Doomworld Forums - Heretic Treasure Chest - It lives... again! (Demo RELEASED)

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kristus
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rf` said:

Harmony quality.

EDIT:
E1M1: Pretty much a redundant map. Someone making a map just to be part of the project, wishing they made a Hexen Community project instead. A few very short offshoot hallways slapped in just so it won't be straight as an arrow linear.

E1M2: Better, But it is also very linear, and from what I could tell. It doesn't appear to be finished. Like you get an yellow key, but for all I can tell. There's no Yellow door in the map. Then it whittle down into an room that you can get stuck in. I jumped down into this pit that couldn't kill me, (the lava floor wasn't damaging and there were no lift or teleporter to get out of there.) Looking in DB I was supposed to shoot a switch to raise a catwalk, but I am not sure if I could reach it one I were in the pit, as I had stopped playing the map when I checked with DB.

E1M3: Better yet, finally a "Heretic" map. It's a pity that it's lifted directly out of the Blasphemer project though. End fight is anti-climatic.

E1M4: Back to "I wish this was a Hexen project". Actually, it's another reused map. This one is a conversion of a map from the Necrosis Hexen WAD. It wasn't very special in that, so I don't understand why it was necessary to reuse it.

E1M5: Kaiser's map. Don't feel like playing through it again, as I've done so several times already since it was released last year or something. But I am curious how/if it was fixed to work in HereticP.

E1M6: Decent fun. But much like E1M1 it tells me that the author more wanted to make a map to be part of the project, rather than he wanted to build something.

E1M7: This is pretty nice, old-schoolish map that carries on for a while, reminds me a bit of Eternal Doom. Pity about some of the texture choices though. I liked the blue ones ok. But the gold and green ones. No thanks.

E1M8: Pretty nice. Feels like an Heretic map. But I would've liked a few more monsters scattered around.

E1M9: Starts with very obvious texture bugs in HereticP. Got mixed feelings about this one. Definitely had some effort put into it. But I didn't particularly enjoy playing it.

TXT file doesn't include any information on who made what. There's only a brief mention of the people involved in the winner text. Torn basically claim all credit in the TXT file. :p

Last edited by kristus on 12-24-09 at 11:03

12-24-09 09:19 #

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Torn
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kristus said:

TXT file doesn't include any information on who made what. There's only a brief mention of the people involved in the winner text. Torn basically claim all credit in the TXT file. :p

It is in the end credits of the demo. :P

12-24-09 12:03 #

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Vermil
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Something Torn doesn't mention is that the HTC Demo was only tested in Doomsday 1.8.6 and ZDoom 2.3.1. Torn's interest in a Dec 23rd release meant there wasn't enough time to test it in HereticP.

I'll fix the lava on E1M2 for the full release. The Yellow Key functions as a marker to get the player to run over a trigger.

Last edited by Vermil on 12-24-09 at 12:38

12-24-09 12:22 #

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kristus
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Torn said:
It is in the end credits of the demo. :P

I did mention that in the very lines you quoted. :p

Vermil said:
The Yellow Key functions as a marker to get the player to run over a trigger.

That's stupid. All it will offer is the player running all over the map trying to find a yellow door for the key.

12-24-09 19:24 #

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rf`
Dr. Nosign

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kristus said:
That's stupid. All it will offer is the player running all over the map trying to find a yellow door for the key.

Very true. Maybe make the yellow key open a door to a small cache of ammo or a couple powerups at least?

12-25-09 01:15 #

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Torn
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kristus said:

I did mention that in the very lines you quoted. :p

Heh, I know. I will put the whole team list in the final text file.

12-25-09 01:31 #

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t.v.
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good to see a release!

congratulations...

and merry christmas :-)

12-25-09 10:49 #

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entryway
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kristus said:
E1M1: Pretty much a redundant map. Someone making a map just to be part of the project, wishing they made a Hexen Community project instead. A few very short offshoot hallways slapped in just so it won't be straight as an arrow linear.

E1M1 mostly has no gameplay at all (boring and flat). E1M1 from heretic.wad has much more.

12-25-09 11:31 #

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Hitherto
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OMG, I think passed at least two hours:

http://e1m2.net/hth/test/htc15-stat.gif

Map for Heretic should not be so huge and switch-haunted like Eternal m30.

Corresponding f/a demo available. If anyone really want to see it, I will upload it. :P

And btw, funny titlepic:

http://e1m2.net/hth/test/htc1-title.gif

Last edited by Hitherto on 12-25-09 at 21:57

12-25-09 21:44 #

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kristus
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They didn't use the correct format for the title pic. It's supposed to be RAW format. It'll work regardless in Zdoom. But many heretic supporting ports won't allow it to be standard doom format.

12-25-09 21:50 #

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Ven
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I just played the demo and I have a few nitpicks.

E1M1: Flat and boring map, pretty bad for a "welcome to this wad" map. I wouldn't choose it. Just a bunch of random hallways, as mentioned before.
E1M5: HOLY CRAP THIS MAP IS HUGE. It was great fun, but too easy to get lost and the switch-hunting can get tiring. Other than that, awesome.
E1M6: Just like E1M1, only smaller and much more cramped.
E1M8: After having bazillions of Iron Liches and even Maulotaurs thrown at you in earlier maps, you get to fight two Iron Liches as an end battle? That doesn't seem to make sense to me at all. I understand this is a "demo" and the other maps could be a bunch of maps meant to be in other episodes, but this is just wrong, flow-wise.

Other than that, I loved E1M2, E1M5 (Without the switch hunting issue) and E1M9 specifically.
Great work, can't wait for a full release. Total of 8.5/10 from me.

12-25-09 22:46 #

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Hitherto
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Just finished playing entire wad in doom+ via vv's hack with f/a (first attempt) demo recording.

In overall it's quality of cchest1 at best, imo.

m1: Already forget about this map.
m2: Squared, not natural design. Shows up huge texture bug under vanilla renderer:

http://e1m2.net/hth/test/htc12-01.gif

I got stucked here twice: first time inside sec #566 and second at the end, like Kristus. That G-switch is senseless and practically invisible.

m3: Looks and plays like true heretic map, but final room was lift down my impressions: it's too tight for maneuring (thanks 8 pedestals), too erratic for playing (thanks 8 GHOST knights in dark sectors) and can be exiting by accident, what happens for me in f/a.

m4: It's only one map what really pleased me by gameplay. Smart thing's layout. True Heretic's drive is here!

m5: Don't want to play this anymore. Half-hour searching for yellow key and then another half-hour searching for access to it... was more than enough.

bug: secs ##857,859 has floor = ceiling of "river" (sector #0), what makes knight's within it complete banished.

m6: Too much monsters for such small space. But just after finishing of m5 it was quite fun game, on contrast.

Bug: got stucked in f/a because teleport line #693 (to the room with normal exit) was triggered by accidental knight's missile. Any strong reason for making this teleport non-repeatable?

m9: So bizzare lloks & plays. Especially outdoor areas:

http://e1m2.net/hth/test/htc19-01.gif

m7: Looks like several different-themed tiny maps just pasted together.

m8: Great looking city, but gameplay reminds me early doom1->heretic pwad conversions. Needs more monsters, weapons and artifacts.

And here was found another serious texturing error:

http://e1m2.net/hth/test/htc18-01.gif

I don't mention lots of vanilla texture tiling errors ("tutti-frutti") which plagued almost every map.
But after all, wad is surprisingly playable in heretic+, considering:

"HTC Demo was only tested in Doomsday 1.8.6 and ZDoom 2.3.1"

Last edited by Hitherto on 12-26-09 at 03:02

12-26-09 02:55 #

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Vermil
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We had big problems with getting the title pic to display proerply. It was actually what delayed the release until 22.00. But in the end we decided not to delay the release for it as the maps were functioning in the tested ports for the HTC.

It turns out that for ZDoom it has to be a Doom format pic. A Raw format pic (at least one inserted with XWE) didn't display in ZDoom. To this end Torn inserted a Doom format image in the place of the Heretic title pic.

While Doomsday only support's Raw format pics like Vanilla Heretic. However Doomsday amusingly displayed the image upside down when I inserted the pic as a Raw image using XWE. Hence I placed an upside down Raw image of the title pic in a wad and created a custom title loop for Doomsday.

The XWE raw inserted image did however turn out to be a slightly different file size to the original Heretic title graphics so maybe Heretic's title pics aren't standard Raw images.

Last edited by Vermil on 12-26-09 at 10:20

12-26-09 10:13 #

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kristus
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Vermil said:
It turns out that for ZDoom it has to be a Doom format pic. A Raw format pic (at least one inserted with XWE) didn't display in ZDoom. To this end Torn inserted a Doom format image in the place of the Heretic title pic.

While Doomsday only support's Raw format pics like Vanilla Heretic. However Doomsday amusingly displayed the image upside down when I inserted the pic as a Raw image using XWE. Hence I placed an upside down Raw image of the title pic in a wad and created a custom title loop for Doomsday.

The XWE raw inserted image did however turn out to be a slightly different file size to the original Heretic title graphics so maybe Heretic's title pics aren't standard Raw images.

You obviously did it wrong then.
The format used in Heretic is standard RAW format. I've done this myself and I know it works perfectly in all versions. Only if you do it wrong you'll get issues.

What program did you use to save it as RAW?

12-26-09 11:31 #

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Vermil
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I've fixed the title pics for the next release (Episode2).

Last edited by Vermil on 12-26-09 at 12:31

12-26-09 12:02 #

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kristus
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If you plan to change the fullscreen pics in the level intermission. Those are in regular Doom graphics format. For whatever reason.

12-26-09 13:51 #

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magicsofa
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What is the new map order? I originally had e1m2 but it seems like people are talking about a different map (I think I only had a green key to a real door or switch, and no pits)

12-26-09 17:50 #

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Pedro VC
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Can i make a map?

12-26-09 19:16 #

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Jarlaxle
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Awesome stuff. I came across this project a while back, and it's good to see it progressing. New Heretic Wads in this day and age are rarities, so it's appreciated. Good luck with it and try to stay as motivated as you can.

12-27-09 01:59 #

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Kirby
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Again, I still have my map that was originally for E3M5, but seeing as everything is mixed around I'll take an open slot and finish my map. It's Ep3 themed though, so if there's a space in the 3 episode that'd be perfect.

12-27-09 02:27 #

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Vermil
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Episode 2 comes along very well.

Though a plan I had for a map I had planned for Episode3 may have to be scrapped along with the map because Doomsday still doesn�t support voodoo dolls in Heretic (Dday only supports voodoo dolls in Doom).

I am tempted to use an XG line to replicate the function of the voodoo doll, but I'm not sure about placing port specific features into the wad (i.e. where does one stop etc) just for the sake of making it work.

None of the rest of the left over maps are suitable to fill the gap created by the loss of this map. Hence I would like to put forward a request for a new map or two (I'm also not convinced that another map really fit's in against the rest of the maps in the episode).

The vague theme of EP3 is of the player climbing a mountain, but that doesn't nescerilly mean one needs to ever be able to look over the sides of the mountain (i.e. their are caves in mountains of course, or maybe some sort of hidden shrine).

Going back to Episode1 for a moment. Why does E1M8's small number of bad guys seem to be considered a negative? I would have thought it would have made a nice change of pace after the more combat heavy E1M6 and E1M7. Kind of like how Doom E1M8 arguably does after E1M7.

12-28-09 12:02 #

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Ven
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Vermil said:

Going back to Episode1 for a moment. Why does E1M8's small number of bad guys seem to be considered a negative? I would have thought it would have made a nice change of pace after the more combat heavy E1M6 and E1M7. Kind of like how Doom E1M8 arguably does after E1M7.

It's not about that, it's about how the previous maps already introduce Iron Liches and even Maulotaurs, and the boss is just a couple of Iron Liches, making the final battle highly anti-climatic.

12-28-09 13:16 #

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udderdude
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I played it and enjoyed it. E1M9 was quite bizzare, but refreshing if you're looking for something different.

Looking forward to the next episode!

12-28-09 17:33 #

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tatsurd-cacocaco
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In this project, should all maps be fine on Vanilla Heretic?

My map almost done. However, it has a fatal error on Vanilla Heretic. "Visplane Overflow" happen in many points. Also, mirrors effects occur in the sky texture.
What should I do?

My map is here

:EDIT
I deleted the link.

Last edited by tatsurd-cacocaco on 12-29-09 at 12:14

12-29-09 08:14 #

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alterworldruler
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Ah, my crappy E1M1 is in! That's bad actually as that map completely sucks ass for my current standards in mapping. IF I HAD time I would have revamped it already but having 3 or 4 projects at once is already a bottleneck. Well too bad, that map could have been so much better.

PS. The map was made a year ago I think.

12-29-09 10:30 #

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Vermil
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tatsurd-cacocaco said:
[B]In this project, should all maps be fine on Vanilla Heretic?

However, it has a fatal error on Vanilla Heretic. "Visplane Overflow" happen in many points. Also, mirrors effects occur in the sky texture.
What should I do?

The HTC is designed for limit removing ports, though specifically Doomsday and ZDoom, so far. I've PM'ed yourself some possible suggestions for your map (I'm mr secretive :p).

I would also be interesting in seeing your map Kirby. I've sent you my email to send it to when you have the time.

Last edited by Vermil on 12-29-09 at 11:40

12-29-09 10:33 #

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tatsurd-cacocaco
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Vermil said:

The HTC is designed for limit removing ports, though specifically Doomsday and ZDoom, so far. I've PM'ed yourself some possible suggestions for your map (I'm mr secretive :p).

OK! I will consider and try your suggestions.

12-29-09 12:17 #

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rf`
Dr. Nosign

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Vermil said:

The HTC is designed for limit removing ports, though specifically Doomsday and ZDoom, so far. I've PM'ed yourself some possible suggestions for your map (I'm mr secretive :p).

I would also be interesting in seeing your map Kirby. I've sent you my email to send it to when you have the time.

At the very least Heretic+, doomsday, zdoom, and soon eternity.

12-30-09 04:21 #

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The Ultimate DooMer
(former) /newstuff Chronicler

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How's the rest of it looking?

01-06-10 12:55 #

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Vermil
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Well, episode 2 nears completion.

Firstly, I've been very lazy and really should have had this done by now.

Secondly... I am finishing a map the HTC was given not fully finished. Hence like the map that became E1M2 in episode1, I am finishing it off. However I got a little carried away this time, which means more time.

01-18-10 20:28 #

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Doomworld Forums > Classic Doom > WADs & Mods > Heretic Treasure Chest - It lives... again! (Demo RELEASED)

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