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Ichor
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I have here a remake of Heretic's E1M7 (The Crypts) that DooMBoy and I worked on (actually, it was his idea, but I ended up doing most of the map). It was designed to be run in the original engine, although it's too large to save any games on it. Source ports could run it, but some of the effects (especially in the blue key room) would be lost. Who wants to test it?

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Old Post 06-06-03 14:38 #
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DooMBoy
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Oooh memememememememe!!!!!!111
Heh. I played it just now, very nice, good looking, good playing, kinda difficult, but a good challenge nonetheless. Once more, sorry I didn't do more for this level, got caught up with some other stuff I was doing at the time. :(

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Old Post 06-06-03 15:37 #
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Ichor
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I hate it when that happens.

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Old Post 06-06-03 15:59 #
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DooMBoy
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Heh me too. Just wait.....you'll see what I'm talking about when it hits the /newstuff. I just hope it will be as good as I, personally, think it is.

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Old Post 06-06-03 16:44 #
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Ichor
The Mysterious Red Square


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Well, I just discovered that the lighting effect I've been wanting so much to use in the map can't be used. This is what I mean, but it just can't be used for Doom and Heretic (Hexen can with no problems, but ACS can do that). Oh well, I'll just have to think of something else.

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Last edited by Ichor on 06-06-03 at 17:43

Old Post 06-06-03 17:07 #
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Ichor
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Ok, I just loaded a new version with a different, but just as nice, lighting effect in the blue key room. Same link as before.

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Old Post 06-06-03 17:43 #
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Vegeta
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In Maximum DOOM you can find a conversion of the whole episode 1 of Heretic to DOOM 2. I'm not sure if that is what you are working on.

Old Post 06-07-03 01:15 #
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Doom Dude
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I just fired it up in Legacy and played some of the first part. Looks pretty good so far. Oh and my saved game works fine. :)

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Old Post 06-07-03 02:51 #
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DooMBoy
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Vegeta said:
In Maximum DOOM you can find a conversion of the whole episode 1 of Heretic to DOOM 2. I'm not sure if that is what you are working on.
No. This is a remake of the original Heretic E1M7. You should really try it :)

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Old Post 06-07-03 03:42 #
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Cacodreams
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Vegeta made me confused! Is this a remake of Heretic E1M7 for Heretic itself? If itīs so, cool! I like E1M7 a lot! The church at the beginning, the crypts themselves, the graveyard...

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Old Post 06-07-03 08:13 #
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Graf Zahl
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Cacodreams said:
Vegeta made me confused! Is this a remake of Heretic E1M7 for Heretic itself? If itīs so, cool! I like E1M7 a lot! The church at the beginning, the crypts themselves, the graveyard...


That's E1M6 (The Cathedral)!

Old Post 06-07-03 08:54 #
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Cacodreams
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Oops! Damn f**king memory!!! Thanx Graf Zahl!

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Old Post 06-07-03 09:48 #
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The Ultimate DooMer
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Ichor said:
Who wants to test it?


If it reaches newstuff next week, I'll test it then.

Old Post 06-07-03 19:52 #
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Ichor
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I just sent it earlier today, but it hasn't made it over to /newstuff yet.

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Old Post 06-07-03 19:56 #
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It has now, and there's a bug. When you teleport onto the platform with the map scroll, it rises up to the ceiling - leaving a hom behind when you drop off, and the secret doesn't register until you noclip back onto the platform. There's also some texture misalignments on the steps leading to the exit platform, but I don't know if it's meant to look like that or not.

Old Post 06-08-03 15:15 #
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Ichor
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That was supposed to look like that. As for the map scroll bug, that shouldn't happen. What port were you using?

It must have been ZDoom (ZHeretic). I guess W1_RaiseTotexture needs to be fixed, but it works fine in Heretic and JHeretic.

However, I did discover a couple of problems that simply had to be fixed. One was on a colum in the yellow key room (I can't believe I missed such an obvious error for so long). Another was that a couple of monsters were getting stuck before having a chance to teleport into the yellow key room. As a result, you couldn't get 100% kills.

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Last edited by Ichor on 06-08-03 at 18:54

Old Post 06-08-03 15:24 #
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Doom Dude
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Ichor said:
I just sent it earlier today, but it hasn't made it over to /newstuff yet.


AS far as I know they won't accept remakes of original maps. Not sure about heretic levels... At least for DooM they won't as my Underhalls remake wasn't accepted even though it was made from scratch.

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Old Post 06-09-03 12:31 #
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Torn
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Doom Dude said:


AS far as I know they won't accept remakes of original maps. Not sure about heretic levels... At least for DooM they won't as my Underhalls remake wasn't accepted even though it was made from scratch.



I think ty only read the text file these days, not testing the wads.
So maybe he took yours out, couse it had the name "underhalls". :/

Old Post 06-09-03 12:33 #
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Ichor
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From what I've heard, they don't accept remakes if they were based on the original map (i.e. the dwango remake of MAP01). I don't know why your map was rejected (it could have been something else entirely), but from what you said, it probably shouldn't have been. Maybe you could try to resubmit it.

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Old Post 06-09-03 14:02 #
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Erik
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a way to fix the raisetotexture tag is to apply the texture on both the back and front lower textures on the object that will rise, then it raises by the correct amount (the texture height) in all ports I have tested.

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Old Post 06-09-03 14:55 #
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Ichor
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There actually isn't any problem with the tag itself. The problem is with ZDoom.

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Old Post 06-09-03 15:01 #
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Erik
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Ichor said:
There actually isn't any problem with the tag itself. The problem is with ZDoom.


Actually the way the tag works is very different in different ports. In doom2.exe (the original and best) and zdoom the sector raises half the texture height unless you have the texture on both sides, in the boom family of ports (except prboom with full compat mode on I imagine), it raises all the way to the full texture height no matter what. I'd say that the original behaviour is the most correct. When you design a non port-specific level it's always best to be compatible with as much as possible, thus the method with lower textures on both sides is recommended.

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Old Post 06-09-03 15:55 #
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Graf Zahl
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Erik said:


Actually the way the tag works is very different in different ports. In doom2.exe (the original and best) and zdoom the sector raises half the texture height unless you have the texture on both sides, in the boom family of ports (except prboom with full compat mode on I imagine), it raises all the way to the full texture height no matter what. I'd say that the original behaviour is the most correct. When you design a non port-specific level it's always best to be compatible with as much as possible, thus the method with lower textures on both sides is recommended.



Actually this is not quite correct. The problem of all this is a bug in the original Doom (and also Heretic) code which doesn't exclude texture 0 (which is simply a placeholder for 'no texture') from this calculation. This dummy texture is 72 units high in Doom 1 and 64 in Doom 2. (I don't have the value for Heretic). Boom fixes this bug and ZDoom has it compatibility optioned (PrBoom doesn't!)
So to be compatible with all ports it is always a good idea (as you already suggested) to put a lower texture on both sidedefs of any line surrounding a sector which is tagged with this line type.

Old Post 06-09-03 16:16 #
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Ichor
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I was going to use W1_FloorRaiseNearAndChange like I usually would, but that changes the floor texture to whatever the sector the trigger line happened to be on (I think). Since the floor was a different flat from the tomb, the center of the tomb would change to that of the floor, and look very ugly. And I didn't want to change the floor to that of the tomb, because that would be ugly too. I tried all the other options, and for some reason, this was the only one that worked. Also, I left the textures blank to give the illusion that the Undead Warrior ghost was rising out of the grave.

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Old Post 06-09-03 16:25 #
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Erik
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uh, I am sure there are line specials to raise to next without changing floor texture, aren't there?

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Old Post 06-09-03 16:42 #
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The Ultimate DooMer
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Doom Dude said:

AS far as I know they won't accept remakes of original maps. Not sure about heretic levels... At least for DooM they won't as my Underhalls remake wasn't accepted even though it was made from scratch.



What applies to DooM maps applies to Heretic and Hexen maps too, but this map looks nothing like the original E1M7, but it does have a classic look to it, and is certainly a lot bigger, too. Good map, fun to play as well.

Old Post 06-09-03 17:07 #
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Graf Zahl
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Erik said:
uh, I am sure there are line specials to raise to next without changing floor texture, aren't there?



There are but the W1 type doesn't exist in Heretic. It was added for Doom 2.

Old Post 06-09-03 20:11 #
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Doom Dude
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From what I've heard, they don't accept remakes if they were based on the original map (i.e. the dwango remake of MAP01). I don't know why your map was rejected (it could have been something else entirely), but from what you said, it probably shouldn't have been. Maybe you could try to resubmit it.


My map is very similar to the original so that's why it got rejected. Anyhow I talked to Ty about it afterwards and I'm cool with the rules. Afterall there will be more maps to upload in the future that have nothing to do with remakes and such.


What applies to DooM maps applies to Heretic and Hexen maps too, but this map looks nothing like the original E1M7, but it does have a classic look to it, and is certainly a lot bigger, too. Good map, fun to play as well.


Since it's nothing like the the original wouldn't it be more like a version 2 than a remake? I haven't gotten around to playing past the first room... been kinda busy but it's cool to see new Heretic stuff being created.

Ichor will you guys be doing more Heretic maps? Maybe an episode? :)

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Old Post 06-10-03 00:15 #
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The Ultimate DooMer
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Doom Dude said:
Ichor will you guys be doing more Heretic maps? Maybe an episode? :)


He made these a few years back:

Carnage Galore

Ichor: Blood of the Gods

Definitely among the finest around.

Old Post 06-10-03 00:24 #
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Ichor
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I don't really consider Carnage Galore my finest work. It was my first in fact, and I really didn't have much experience with map making back then. The second one was a lot better though.

And no, I'm not making any more maps for Heretic. I've gone back to working on the Hexen project.

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Old Post 06-10-03 00:39 #
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