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Envid
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Although Ive heard alot of rants and raves about people not getting all the resource packs to integrate in to one. I managed to do it as tedious as it was I have had no errors except with the JDOOM port itself with compatabilities with my ATI Radeon 9800 card and had to disable the mipmapping via the kickstart program.

Using the following mods for Jdoom I got these fantastic features

JDRP 1.01 by danni (I had to unpack all of the pk3 files and sort them via their raw formats) awesome work by far.

Retexturing project that was 200 mb download but well worth it.

JDUI pack (i believe by danni again)

JDEP pack (slide and some others including danni)

Anyway after messing with the files and screwing with it for a while (persistence was the key here) I got these great screenshots that show why Jdoom is the dominator here. I have yet to see a port come this close to owning.

All screenshots are unmodified except to convert from tga to jpg for compression and the filename itself for ease of use.

These are all 1600x1200 in-game screenshots and I had no deviance from my 35 fps except for when i did the screen shots when it dropped to 32?

http://www.nullparameter.com/jdoom1.jpg
http://www.nullparameter.com/jdoom2.jpg
http://www.nullparameter.com/jdoom3.jpg
http://www.nullparameter.com/jdoom4.jpg
http://www.nullparameter.com/jdoom5.jpg
http://www.nullparameter.com/jdoom6.jpg
http://www.nullparameter.com/jdoom7.jpg
http://www.nullparameter.com/jdoom8.jpg
http://www.nullparameter.com/jdoom9.jpg
http://www.nullparameter.com/jdoom10.jpg
http://www.nullparameter.com/jdoom11.jpg

Anyone have screenshots of a more impressive port with mods???
Major props to danni and all his work on his resource pack as well as the other mods to jdoom.
Old Post 06-23-04 21:43 #
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Grazza
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Calm down now. Yes, jDoom looks great, but it isn't necessarily everyone's favourite port. Terms like "owning" and "dominating" don't belong in this sort of discussion.
Old Post 06-23-04 21:50 #
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Naitguolf
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in fact, you should try others mods. Zdoom for example, is more capable to make great maps, effects, and so.

Try excelent map: The Void. That "thing" cannot be done with actual Jdoom.
Old Post 06-23-04 21:56 #
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Envid
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A favorite is an opinion as is owning and dominating it does do in forms of graphics.

Although you may be offended to it. Some people still like their old Castle Wolfenstien so it is all relative. Why you so sensitive?
Old Post 06-23-04 21:56 #
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Envid
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I was in to zdoom a long time ago for the multiplayability but when I checked up on how the source ports were doing zdoom lacked and it especially lacked with zdoomgl and the models I could not get to load. True it supports opengl and direct3d but what port doesnt? Show me a couple of screenshots and make me a believer?

Ive shown what jdoom can do... Show me what zdoom can do?
Old Post 06-23-04 21:59 #
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Graf Zahl
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How can a source port 'own' if it can't even run any of my favorite maps? :P
Old Post 06-23-04 21:59 #
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Graf Zahl
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Envid said:

Ive shown what jdoom can do... Show me what zdoom can do?



JDoom can do nice graphics. ZDoom can do great levels!
Old Post 06-23-04 22:00 #
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Envid
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Zdoom's custom maps differ than that of Jdoom's? Or are you implying you cant make maps with Jdoom's port?......
Old Post 06-23-04 22:03 #
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Graf Zahl
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1. Try to find ZDoom specific maps in the /idgames archives.
2. Try to find JDoom specific maps there

Result 1: You will find a lot of great maps
Result 2: Good luck finding anything at all!

The reason for this is thar ZDoom is a port specifically aimed to provide good editing features for new maps.
JDoom on the other hand is a port that is primarily aimed at making existing maps look good.
Old Post 06-23-04 22:08 #
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Ichor
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I said in another thread:
Doom + Hexen + slopes, colored lighting, and other extras = ZDoom

JDoom, on the other hand, mostly has nifty visual effects like lens flares. However, it is possible, either by .ded or in older versions .dll files, to modify the source code itself. Doom64 TC is one example of this. Unfortunately, all those neato, whizbang bells and whisles tend to really slow down many computers.

Doom64 TC is about the only thing I use JDoom for, and it looks quite good, but I use ZDoom much of the time. Although, I use JHexen (but an older version) almost all the time for Hexen.
Old Post 06-23-04 22:10 #
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Epyo
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also zdoom joypad support >>>> jdoom joypad support

just for the record you know

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Old Post 06-23-04 22:14 #
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chilvence
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Mapping for every port is different. By far the most intuitive is ZDoom, since it builds on features like ACS which have been around for yonks.

By far the largest amount of custom maps are made for Zdoom, and if you dont play them, its your loss. It doesnt take much to have two different doom ports on the same computer you know.
Old Post 06-23-04 22:14 #
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Envid
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zdoom maps are different than a .wad? I looked and saw a converter to convert any map to zdoom standard type wad although I havnt searched or checked for a way to convert it back to a regular wad. Regular wads can be utilized through Jdoom, What is zdoom's specific type map (if it is a zdoom specific type) allow as a bonus instead of a regular wad file?
Old Post 06-23-04 22:17 #
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Ichor
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Many maps made specifically for ZDoom are based in the Hexen format (i.e. hubs, ACS, polyobjects, etc.), which won't run if if you tried to run in JDoom.

And trying to run them in Hexen won't work either, since ZDoom, although based on Hexen, has things that it doesn't have, like slopes, more variety of ACS scripting, and the ability to use monsters from other games, even Strife.
Old Post 06-23-04 22:20 #
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Envid
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joystick support?

Oh you mean this?

http://www.nullparameter.com/joystick.jpg
Old Post 06-23-04 22:20 #
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Envid
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True the hexen wads are different but I see alot of conversion utilities to alternate between different wad types. I havnt been interested in levels since 96-97ish when they were abundant and I thought I played them all. I also contributed quite a bit before the source release.
Old Post 06-23-04 22:22 #
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Epyo
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Hey man I know Jdoom has joystick support, I just said that zdoom's was better.

Just for the record.

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Old Post 06-23-04 22:23 #
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Nmn
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Zdoom can play both-normal maps (regular Doom maps) and maps that are specific Zdoom format (Hexen format + Enhced Zdoom Features). WAD files have 2 formats-Normal and Zdoom. Jdoom plays normal, Zdoom plays both.
You can play any regular Doom map with Zdoom, You don't need to convert it. If You want to take advantages of Zdoom's special features (mentioned above) then You need to make Your map with the special format.
Jdoom on the other hand can play only regular Doom maps. It doesn't have all those outstanding editing features that Zdoom has.
There are lots of Zdoom maps that can be played only with Zdoom, because a lot of poeple find it's features very useful and fun to make new gameplay, story driven wads, objective-gameplay or just plain colored lighting. You can do almost anything You want with Zdoom, that's why a lot of people map for it. Their creative horizons are much wider than plain old Doom. Zdoom does much much more.

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Old Post 06-23-04 22:27 #
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Envid
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Yea i checked some archives on zdoom's "special" features although Ill have to check some more on it.

Jdoom does allow all of the doom2 WAD type maps. So saying that the customizing as far as Jdoom goes is zerch is very misleading considering the amount of custom maps out there for doom, heretic, and doom2.

Thanks for the info on the zdoom type maps tho
Old Post 06-23-04 22:32 #
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DaniJ
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Thanks for the props Envid.

Personally I NEVER play with fog enabled as it forces Doomsday to use the shite additive blending for the lights.

Also you might wanna try menu-fog 0 in the console for a better version of the "curtain" effect on the menu.

Nmn - Doomsday has coloured lighting too. It's far better than Zdoom's.
Old Post 06-23-04 22:32 #
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Ichor
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But, I like JDoom (or JHexen in this case) because I can use it to alter the source code, allowing me much more control over what I can make. I can fix bugs (or create new ones that I won't be aware of for several weeks and have them show up at the worst possible time), tweak settings, and add new items, enemies, and weapons, and create the behavior for them (limited only by my imagination and my knowledge of the source code). ZDoom, while it has all these nice features and Dehacked support, still has its limits, because asfar as I know, you can't modify the source code just yet.
Old Post 06-23-04 22:34 #
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Epyo
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Nmn said:
WAD files have 2 formats-Normal and Zdoom. Jdoom plays normal, Zdoom plays both.

Oh but don't forget, there are jdoom-only map(s?) too, and legacy, and etc etc.

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Old Post 06-23-04 22:37 #
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Vegeta
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Jdoom looks better.
Zdoom plays better.

Personaly I find more inmersive a map when all kind of things can hapen (a Zdoom map), rather than a map with the same predictable effects of the DOOM exe but with good looking models/textures (a Jdoom map).
Old Post 06-23-04 22:37 #
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DaniJ
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THE best feature of Doomsday are it's ded files.

With .ded's you can create new monsters, edit the weapons, change the behaviors of stuff and of course add all the cool particle fx, models and lights.

Not as comprehensive as ACS but it's a lot easier to simply define a new monster/item/object rather than scripting it.

Actually there is no reason why a jDoom map should be predictable (XG).
Old Post 06-23-04 22:38 #
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Nmn
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Epyo said:

Oh but don't forget, there are jdoom-only map(s?) too, and legacy, and etc etc.

Actually no.
The maps that are meant for Jdoom or Legacy are still plain Doom2 Format, altough with special features (so if You play them with ZDoom it won't crash, yet things like 3d bridges won't appear).
Zdoom on the other hand has a different map format (Hexen, Zdoom and Vavoom use it, other source ports simply crash) it allows for specific Hexen format features like polyobjects. For a proof check any ordinary map in wintex.
Open up a wad file for Doom and look at the map. You should see a normal layout with bluelines.
Now open up a Wad with a specifc Zdoom map and look at the map-what You see is a garbled mess of linedefs.

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Old Post 06-23-04 22:41 #
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Epyo
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Nmn said:
Actually no.
The maps that are meant for Jdoom or Legacy are still plain Doom2 Format, altough with special features (so if You play them with ZDoom it won't crash, yet things like 3d bridges won't appear).

So what you're saying is, Zdoom can load all maps, but not correctly.

dur! Why would I load a map in zdoom if it won't load correctly, when I can load it in the right port? :)

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Old Post 06-23-04 22:46 #
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Envid
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Ho yea dani, major fan of your skinning talent that you have.

When I looked for a new doom port I want to immerse myself back in the doom atmosphere without the mods of people who didnt quite get the effect quite right.
Danni and the others who have retextured, created new effects, and spent hours of work shows very much so in a before/after shot.

Zdoom looks awful compared to Jdoom (this is me as a player talking) and being straight up considering I only downloaded this port 2 days ago and got it working the way I want it to work 6 hours ago.

Thanks for the tip on the nofog danni Ill check it out.

If i want really fun or playable maps I might as well go to quake 3 engine or a halflife modification if im looking for "gameplay". This might be because I created and edited hundreds (yes hundreds) of maps back in the day....They all look like clones or derive off the same features as the original maps.

As far as the doom experience goes.... This port totally rocks and looks better than opengl version of quake.

Back to the reason I use the fog effect....even though the blending needs alot of work, (and the lighting needs optimization as well) the fog gives a little bit of an "eerie" feel to it. Add a couple of console computers with displays of earch, united alliance logos, and some hellacious monsters and you got a nice creation.
Old Post 06-23-04 22:46 #
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DaniJ
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That's not strictly true Nmn. Try downloading some TRUE jDoom only wads and you'll find that if you run them in Zdoom they either won't work properly, or you'll be missing out on a lot of the atmospheric stuff.

jDoom is only just starting to mature as a viable platform for wad authors.
Old Post 06-23-04 22:47 #
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Epyo
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In short, download all ports, be happy, and keep your mouth shut. Happy dooming everybody!

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Old Post 06-23-04 22:51 #
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Nmn
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Epyo said:

So what you're saying is, Zdoom can load all maps, but not correctly.

dur! Why would I load a map in zdoom if it won't load correctly, when I can load it in the right port? :)

:-) Read my post
Zdoom loads BOTH and plays them:
maps with regular format and Zdoom format maps. It's obvious that if You load a Jdoom specific map for Zdoom it will launch but not correctly, because that map is for Jdoom, not Zdoom, get it?
Ports that use the Zdoom map format (Jhexen, Vavoom, Zdoom, ZDoomgl) will load regular Doom maps, as well as other ports' maps, but those other ports' maps will not work correctly. However, if You load a map with a Zdoom format into other ports besides those mentioned above it won't launch at all.
Dani, ofroucse You will be missing some exclusive features. For example, You can load the Doom64_abstin.wad into Zdoom (I've corrected the colormap lump!) and it WILL play, but will lack colored lighting, DED's and all that cool Jdoom stuff.
EDIT: Epyo, if You want to shut Your mouth, fine. Don't post.
In Short-play regular Doom2 maps with any port You want.
Play Jdoom maps with Jdoom, Zdoom maps with Zdoom, Legacy maps with Legacy. Simple.

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Last edited by Nmn on 06-23-04 at 23:00
Old Post 06-23-04 22:54 #
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