Doom 4 teaser and how it compares to the reveal

MeetyourUnmaker said:

The people developing it said they were inspired by Brutal Doom which a lot of the new people in the community like so we'll just have to wait and see.

What does this have to do with the soundtrack?

GoatLord said:

What does this have to do with the soundtrack?

I suspect having a lot more gore (in the action not for ambience sense)/finishing moves would make the game more non-serious/cartoonish, possibly changing their music direction.

I hope they don't, because dark ambient/industrial or whatever could still work out greatly with the BD inspiration.

Looks too fleshy? At least they aren't complaining about his shoes or length of his legs, because everything has to be 100% accurate at all times. Unless its Mortal Kombat.

The reveal found an interesting balance between cartoonish and serious. The music that played reflected that; kind of a dark ambient/industrial thing.

MeetyourUnmaker said:

The people developing it said they were inspired by Brutal Doom which a lot of the new people in the community like so we'll just have to wait and see.

No they didn't.

Touchdown said:

No they didn't.

It is what I have heard on here iirc.

Whoever manages the DOOM Twitter once posted something about a new version of Brutal Doom and Matt Hooper tweeted that he likes it or something. Hooper is no longer with id though. Other than that people talk with all the confidence in the world that DOOM4 is inspired by Brutal Doom because 'gore and finishing moves'. But the 'inspiration' part was made up by those who haven't even seen the game. They just assume that because DOOM4 has melee takedowns it had to come from Brutal Doom (even though there are TONS of AAA games with melee finishing moves).

Yah, but people have narrow minds and are generally retarded when in groups.

Like I said after seeing the QuakeCon footage in person, it is more like Doom 3 than Doom 1/2. My brother and I were let down, big time.

Monsters, sounds, effects, music, etc looked just like Doom 3. It did not have that classic Doom feel at all...

Gruson said:

Like I said after seeing the QuakeCon footage in person, it is more like Doom 3 than Doom 1/2. My brother and I were let down, big time.

Monsters, sounds, effects, music, etc looked just like Doom 3. It did not have that classic Doom feel at all...

Wow, really? Almost everyone else has said that while it may have Doom 3's aesthetics, it plays much more like the original Doom games. I really do hope that the sounds are much better than they were in Doom 3 because the sounds in Doom 3 were horrible. The guns sounded and felt weak, the explosions didn't sound like explosions at all, the monsters did not sound nearly as scary and intimidating as the originals, it was just bad. I really hope that they have improved upon that.

My impression from the reveal was that it was big, loud, violent and moody. Yes, it felt like Doom 3, but it also felt like Doom, Doom 2, PSX Doom and Doom 64.

Gruson said:

Like I said after seeing the QuakeCon footage in person, it is more like Doom 3 than Doom 1/2. My brother and I were let down, big time.

Monsters, sounds, effects, music, etc looked just like Doom 3. It did not have that classic Doom feel at all...

From what everyone else has said about the reveal, me thinkest thoust art a bit whiny.

Marnetmar said:

From what everyone else has said about the reveal, me thinkest thoust art a bit whiny.

And theres a lot of that going around, people are complaining about the Revenants posture or it's rocket launchers are too big. Just WTF in general I guess. We're getting a brand new Doom game after all this time, and from two seconds of footage it's already no good.

GoatLord said:

My impression from the reveal was that it was big, loud, violent and moody. Yes, it felt like Doom 3, but it also felt like Doom, Doom 2, PSX Doom and Doom 64.

Hallelujah. Then it will rock.

[QUOTE]Gruson said:
Like I said after seeing the QuakeCon footage in person, it is more like Doom 3 than Doom 1/2. My brother and I were let down, big time.

Monsters, sounds, effects, music, etc looked just like Doom 3. It did not have that classic Doom feel at all... [/QUOTE

Here's the thing: for the longest time, the Art / Atmosphere / Aesthetics of id Software games have all been fairly similar. Setting maybe different, tone of the story may be different, but as far as aesthetics go, id has had a very particular way of presenting their vision, ever since at least Quake III.

I honestly don't see that as a problem. As an artist myself, I absolutely LOVE the "id aesthetic". That includes Doom 3. I suspect that as long as Kevin Cloud works there, they will have that particular look.

Obzen said:

Here's the thing: for the longest time, the Art / Atmosphere / Aesthetics of id Software games have all been fairly similar. Setting maybe different, tone of the story may be different, but as far as aesthetics go, id has had a very particular way of presenting their vision, ever since at least Quake III.

I honestly don't see that as a problem. As an artist myself, I absolutely LOVE the "id aesthetic". That includes Doom 3. I suspect that as long as Kevin Cloud works there, they will have that particular look.

I agree that Doom 3 had very cool aesthetics. I love the very futuristic look, yet very dark and gritty look of Doom 3. It just needed a little bit more vibrant colors. If the new Doom looks like Doom 3 but with more color, I'm good with that.

The Revenant has always been an iconic Doom monster throughout the years, I wonder which of the other beasts we'll get a glimpse of?

Okay, color me impressed. Goatlord's description of the game and now finally seeing some footage has me pretty excited. Looks and sounds as though it's going to be a vastly superior version of Rage, which is awesome. I just hope they completely abandon the whole "hub" world Rage used and focus on progressive level-driven gameplay in the vein of the original Doom games.

I really don't know which description of DOOM i should trust i mean one person says its like the originals, and the other person says its like doom 3. Who is right and who is wrong?

DoomKid123 said:

I really don't know which description of DOOM i should trust i mean one person says its like the originals, and the other person says its like doom 3. Who is right and who is wrong?

Well, considering that 99% of everybody who saw it says it's like the originals, I wouldn't worry about it.

DoomKid123 said:

I really don't know which description of DOOM i should trust i mean one person says its like the originals, and the other person says its like doom 3. Who is right and who is wrong?

Grusen said that the new Doom LOOKS like Doom 3. He didn't say anything about how it plays. So his impression isn't too different.

Even Goatlord said the new Doom shares a similar aesthetic to Doom 3, but the gameplay is far different.

Guess we shall know in 3 weeks....

wouldn't spend too much time worrying about.

I am confident it will be awesome. Almost everyone who saw it thought it was mind blowing. Gruson is the first person I've seen say that he didn't like it. Everyone else has had nothing but positive things to say about it. Heck, John Romero even said that the new Doom will be mind blowing.

doom_is_great said:

I am confident it will be awesome. Almost everyone who saw it thought it was mind blowing. Gruson is the first person I've seen say that he didn't like it. Everyone else has had nothing but positive things to say about it. Heck, John Romero even said that the new Doom will be mind blowing.

But will it make you an imp's bitch?

I don't think this teaser shows anything that couldn't have worked in the trailer for the so called canned version?

Though neither video has shown much at all, as we all know.

Can't help by respond to this :)

GoatLord said:
[This is nit-picky, but I'm a bit disappointed that the lighting isn't better, as it's glaringly obvious that not every object is casting a shadow. Now, that might not seem like a big deal, since the overall detail is high, but for fuck's sake, this is the PS4 era. It should have no problem casting shadows on all objects and retain a decent framerate, considering the best PS3 games can almost do that. Motion is a huge factor when it comes to selling realism, and guess what? So are shadows! I'll still support the hell out of Doom, but I think I'm seeing now how consoles are compromising the level of visual detail. Kinda sucks. [/B]

Well, actually, that's not entirely true. Shadows are pretty damn expensive. You usually mark some lights as not shadow casting at all to improve performance and only make things like the Sun and main lamps shadow casting. Maybe a few fireballs here and there since this is DooM and that would look really cool!

Even on PC with extreme hardware it's still not a good idea to make everything receive shadows and make all lights cast shadows. Each shadow casting light needs to allocate shadow map buffers and manage them and all this other technical stuff. If they're using shadow maps, you'll have to have some lights use a lower resolution shadow than other lights and at some point it's best to not have shadows at all than the horrible quality shadows you may get from low resolution shadows. You probably aren't going to notice a missing shadow, but you'll notice a horrible looking one.

Stencil shadows aren't even an option like they were in DooM 3. At the time shadow maps looked even worse since the hardware at the time couldn't handle it for whatever reason, probably memory. But they work in Doom 3 since everything is fairly low poly. Modern poly counts and levels of detail would kill stencil shadows.

Overall, I'd say the lighting is quite excellent and didn't even notice any issues.

Here's a forum post I had about issues with shadows in friggin Unreal Engine 4 of all things.
https://forums.unrealengine.com/showthread.php?52904-Light-bleeding-a-little-through-wall-and-affecting-shadow

I haven't personally watched the teaser so I can't tell you whether in my opinion the graphics are good or not. But the problem I have is that apparently Tech 6 graphics are not that impressive and many people are downright disappointed with them (I've heard some say it looks like an upgraded DOOM 3). The reason why this is a problem is that I'm almost certain the graphics will be even worse by the time of the release. Almost every game suffers a graphical downgrade between the unveiling and the release and certainly no game looks better in the final version than in the showcase.

And yes, I am a graphics whore. RAGE looked pretty damn amazing on 360/PS3. There's no reason why DOOM4 shouldn't be able to totally blow it out of the water on significantly more powerful XO/PS4.

Touchdown said:

I haven't personally watched the teaser so I can't tell you whether in my opinion the graphics are good or not. But the problem I have is that apparently Tech 6 graphics are not that impressive and many people are downright disappointed with them (I've heard some say it looks like an upgraded DOOM 3). The reason why this is a problem is that I'm almost certain the graphics will be even worse by the time of the release. Almost every game suffers a graphical downgrade between the unveiling and the release and certainly no game looks better in the final version than in the showcase.

And yes, I am a graphics whore. RAGE looked pretty damn amazing on 360/PS3. There's no reason why DOOM4 shouldn't be able to totally blow it out of the water on significantly more powerful XO/PS4.

Last time Id made a Doom game about graphics people didn't care, and you can't exactly say it wasn't a true PC game. From the reception of Doom 3 it seems that people care more about the gameplay and they are right. The gameplay is what gave the game enduring popularity even after 21 years. We don't still play Doom because of its technology, rather its simple (but highly effective) beauty and gameplay.

Besides, I think we have reached a point where game graphics are realistic enough. Back then graphics were either bad or really good, there wasn't really any middle ground. Graphics don't limit the artists anymore which inturn lets them do whatever they want. If games stopped looking better than say The Witcher 3 or Dragon Age I wouldn't really care.

Nowadays I care more about how interesting a game looks than the technology. If I had choose between Crysis 3 and Wolfenstein: The New Order I'd choose Wolfenstein because it's the more interesting looking game whereas Crysis 3 looks pretty boring.

So if sacrificing graphics lets them make more interesting-looking environments I'd say they should go for it.

One thing a friend of mine has pointed out time after time is that art direction and visual fidelity are two different things. A game not running on the latest technology can still wow everyone if the art direction is strong.

GoatLord said:

One thing a friend of mine has pointed out time after time is that art direction and visual fidelity are two different things. A game not running on the latest technology can still wow everyone if the art direction is strong.

Depends on the era we're talking about. From 2000-2007? You are absolutely wrong. Between that period there were no "middle ground" graphics. Just shitty graphics and great graphics so that constrained the artists from realizing their vision.

Onward from 2007, technology has gotten good enough that even midde of the road graphics have gotten good enough. Just look at Unreal Engine 3.

My point is that graphical technology needs to get to a point where it doesn't constrict the artists. I believe we have reached that point and that full realism is not even necessary. So if developers stopped making new graphics tech it could even be a positive thing seeing how expensive games get because of it. What they should invest time and resources in is how to better optimize the production pipeline to reduce costs. With reduced costs they can make even better stuff.

If games stopped looking better than Crysis 3, Battlefield 4, Dragon Age Inquisition, Metro Last Light or The Witcher 3 (for example) I wouldn't care at all. If they had stopped getting better than Unreal Engine 1 I would have been concerned.

I would say Doom 4 definitely looks good enough. It is far more important to me that it looks interesting.