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cannonball
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Implemented all the changes suggested by all, removed some of the clashing colours in places, a bit more uniform the texturing is now. Also replaced the lava ceilings with the sky texture (better make sure to make a skybox before releasing the next version.
Also at the end the archviles were trapped in their room. This was accidental. Would you like those released into the arena or stuck where they are?

Also music is from Lufia 2 (Used it as I think it suits the map like it did in phmlspd)

Old Post 11-04-12 21:04 #
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cannonball
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Royale Arena v.2
http://www.mediafire.com/?w4f9afu2b76y7qg
Changes listed pretty much in previous post, also difficulty settings and co-op starts added

Final version of Total Recall
http://www.mediafire.com/?9u2dj9iq2rf9dde
Added a switch action to lower the exit teleporter, like the exits there is one in every archvile wing so there will be no issues caused.

Old Post 11-05-12 09:41 #
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j4rio
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dobugabumaru said:


I also finished DHlandia, and it's a pretty frantic, goofy, but fair level. I never felt overwhelmed or pissed at any battle, as it was a pretty smooth ride overall. Only noticed a few things: cybie lifts look weird since they're pegged, the tele the cyberdemon is protecting in the blue key room seems too big (as it's really easy to just nab the key and run out), and there may be too much cell in the mastermind room... although that last problem might be fixed if you teleport a couple cybies into the hallway back to the starting room, so when you grab the yellow key and jump through the tele, you have to tango with three cybies. Other than that, it's a neat map, if not a bit ugly.



Well, I have copypasted whole DH's layouts and just threw them together, so at least I'm not the one to blame for looks. :))
I'm definitely not the guy to be taking care of looks though, I'm too clumsy in that regard. I'll probably just leave it to volunteers if there happen to be any (... odds are astronomical).

I don't mind the BK teleporter much. You still risk getting blasted by approaching it just like so you can consider it a reward for recklessness.

I also don't want to alter cells in last room. It's already quite far and there's no harm in being a bit generous. You can still easily run out if you enter with little to no cells and use them inefficiently.

Old Post 11-05-12 23:24 #
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j4rio
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Proceeding with list

Boom Town - I think not much more to add here. I would have enjoyed it more if there were RL/normal BFG instead of spam BFG, but whatevs.

Exodus - nothing to add

Hard Contact - I would put megasphere to start. It would solve the dumb beginning as it is now and you'd be able to break through infinitely tall stuff when you jump below. Not sure about last fight either, I'll have to try it a few times with saves.

Burn Marine Burn - I didn't feel too inclined to play it after watching Phml's FDA. Another DH's below par map.

Core Annihilation - nothing to add either

Last Cup of Sorrow - This is really neat. It's just a little bit past my masochism tolerance. Those archviles near exit are just evil. BTW, I noticed some mancubuses don't leave their teleport dummy rooms.

Warborn - Just last room and the keycard room with gimmicky teleporters could use some edits, besides that it's neat overall.

Last edited by j4rio on 11-06-12 at 20:54

Old Post 11-06-12 19:34 #
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j4rio
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Crimson - woo, another demo of me failing. Around 50 minutes in, screws up at last 50 monsters. Last sections were more or less a FDA.

http://filesmelt.com/dl/shith1.lmp

Old Post 11-07-12 16:42 #
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Phml
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Box (requires SF2011-tex)

Built it yesterday, tested it today, save for the final fight (teleporting cybies + shotgunners).

It was supposed to be small but quickly got out of hand. The plan was plasma + RL until you got all three keys, unfortunately I just couldn't make it work with all that open space - either there weren't enough monsters to be threatening, or there were too many and it got tedious to take them out. I didn't feel like scaling the map down, so instead, I turned it into your standard BFGfest.

FDAs and feedback welcome (although, to be entirely honest, I've already moved on to other ideas).

Last edited by Phml on 11-12-12 at 22:32

Old Post 11-12-12 22:26 #
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Ribbiks
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ffffffff, got like 30 mins in (playing pretty slowly/safely) then died when a bunch of AVs tele'd in and I didn't know what to do. here's the demo. I'll probably idkfa and check out the last few areas, was having fun up until that point.

that's a gigantic box of a map all right, first area with HK/imp was pretty fun, the keys and such would be a bit more enjoyable if it wasn't the exact same thing 3x in a row. I liked the secret megasphere's peppered throughout the map, especially the one way on the outskirts :) (did that one trigger like a bajillion masterminds? I'm not sure where they came from). the cacos that teled in after each key weren't very threatening at all, mostly tedious. I have a feeling this map plays a bit better if you rush through? (ie: somehow grab all 3 keys, then play clean-up?)

Old Post 11-13-12 08:35 #
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Phml
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Thanks! Will watch your demo later. For now, words.


then died when a bunch of AVs tele'd in


Hmm, there shouldn't be teleporting AVs unless I messed up something, but I might know what you're talking about (probably triggering AVs on the sides of the final corridor while dodging the HK/rev horde?).

I agree the repetition will likely annoy most people. I thought about it but I think swapping monsters for others just to try and simulate diversity would be even more gimmicky, there'd have to be drastic architectural changes - and I'm not willing to put that kind of effort into this map, not to mention I wouldn't know where to go.

Cacos used to come in one big swarm from those two gigantic darkened windows once you picked up all three keys, but that just didn't work - they took ages to come out. They were, and are, mostly here as harassment.

No doubt if you sit back and kill everything methodically (as is only sensible to do) you're just doing the same thing three times and it can be tedious. I like to think the symmetry and identical encounters encourage you to rush, but I know that's ultimately cheap and poor design.


Anyway, just made this on a whim and I figured, why not share it. It doesn't have to be included to SF2012 or anything, it's definitely not a very good map.

Still beats Startan Arena though. Suck it, Startan Arena!

Old Post 11-13-12 11:30 #
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j4rio
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Some notes - I'll try to be brief

- Too big for the included encounters. I'd mercylessly scale it if it somehow happenned to be my map.
- Gameplay and layout symmetry at such level feels like implementing the phrase "beating a dead horse" into doom map. It kills off any and all replay value and buries it 666 feet under. Even if I were to work with symmetrical layout, I'd always try to refrain from recycling fights no matter what.
- It might work in theory that the way encounters are made now encourages rushing - however, it does so only if surviving isn't way too high on your priorities list. You're basically decreasing your survival chances with each daring action you pull off, which is not something common to expect from players. In other words, if a map doesn't feel right unless you multitask, something is probably wrong. Probably even more wrong than being faced with unsurvivable odds if you try to multitask.
- I didn't check it in DB, but the map may be potentially affected with sunder-map-5 syndrome, aka monsters fall off playable area and you're more or less screwed if you're going for max. There are at least some teleporters, but you'd be screwed nonetheless, as checking all the lava for a heap of minutes after long struggle to finish it is just a recipe for rage. A lot of blocky lines have to be added if they haven't been yet.
- I didn't even get to try the poor startan sod. A link? Pretty please?

OT: Are there any plans for sf13? I'd personally vote for postponing it, maybe a pause for a year, and just finishing this year's sf properly.

Last edited by j4rio on 11-13-12 at 21:31

Old Post 11-13-12 21:20 #
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Ribbiks
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j4rio said:
OT: Are there any plans for sf13? I'd personally vote for postponing it, maybe a pause for a year, and just finishing this year's sf properly.


an extra year, even though there are well over 32 submissions already?

Old Post 11-13-12 23:05 #
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j4rio
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Dunno, just wondering if peeps want to keep at it or want a break? Not that it matters to me in any case. Besides, a year isn't a long while.

Old Post 11-13-12 23:18 #
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TimeOfDeath
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Download: Split Wide Open

http://timeofdeath.wrvids.com/doom/spltwdpn.jpg

Last night I had a burning desire to make a fucked up 90's level, so I did and finished it today.

OT: I don't have a problem with SF13 starting immediately in 2013. Once 2012 is over we can focus on putting SF12 together and releasing it, but if some people want to make new maps for SF13 then that sounds fine to me.

Old Post 11-13-12 23:28 #
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Phml
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Quick FDA before sleepy time. Doesn't complete.

That was so cool. Loved the looks, the shapes, and the difficulty was right where it needed to be to be entertaining.



As for SF2013, I don't care either way. Right now I don't plan on contributing much if at all, as I'm getting a better feel for ZDoom mapping these days. So much interesting things you can do with the Z axis, scripting, custom stuff... So much choice it's paralyzing, but fun nonetheless.

Old Post 11-14-12 00:08 #
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dobu gabu maru
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Mostly played through Box too, really gave me lukewarm feelings running through it. I like the scope and massive lava falls in the distance, along with the giant gaping voids towards one end of the arena. Really gives an oppressive atmosphere to the whole level.

Encounters were pretty iffy though. I liked the imp & HK throwdown right in the beginning, with the archviles keeping you away from the edges of the levels... but that was the only encounter I really enjoyed (a big part of that had to do with watching where my feet were, which incidentally made all the enemies more dangerous). Arachs were useful at keeping the player away from the rest of the level, but it felt like they could've provided a unique mix to the starting fight if only they could see the player after he grabs the PG and runs back. Revs were okay, but mostly everything after that just felt... uninteresting... or at least from my perspective since I'm more of a "stay back & hide behind cover" player. And since all of the battles take place inside of a single, giant room, it involves me running halfway across the map and firing rockets at demons from afar.

Getting all three keyes with no variation in enemies wasn't that thrilling either, and pushed me to just ran past most of the enemies. I stopped after getting the three keys and running to the finale, not wanting to batlle hundreds of barons and revs in a hallway backed by AVs. It was one of those things I knew I could do, but didn't want to spend the time doing. I wouldn't know what to suggest in order to improve the level however, as you don't seem keen on making large renovations. It might be pretty fun if you cut a lot of it down, keeping the first fight but making it easier to get the three keys and finish the level quickly.

As per delaying the collection, I know you guys have discussed having two separate releases, but have you considered having the "reject" release be SF2012? That way you can allow the "Super SF" collection to be uninhibited by date, and as soon as you have 32 solid maps, you can release that instead of waiting for the end of the year, or having to make good maps as quickly so you can to fit the end date. Just an idea though, I know it has its own pros and cons.

Old Post 11-14-12 00:13 #
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j4rio
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TimeOfDeath said:
Split Wide Open



Ha ha awesome. Managed to beat it by abusing some stuck cybers in last fight.

http://filesmelt.com/downloader/splt-fda-j4.lmp


dobugabumaru said:


As per delaying the collection, I know you guys have discussed having two separate releases, but have you considered having the "reject" release be SF2012? That way you can allow the "Super SF" collection to be uninhibited by date, and as soon as you have 32 solid maps, you can release that instead of waiting for the end of the year, or having to make good maps as quickly so you can to fit the end date. Just an idea though, I know it has its own pros and cons.



Hm, not sure if I get it. I don't really have any problems with how it is being handled now - 32 maps yearly if it's possible to fit into main wad and keep rejected ones packed all separately in an additional folder along with main wad and textfile. We didn't really plan on 2 releases as far as I know.

Also, I'm sure I brought it up before, but can there be a rule added that you have to add something replacing doom2 midi in your map? Either a looped silent midi if you don't want to add anything or a doom/2 one if you want doom/2 one. It's somewhat awkward to just end up having whatever midi is played in a mapslot in which map ends up after final sorting.

Old Post 11-14-12 14:08 #
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j4rio
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Doomherolandia v7

Removed some uglyness (mad props to cb) and other junk I don't feel like listing.

Old Post 11-16-12 03:15 #
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TimeOfDeath
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Thanks for the fdas you guys. I'll trap the player in the big room to stop the cybers from getting stuck in the final version.

Old Post 11-16-12 03:29 #
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Grain of Salt
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__________

Old Post 11-16-12 05:16 #
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dobu gabu maru
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j4rio said:
32 maps yearly if it's possible to fit into main wad and keep rejected ones packed all separately in an additional folder along with main wad and textfile. We didn't really plan on 2 releases as far as I know.


Okay, my b, I just didn't understand.

Played Power Plant. I love when arachnatrons are used as the key harassing unit, and the layout fits them well. Only thing I could think of is that there needs to be a unit that attacks the player from the outside of the arena, like a manc or something, since the revs easily start an infight with the AV, and from there you just go around sniping each one until it becomes this elongated circle strafe battle which is only a challenge once you stop strafing. Putting just a few dudes on the outside should provide for enough of a distraction, forcing the player to choose between taking out the busy AVs are getting rid of the monsters on the outside. I'd love to make edits if I just had a some more time.

Old Post 11-16-12 05:42 #
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cannonball
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Meh got bored and made a map in pretty much a day (between work), went to town on the quake textures again and here is the result.
Fortress Of Damnation.
http://www.mediafire.com/?2it7kofezr3zm9t
Ammo wise is fine, health not so sure, everything seems to work so enjoy this fairly short map.
Thumbs up for very uninspiring map name

Old Post 11-17-12 00:35 #
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j4rio
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Heh, I like how there are more maps submitted to sf than to doomworld mega project.

Here's FDA on ^

Old Post 11-17-12 02:11 #
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Ribbiks
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I thought I was recording an fda, but I must've botched the command-line so no demo :(, anyways, here's some thoughts/observations:

the damaging lava around the mastermind isnt damaging, I got stuck down there -.-

also, make the mastermind cage impassable, I got it infighting with some revs and the rev missiles pushed it off the ledge.

what's going on in the RK room? I'm not sure how that was intended to be handled, it's very messy, rocket usage is incredibly risky. also it's pretty easy to skip and not easy to come back to later due to monster infinity-tallness

the plasma trap isn't very threatening, maybe a single AV thrown in would give the player something to do while waiting for barons to kill off the revs

why not remove the monster blocking line from the entrance to the blue key room? It could let the manc from that room get involved in the demon/imps in the beginning.

also, I like your taste in background music :)

Old Post 11-17-12 02:56 #
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Ribbiks
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Ok, so here's a pseudo-fda for fortress of damnation: http://www.mediafire.com/?j52pws75by1by5o

I had previously seen up to the YK room (where I immediately fell into the aforementioned non-damaging lava)

I retract my comment about the RK room, it's actually pretty fun cleaning up the lost souls that get in the way while trying to avoid cyber rockets. I still think it should be made harder to skip though, some lowering bars in front of the teleporter or something.

In the last fight I think there might be a mild excess of cells/rockets/health, but that probably encourages more agressive play than what I did, so I'd say it's fine.

Overall: fun map, really liked it.

Old Post 11-17-12 03:28 #
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cannonball
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@j4rio - probably because i'm not allowed to map spam on there :P
http://www.mediafire.com/?847tr7sqb0mk1gv
Here is the fixed version where there is no mm cage of noobishness. This is why I shouldn't finish maps late at night. Along with this I altered the door function on the door to the north of the centre room and removed the blocklines.
Added blocklines to the start of the red key room, just to stop monsters entering that cubbyhole and gives free roam on returning to that room later. Also the switch which lowers the teleporter out of that room has some bars around it which descend when you grab the key. They are not that high, but sufficient to allow most hks to teleport before you can hit that switch.
Also added some detail to make the cave descent to the yellow key a little more interesting (visually).
Grabbing plasma and bfg releases avs in start area just like picking up the rocket launcher did, as per ribbiks advice.

Old Post 11-17-12 10:47 #
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j4rio
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Some things
- the first room has probably more demons than necessary, I'd switch imps for demons and demons for imps, so there's abundance of imps in first room rather than demons
- you could open up those windows some more so arachnotrons become more notable threat
- I don't like those chainers in blue key room much as they just force player to take cover and take them out from safe distance, which is not that good thing in general imo.
- it's somewhat easy to escape blue key room, although I think I'd refrain from adding any lowering bars here as there are other ways to block player (like teleporting some monster(s) behind door)
- some delay for archvile teleporting in after you pick plasma gun would be plausible - if it just enters the scene along with those other baddies, you'd be most likely unable to take cover behind those tiny pillars
- same thing about blue key room applies to yellow key room - it's too easy to escape and doesn't really offer too many ways to hurt player until those 4 AVs teleport in inside that tunnel. I'd say this room could be more notably expanded and more of an encounter added here

If you are about to do some map spamming sometime again, you could try focusing on some map that's whole based in huge open outside field, like the last chunk of true grit and this one, with a lot of optional places to visit. I can't say I like that room by room connected by tiny hallways progression much, as it limits possibilities of implementing encounters.

Old Post 11-17-12 12:04 #
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Phml
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FDA for Power Plant.

Once again, I want to complain about the bumpy floors. Still, it's not possible to hate a map that uses the arachnotron as its main monster. :)

Also, personally (re: text file) I love the looks and atmosphere; although while recording, I somehow end up with the CC4 sky (white one), and I feel it fits the map better.

Seems the current version could use a bit more ammo, and I feel there's a need for something to happen so the map doesn't break down into slow and mostly mindless circlestrafing past the hectic first minutes, as you can see in my demo. On the other hand adding more pressure too early could be devastating as is, so it's a fine line to walk.

Perhaps if there was switches at ground level you could flick to lower these walls on the side, revealing more enemies and ammo; and flipping all those switches would be required to lower an exit in the middle. This way you'd have the choice between slowly picking apart the main horde, rushing, or opting for just enough kills to lower the walls safely.

I'm half tempted to butcher this map. I'd much rather see something happening from someone else. ;)

Old Post 11-17-12 21:35 #
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j4rio
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^

I was tempted to try adding something to it as well. I tried
- changing chainers to revs
- moving upper avs onto the tiny platform with lamp below, widening the platform and ... quadrupling amount of avs (is that a word?)
- adding a switch next to each of those platforms that will do... something I haven't figured out yet
- I thought those upper doors could open up at some point and a bunch of cacos gets in

Old Post 11-17-12 21:54 #
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Phml
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FDA for Fortress of Damnation v2. A few deaths, doesn't complete.

Loving it. You keep improving as a mapper.

Those arachnotrons from uphills outdoors were the highlight of the map, to me. Constant pressure, leading the player to take a look outside, making him wonder how to get there. Great foreboding, and they're placed just far enough to only punish you if you're silly enough to stand still for too long. Just perfect! Everytime I got killed by plasma, I genuinely thought, without irony, "that is awesome".

I liked the way you smoothly move up and down as you circlestrafe into the red key room to take out those revenants with SSG. Little things like this may not seem like much but add a lot to the experience IMHO.

The HK horde after the cybie/PE/manc fight was somewhat awkward for me as I completely missed the rocket launcher - and as a result, even more problematic was having to fight two arch-viles instead of one during the rev/baron horde fight. You've put a glowing sector there, and that's good, but I think it could use even more emphasis, because it's likely monster corpses will block the view. Perhaps the start sector could be raised by 8 pixels, perhaps it could have a GATEx flat, perhaps both. Something, to help the Phmls of the world not miss important stuff nor trigger multiple ambushes at once. :)

The rev/spider mastermind room felt like filler... Until I tried to skip it and found myself almost crushed between arch-viles on both sides, heh. Creating situations in which people can get in near death scenarios due to their own impatience, and be aware of that, *and* pull through by reacting fast is just great, great mapping IMHO. :)

Teleporting cybies from every side - meh. I would have liked to see them behind lowering walls instead, say, in the SE and SW sides of the room as you've got some space there, so the player gets to see them stomping for at least a second or two before they get out. Apparently I got lucky with the arch-viles too, and the second one didn't teleport until later. As it happened it was good. I can't help but feel it would have been much more brutal, borderline unfair, had both AVs been teleported at once with the 4 cybies.

I liked the outdoor area. Once again died due to my own mistake, once again could see it coming. Great job. :)

Last edited by Phml on 11-19-12 at 21:11

Old Post 11-17-12 22:17 #
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cannonball
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Thanks for the kind words :)
@phml and j4rio, I shall implement some changes tomorrow. I've probably made enough maps as it is so another map is probably unlikely, though for some reason I seem to change my mind quite often so who knows.
Played power plant, pretty nice, would like to see this in a completed form. I will let you two play around with the map for if i were to go near it then the map would be a remix of a remix of a remix of a map from sf2012 and that is just insane :P

Old Post 11-18-12 00:24 #
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j4rio
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The rest of OP

Judgement desu no! - This would rock if it was submission to sf1994... but it's a little too late for that. Bland looks and miserable gameplay combination. I assume this was left here for somebody else to finish.

The Side Winder - Seems like a casual non-slaughtery map that ended up being submitted to wrong thread.

Crimson - I noticed you can safely take out archviles behind blue key door right behind starting position. Just open door, shoot to wake them up and stay behind that door spamming RL. Not sure if intended.

final level concept - Compared to rest of submissions, this is below par map imo. Not too visually interesting and gameplay isn't too thrilling either.

Fourtress - Considering this is elmle map, I think this was surprisingly good. Up to BFG and upcoming battle, it's really awesome, but after that those indoors sections are usually horrible. I think this can make it to main wad if some chunks of map get sliced off.

decimal error - Well, unfortunately AB didn't finish this and it still features the mind-numbing requirement of spamming out 1000 HKs with spam BFG. Hopefully there'd be an update to this.

Electric Wizard - Not much to add. There's still some stuff that was supposed to be changed here, but I don't recall what. It might require a bit digging through thread.

sworf - Still haven't managed to beat it yet.

Cashews - The last room with 2 cybers could really use a bit altering.

Trifling - Nothing to add.

Doomherolandia - Uhhhhh, you tell me.

Island of Mystery - Not sure if this is definite final version. I thought some stuff could use altering, but I forgot what. Urgh.

The last ones are quite recent so no need to bring them up.

I'll try and pick my contenders for placeholders in main wad laters, also maybe some ideas for map order.

Old Post 11-18-12 19:47 #
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Doomworld Forums : Powered by vBulletin version 2.2.5 Doomworld Forums > Classic Doom > WADs & Mods > Slaughterfest 2012 - NEW Final Final Version is up

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