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tempun
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Posts: 597
Registered: 08-09



The Green Herring said:
It's not for performance reasons, but because some source ports will crash if the level they're trying to load has a zero-byte REJECT lump. This, at one time, included Odamex. I've taken to fixing zero-byte REJECTs for safety reasons.
Okay. Will you clean out unusd resources from the wad, though?

Old Post 08-14-12 18:21 #
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ClonedPickle
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Shit, guys, a 20 megabyte wad, I will never be able to download this in time for Odamex Nitro with my 56k connection

Old Post 08-14-12 18:26 #
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tempun
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ClonedPickle said:
Shit, guys, a 20 megabyte wad, I will never be able to download this in time for Odamex Nitro with my 56k connection
Odamex in-game downloading is 200kbit/s unless server AND client settings are changed.
Same shit, different size. Might have broke something in the process.

Old Post 08-14-12 18:56 #
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The Green Herring
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tempun said:
Okay. Will you clean out unusd resources from the wad, though?
For the final version, yes.

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Old Post 08-14-12 19:08 #
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nub_hat
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If file size is a problem here's a MUS of my song.
http://www.mediafire.com/?k1w7647qkwp7f75

Old Post 08-14-12 19:16 #
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tempun
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nub_hat said:
If file size is a problem here's a MUS of my song.
http://www.mediafire.com/?k1w7647qkwp7f75

Don't worry :)

Old Post 08-14-12 19:36 #
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The Green Herring
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Now, here is Testing Version 1A.

http://www.speedyshare.com/rAgxu/32...ngVersion1A.zip

This is an intermediate version released to fix the silliest bugs present in the previous release. Among others:
  • "Obvious Filler Map" had three red flags, two of which were meant to be player spawns. This has been corrected.
  • "Lost Facility #28," "Gray Mainstream Map," and "I've Got Two Words for You and They're Not Happy Birthday" contained unknown textures. These have been removed.
  • "Hamburglar Hill" had blue textures near the red flag; this has been fixed.
  • "Water Purification Facility," "Just Out of Reach," "Some Tourist Attraction," "Meatwad Goes to the Super Bowl," and "Generica" had no player 1 spawns, preventing you from checking them out outside multiplayer in some ports, likely because there was no rule that you had to include one. They have been added.
  • "Some Tourist Attraction" also had everything flagged as multiplayer-only, so it was completely empty in single-player even if you had a player 1 spawn included. This has been corrected.
Because Shaikoten said it was okay, Solarn's level update has also been included, although I removed the fake doors due to them not being kosher in a gameplay mode where quick, straightforward navigation is of the essence. And last, but not least, I included the latest update of esselfortium's texture WAD.

To those concerned, unused resources will only be removed for the final version; this is to prevent anything in the WAD from breaking until then.

Enjoy!

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Old Post 08-14-12 21:16 #
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BloodyAcid
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Might as well post a few things I noticed:

MAP01 -> Blue base has a WR trigger for the lift, but red doesn't.
MAP26 - Lines 1792 and 1794 are 0-length, sectors 440,955,1030 have no lines


Also, ERMAHGHERD EARBLEED MAP30

Old Post 08-14-12 21:57 #
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traversd
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Shaikoten said:
We miss you Bucket :( Maybe if someone needs to bail on next session this Sunday you could work on detailing, rebalancing, or bugfixing?


Any chance a countdown timer (based on the timezone) could be put in the first post for future mapping sessions?

*sigh* not that ended up having time but I did get quite psyched when I saw this thread :0)

Old Post 08-14-12 22:03 #
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dew
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XutaWoo - Just Out of Reach

we discussed this already, i think ssg's will be ultimately necessary to make the map flow correctly. and sg's on spawns. plus i think the spawns should be placed more creatively, not just crammed into the flagroom (which also means it will be heluva tough to conquer it if defenders just keep respawning under your feet).


Mechadon (with shai items) - A Roboticized Lizard Comprised Entirely of Wooden Moving Parts and stuff

this map will be too large for 3v3 imo, but it can be a good fit for more crowded games. anyways, turn the BAs into GAs or you're making it too easy for attackers - especially if they rj around from one route to another. bye bye chasers. also i'd love to see the flag lift being ultrasuper slow so there's some more suspense up to the last tic before scoring.


Rottking - Lost Facility #28

looking forward to trying this one out. it has all the necessary parts, except mixed together in a weird way, so i'm intrigued. to bitch at least about something, the red blinking stripes are much more attention grabbing than the blue ones. not sure if it can affect anyone's game, but some people will definitely blame their losses on it.


Luca95 - Gray Mainstream Map

looks like a decent map for 4v4+ games, anything less will feel too empty, imo. cool and possibly clever bases, the mid is kinda poor, like last moment effort before stitching the complex bases together. :P we'll have to see if the flagstand isn't just too deep and too well defended. also i'm a bit disappointed by the inexplicable impassible linedefs at the middle upper regions - those are reachable by rocket jumps and just sealing them off with invisible barriers is lacklustre for nosy players. :P you could totally add a third mid route there, complete with small slow elevators on both sides (for nonrocketjumpers, he he).


AlexMax - Scary Flaggers and Nice Caps

we already discussed about this. i think the lift is open a bit too long now, but that needs to be tested ingame.


TheMionicDonut - Hamburglar Hill

this is big and organic and twisty, can't really divine much about it. actually... it reminds me of subterra (minus lava and bfg), so it's probably going to need a crowd to fill out properly. routes are varied enough and item placement seems competent... possibly a good large pub(lic servers) map. EDIT: oh, the flagroom is actually brutally cramped, plus i don't get the door switches.


Llewellyn - Bridge to Nowhere

this looks like small and brutal rampage. well, it's definitely in more taste than Not Kansas from uctf, heh. i think the two main gimmicks of the map are only half-successful though. the central elevated way should definitely be a zdoom thing bridge. alas, we have to make do with pillars. i think they should be farther apart, because they make movement below too awkward to justify their slightly obscure intent. the switch that opens the door is just crazy, that'd take a lot of teamwork to make use of properly. and of course the teleporter part... first of all, it has a slow lift. that means it's woefully unpractical as a clever way into the defender's back, he'll just notice and he has about 100 years to prepare. that's really shooting your team in their collective knee on a map with insane pace in the main area. second of all, it has spawns inside... NO! make it just a secondary, optional "clever" route. anyone spawned down there will just curse your name, because he's taken out of the action (and for a long time, thanks to the slow lift). especially defenders would take a massive lottery draw with every respawn.


zap610 - Danny Tamberelli's Manboobs

a totally classic design, perhaps too uninventive, tbh. it could still be a fun romp... if everything was 3 times smaller. really, just take the whole map and shrink it. i can't believe how oversized the map is despite item placemet like in a regularly sized map. it's almost realistic-sized, i expected to hear echo after shooting inside, heh. too big for its own good.


skillsaw - Mark it Zero

bowl 2012. for those who don't get the reference, look at zdctfmp2 map20. maps like these are sometimes played to blow off some steam, but the ctf value of such games is... questionable. ffa with flags, i guess every wad has its bowl.

Last edited by dew on 08-14-12 at 23:25

Old Post 08-14-12 22:16 #
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lupinx-Kassman
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Updated the map again. It is no longer possible to jump outside of the boundaries.

Old Post 08-14-12 23:20 #
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IvanDobrovski
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I'm not sure if this was intended but on the map WTF CTF, you can just jump from windows next to flags and make your way out :P

Old Post 08-15-12 00:26 #
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Xaser
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Did I forget to flag those impassible? D:

TGH: would you mind sneaking the fix in there? It's actually quite critical, amusing as the resulting game might be. :P

Also, holyshit, ToD's map is all sorts of brilliant. Best CTF since Jane Stop This Crazy Thing.

Old Post 08-15-12 00:56 #
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The Green Herring
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And now, for Testing Version 1B.

http://www.speedyshare.com/TB6cS/32...ngVersion1B.zip

Yes, it's another intermediate update, because we're the least competent mappers on Doomworld. This time around:
  • Fixed an idiotic mistake in "WTF CTF" that allowed you to jump from one flag room to another; now there are impassible linedefs in the way.
  • Removed unused sectors from "Right Angle of Destiny."
  • Voodoo dolls removed from "Gray Mainstream Map" and "Cereal Crates." Because apparently, that really matters in Capture the Flag.
Included is an update to "Mudman Wonderland" by Kassman that prevents you from jumping out of bounds. (Special "thanks" to Kassman, by the way, for making me fix your broken player and flag spawns all over again.) It also includes updated versions of "This Aggression Will Not Stand, Man" by skillsaw and "Bridge to Nowhere" by Llewellyn which were made during the session. (Special "thanks" to those two for not informing me about it in any way whatsoever.)

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Old Post 08-15-12 01:44 #
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BloodyAcid
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I just noticed that there's no difference between flats TLITE65B and TLITE6B1.

Likewise, here's an updated version of my map (the only change is that there were red lights in the blue base's hallway, and nothing's tagged multiplayer only) :

Edit 2: http://www.mediafire.com/?8nz8a26fvu7rp9l

Last edited by BloodyAcid on 08-15-12 at 02:06

Old Post 08-15-12 02:00 #
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Mechadon
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Hi guys! I got an update for the layout I made (with Shai's item placement wizardry) in response to dew's suggestions. Thanks again for doing the item placements for me Shai. I played it for a bit and it felt pretty good :)

http://mekworx.the-powerhouse.net/m...odtexturesi.wad

I hope those flag lifts are slow enough dew. I think that's as slow as I could make them with Boom's actions. I also changed the BAs to GAs. In addition I had to make a slight adjustment to the upper flag lift switches so they'd lower faster than the flag stand (otherwise they wouldn't work quite like before).

Old Post 08-15-12 02:19 #
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TheMionicDonut
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TGH, You are slowly but surely turning into deathz0r

In other news, on "This aggression..." with a well placed rjump into the rocky decor, one can easily go to a non conventional hiding spot. If said person is flag carrier, the map will be a lot less fun (See ZDCTF07 for reference). just make the rocky scenery impassible to alleviate.

Last edited by TheMionicDonut on 08-15-12 at 04:05

Old Post 08-15-12 02:21 #
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Tango
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TheMionicDonut said:
TGH, You are slowly but surely turning into deathz0r


pretty soon he's going to start making asshole comments in the txt files too!

Old Post 08-15-12 05:35 #
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TheMionicDonut
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Tango said:


pretty soon he's going to start making asshole comments in the txt files too!



And we will love him all the more for it anyway!

Old Post 08-15-12 06:31 #
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zap610
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Appreciate the feedback and happy the map has some potential. Should I shrink the entire map or just that one room in the middle?

Old Post 08-15-12 06:32 #
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Shaikoten
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To any players modifying maps for any purposes whatsoever, you must base your changes on the version included in the LATEST testing beta, just in case someone made a fix that you are for some reason not aware of. TGH is awesome for re-compiling stuff so promptly, don't give him a big 'ole headache.

Old Post 08-15-12 06:52 #
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Solarn
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I will be away for the weekend, so I can't participate in the second mapping session, so if my map (Face to Face) turns out not to be up to par, just drop it from the set, since I won't be here to fix it up.

Old Post 08-15-12 16:08 #
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dew
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zap610 said:
Appreciate the feedback and happy the map has some potential. Should I shrink the entire map or just that one room in the middle?

the whole thing, the bases are rather roomy as well. you'll also help your plasmaguns to be actually useful, they're wasted in such airy design.

btw i looked at some popular ctf maps and measured mids, with most scientific approach, of course. i ran across them counting continuous ssg shots. maps considered fairly large or with prominent mid sections usually score between 2 and 3 click-clacks, anything over 3 was usually considered a 4v4 map or more (as in unplayably large for 3v3). your map, depending on the starting point, can get up to 5, heh. i can't give you an exact scale reduction, but i hope this silly example can help you find the right proportions.

Old Post 08-15-12 17:03 #
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Shaikoten
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I'm sure someone will be willing to touch it up for you during second session, no worries. We don't need to toss maps away!

Old Post 08-15-12 17:18 #
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TheMionicDonut
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dew said:

the whole thing, the bases are rather roomy as well. you'll also help your plasmaguns to be actually useful, they're wasted in such airy design.

btw i looked at some popular ctf maps and measured mids, with most scientific approach, of course. i ran across them counting continuous ssg shots. maps considered fairly large or with prominent mid sections usually score between 2 and 3 click-clacks, anything over 3 was usually considered a 4v4 map or more (as in unplayably large for 3v3). your map, depending on the starting point, can get up to 5, heh. i can't give you an exact scale reduction, but i hope this silly example can help you find the right proportions.



Using this method, how big is 32-4 map13 (Rotts beloved one that since became an IDL staple)

Old Post 08-15-12 17:37 #
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dew
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TheMionicDonut said:
Using this method, how big is 32-4 map13 (Rotts beloved one that since became an IDL staple)

straight sr40/50 run through mid is just under 3 full shots!

Old Post 08-15-12 17:46 #
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zap610
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Shaikoten said:
I'm sure someone will be willing to touch it up for you during second session, no worries. We don't need to toss maps away!


If someone wants to take a crack at it that would be awesome. Otherwise I'll try fixing it myself. Either one works! Of course someone else doing it would allow me to detail another map if someone wants.

Old Post 08-15-12 19:14 #
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Shaikoten
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zap610 said:


If someone wants to take a crack at it that would be awesome. Otherwise I'll try fixing it myself. Either one works! Of course someone else doing it would allow me to detail another map if someone wants.



Oh I meant about Solarn's post, forgot to quote. But I'm sure you'll work something out!

Old Post 08-15-12 19:19 #
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dew
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Young Cyberdemon / Devon - Late in Britland

well, this map is obviously unfinished, there are too many bare empty spaces. when you finalize it, i strongly suggest nuking some of the extraneous rooms entirely, because the map feels large for no good reason - just to have more rooms, sort of.


Pavera - Close Friends!

quite large, but i do like the two-way idea. it could fill out nicely for 5v5 or so, heh. some parts seem a little unfinished compared to others, especially item placement wise. anyways, i'd love that flag elevator to be slow - just going down and then up immedially/a second after hitting the floor. crawling speed. it'd help the dynamic of the flagroom, the wait for the elevator is rather tricky and cruel for the runner who finally fought his way through the map. the slow lift would exploit jumping nicely!


Clonedpickle - Tong Dat Catte

this layout looks very classic, there should be nothing wrong with it. well, maybe the possibility of rocket-spamming the enemy flag from your own flag is slightly alarming, let's see how it survives the nitro session.


BloodyAcid - Some Tourist Attraction

this looks very simple and i wanted to bash the map for too much straitforwardness in the direct route and way too slow back route, but then i found out that it might work just nicely, hehe. everything might just complement everything else with a bit of luck! the side entrances could be wider, i think... and the pillars around the staircase supershotguns are terribly restrictive when trying to move on top of that ledge. also put the firesticks on mid into walls, they're annoying to run into. :P this map should be better than it seems at the first sight.


IvanDobrovski - Eye of the Tiger

hmm, this should be really really fast paced. your idea with so many green armors will be interesting to watch in the testing session. i hope it works, athough i have a pinch of doubt. what does look dangerous is the easy shortcut if one makes it out of the flagroom - jump to soulsphere, jump on your lift, run into teleport and you're home. it seems too fast (even though i like the onesided teleport otherwise). how about putting that soulsphere platform lower so you can't jump to the elevators from it? well, without rocketjumping at least. :P


Wartorn - Meatwad Goes to the Superbowl

haha, oh man, when i told drew you that picture, i thought those facial features would be pillars. my bad for not explaining myself properly, i wanted more cover in that little arena of ssg jousting. you generally don't provide much cover on the map, so it'd come handy on mid.

Last edited by dew on 08-15-12 at 23:59

Old Post 08-15-12 23:26 #
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Snakes
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Oh goddamn it, I missed this :/

Of course, when it comes to a good CTF map I have even less at how to make something quality than I do an FFA map, so at least I probably only missed out on embarrassing myself. Good job errbody involved.

Welp, next time, gadget. Next time!

Old Post 08-16-12 00:43 #
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