Something to look forward to...

Excerpt from DoomsdayHQ:

"Version 2.1

Version 2.1 will be about new gameplay features, the implementation of which has been made possible by the changes made in 2.0.

Planned features:

Sectors over sectors (or SoS). The basic idea is to let a single subsector belong to multiple sectors. This allows maps to be, what, 2.75D? There will be no slopes, though. (I will not waste my time transforming Doomsday into Quake. IMHO, if you need slopes, Doom is not your engine.)"

So, no slopes, but sector-over-sector editing will hopefully be possible with the doomsday engine within six months.
On the plus side, it'll mean more complex and realistic mapping. On the other hand. i'll have a hell of a lot of Underworld maps to re-vamp. Lots of work ahead, then.

O yeah, sector over sector is very Doom-ish.

But slopes are just fine, are they? I don't hear that many bashes against Zdoom. Or Legacy, for that matter - another sector-over-sector port, IIRC.

This is a source port forum. Think about that for a minute.

Sounded more to me like Tarin was saying why object to slopes being not doomish if you are happily adding sector over sector effects which are also not doomish.

Tarin has done so much Zdoom editing and scripting I think it's safe to say he'd be in favour of non doomish advances to the engine such as sector over sector and slopes.

Enjay is 100% right. IMO it's ridiculous to say that slopes would transfor Doom into Quake, yet he implements sector over sector. How can the coder of an OpenGL (!) port say something like this? Maybe coding all the GL stuff fried some of his brain cells? ;)

[edit]Oh, and before you start some "tarin you suck" again: I don't have anything against JDoom or Jaakko personally[/edit]

If anything, slopes and sectors over sectors would make Doom more like games like Blood and Shadow Warrior.

Slopes n sector over sector doesnt make it seem any less doomish to me, nor like quake, cause Ive never played quake on a puter, heh.

oh and btw, Tarin, you suck. :P

According to anybody you talk to, DooM is FAR too old for them to actually play - so perhaps, this is needed for them to shut-up.

boris said:

Enjay is 100% right. IMO it's ridiculous to say that slopes would transfor Doom into Quake, yet he implements sector over sector. How can the coder of an OpenGL (!) port say something like this? Maybe coding all the GL stuff fried some of his brain cells? ;)

[edit]Oh, and before you start some "tarin you suck" again: I don't have anything against JDoom or Jaakko personally[/edit]

Ah, sorry, i misread your post - and you've got a perfectly valid point. It's a bit confusing, isn't it? I'd be all for slopes as well as SoS mapping. The reasons are beyond me, though Jaakko himself has been infinitly helpful with DED editing.

PS - i'm sorry for all the shit last time; i'm sick of all the flaming and would love to see the back of it too.

ZDooM needs floor over floor editing, I would love to see that :)
On topic: JDoom will have floor over floor, eh? Yay!

tarin you suck

...

^____^ Joking.

Anyhow, that is a good point. I mean, sector over sector kinda takes the fun outta making doom maps. :P

Sector over sector makes some levels a lot more interesting. I made a small level for Legacy once that had a five story building with an elevator. The problem with Legacy is that I had to do a little trick to make the monsters be on the right floor to start with, and even so, they try and "shoot" through the floor at you.

Slopes are for neat effects. There's a level I'm working on right now that I'd really like to add slopes to (square hallways are often boring. Dome hallways would be nice every once in a while), but since it's "vanilla," I decided against it. Slopes are a good feature sometimes. I enjoy it when slopes are added to make the levels look really nice. Railings, handicap ramps, dome ceilings, up/downhill areas, and anything that needs to be round (pipes and stuff) are good uses for slopes.

Really, if ZDoom had 3D floors, I'd be way more inclined to make levels for ZDoom than vanilla. As-is, I use ZDoom all the time anyway, but I'd really like making 3D floors in levels. Too bad Legacy's 3D floors are so weird and buggy.

I kind of wish Jdoom would concentrate on making vanilla doom maps look and play really well, as opposed to adding Zdoomish map features. I don't want to see Jdoom compete with Zdoom. I say it should just perfect its Boom support, and optimize its performance.

I mean, are mappers really going to want to learn another scripting language just to make maps for Jdoom?

Honestly, I'd rather have slopes than sector-over-sector. Slopes can greatly add to the look of a level (as Im sure you all know), "SoS" is very non-doomish IMO. I always felt that Doom editing took more skill than quake editing because of that restriction.

I still continue to use JDoom no matter what though.

It is level DESIGN, and not editing features that make Doom "not Doom." But hell, look at all the user levels out there. None of them are Doomish by this standard.

There will always be those authors that make levels that are not Doom, and there will be those that make architecturally complex levels while still maintaining, if not enhancing, the original Doom feel.