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Dreadopp
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Shoot, looks like I didn't have the latest version of the MEDIVLTX :P. Sorry about that, its just that there was 3 versions of MEDIVLTX on the same page, kind of confusing which one people use now. Never mind what I said earlier (except the ammo thing).
Old Post 05-13-08 10:46 #
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Artillery
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First, I'm a little confused as to which texture set is the right one. I use the one posted on ler's FIRST POST. It would be nice to remove all the wrong links, since it's confusing. With this texture set I got the messed-up exit floor in Snarboo's map.

Snarboo: Except for that missing texture, I noticed another weirdness. In gzdoom, I managed to grab the green key before the yellow one. I doubt this was the intention.

Otherwise than that, though, I think the map is absolutely great, and the layout is very nicely set up.
Old Post 05-13-08 11:28 #
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Vermil
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@ Artillery
Theres only one link to the texture wad in THIS thread, which is the correct one ;)

@Jodwin
That's a quirk of ZDoom when the sectors either side of the mid texture are exactly the same. If you make a tiny change to the sector on one of the sides (i.e change the flat, raise the light level by 1), it should go away.

@Lord_Z
You've left the DB 3D start thing in your E1M9 map (it's a long way away from the map it'self).

@Snarboo
You've forgotten to tag the lift trigger on Linedef 1462 to the actual lift.

Last edited by Vermil on 05-13-08 at 11:46
Old Post 05-13-08 11:34 #
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Lord_Z
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Looking through the previous pages, I found a lot more than one link to the texture wad, theres like 7 of them. I don't know how many actually work but it could still be confusing.

Thanks for letting me know about the 3D start, Vermil. (I could have sworn I got rid of it already, but more importantly, how did it get way out there...)

This link is no longer available (I assume you have it, ler)

Last edited by Lord_Z on 05-13-08 at 19:40
Old Post 05-13-08 12:19 #
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jobro
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And what texture set IS the correct one? Give us a link here please.
Old Post 05-13-08 12:54 #
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ler
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There's a link in the first post with the correct one.
Old Post 05-13-08 13:06 #
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Vermil
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Whoops, me bad. When I wrote that, I was thinking that there was only one link to the texture wad in this thread and that the corrections (and the associated posts) to it were made while the old thread was still being used. Must have been a loose connection upstairs.

Any way’s, the link in the first post is to the latest version of the texture wad (Ler updated it after the corrections were made).
Old Post 05-13-08 13:08 #
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Jodwin
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Vermil said:
@Jodwin
That's a quirk of ZDoom when the sectors either side of the mid texture are exactly the same. If you make a tiny change to the sector on one of the sides (i.e change the flat, raise the light level by 1), it should go away.

Well I didn't know it's ZDoom specific, but still there's no reason to not to fix it since it's exactly as simple as you said: Just raise/lower the other sector's light by 1.
Old Post 05-13-08 13:36 #
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Artillery
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ler said:
There's a link in the first post with the correct one.


I used that one for Snarboo's e1m3, tested it in gzdoom, and got the missing floor texture mark on the exit teleport.
Old Post 05-13-08 14:02 #
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Snarboo
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I must be using the wrong version of medivltx, then. My version has another exit teleporter flat. I'll just change it.

Linedef 1462 should be tagged to the proper sector now, too.
Old Post 05-13-08 19:57 #
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Vermil
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Actually it's Artillery who has the wrong version of the resource wad. Snarboo has the right one.

After all the tweaking to the resource wad was done and links to several versions were ultimately posted, the link in the first post was silently updated by Ler to the final (well currently) version.
Old Post 05-13-08 20:01 #
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Snarboo
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Oh...well I changed it anyway and it's fine. :)

Here's the latest version:
E1M3

Please overwrite older versions!

Changes include: removing a few of the more troublesome monsters on medium, changing some of the crystals into geodes for a better wand start, moving the crossbow on difficulties below Smite-meister to the courtyard, moving the fence and posts up so they don't bleed into the ground, tagging the lift near the yellow key door properly, moving the green key so you cannot jump and reach it in G/ZDoom and changing the flat for the exit teleporter.

Maybe a few other changes that I forgot, but it should work now.
Old Post 05-13-08 20:15 #
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Creaphis
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Well, we still haven't really put together the "right" texture wad, with fully compatible textures.
Old Post 05-13-08 20:56 #
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Artillery
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Vermil said:
After all the tweaking to the resource wad was done and links to several versions were ultimately posted, the link in the first post was silently updated by Ler to the final (well currently) version.


Aaaaah, so that's the problem! Gee, for a moment I though I was mad...

But it's not clear with me than, which one should I download? The one which is on the first page now?

Snarboo: I didn't use jumping for the green key or anywhere else, I simply kissed the wall, and voila! But if you prevented that from happening, then it's all fine.
Old Post 05-13-08 21:13 #
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Snarboo
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Artillery said:
Snarboo: I didn't use jumping for the green key or anywhere else, I simply kissed the wall, and voila! But if you prevented that from happening, then it's all fine.
Ah, I see what you mean. It was probably too close to the edge, and I think if you have some of the compatibility options checked such as infinitely tall actors, you can pick it up. It's been moved back now, so no worries. :)
Old Post 05-13-08 21:20 #
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ler
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I took a look at the E1M3. It looked pretty excellent and ran in Heretic+ (though I didn't run all the way through).

I'm probably going to go over a lot of these maps later with a fine toothed comb, maybe after we get a complete episode (which looks like soon! look at e1).
Old Post 05-14-08 00:03 #
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Snarboo
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ler said:
I took a look at the E1M3. It looked pretty excellent and ran in Heretic+ (though I didn't run all the way through).
Yay! :D I didn't want to fool around with Heretic+, but I'm glad to hear it's compatible. I might just need to install it for testing.

If we get the first episode finished, will all the maps be put together and released for testing? Or would you rather wait until we have more completed?

I'm considering doing another map, probably in the E4/5 slot, but I want to take a break first.
Old Post 05-14-08 00:14 #
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ler
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I'd rather have the testing done episode by episode. I'll release the wad of 1 episode for testing, give people a week to play and give notes, and then I'll combine the notes together, talk to individual mappers about fixing and refining and otherwise improving the maps, and then we'll hopefully have a final version of that episode.

If we do it this way we will be done an episode at a time, so we will technically have a complete product no matter where we have to stop.
Old Post 05-14-08 00:17 #
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Snarboo
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Would you mind updating the first post with links to the completed maps, ler? It would help those just coming into the thread find the relevant links quickly.
Old Post 05-14-08 00:23 #
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ler
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I think instead I might upload them to my webspace which is considerably more permanent, and I can make sure I have the most recent versions of people's maps.

Also vermil did some corrections on some of my copies, so they might be more updated than the versions the authors have!

Edit: Okay they're up, I think I have most of the completed maps. If I'm missing any tell me, and if there's something wrong with the version I have up there tell me. I also have the resource wad I'm using there and a levelnames.txt that has credits for the level creators and the name of the level if I have it (which you can slip to me however you'd like if you want a name for it). This is a useful resource for whoever is making those level name pictures- if you are doing so please add the creator's name. And if you would rather be credited by some other name please tell me and I will change it as soon as possible.

Last edited by ler on 05-14-08 at 00:40
Old Post 05-14-08 00:27 #
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Snarboo
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My map's name is Vigilant Outpost.

Edit:
I just played through my map from the resource and it's the right version. :)

Last edited by Snarboo on 05-14-08 at 01:11
Old Post 05-14-08 00:56 #
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Snarboo
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I've done a run-through of all the maps we have so far, and most of them are good. A few of them have minor issues that need to be fixed or tweaked, but I'll save that for another post. I'll probably post my impressions around the time we have all the E1 maps ready for testing.


However, there are two maps that I really need to comment on, and these are both in E2:

-E2M1 is bad. I hate to say it, but it just isn't very good. It comes off as a 1994 map. For example, there are random changes in texture and theme all over the place, doors do not have proper textures (they look like wall textures more often than not), doors do not have their door track textures unpegged, there are monsters all over the place, and the lighting level is bland. It's just sort of a mess right now.

-E2M6 isn't terrible, but something about it comes off as being a randomly generated map that has been tweaked. The rapid theme changes were a tip off, but the biggest thing that set off alarm bells in my head was how the map was detailed.

There was one room that had these ceiling fixtures that I could swear I had seen before in an oblige or slige map, which is what first tipped me off. After that, I took notice of the map details. The rooms are rather bland looking and generally made out of boxes with 90 degree angles, but are littered with haphazard detail. A pillar here, a snaking river there, or a random ceiling design. It doesn't feel very natural and comes off as copy-pasted or generated. The consistency of certain details despite rapid theme changes, such as how certain textures and details were used together, was another indicator.

While I cannot prove that it was randomly generated, there are just certain things about it that lead me to believe it is. Others will have to determine that for themselves.

Last edited by Snarboo on 05-14-08 at 04:22
Old Post 05-14-08 04:13 #
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ler
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Hrm. That is disconcerting about E2M6. I will take a look. Alternatively, he could have been influenced by random map generators. I know I like Oblige if I ever get bored sometimes. I'm not going to write this off until I do some real intensive study.

Update: I'm unconvinced. While the wad does have some very bizarre theme choices and some square rooms, errors such as the weird use of skies (how many generators put a room outside a "window" that has sky floor and ceiling?) and incorrect usage of middle textures (The chains kind of bleed through the floor) lead me to believe that it's just mapping error and possible random map generator influence. Also, I did a quick google search for Heretic level generators and it mostly came up with the same ol' oblige and slige, and some random object placers. Maybe I'm not seeing it or you're a little paranoid?

E2M1 I am on the border. It has pretty good gameplay but the detailing is just so agonizing. Maybe we can give it a vote, but what I'm hoping we can do instead is just have someone else go back over it and improve it visually, which would be a lot easier than trying to get a new mapper for that slot.

Everyone else, constructive criticism is appreciated!

Last edited by ler on 05-14-08 at 07:55
Old Post 05-14-08 07:41 #
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Snarboo
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Yeah, at this point I really can't say. It could just be the author's mapping style. I didn't mean to come off as though the map was bad or that it's wrong to use a randomly generated one as a base, I just wasn't sure if the project allowed randomly generated levels.
Old Post 05-14-08 07:46 #
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ler
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Well I'd probably look down upon a map very harshly but as I just updated (that you missed) it doesn't seem to be generated.
Old Post 05-14-08 07:56 #
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Snarboo
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Alright then. :) I was just probably a little overzealous.

Last edited by Snarboo on 05-14-08 at 08:36
Old Post 05-14-08 08:14 #
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Lord_Z
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It looks like you have the most updated versions of my maps, so that part is good. On the first post it says on E1M9 that the DB 3D start is still there but it should be gone now.

I don't think E2M6 could be randomly generated because it has some rooms that are on angles which means some work was put into it and Artillery does not strike me as someone who would cheat in such a way. If it does turn out that it is an RGL, I don't think it should be used.

Anyway, I guess my work here is done. I'll continue to visit regularly and drop my two cents in whenever possible. I really want to see this thing get released, and I believe we can do it!
Old Post 05-14-08 08:19 #
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Artillery
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Okay, everyone, rest assured that I've built e2m6 COMPLETELY from scratch, every linedef, every sector, and all of it done in doom builder. I've posted several versions of the map, and few days ago I sent ler the latest tweaked version, and before that (in the previous tread), I asked several people for feedback, evaluation, advice, etc.

As I said, it's technically my first relesed map ever, so it does look a bit patchworky maybe. In some ways, it was deliberately so to give it a unique "feel" with a few strange ideas. If there are objections to my mapping style or skills, well what can I say, I'm sorry. I did my best, but I'm still learning.

I don't even have any random map generators on my HD.

Ler: I asked several times and posted you to say what you mean about the map. If you find it inacceptable, send it back, open the slot and redraw the map. It won't be wasted, instead I'll redo, retexture, rework the map and I'll release it as a standalone doom map. If there are parts that need to be reworked to be included, I'll do that as well, but that's it.

Last edited by Artillery on 05-14-08 at 10:09
Old Post 05-14-08 10:03 #
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Dreadopp
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Here's the newest version of my first map. I added some death match starts and some death match weapons. If you manage to find anything out of place, or anything like that, let me know.

Link: Check page 11

As for my second map, it's coming along quite nicely. It's set in a volcano type area. I will see if I can get some screen shots up within the next couple of days (quite busy atm).

Last edited by Dreadopp on 05-23-08 at 20:22
Old Post 05-14-08 10:35 #
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Lord_Z
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Artillery, I think your map looks quite nice, especially since it's your first released map. I would not worry about it too much. The maps I made are also the first that I have released and they are the first Heretic maps I have ever made. I'd say we have the same kind of quality.

Here is another version of Omgekeerd with some different music. It uses GROVER from Hexen.
(Link Removed)

Here is also a new version of Cold Feet with new music. This one is D_DEAD from TNT.
(Link Removed)
Let me know what you think.

EDIT: Music should now work for Cold Feet. The only problem is that the music in Heretic is coded to play on a couple different levels, so since mine are different, they would also play on other peoples maps. I don't know if there is a way around this but here are my maps with music anyway. If it turns out that we are not going to have custom music, I'll change it back.

Last edited by Lord_Z on 05-16-08 at 08:36
Old Post 05-14-08 11:24 #
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