Doom 2 in name only (tentative title)

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Antroid
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Posts: 685
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In the mines review it says "couldn't look less like a mine" and i presume you mean "more". Just a nitpick. Although what would be a level that is the least mine-like imaginable?

10-01-12 19:39 #

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Eris Falling
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yep, you're right. My brain wasn't working properly when I wrote it. Fixed the post.

I seem to be getting ever so slightly better at dodging projectiles, so maybe the difficulty side of things can be properly determined for the later maps.

Last edited by Eris Falling on 10-01-12 at 19:55

10-01-12 19:41 #

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Olympus
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Posts: 304
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I apologize for making the map so difficult. Its just that usually i make my maps too easy, so i was trying to make sure it was hard enough for map 26. In the next version the crushers will dissapper; ill also work on the monster and ammo placement. Thanks a ton for taking the time to leave a review :)

10-01-12 20:47 #

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Eris Falling
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I always felt, Olympus there was a similarity between these 2 maps that you did, one for this, one for TNT2. Don't knock the difficulty back too much, because after all theres only 4 maps after it.

http://imageshack.us/a/img607/2753/olympusv.png

It's cool though, it's a nice style and hey, I'd probably do that too :P

10-01-12 20:54 #

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glenzinho
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Olympus said:
I apologize for making the map so difficult. Its just that usually i make my maps too easy, so i was trying to make sure it was hard enough for map 26. In the next version the crushers will dissapper; ill also work on the monster and ammo placement. Thanks a ton for taking the time to leave a review :)

Let me go into a little more detail: Monster placement is actually very awesome! Probably the best in the project to date. I just think that you need a little more health and I'm not sure how you intend for us to deal with the Cybie and Spider in the map (from pistol start.) if you have a cache of guns and ammo to deal with those two suckers, send me PM to not spoil it, otherwise put something there to deal with them. I imagine playing continuously with weapons and ammo held over from previous levels it may not be such a hard task, but one of the goals here is to be able to finish from pistol start. Oh yeah, and those f'n crushers as well!

Some good stuff you have in the map:
* Plasma Gun area, where two randomly different enemies teleport in. I played this at least a dozen times and I had different enemies warp in each time. I'm going to steal this ;)
* Archvile (at the end of the railroad tunnel), this bastard keep resurrecting everything in between me and it, causing me to spend copious amounts of shells trying to knock the fucker down! Excellent placement there.
* The start area is pretty much perfect... most of the level is perfect, just need more health! (And a way to kill the bosses)

I've played through on nomonsters just now and I can see I wasn't very far from the exit at all :( I will wait for an update before I try this again.... once again, great map.

Thanks to cannonball for pointing out that I need to use mudwater.wad with this.

@cannonball: I figured that section out now, and I found the secret exit too, but I haven't been able to complete a demo yet. Dangerous level! It has a strong TNT vibe too it as well...

Last edited by glenzinho on 10-02-12 at 00:40

10-01-12 21:45 #

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Olympus
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I was feeling especially evil with those crushers.

Dont worry, ill modify or remove them from the next version. Thanks glenzinho for all your help, ill definitely take your points into consideration.

@eris:

Oh no.... There on to me.....

In All seriousness, yeah it came out pretty similar looking. But I don't want to change it unless it is really a big problem.

10-02-12 00:18 #

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glenzinho
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Eris Falling said:
I must confess, I can only fail so many times until I yell 'FUCK IT' and type "God" "SV_infiniteammo true" "SV_Fastweapons 2" and "Give berserk"

I still found a bit of bug in the caves (I think blockmap, but I don't understand bugs very well so I could very well be wrong), and if I'm totally honest, that's all you can do to improve: Fix it.

There is a berserk at the start of the map! ;)
I tried to fix that bug like I fixed the HOM bug that was nearby; by deleting the sector and drawing it again. However, it still doesn't fix the problem, but it seems pretty minor to me even though I would love it to be perfect obviously. I also thought it may have something to do with what's talked about in this thread but that doesn't seem to be the case either...

@Olympus: already looking forward to the next version! Don't change too much, a little more health and ammo is enough.

10-02-12 00:39 #

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Eris Falling
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I do enjoy berserk fights, very much so, but usually the only thing I can punch without getting my ass handed to me is a demon or a spectre. Although I did take down the baron in map26 with berserk, which i was proud of myself for. The berserk pack early in your map does allow for Revenant fist fights, which if you can succeed in doing, is very satisfying.

10-02-12 20:57 #

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an_mutt
Green Marine

Posts: 37
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Eris Falling said:
I do enjoy berserk fights, very much so, but usually the only thing I can punch without getting my ass handed to me is a demon or a spectre. Although I did take down the baron in map26 with berserk, which i was proud of myself for. The berserk pack early in your map does allow for Revenant fist fights, which if you can succeed in doing, is very satisfying.

You'll certainly enjoy my contribution towards map 17 then. :V

I've been busy with other things over the past few days (a new expansion set is currently making the moves in MTG, don't judge me) so I haven't got too much done with my new map so far - I'd say around 40-50% is built and decorated, but I still need to start work on thing placement and general playtesting to get the flow of the map going. I'm hoping to make it quite complex in terms of layout (and so that you have a large amount of areas to explore), but also ensure that a player can figure out early where the important areas are first. So yeah that might take some time.

10-02-12 21:09 #

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Eris Falling
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I'm intrigued, but don't make it compulsory :o

10-02-12 21:11 #

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Never_Again
knows his birth month

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I haven't read through this thread but going by the first post the tentative title does not reflect the idea of the project at all. "Doom 2 in name only" would suggest that this project is only called "Doom 2" but in reality is nothing like DOOM2. (Come to think of it, that title would fit a lot of ZDoom mods. ;)

I think a more appropriate title would be something like "DOOM2: The Literal Interpretation".

BTW, Roger Ritenour already did something like this for the first four levels of Knee Deep in the Dead using the vanilla DOOM2 engine, 14 years ago.

10-03-12 02:33 #

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ella guro
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Posts: 114
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Never_Again said:
I haven't read through this thread but going by the first post the tentative title does not reflect the idea of the project at all. "Doom 2 in name only" would suggest that this project is only called "Doom 2" but in reality is nothing like DOOM2. (Come to think of it, that title would fit a lot of ZDoom mods. ;)

I think a more appropriate title would be something like "DOOM2: The Literal Interpretation".

i think you're interpreting the title a bit literally. the "in name only" is a pun on how the levels are just based off of are the names. it's not meant to mean "this project bears no resemblance to Doom 2 other than the name".

Never_Again said:
BTW, Roger Ritenour already did something like this for the first four levels of Knee Deep in the Dead using the vanilla DOOM2 engine, 14 years ago.

i wasn't claiming that this was that novel an idea, or that i was the first one to come up with it :)

10-03-12 02:47 #

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ella guro
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gggmork said:

Its pretty obvious that almost all the titles are perverted/sexual in nature.

All of these refer to the anus:
entryway, the waste tunnels, the pit, 'o' of destruction, downtown, the inmost dens, the chasm.
"the living end" obviously refers to the glans penis, and "the crusher" is a guy's pet name for his enormous dick. The icon of sin is obviously the penis.
Then there's the references to chicks with dicks: tricks and traps, and gotcha.
Nirvana refers to orgasm. Wolfenstein is wolf beastiality and monster condo is perverted monster cosplay.

i'd like to see 'O' of Destruction, etc paired with TEETH.wad then :)

BlueFireZ88 said:
If "The Pit" is still available, I already have a rough design for it. That is, if you wish to assign it to me.

First the screenshots (remember, this is a very early and rough design):

The First Room (I might change this to match how MAP08 ends for consistency).
http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y2...8-Doom/PIT1.png

Through the door to the cave opening.
http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y2...8-Doom/PIT2.png

The cliff from which you can see the whole area.
http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y2...8-Doom/PIT3.png

The entire area seen from the cliff.
http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y2...8-Doom/PIT4.png

The concept is that the UAC is studying a volcanic crater (nicknamed "The Pit") which was formed when a meteorite struck the Earth thousands of years ago. Ruins of a forgotten civilization stood where the crater struck, and the people made extinct because of the cataclysm. Miraculously, many of the temples and ruins survived, even when submerged by the lava which lines the crater floor. The UAC has set up a working research post on a crater cliff side to study the ruins in detail and hopefully learn much about this lost civilization. However, with the demon invasion of Earth, all of the personnel were slaughter, and now only the hellions remain.

i haven't decided if i want to give it up yet or not. it depends on if i can get inspiration, i guess. go ahead and work on it if you want to, though, and i'll let you know when i decide.

10-03-12 02:56 #

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Never_Again
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ella guro said:
i think you're interpreting the title a bit literally. the "in name only" is a pun on how the levels are just based off of are the names. it's not meant to mean "this project bears no resemblance to Doom 2 other than the name".

I suspected the title was a pun of some sort but couldn't figure out the wordplay. Your explanation doesn't really help, I'm afraid, as "a pun on how the levels are just based off of are the names" doesn't make sense to me. Maybe it's a language barrier, or maybe it's just me. ;)

ella guro said:
i wasn't claiming that this was that novel an idea, or that i was the first one to come up with it :)

My remark wasn't meant as a slight to your idea, just what I thought to be a relevant tidbit of info. It's a great idea, IMO, and I'm interested in seeing what comes of it.

10-03-12 03:07 #

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Hellbent
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Never_Again said:
I haven't read through this thread but going by the first post the tentative title does not reflect the idea of the project at all. "Doom 2 in name only" would suggest that this project is only called "Doom 2" but in reality is nothing like DOOM2. (Come to think of it, that title would fit a lot of ZDoom mods. ;)

I think a more appropriate title would be something like "DOOM2: The Literal Interpretation".

BTW, Roger Ritenour already did something like this for the first four levels of Knee Deep in the Dead using the vanilla DOOM2 engine, 14 years ago.

holy shit this is awesome!!

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-_UhwHbmDf5M/UGuduzSYO1I/AAAAAAAACd0/A_Y3XPccnng/s480/Screen+shot+2012-10-02+at+10.03.25+PM.png

10-03-12 03:08 #

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glenzinho
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Posts: 491
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Hellbent said:
holy shit this is awesome!!

Yes, indeed it is... but the gameplay isn't much chop from what I can remember. Roger gives full modification permissions in his text file, maybe somebody who's particularly inclined can update the gameplay in this?

10-03-12 03:26 #

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ella guro
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Posts: 114
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Never_Again said:

I suspected the title was a pun of some sort but couldn't figure out the wordplay. Your explanation doesn't really help, I'm afraid, as "a pun on how the levels are just based off of are the names" doesn't make sense to me. Maybe it's a language barrier, or maybe it's just me. ;)

ah, no problem. it might be the language barrier or that it's a pretty subtle pun. :)

Never_Again said:
My remark wasn't meant as a slight to your idea, just what I thought to be a relevant tidbit of info. It's a great idea, IMO, and I'm interested in seeing what comes of it.

yeah. i apologize for being a little defensive! i should check out phobos some time soon.

10-03-12 03:32 #

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BlueFireZ88
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ella guro: "i haven't decided if i want to give it up yet or not. it depends on if i can get inspiration, i guess. go ahead and work on it if you want to, though, and i'll let you know when i decide."

Cool, I'll going to work on this when I have the time (working on a couple other projects right now). If you do grant me the spot, I'll try working on this sooner rather than later.

10-03-12 03:36 #

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Antroid
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Cmon ella, don't leave me hangin, did you check out the alpha map29 i sent you? It would provide a lot of motivation to finish balancing and testing if i knew you approved it so far. (and if you don't, then i don't need to hurry at all! :) )

10-03-12 09:28 #

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glenzinho
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@Antroid: check the first post, you're already penciled in.

10-03-12 09:39 #

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Antroid
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Oh, indeed. Cool! I didn't think to check that.
That's actually really encouraging, since she had higher than usual expectations for the penultimate map. Seeing myself "penciled in" for the slot gives me warm fuzzies. Thank you glenzinho for pointing this out for me :)
I'm going out of town for a couple days, but I'll take my laptop with me and try to finish everything up.

10-03-12 14:19 #

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kmxexii
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Never_Again said:

I suspected the title was a pun of some sort but couldn't figure out the wordplay. Your explanation doesn't really help, I'm afraid, as "a pun on how the levels are just based off of are the names" doesn't make sense to me. Maybe it's a language barrier, or maybe it's just me. ;)

My remark wasn't meant as a slight to your idea, just what I thought to be a relevant tidbit of info. It's a great idea, IMO, and I'm interested in seeing what comes of it.

It's an idiom, but it's not that common in my experience. I mostly heard it in reference to the American Godzilla movie being Godzilla In Name Only (abbr. GINO).

10-03-12 16:22 #

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Eris Falling
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I started imagining massive Nazi experimental labs last night...where killing all Keens (dotted around this huge map) would open the castle trapdoor, then you would have to work your way down into a village and escape.

If either MAP31 or 32 are dropped, I will fill the position.

10-03-12 16:26 #

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ella guro
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Antroid said:
Cmon ella, don't leave me hangin, did you check out the alpha map29 i sent you? It would provide a lot of motivation to finish balancing and testing if i knew you approved it so far. (and if you don't, then i don't need to hurry at all! :) )

oh geez, sorry! actually i did play it the day you sent me it but i couldn't figure out how to get past the first area! what was there looked very nice, though. i decided to come back to it but then other things got in the way.

10-04-12 00:30 #

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Eregore
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I'm happy to report that I'm back. My level now can be played front to back, and has also been tested for vanilla compatibility. It now also has great custom music. My concern for this level is that the player may already have a BFG by this time, which could smash the intended flow of this level.

Days: 10
Hours: 64
Structure: 95%
Actions: 95%
Texture/Lighting: 75%
Items/Monsters: 5%
Total: 70%

I finally have some screenies worth showing:

http://i1161.photobucket.com/albums/q512/jeff_king1/Destruct/1.png
http://i1161.photobucket.com/albums/q512/jeff_king1/Destruct/2.png
http://i1161.photobucket.com/albums/q512/jeff_king1/Destruct/3.png

10-04-12 03:15 #

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BlueFireZ88
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I honestly can't remember when the BFG first shows up in Doom 2 (Doom wiki doesn't really have that info).

So what aspects about your version of "O of Destruction" would be problematic with the BFG? Could it be compensated for?

10-04-12 04:22 #

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Eregore
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Well, its a bit of a spoiler, but I don't know how to hide spoiler stuff. Anyways, the destruction at the center of the the O is a cyber-demon who can hit you from a great many angles throughout the level, and without a BFG it is practically impossible to kill him, which in turn forces the player through the level while dodging his missiles. Its a bit reminiscent to the mega-WAD Cyber-Dreams, but more subtle. On the flip side, if he is killed immediately the rest of the level becomes boring and bland, which sucks for everyone. I don't know, I guess I don't really care, pistol start will still be bomb.

10-04-12 05:31 #

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Obsidian
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BlueFireZ88 said:
I honestly can't remember when the BFG first shows up in Doom 2 (Doom wiki doesn't really have that info).

So what aspects about your version of "O of Destruction" would be problematic with the BFG? Could it be compensated for?

I believe you first find the BFG in a secret in MAP08 Tricks and Traps.

10-04-12 09:17 #

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Antroid
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ella guro said:
oh geez, sorry! actually i did play it the day you sent me it but i couldn't figure out how to get past the first area! what was there looked very nice, though. i decided to come back to it but then other things got in the way.

Haha, i thought it was fairly simple. Maybe i need some more indication (although i'm afraid to touch anything because of the precarious drawseg balance that already exists there). I assume you found your way inside the building? There is a switch that lowers a lift, you push it, run to a switch across the street, press it and run back. That second switch has two metal bars jutting out of the ground around it, that was the best indication i could come up with that it opens the bars back in the building near the lift. But only temporarily. Jump across the alley to the second building and a shortcut will open so you don't have to do the running again.

Eregore, those screens look really good!

10-04-12 10:42 #

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