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Ichor
The Mysterious Red Square


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Recently he's been helping me figure out how to get Doomsday (not the .dll game source code, the .exe). I had a very hard time trying to even contact him, but that wasn't his fault though.

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Old Post 07-10-03 20:50 #
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kinkyfriend85
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I like ZDoom and JDoom equally. naturally, if a wad REQUIRES ZDoom, then that's what I have to use. Otherwise I choose which port to use according to my mood.

same here, altho im too tired to download every wad and install all ports but i might do that now, since i like most of the ports except ZDaemon

That being said, kinkyfriend85, why are you here? What was the point of this thread. Many people here are quite aware of JDoom's capabilities. If something new is added, it will probably be posted in a news article and we will all be informed of it. Not everyone here is a zdoom addict. There are lots of prboom fans as well (and even a few lagacy users).


I wanted to debate a bit, I know there are all kinds everwhere. And the reason of why I am here has the same answer as yours



Did you expect us all to suddenly ditch all our usual ports and swear alliegance to JDoom?


No I don't want that either.


Furthermore, whats all this about "port competition"? I have copies of JDoom, ZDoom, legacy, prboom, eternity, and MBF on my hard drive. It's not like they take up gigs of space. Nor will they attempt to delete each other or something stupid like that. There's no reason why any port author should attempt to dominate the "competition".

I have around 12 different ports and many different versions, i have soem gigs of doom stuffs and over one gig of "doomsday stuff"
I like to see peoples reaction but i dont like stupid answers and i love to debate. Actually i like most of the ports as i mentioned earlier and i can bring up good things with all ports.

Old Post 07-10-03 20:52 #
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Use3D
Forum Legend


Posts: 4714
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Assmaster said:


Furthermore, whats all this about "port competition"? I have copies of JDoom, ZDoom, legacy, prboom, eternity, and MBF on my hard drive. It's not like they take up gigs of space. Nor will they attempt to delete each other or something stupid like that. There's no reason why any port author should attempt to dominate the "competition".



Yeah really, like I said, I'm using jdoom for Doom64 tc and it's awesome. I have prBoom, zdoom, Eternity, and Legacy too. Like the others jdoom has its strengths and weaknesses. For all-around Doom goodness I reccommend prBoom!!

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Old Post 07-10-03 20:55 #
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Doomer34
Newbie


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i have to say that eternity is a very good engine and i am hoping that this would be put onto Doom Connector soon, but JDooM's single player quality is 10/10 for me. the Graphics are superb, the editing quite okay aswell. i have downloaded the new snapshot but i think the netcode could be better. JDooM is the best engine to have the DooM64 tc i think.

Old Post 07-10-03 23:33 #
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Graf Zahl
Why don't I have a custom title by now?!


Posts: 7785
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Rellik said:
Why isn't he pushing for BOOM compatability? Another guy even did all the coding for him. BOOM is what, 4 years old and JDOOM still hasn't even got as much editing ability as it. I asked the JDoom coder when he was gonna have features like that. He told me to fuck off, and if I wanted to use that "shit" I should go use a different port. Guess 2 and a half years later he's finally figuring out that that "shit" is pretty vital.



Why am I not surprised about that?

Old Post 07-10-03 23:37 #
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Shaviro
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Hahahahahahaha

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Old Post 07-10-03 23:55 #
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boris
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Does Eternity even have multiplayer?

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Old Post 07-11-03 00:29 #
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Grazza
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It has a multiplayer menu (from the Features menu).

Old Post 07-11-03 01:23 #
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Bloodshedder
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Eternity has no netcode.

Old Post 07-11-03 04:24 #
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timmie
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Heh, I'll do a ZDoomGL/JDoom comparison here (based on the in-development 0.75)... Note that if I say ZDoom supports it, I also mean ZDoomGL supports it by default:

Like textures up to 4096*4096 pixels - hmm, ZDoomGL supports the exact same hires textures JDoom supports (and I think I'll add jpg support soon), and ZDoom itself supports 2048*2048 textures (although not in PNG format)
hi res sprites - heh, halfway supported in ZDoomGL. I just have to set it up so it reads the right ones for the current translation
mp3 music support - zdoom has this
eax support - zdoom also has this as an editing feature, no less: http://zdoom.notgod.com/ftp/examples/eax.zip (use latest ZDoom)
md2 support - alright, ZDoomGL doesn't support those right now, but it's on the list
special lights - same as models, but it's higher up on the list
better 3d view - do you mean mouselook? ZDoom's looks funny, but it's there and ZDoomGL has the same mouselook as JDoom
better Jump than zdaemon - probably no change here, but it's personal preference
good air movement - haven't really compared and contrasted ZDoom/JDoom on this
model lights - see above for models
anisotropic texture filtering - ZDoomGL has supported this since 0.7
Stable singleplayer - ZDoom is rock solid
detail wad support - I'll probably add support for detail textures to ZDoomGL in the future :)
Hi res titlepic, hudbar etc - the hires titlepic works, but the statusbar uses the same methods as the fonts, so it's not hires :(
ded - hmm, ZDoomGL probably won't support DED anytime soon (I've got my own things cooking)
Good option panel - I have to admit, I love the options panel in JDoom :)
And best of all we get many updates, which legacy do not, nor Zdoom - ZDoom gets updated quite regularly, just not recently (of course, who am I to talk about irregular updates) =/

And the things I have planned for the future:

shader script language - Quake3-style texturing in Doom!
mapper-friendly lights - an actual light object you can place in your maps
placeable models - being able to place md2 models in maps as objects would be pretty cool, too

I'd also like to point out the animation blending and ultra-large flats (tested with a 2048*2048 flat) in ZDoomGL :) Basically, I want to take the fancy gl features that JDoom popularized and make them mapper friendly (finally).

Now, I'm not bagging on JDoom at all, in fact it's the port I most look to for ideas right now (I added hires sprite support when I read it on the Doomsday forums) since it's the benchmark for visuals in Doom. I'm just pointing out that it's not as wildly advanced as you say it is (the other ports are right with it, ahead in some areas and lagging in others) :)

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Old Post 07-11-03 05:15 #
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Doomer34
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timmie said:
Heh, I'll do a ZDoomGL/JDoom comparison here (based on the in-development 0.75)... Note that if I say ZDoom supports it, I also mean ZDoomGL supports it by default:

Like textures up to 4096*4096 pixels - hmm, ZDoomGL supports the exact same hires textures JDoom supports (and I think I'll add jpg support soon), and ZDoom itself supports 2048*2048 textures (although not in PNG format)
hi res sprites - heh, halfway supported in ZDoomGL. I just have to set it up so it reads the right ones for the current translation
mp3 music support - zdoom has this
eax support - zdoom also has this as an editing feature, no less: http://zdoom.notgod.com/ftp/examples/eax.zip (use latest ZDoom)
md2 support - alright, ZDoomGL doesn't support those right now, but it's on the list
special lights - same as models, but it's higher up on the list
better 3d view - do you mean mouselook? ZDoom's looks funny, but it's there and ZDoomGL has the same mouselook as JDoom
better Jump than zdaemon - probably no change here, but it's personal preference
good air movement - haven't really compared and contrasted ZDoom/JDoom on this
model lights - see above for models
anisotropic texture filtering - ZDoomGL has supported this since 0.7
Stable singleplayer - ZDoom is rock solid
detail wad support - I'll probably add support for detail textures to ZDoomGL in the future :)
Hi res titlepic, hudbar etc - the hires titlepic works, but the statusbar uses the same methods as the fonts, so it's not hires :(
ded - hmm, ZDoomGL probably won't support DED anytime soon (I've got my own things cooking)
Good option panel - I have to admit, I love the options panel in JDoom :)
And best of all we get many updates, which legacy do not, nor Zdoom - ZDoom gets updated quite regularly, just not recently (of course, who am I to talk about irregular updates) =/

And the things I have planned for the future:

shader script language - Quake3-style texturing in Doom!
mapper-friendly lights - an actual light object you can place in your maps
placeable models - being able to place md2 models in maps as objects would be pretty cool, too

I'd also like to point out the animation blending and ultra-large flats (tested with a 2048*2048 flat) in ZDoomGL :) Basically, I want to take the fancy gl features that JDoom popularized and make them mapper friendly (finally).

Now, I'm not bagging on JDoom at all, in fact it's the port I most look to for ideas right now (I added hires sprite support when I read it on the Doomsday forums) since it's the benchmark for visuals in Doom. I'm just pointing out that it's not as wildly advanced as you say it is (the other ports are right with it, ahead in some areas and lagging in others) :)



i think that is a biast view, you obviously love ZDoom, but i dont know how anyone can compare ZDooM/ZDooMGL graphics to JDooM, dont get me wrong but ZDooM has excellent editing features but comes way behind in graphics.

Old Post 07-11-03 08:35 #
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Ultraviolet
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timmie: I noticed you mentioned placing models as objects in maps... perhaps one could just find a way to have the DECORATE lump's objects have a model assigned to them?

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Old Post 07-11-03 08:56 #
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Melfice
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I personally use all three of the major ports, ZDoom, Legacy, and JDoom. Even though I did decide to drop Dark Nexus' ZDoom version...because its so far behind Legacy and JDoom (just IMO).

The whole competition think is retarded really. Heh, someone should try to get all the features and just put them into one port and fuck all the rest to hell.

Like Ichor, I find .ded to be a pain in the ass. There's a bunch of unecessary lines and crap in it. Even though I don't like ZDoom too much anymore, I do like the .acs scripting it uses.

Since from what I ready, Skyjake is putting .acs scripting into JDoom, I'll probably start editing with it alot more than any other ports. I love scripting, I just don't like having one script be so damned complicated. With the amount of lines it takes for one script in XG scripting, I could do 6 events at the same time in .ACS scripting.

BTW, Kinky, saying that something is the best, regardless of if you didn't mean to push your opinion onto other people, is a big mistake, because it still steps on the toes of those who think differently, and begs for a return comment ;)

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Old Post 07-11-03 09:27 #
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myk
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Kuberr said:
The whole competition think is retarded really. Heh, someone should try to get all the features and just put them into one port and fuck all the rest to hell.


On the contrary, it is because they try to code super feature-happy engines that the competition exists, among users (that ask for the features) as well as among the coders, who listen to them and work their asses off to make their engines popular.

JDoom came on with great graphics, being on par with ZDoom but on diifferent grounds, so then timmie came by and worked on ZDoomGL, pretty much aming for something more or less like ZDoom + JDoom... so then you have SkyJake adding ZDoom-like features to JDoom (when intitially he didn't want to,) and so on.

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Old Post 07-11-03 09:47 #
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kinkyfriend85
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Kuberr said:

BTW, Kinky, saying that something is the best, regardless of if you didn't mean to push your opinion onto other people, is a big mistake, because it still steps on the toes of those who think differently, and begs for a return comment ;)



Actually what I mean is that it's the most advanced port, not the best :P

Old Post 07-11-03 09:52 #
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kinkyfriend85
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I twould be great to have all those ports merged into one, not all stuffs just some good stuffs each has.
as like I would not consider zdaemons gameplay as doom (hey that feels quakedoom)
edge's shadowing is kewl (on items, monsters etc). but thats for sprite users only

Old Post 07-11-03 09:58 #
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Ultraviolet
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Uh, "most advanced" is just a way to say "best."

And no, let's not have ALL features in one port. That would be such fucking ugly bloatware, ugh. Imagine it, dynamic lights everywhere, about forty-eight custom weapons, every object would have five coronas, the purpose of every custom level made would be to see who could stack up the most 3d floors...

Limitations make for good art. A sculpter stops not when there is nothing more to add, but when there is nothing more to be taken away.

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Old Post 07-11-03 10:13 #
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Shaviro
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kinkyfriend85. I must insist that you post one thread at a time instead of two just after eachother. Yes, I mean it seriously.

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Old Post 07-11-03 10:14 #
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kinkyfriend85
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Shaviro said:
kinkyfriend85. I must insist that you post one thread at a time instead of two just after eachother. Yes, I mean it seriously.


either you guys are crazy thinking i can merge 5 posts into one or you are used to get one message per month.

You think i have the tine to quote 5 people on same message and plus i dont know html coding.

and besides somone mentioned the threads you make are your own, so why do you claim me spamming. if this is true then you either dont go in this thread or you read them without any complaints.

You ask much of me, if i write too long post i get those nasty replies and if i reply on posts each, not all on one then i am getting the same result.

Old Post 07-11-03 10:20 #
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Grazza
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Perhaps it would have been helpful at the start of this thread to state your definition of advanced.

Editing posts is really rather simple. Just click on the Edit/Delete button and cut/copy/paste away. Using multiple windows can make it easier if you want to quote from several people's posts.

Old Post 07-11-03 10:28 #
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kinkyfriend85
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Grazza said:
Perhaps it would have been helpful at the start of this thread to state your definition of advanced.

Editing posts is really rather simple. Just click on the Edit/Delete button and cut/copy/paste away. Using multiple windows can make it easier if you want to quote from several people's posts.





I know this but i wont have 5 more screens open when i already usually have 15-20+ opened

Old Post 07-11-03 10:31 #
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Shaviro
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kinkyfriend85 said:


either you guys are crazy thinking i can merge 5 posts into one or you are used to get one message per month.

You think i have the tine to quote 5 people on same message and plus i dont know html coding.

and besides somone mentioned the threads you make are your own, so why do you claim me spamming. if this is true then you either dont go in this thread or you read them without any complaints.

You ask much of me, if i write too long post i get those nasty replies and if i reply on posts each, not all on one then i am getting the same result.



Read the FAQ.


kinkyfriend85 said:
I know this but i wont have 5 more screens open when i already usually have 15-20+ opened


This is not our problem. Follow the rules or stop posting.

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Old Post 07-11-03 10:41 #
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Nanami
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Heh, Shav, you go girl!

Anyway what does not knowing HTML have to do with posting on the forums Kinky? O_o

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Old Post 07-11-03 10:47 #
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kinkyfriend85
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Shaviro said:


Read the FAQ.

I have and i dont need your help.

This is not our problem. Follow the rules or stop posting.



yes it is your problems when you come to a thread i created. I dont like to write a message which has answers to 5 people, i write an answer for each message.
If this means i cant be here posting because i dont accept that then you're no better than newdoom crap.

Old Post 07-11-03 10:54 #
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zark
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Heh, you guys are so picky when it comes to posting. It's also dragging it off-topic. Couldn't you PM him about it?

Old Post 07-11-03 10:54 #
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kinkyfriend85
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Nanami said:
Heh, Shav, you go girl!

Anyway what does not knowing HTML have to do with posting on the forums Kinky? O_o




The quoting etc, diff font...

Old Post 07-11-03 10:56 #
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SmellyOgre
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Click the magical button at the bottom of my signature Kinky.

Old Post 07-11-03 10:56 #
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Shaviro
Team Future Chief


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kinkyfriend85 said:
yes it is your problems when you come to a thread i created. I dont like to write a message which has answers to 5 people, i write an answer for each message.
If this means i cant be here posting because i dont accept that then you're no better than newdoom crap.



Call us what you want. We have rules which are here to be enforced. We are trying to make this forum a better place to be. If everybody were posting numerous replies like you are, it would be virtually impossible to read the threads, not to mention how ugly it would be.


kinkyfriend85 said:
The quoting etc, diff font...


It's NOT hard! Use tags like these.

[IMG]
[I]
[B]
[QUOTE]
[URL]

It's all in the FAQ. Why don't you go read it?

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Old Post 07-11-03 11:03 #
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Grazza
Let's try Caesium


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kinkyfriend85 said:
If this means i cant be here posting because i dont accept that then you're no better than newdoom crap.
Heh, since you brought it up, what happened between you and those nice friendly people at Newdoom?

Old Post 07-11-03 11:04 #
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Espi
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Kinky.

Old Post 07-11-03 11:04 #
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