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Grazza
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Which demos have you enjoyed watching most?

No particular rules in this thread: just give a list (long or short) of those you have liked. You may wish to divide it into categories, since it is hard to compare TAS runs with unassisted demos, or movie-runs with single-map demos.

If you record demos yourself, feel free also to give a list of those that you are most happy with.

Old Post 11-17-03 00:10 #
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Opulent
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too hard to list everything, but in general I like the 'clean' maxdemos the best.
This is a really good question... I look forward to hearing what others have to say.

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Old Post 11-17-03 00:59 #
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Searcher
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I love to watch other people play. I most like "clean' max runs like Opulent suggested.

I also love watching the top dozen or so players in the world tear thru maps that put me on my knees, and not even seem to break a sweat. Man those guys are good. I learn a lot from them.

Way to many demos to list. I am more of a generalist.

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Old Post 11-17-03 01:14 #
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Grazza
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To get the ball rolling, here is a list I threw together. Sorry, I haven't made them links, but they are all either Compet-n, TAS or SDA demos (FTP), apart from the one where I have given a link. Otherwise I have put C, T or S after them. The demos are listed in no particular order inside any of these categories. Note that the TAS demos can be found here. I have regarded new TAS demos (since the move to SDA) as SDA demos - "T" implies it is from the original TAS site. I apologize in advance for any errors in these labels or in the file names.

TAS (or built) movies
30uv1617 T
hacx3215 S
30nm1849 T
30hr2843 T
plnm7104 T
0934hr10 S

TAS (or built) single map
pn22-123 T (NB: despite the name, this is for hr.wad, not Plutonia)
pa02x031 T
t4m6tas T
tn09tas T
an32x032 S
hf111358 T
hr13nmx T

Movies (unassisted)
30nm3413 C
30pl4111 C
e4nm0554 C
30tv3108 S
30ns6155 C
0711nm01 C
30nm3737 (coop) C

Single map (unassisted)
nm29-157 C
e1m7-224 C
M1F4-1ST (H2HMud)
lv07-006 C
pa04-037 C
pp31-245 C
hp13-106 C
tn08-335 C
h2322437 S
p4e6-144 S
t2f8-720 C
hn32c021 (coop) C
sn26-038 S (DSF Scythe pack)
hr14-147 C
p1m7-146 C
ps23-215 C
pl12-006 C
lv24-036 (without the trick) C
t4m2-835 C
f4m2-144 C
p3m9-141 C
t3m8-124 C
p1m8-229 C
n4m1-035 C
lv19-036 C

And of my own demos, I like the following best (all at SDA): En03P245, En04N134, Rige-126, Sq32P238, Sv05N422, TrydN338, TV12P137, TV26-128, TV28S349, Zoo2-917.

Last edited by Grazza on 11-17-03 at 06:32

Old Post 11-17-03 04:00 #
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Opulent
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yikes, that's a lot to take in.
great list though... I'd add lv18-022, lv04-056, lv07-046, lv30-030, pl32-337, mm2281413, hr30-156, hr182206, hr22-803, and and and(bunches of SDA demos).. y'know I never did find time for this list.
I recommend the 2 GoldenCyber awards lists for those looking for some more.
and what is M1F4-1ST out of curiousity?... I wonder if I've seen that. :)
http://members.cox.net/opulent/o/index.htm :(

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Old Post 11-17-03 04:47 #
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Grazza
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Opulent said:
and what is M1F4-1ST out of curiousity?... I wonder if I've seen that. :)
It is in this zip. It was the winning UV Speed on map01 of H2HMudFE.wad. That is basically the same map as map12 of H2H-Xmas (though there are some minor differences, since the demo desyncs on the Xmas version). The winning UV Max on the same map is quite impressive too.

BTW, I realize that my list is very short on Alien Vendetta demos. Lots of great demos on that wad of course, but I found it hard to single many out. And as you say, lots more SDA demos deserve a place on the list too. Well, there's no way we can hope to come up with a definitive list of "the best" demos, but I'm sure people (esp. those new to watching demos) will find it useful if there is a list of "guaranteed excellent" demos.

Old Post 11-17-03 06:25 #
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Kristian Ronge
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My favourite category is pacifist, without a doubt, since it is so diametrically opposed to the original purpose of the game. So some of my very favourite demos are the p1m7's, p1m5's, p3m1's, etc. of the Ultimate DooM.

I also have a tendency to thoroughly enjoy demos of something considered extremely hard being done the first time... for example t2m8, t4m6, 30nm, ty07, t4m1, n4m1... you get the general idea.

The most satisfying demos, though, are probably quick and brutal max-demos. There's something very special about "cleaning out" a map, especially if it's packed with monsters to begin with. I'm thinking av24/5 (Demonic Hordes), av32, hr22, hr24, pl32, etc.

I could be more specific about certain demos I like the most, and actually bother to answer the question, but I'm too lazy. ;-P

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Old Post 11-19-03 19:42 #
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Vile
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Pacifist was an addiction for a brief time, and very brief, because it can be insanely frustrating to play. P1m7 for instance, you can have the perfect run, everything's going great, but to no fault of your own, the enemies at the end form THE perfect barrier and hold you in place until they either kill you or drown the hope of a new record. Nah, wasn't for me it turned out. :)

As a matter of fact I spent an additional 4-5 hours on p1m7 after getting the time that was uploaded as the current record.. and I'm sure something closer to 1:40 is possible, but it just wasn't something to be proud of.

Old Post 11-19-03 21:01 #
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Opulent
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PlanetAdam has some magic feet when it comes to pacifist. The patience needed for that cat. is absurd.
an under-rated category, as some parts are so much harder than it looks.

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Old Post 11-19-03 21:30 #
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Grazza
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Yes, there's nothing like a good pacifist.

Opulent said:
PlanetAdam has some magic feet when it comes to pacifist. The patience needed for that cat. is absurd.
That reminds me of this, from the txt for AdamW's pp13-044:

And verily did Sod come to the tribe of Williamson, and spake thusly, giving his law: "Much shalt thou try to conquer Plutonia MAP13 without the use of weapons, for thou be proud; and though thou triest and triest and triest again, never shalt thou seem to succeed; and yea! verily shalt thou be plagued by imps. Thine face shalt be shot off by Mancubi, and sergeants shall block thy path at every turn. Verily shall archviles fail to be distracted by chaingunners; and when at last thou dost achieve a good time, it shall be on a run wherein thou wast forced to shoot a mancubus, and which thou carriedst on only for practice."

And plaintively did the tribe of Williamson reply: "oh, bugger."

And there was much wailing, and gnashing of teeth.
I really liked a lot of Vile's pacifists (see my list above!), and think it's a shame he got frustated by some maps where pacifist needs a lot of luck.

I notice that I forgot to include Selim's paxep1 in my list of TAS movies. Silly me.

[A bit off topic:] One map where I have wasted a lot of time attempting a pacifist run is Henry.wad map04. The closest I have got to exiting was reaching the exit door, but being blocked by a lost soul while my remaining 7% health got stripped away before I could press the switch. Not recommended (except for masochists), but a quick and successful demo would look nice.

Last edited by Grazza on 11-20-03 at 01:49

Old Post 11-20-03 00:59 #
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Kristian Ronge
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Vile: I think pulling off an insanely hard pacifist run, such as your p1m7, IS something to be proud of. Indeed, a lot of luck is involved, but to have any chance of utilizing that luck one has to be very skilled. Besides, a good player is *always* lucky, right people? ;-)

Op: Yes, extremely under-rated. I'm not keeping statistics, but an educated guess would be that the Tyson and Pacifist categories are the ones with fewest contributions, and fewest number of people contributing to the COMPET-N. Or maybe it's -respawn and -fast? Oh well...

Graham: That .txt I consider to be one of the best of COMPET-N ever, because it is not only humorous; it also gives you some insight of just how extremely hard pp13 is. Adam W rules.

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Old Post 11-20-03 08:04 #
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Ryback
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I've been thinking about this question, but it's damn hard - there's more than seven thousand demos in my C-N directory alone, and trying to think of all the different stuff I've watched over the years... hard stuff.

I don't care so much about times, though of course a faster time implies a greater skill. What makes a classic run for me is more a question of style, a certain fearlessness on the part of the lmp author, the ability to think on their feet and recover quickly from unexpected events, and the constant motion and lack of dead time that comes from a total knowledge of the level and the strategy chosen for that level. (That's an interesting question: what constitutes good style in a demo? Maybe we should make a thread about it.)

One example of this: Claudio's fa27-448, which is in the Dang tree somewhere. He's done faster demos (including an unbelievable 4:08), but this is my favorite of his. The smoothness of motion, the relaxed playing, making a hard task seem totally easy.

What I really like, more than just a single great demo, are great demosets. And they don't have to be recent ones, or even particularly fast: I think the first Final Doom UV demoset is great, even though the times are dismal by today's standards. Watch Anthe's PL32 maxdemo, people just don't play like that these days, speed is too much of a concern.

Other particularly good demosets:
d2-tgm: Peo and Demonlord do 21 Doom2 level Tyson style with -fast monsters. Impossible tasks done with style.
mm2_3: Peo and the Nordic Connection record a full maxset for Memento Mori II after Peo gets pissed off at some comments by Migru in his demoset. What I really like is how they handle some utterly huge levels with risky playing and total route knowledge. And you've got a great variety in styles between the players.
pluvdemo: Probably the hardest-worked demoset ever, this one set new standards when it was released and I still think it's the benchmark for max demosets. The playing is incredibly aggressive - nobody waits for monsters to come into view, they run out and slaughter them!
hruvlmp2: Similar aggressive playing, this time on maps even harder and thus less conducive to this style of play. Anyone who's had a demo in this can legitimately call themselves a Doomgod.

There's tons more, and tons more single-player demos that could be listed, but I'd have to think about this some more...

Old Post 11-20-03 09:19 #
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DEMOn
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brainstormed for a massive 3 or 4 minutes and listed the demos for the 10-year Demos history page.(probably posted tomorrow morning)
I went a bit crazy with the AV demos, but perhaps we could start making a real list.
and fa27-448 is nothing but class and skill.

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Old Post 12-11-03 19:31 #
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Angus Thermopyle
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There is a new perfect speedrun from Ocelot in the Compet-N incoming:
lv10-025 :)

Old Post 12-20-03 09:46 #
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Erik
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I guess vile's new h232 now should be on everyone's list =)

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Old Post 01-03-04 19:53 #
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Grazza
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Certainly, but the one he recorded with Doom2.exe still seems a greater miracle to me - I mean, half the monsters he was fighting then were invisible to him.

Oh, and Ocelot's new f1m7-228 looks pretty sweet.

Old Post 01-03-04 20:09 #
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ocelot
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For showing to someone new to demo-recording, I would pick what I find to be the best run of each main category - the best movie, the best speedrun and the best max run - some particularly entertaining stuff with cybies and big guns, and the best cheated run. In my opinion those would be:

30nm3413 by Henning (movie)
lv24-036 by Sedlo (speedrun)
lv07-046 by Hegyi (max)
pl32-337 by Vile (flashy max) and
15pl0723 by Sedlo (cheated run)

Old Post 01-07-04 10:19 #
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Erik
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has sedlo's plutonia run even been released somewhere? I sure can't find it.

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Old Post 01-07-04 10:33 #
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Opulent
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only the lucky few have seen Sedlo's unfinished TAS movies. (hint, I was never very lucky)

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Old Post 01-07-04 14:08 #
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ocelot
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Here you go folks.

www.geocities.com/ossiosamaksu/pltassdl.zip

Old Post 01-08-04 20:28 #
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Opulent
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oh yeah. :)
Andrey's got something special coming too.
thanks, ocelot!

Old Post 01-08-04 20:43 #
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Erik
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omfg!

Old Post 01-08-04 20:49 #
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Opulent
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Does this mean I can post in on the TAS site? (since we're semi-public here anyway?)
maybe I should email the Sed-meister...

Old Post 01-08-04 22:02 #
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Adam Hegyi
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You could, but he sold his computer to cover other expenses, it's doubtful he even has access to the net at the moment.

Old Post 01-08-04 22:33 #
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VinceDSS
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I cannot spot a demo I prefer, It's more related to its author in fact.
i like most :
- Adam Hegyi speedruns
- Sedlo speedruns
- Ocelot speedruns and his DM Demos
- Henning NM demos
- Anders Johnsen Max, Tyson and NM demos, and his DM Demos
- Radek max runs and movies
- DF playing 30nm coop with Henning
- Vile's speedruns and movies
- Adam Williamson speedruns esp. the pacifists and the EP1 speeds
- Ryback playing PWads and his 30nm
- Xit Vono on Tyson rampage
- all nightmare movies slower or faster
- old records like Demonlord's, Panter's, Kai's, Anthe's, Esko's, Yonatan's, Ilya's and all classics !
- and last but not least, QWERTY running Heretic speedruns

I probably forget a couple others... pls forgive me :)

Old Post 01-16-04 04:56 #
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Dron
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The HR Demopacks(both of them), all max-kills demos, Tyson UV and NM demos, UV and NM movies, Reality demos, etc.

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Old Post 03-20-04 17:28 #
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gravitar
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Dron said:
*Bump* The HR Demopacks(both of them), all max-kills demos, Tyson UV and NM demos, UV and NM movies, Reality demos, etc.


I agree, especially both secret level demos are amazing.

Old Post 07-06-04 09:11 #
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Mogul
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I've really got to say that Sedlo's TAS DOOM II 30uv1448 is the most entertaining DOOM speedrun demo I've ever seen.

Old Post 07-06-04 09:12 #
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Grazza
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It's not by Sedlo.

Old Post 07-06-04 09:15 #
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Mogul
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Eh! So it's not! It's by Andrey Budko. I somehow must've thought it was Sedlo's because of the readme's mention of him several times.

My bad.

Old Post 07-06-04 09:21 #
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