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Superluigieth1
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Arjak said:
TOMORROW!? Well, there goes my plans for having my Map 01 candidate done by the start date

Already finished mine.

Old Post 06-14-14 04:26 #
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kildeth
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I'm going to make the official Nova II thread in a minute. First, to answer your queries:

@Ashstrodamus - If you're a fair way through the creation of your map, you could always upload a copy so we can have a playtest of it. Then we can give lots of useful advice on your map. If you're not that good on architecture, it's perfectly fine to hand over your map to a more experienced mapper for polishing up, as what happened with 'Vile Arterium' in the first NOVA.

@kmxexii - While everyone gets started on NOVA II, I might go back and do some fine tuning of the first NOVA to fix up bugs, then upload a v1.1 to /idgames with a changelog once I've done the appropriate fixes, as the current finished product is still a little rough around the edges. Once we get NOVA II in its own thread, we can make this thread all about bugfixing the first NOVA.

@plums - Thank you so much for fixing up the texture dilemma for us.

@SteveD - Good to hear you joining us. I'm probably off to play the first NOVA now as well as I never actually got all the way through it back when I was playtesting for its /idgames release.

Old Post 06-14-14 05:51 #
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Superluigieth1
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kildeth, I CAN'T WAIT ANYMORE! MAKE THE NOVA II THREAD!

Old Post 06-14-14 06:01 #
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kildeth
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I'm writing it as fast as I can!!! :P

Old Post 06-14-14 06:25 #
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Superluigieth1
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too late. Damn. I could write the thread.

Old Post 06-14-14 06:41 #
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kildeth
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Well it's here now:

http://www.doomworld.com/vb/wads-mo...ly-new-mappers/

All NOVA II stuff is to be put the thread linked now. This thread will be reserved for discussion on bugfixing in NOVA I as it seems there are still a few issues post-release that need to be worked with.

Old Post 06-14-14 06:48 #
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TheCupboard
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Hey NOVA fans, we will be playing this megawad over the course of three separate open game sessions on the ZDaemon port. It will take a total of three separate weeks to *properly* play through the entire thing. :) Here is the link announcing when the first episode will be played on July 4th: http://forums.zdaemon.org/viewtopic.php?t=16007

Enjoy at either the European or American sessions!

Old Post 06-23-14 06:56 #
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Joe667
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Hey, am I still going to be able to submit my map? Oh crap, I haven't even officially joined yet! D:

Whoops, wrong thread. XD

Old Post 06-23-14 07:41 #
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plums
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More bugs! (I assume there hasn't been a bugfix update released yet?)

Crispy Doom is in the process of having it's limits raised and other fixes applied so that NOVA (among other wads) will work properly. While I believe it will end up working as-is, there are two bugs uncovered with MAP30 that may cause problems in other ports.

1) Many linedefs in dobu gabu maru's section are 1-sided, but have the 2s flag set. This is easily fixed in DB2 by selecting ALL the linedefs, choosing Linedefs -> Select Single-sided only in the menu, and then unticking the 2s flag.

2) The final area with the sky on both the floor and ceiling has HOMs all around. (An area of one of joe-ilya's maps might have this too, not tested yet.) The right way to do a sector with F_SKY1 floor and ceiling is to surround it with a sector that has F_SKY1 on ceiling only, ceiling height equal to the sky sector, and floor height low enough that you can't see the texture, then surround that with another sector that is identical except the ceiling height is floor height + 1. hr.wad MAP26 does this, for an example.

If you are making a bugfix release, these are easy problems to solve, so I recommend fixing them. I can provide my fixed file, if you want.

Last edited by plums on 07-22-14 at 11:51

Old Post 07-22-14 11:40 #
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kildeth
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I haven't got around to bugfixing the first NOVA yet and as of now I'm back at uni and busy (final year). I want to do so eventually so I wouldn't mind if you want to me out plums. I'll give you credit for the updates if you do.

Old Post 07-22-14 12:08 #
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plums
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Sure, I'm on it. Will fix all bugs reported in this thread. I'm not making any gameplay changes, so anyone with changes they want incorporated should post them or PM them to me.

Old Post 07-22-14 15:14 #
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Veinen
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Hoping no changes to gameplay are necessary since it would suck to see my maxes desync... You (as in the mapping team & plums) can of course do as you see fit though. I've found a few bugs you could fix also. Mostly problems with -cl2 compability, tele closets/traps not functioning properly and such.

Map17: sector 29 was one of them at least, I see that has been noted already.

Map19: check out the tele closet containing sector 1226, doesn't work in -cl2.

Map07: the lone secret of the map doesn't register (because the effect is erased when the sector lowers and changes, I think). Also sectors 190 and 191 don't lower like they should in -cl2, for whatever reason. Works in -cl9 though.

Didn't check if these have been mentioned already so ehh.

Old Post 07-22-14 15:46 #
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kildeth
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Plums,

If you're determined to fix everything, I got some helpful PMs from someone under the username Vermil who has reported several bugs to me which may otherwise be overlooked.

Vermil's messages:


Hi.
I originally posted this over at Doomed wad reviews, but I figure I should have PM'ed yourself instead (i.e I would delete the mentioned comment now if I could).

"Map17 of the original Nova has a mapping error that means it requires a Boom compatible port, rather than just limit removing.

Door Sector 29 accidently has a tag of 3, meaning it is accidently affected by the constantly moving floor trigger on linedef 173, which prevents the door from being opened on non-Boom ports.

In Vanilla Doom, only the floor or ceiling of a sector can move, not both at the same time. The afore mentioned constantly moving floor trigger is always on and thus the floor is considered always moving. This blocks the door triggers (which attempt to move the ceiling) from working."

The point is that the above is something to watch out for if your going for 'limit removing' with Nova 2 (I don't know if PRBoom's Comp Level 2 includes this).

Of course, Doomsday is about the only notable limit removing port without Boom support (and even that makes a couple of alterations to the Vanilla Doom behaviour, though far far far less than the likes of Boom or ZDoom and actually currently has a couple of other Boom-isms on by default as it very slowly gains Boom support).

Martin



There are also some unreachable trigger linedefs on linedefs 3897, 3892 and 3896 on Map17.



Hi.
To continue my comments, Map19 uses Boom linetype 85; scroll right, for a few visual effects. Vanilla Doom only had a scroll left linetype (Vanilla Heretic added a scroll right linetype however).

Of course, in this instance, given it's purely for visuals and Vanilla Doom doesn't bug out over unknown linetypes IIRC, it's probably not an oversight that needs fixing (just a little visual FX for Boom compatible ports).

Martin



Hi.
To continue, Map23 of Nova has a game halting Boom-ism.

In Vanilla Doom, sector movement is blocked if there is a badguy on top of the moving sector without enough room for it's full height.

Boom changes this behaviour so sector movement will still occur in the above scenario.

Map23, features thing 882, an Arch Vile on a lowering sector, that reveals a switch required to complete the map, without enough room for him. In non-Boom port's this sector is stuck due to the above Vanilla behaviour.

Martin

Last edited by kildeth on 07-22-14 at 16:08

Old Post 07-22-14 15:57 #
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plums
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Thanks guys, I had some of those from the thread, but not all of them. Will add them to the list!


Veinen said:
Hoping no changes to gameplay are necessary since it would suck to see my maxes desync...

Unfortunately any map changes which require rebuilding nodes will probably cause a desync. I'll do what I can to avoid this where possible, sometimes you can get around it by copying the nodes info from the old wad, but in most cases it's probably unavoidable. The old version will stay around in some form at least, though.

I don't think any gameplay changes are necessary, but reading through the thread I saw a few people who mentioned that they might want to change something about their maps.

BTW those demos aren't on DSDA at all? I think I have them all from before anyhow, just curious.

Last edited by plums on 07-22-14 at 18:52

Old Post 07-22-14 18:37 #
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Veinen
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Bah, well you guys do what you gotta do and I'll assess the damages later. Of course I can include the current nova.wad in the eventual zipfile I'll post but if there are changes to gameplay, minor or major, I feel like it's not the same map anymore and I think I'd just redo the demo completely. But like I said, do what you gotta do.

And nah, they're not on DSDA yet since my intention was to release them as a full 32-demo demopack so I haven't released the .lmps anywhere yet. They're not the same as the FDAs I did for the beta, these are legit UV-maxes with some resemblance of effort put into them. I've uploaded the maxes I have done to yt though so they're there if you're interested. I've done maps 1-18 + 31&32 so far.

Old Post 07-22-14 19:43 #
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plums
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Of those maps, 7, 10, and 17 are getting changed. MAP07 will almost certainly desync because of changes needed to make sectors 190 & 191 open. Maps 10 and 17 might be OK though; if you want, you could send me those lmps and I'll try to maintain compatibility with them.

So far the other maps with changes are MAP19, MAP23, MAP27, and MAP30, so I'd hold off on doing those for now unless you're really in a hurry to get them done.


For MAP19, I am going to ask what mouldy wants to do about the scroll right linedefs. It's not a critical bug - they will just be ignored in complevel 2 etc. - but maybe he would prefer having them all changed to scroll left so they work in cl2.

Old Post 07-22-14 20:10 #
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Veinen
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I've been at this since february so I don't think I'm in much of a hurry here :p Map07 I disliked and the demo is rather poor so I wouldn't really even mind a desync. Gameplay could also be altered in that map by adding a SSG somewhere, if I had a say about it. I can send you the .lmps for 10 and 17 but don't sweat it if you can't maintain compability. 17 was a little time consuming but whatcha gonna do, at least it should be quicker to get a good time after this much practice heh. Redoing 10 shouldn't be much of a problem anyway since it's an easy map and pretty fun to record on.

Old Post 07-22-14 20:24 #
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dobu gabu maru
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Thanks for the fixes on MAP30 plums; the double sided linedef error is due to a lot of copy & pasting on my part. Also in that final sky section, the big MARBFACE at the back shouldn't have a BFALL as the texture behind it—it should just be the sky.

Old Post 07-22-14 20:29 #
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nub_hat
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yo a lot of these maps have 1 way exit doors with dm spawns in them, if you could fix these so you can open them from the inside dm will be much better
dm is very good in general though really nice job to ppl involved

Old Post 07-22-14 22:49 #
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plums
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dobu gabu maru said:
Thanks for the fixes on MAP30 plums; the double sided linedef error is due to a lot of copy & pasting on my part. Also in that final sky section, the big MARBFACE at the back shouldn't have a BFALL as the texture behind it—it should just be the sky.

Welcome. The bloodfall got fixed as a side-effect of doing the sky properly, which is nice.


nub_hat said:
yo a lot of these maps have 1 way exit doors with dm spawns in them, if you could fix these so you can open them from the inside dm will be much better
dm is very good in general though really nice job to ppl involved


Interesting, I wouldn't have pegged this for a good DM mapset. I'll try to fix all of the exits.

Old Post 07-23-14 05:00 #
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plums
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Dehacked issues:

If you remember, there was trouble getting PrBoom+ to read the Dehacked patch properly in complevel 2. Turns out this is because it's in Boom format, not Doom format. Unfortunately Doom format deh has a fixed length for strings, so getting it to work in that format requires some changes.

Map names have been changed to have the map name only, no more author. In addition MAP02's name has been truncated to "ADMIN CENTER". These changes affect automap names only, not the map titles on the victory screen.

Also, I wondered if you wanted map numbers to appear on the automap, since with the current patch they don't e.g. "OUTPOST" vs. "LEVEL 1: OUTPOST". (I haven't checked length yet but you should be able to at least get the numbers in in Doom format e.g. "01: OUTPOST") Of course this can be done in Boom dehacked format as well if you prefer to stick to that.

OTOH if you prefer, you can stick to Boom-format Dehacked. You could also include xMAPINFO files so that ZDoom, Eternity, etc. display the original text while other ports can display the Doom-format text.

The intermission text also required some editing, quite heavily in some cases. Here is what I've come up with. Whoever wrote the text originally can provide alternate versions if they want.

MAP06 to MAP07

Something strange is in the air. It is as if
all has been poisoned or tainted in some
way by a supernatural force. While
society at large remains sceptical, you,
a lone unaffected soldier, walk alone
across a mysteriously changing urban
landscape. Something evil is afoot, and the
only solution is between you, a shotgun, and
the corpse of an imp blasted open with a
full round of shells...


MAP11 to MAP12 (unchanged)

You have breached a barrier somewhere
in your travel through strange and
foreboding facilities that were once
filled with life, but now stench with
death and evil. Your intuition is clearer
than ever and you know exactly where
to go and how to destroy the forces
that harm the Earth. It is as if the
source itself is beckoning for a duel
with you.

So give 'em hell.


MAP20 to MAP21

Strange thoughts begin to fill your mind
and you come close to losing your sanity.
Hell is in fury now and it does everything
to distract you from victory. The world
around you distorts between reality and
fantasy. There is no turning back, to find
the way out, is to take out the heart of
Hell itself...


MAP30 Victory

Hell's forces combined... they unleashed
a combination of things you could never
even speak of. But you, the always
impeccable one man army who took on their
previous masses, showed them how futile
their resistance really is. The last
standing entity, an evil eye which has been
watching you ever since you attacked hell,
also crumbles in your wake. You'd want to
go relax now, but to do that you'd have to
get out of here of course.

Thank you for playing NOVA: The Birth!


MAP15 secret exit to MAP31

Bruised and flummoxed, you awaken at the
bottom of the chute. Torches flicker and
dance along the wall, illuminating your
path...

Better pay attention then.


MAP31 secret exit to MAP32

From an ironed-out nightmare, into an
aquatic valley full of monsters...

Rip 'em a new one!

Last edited by plums on 07-23-14 at 10:22

Old Post 07-23-14 05:23 #
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plums
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NOVA 1.1 beta1: https://www.mediafire.com/?2x779fs6g3awwii

Mildly tested, could use another pair of eyes on the levels that have been changed though.

List of changes, mainly for complevel 2 functionality, and known bugs that are not changed:


TODO: Fix all DM starts in locked exits.

MAP07
  • Linedef 407 changed from type 37 to 38 (doesn't change texture or sector special). No longer clears secret sector type.
  • Sectors 190 and 191 given new sector tag, and corresponding Door Open linedef given matching tag. Chaingunner doors now open properly.

MAP10
  • Yellow door changed from S1 to SR, so the player can't get locked out.

MAP17
  • Sector 29 tag cleared, which allows the door to open properly after the rising platforms have been activated.
  • NOT CHANGED: Linedefs 3897, 3892, 3896, 3890, & 3894 have unnecessary action types. Seems harmless, and changing them breaks demo compatibility.

MAP19
  • Sector 1226 split and new sector corrected, so that monster closet works properly.
  • NOT CHANGED: Linedefs with type 85 (scroll right, Boom-only) - doesn't work in CL2 but is harmless.

MAP21
  • TODO: HOM in exit sector with the lowering platform and F_SKY1 floor & ceiling, in ports that don't fix it. Hard to do without introducing other visual errors, so I might leave it as is.

MAP23
  • Sector 363 ceiling height raised by 56, so that the Archvile in the sector is not stuck, which was preventing it from lowering. Texture offsets adjusted to compensate.
  • Secret soulsphere thing moved out slightly so it doesn't get pushed up to the higher ledge

MAP26
  • Sector 286 given tag 23, so that the lost souls can escape properly.

MAP27
  • Invalid sector types cleared.
  • Map rebuilt with BSP-W32 - fixes problems with monster targeting in self-referencing sectors.

MAP29
  • NOT CHANGED: STEP6 is used as a middle texture in a lot of areas, which will cause medusa effect crashes if you attempt to play it with a port that doesn't fix this bug. (I think even boom.exe fixes this, though.)

MAP30 - Could definitely do with more testing if anyone is up for it.
  • All 1-sided linedefs with 2s flag fixed. I took the brute-force approach, shouldn't cause any problems though...
  • HOM in sky area fixed by adding a second border sector and changing their properties as needed. This also fixes the problem of having a BFALL texture behind the MARBFACE at the back.
  • Cleared impassable flag on linedefs 25128 and 25130 (Arjak's section), which were stopping the monster closet there from working.
  • Deleted 6 stray linedefs from dobu gabu maru's section, near SMM in green marble area. 90% sure these were leftovers from copying and pasting.

Dehacked file: changed as per previous post. Level numbers not added yet.

Other
  • Updated music credits and other things in text files, per previous posts in this thread.
  • Changed tabs to spaces in the text files, because I'm a nerd.
  • Added "AKA Getsu Fune" to Hurricyclone's name in NOVAinfo.txt
  • Added some credits for myself and bug reporters in NOVAinfo.txt :>
  • Redid ascii art logo in NOVAinfo.txt :> :> :>
    Hope you don't mind Getsu
code:
.------. .----. .--------------. .----. ,-----, ,-- +-. | \ | | | | | | / / / \ | \ | | |________________| | | / / / | | \ | | .----. .----. | | / / / | | |\ \ | | | | | | | | / / / /| | | | \ \ | | | | | | | | / / / / |____| | | \ \| | | | | | | |/ / / /_______ | | \ | | |______| | | / / | | | \ | | | | / / _____ | | | \ | | | | / / / | | |____| `._____/ `.______________.' `._____,' /_____/ |____| _ _ _ _ _ _ _| |_ | |___ ____ | |___ |_| _ __ _| |_ | |___ |_ |_\ |___ | | __| | _ | | | | ||__\ |_ |_\ |___ | | | | | | | | |_|_ | |_| | | | | | | | | | | | |_| |_| |_| |____/ |_____| |_| |_| |_| |_| |_|

Old Post 07-23-14 08:59 #
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mouldy
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Hey plums, thanks for helping out with bug fixing and stuff. Cool ascii logo by the way. I might try testing map 30 at some point, was it only certain areas that were having problems?

Old Post 07-23-14 11:17 #
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plums
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The only problem areas were in Arjak's section with one monster closet not working (strangely it worked in the beta version I played back in testing) and the 1s linedefs and all-sky areas not displaying properly on ports that don't fix those errors.

The main reason I'd like some more testing is just to ensure that my changes haven't broken anything else in the process. Easy to verify for a smaller map, but for the behemoth that is Megiddo it's quite possible to overlook something. It's not likely that there are new errors but I'd hate to leave a map in a worse state than I found it, you know? And it's also possible that there are other bugs that I didn't catch, given that there was at least that one bug introduced between the beta and the idgames release.

If there are any new bugs, it's likely that they are in dobu's section, so even if you felt like just playing through that part, it would help reassure me.

Last edited by plums on 07-23-14 at 11:55

Old Post 07-23-14 11:35 #
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mouldy
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Just ran through map30 on cl2 in godmode, didn't notice any problems

Old Post 07-23-14 14:57 #
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kildeth
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Love the new logo. Looks like the titlepic I made in game!

One other thing. In MAP14 (Man Cub Up), I found it impossible to trigger the secret at sector 480 due the sector being too small. Should the secret trigger be moved to another sector because of this?

Also, there is a slight issue in MAP03 (Water Treatment Plant) which was my mistake. I switched a Plasma Rifle for a Rocket Launcher (thing 181) in one of the map's secrets before release without realising that there was a multiplayer mode rocket launcher elsewhere in the map (thing 172), meaning that as of the /idgames release there are two rocket launchers and no plasma rifles on that map in multiplayer mode which is a mistake, thing 172 should probably be a multiplayer-only plasma rifle. I also think that the Super Shotgun (thing 192) on that map should be made available on single player just to recognise the effort it takes to get to that room as it is very well hidden for a non secret.

That's about all I picked up last time I went through but they've been bugging me. :P

Last edited by kildeth on 07-23-14 at 15:12

Old Post 07-23-14 15:03 #
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mrthejoshmon
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kildeth said:
Also, there is a slight issue in MAP03 (Water Treatment Plant) which was my mistake. I switched a Plasma Rifle for a Rocket Launcher (thing 181) in one of the map's secrets before release without realising that there was a multiplayer mode rocket launcher elsewhere in the map (thing 172), meaning that as of the /idgames release there are two rocket launchers and no plasma rifles on that map in multiplayer mode which is a mistake, thing 172 should probably be a multiplayer-only plasma rifle. I also think that the Super Shotgun (thing 192) on that map should be made available on single player just to recognise the effort it takes to get to that room as it is very well hidden for a non secret.

Damn, I will get to it!

(The SSG DM only secret was a wee bit of a dick move on my part, I think we should not tag it as secret though so there is a chance for people to still not know about it/make it easier to 100% for newer or less patient players)

EDIT: I actually can't fix that myself, if I remember correctly somebody else tweaked the DM on my map (Thus I don't have the same version archived as you guys do :/)

Last edited by mrthejoshmon on 07-23-14 at 22:15

Old Post 07-23-14 22:04 #
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dobu gabu maru
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The Boom Dehacked is another copy n' paste mistake on my part. If we could, I would really like the MAPINFO file to be included since losing a lot of the original text is a bummer.

Old Post 07-23-14 22:17 #
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Getsu Fune
formerly Hurricyclone


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plums said:
  • Updated music credits and other things in text files, per previous posts in this thread.
  • Changed tabs to spaces in the text files, because I'm a nerd.
  • Added "AKA Getsu Fune" to Hurricyclone's name in NOVAinfo.txt
  • Added some credits for myself and bug reporters in NOVAinfo.txt :>
  • Redid ascii art logo in NOVAinfo.txt :> :> :>
    Hope you don't mind Getsu



uhhhhh...ok

Old Post 07-23-14 22:20 #
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plums
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mouldy: thanks for that.

kildeth: thanks for those. Will fix.


mrthejoshmon said:
EDIT: I actually can't fix that myself, if I remember correctly somebody else tweaked the DM on my map (Thus I don't have the same version archived as you guys do :/)


No worries, I got it.


dobu gabu maru said:
The Boom Dehacked is another copy n' paste mistake on my part. If we could, I would really like the MAPINFO file to be included since losing a lot of the original text is a bummer.


Sure. I know there's ZMAPINFO for ZDoom, EMAPINFO for Eternity, MAPINFO for ZDaemon and maybe other ports... Don't know nothin' bout Doomsday, though. Guess now's a good time to learn.

edit: Actually it seems like I can put in two DEHACKED lumps into the wad, and ports that can read the Boom version will do so, while others will fall back to the Doom version. Works for me!

Last edited by plums on 07-23-14 at 23:42

Old Post 07-23-14 23:28 #
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