the Golden Torizo.

Clearly this code was used by the developers to test the boss fight, which was undoubtedly one of the last few things to be finished, but they either forgot to remove the debug code or it became too inconvenient to remove it after later development (due to parts of the game having been written in 65816 assembly with absolute jump targets...)

Old Post 07-26-13 20:03
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Da Werecat
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Antroid said:
But wow if Nightmare really doesn't have respawning monsters, I gotta go beat SNES doom on nightmare sometime. I never even tried that.

[nostalgia]

I used to complete all three episodes on Nightmare skill without dying back then. I remember monsters being very fast. They're generally faster in this version, probably to compensate for their deafness and other alterations.

[/nostalgia]

Old Post 07-26-13 20:41
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sector666
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Antroid said:
And some episodes are outright impossible to access on lower difficulty levels.
They weren't selectable, but if you played through from a previous episode on a lower difficulty you could continue on to the next episode on the same difficulty. E3 could even be played on the lowest difficulty this way. Not very practical though.

How much difference is there between UV and Nightmare on SNES? I remember wondering if there even was a difference when I played through it however many years ago.

Old Post 07-27-13 06:40
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Da Werecat
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sector666 said:
They weren't selectable, but if you played through from a previous episode on a lower difficulty you could continue on to the next episode on the same difficulty.

Actually, no. The lowest possible skill level at which you can access all three episodes is HMP. On lower skills the game ends after E1 or E2.

I'm talking about NTSC version. Not sure about other regions.

Old Post 07-27-13 12:11
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Antroid
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On my version of SNES doom, you were not able to progress past e1. Not sure I ever beat it on higher difficulties and whether or not it would let me pass to e2 then, but that would be ultimately useless because it definitely didn't let me pass on the lowest difficulty (as a kid I always tried to choose the lowest one). I could access Inferno on difficulty 3 but that required beating the entirety of E2 first. That's how I actually beat E3 as a kid (I wasn't able to beat Slough of Despair on UV at all) - I dedicated an evening and played through all of e2 and e3 on diff3. By the end I was in a really strange state of mind, kinda crazy-shivering-style (doom was fucking intense for kid me).

Old Post 07-27-13 17:16
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sector666
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Interesting. I always thought it was on the lowest difficulty that I first played through all episodes consecutively. Must've been a higher difficulty after all.

Old Post 07-27-13 21:16
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the_bookman
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Alright, lets settle this right now! Provide me with Randy Linden's email address (he's the main developer for SNES Doom incase you didnt know) and we shall see if there are cheats for SNES Doom once and for all!

Old Post 07-28-13 03:03
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sector666
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But even if he does respond where would the proof be that he isn't lying?

Old Post 07-28-13 05:05
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Antroid
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the_bookman said:
Alright, lets settle this right now! Provide me with Randy Linden's email address (he's the main developer for SNES Doom incase you didnt know) and we shall see if there are cheats for SNES Doom once and for all!


Nobody cares but you. The "I assume against all odds that a thing is true until it is proven false" stance is idiotic, and if you still don't see that, that's not really our problem. Why should anyone bother proving anything to you after you displayed complete lack of understanding of how logic works?

Old Post 07-28-13 12:44
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