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Optimus
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I'll explain my case. So far, I despised mods that changed the gameplay of the original doom, like weapon mods or new monsters, even though I had some little fun trying something else but then I wanted to return back to true doom.

I have seen some vids on youtube about brutal doom and I wasn't sure if I want to try this one. Then I tried it. Now I play only brutal doom. So much that while I was having 66 hours in old Zdoom for over a period of months, I gathered 100 hours in 2-3 weeks in GZdoom. I replayed all the classic levels, original and final doom, and then classic megawads. Also, I am converted. I used to be a keyboarder and playing the software rendered engine, but now for Brutal Doom it's recommended GZdoom and true aiming with mouse. I cannot go back!

It wasn't just the brutality but how awesome everything was done and while gameplay changes happened, they were done for the better, it's like an enhanced doom gameplay. Weapons are more kick ass and fast, enemies are faster too. It reminded me the old times when I was newbie and I was scared to enter into that dark room. The good thing is, those changes are careful, they don't move very far away from original gameplay, just improve it and make it to addictive.

Seriously, I tried to play some WADs with the original old doom. It's boring. I am converted. I can never play old doom again.

Has that happened to any of you with Brutal Doom? It's so friggin awesome, resurrected doom for me!

Old Post 10-09-12 14:09 #
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ComicMischief
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I've seen Brutal Doom being played, but I don't want to ever try it for the reasons outlined above. It'd be like letting the Marvel vs Capcom games ruin my enjoyment of simple, solid, Street Fighter. All flash without the substance, so it seems to me.

Old Post 10-09-12 14:14 #
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Phml
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I tried it and within a few minutes I bursted out laughing at how cheesy and childish it is. Taunt straight out of a B action movie dubbed by some dude trying to act tough while recording in his bedroom. Takedowns with crude, ridiculous animations. Ludicrous amounts of blood washing out any emotional trigger it might have, and the cartoonish way in which all that gore happens shattering any immersion into pieces. Overly loud gun noises. Cracks blocking your vision. Recoil. Powered up monsters turning every encounter into peekaboo or trench warfare, utterly destroying the original fast-paced, movement-based Doom gameplay.

To sum it up that way doesn't do it justice, the result manages to be even worse than the sum of these parts. Perhaps, particulary because it takes such a great game as a base and bring it down to the abysmal craphole many first-person shooters have been in for the last decade or so. This mod seemingly manages to take every terrible modern feature and shove it into an old game, creating the worst possible scenario: a game with poor gameplay *and* outdated eyecandy. It could be an ironic depiction, a statement about the stereotypical FPS gamer, but now comes the frightening part: there is no irony here.

Reception to this mod has been overwhelmingly positive, and this was a bit of an eye opener to me. I tend to be an optimist at heart and intuitively believe people are (or can be) sensible, no matter how many times I'm proven wrong. When it came to Doom it used to be I'd sit in my little fluffy cloud, and any disturbance caused by people praising garbage would be merely temporary. Brutal Doom's consistent success is a permanent reminder this thing, this is what people want out of video games, even people playing Doom.

So, yes, I feel burned out of the Doom community due to this mod.

Old Post 10-09-12 15:14 #
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PRIMEVAL
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It's cool, but I'm no convert. However, I have been using the Particle Fire Enhancer mod for most of my Vanilla Compatible WADs. It's like Brutal Doom without the Brutal. Same gameplay, but updated everything.

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Old Post 10-09-12 15:41 #
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Jimmy
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Can't really get into it because it makes things too hard for me.

It's a really well done mod, though. Can't fault it on its aesthetics and various other enhancements.

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Old Post 10-09-12 15:47 #
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BaronOfStuff
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Looks good, but is simply style-over-substance shit and throws IWAD maps completely off-balance.

In other words, I don't like it.

Old Post 10-09-12 16:02 #
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Gez
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I played it a couple of minutes when it was in v13 and got a cacoward.

It was amusing while the novelty lasted, but nothing more. Haven't felt the desire to play it again.

Watching a video made some time ago vaccinated me against wanting to give the newer versions a try, too. Apparently, changing the look and feel wasn't enough; the sounds had to be replaced too, and by the most obnoxious, screechy noises possibles. Zombie screams seem to drown out every other sound (as well as the music), all of them dying with the same cry that seems to last forever, even though the death animation has finished playing.

It's like recording a thousands chalks grating on a blackboard, layering them all over each other, mixing it with modem noise, and cranking the loudness up until the soundwave's shape pushes sound engineers to commit suicide. Then stretching it for twenty seconds and making it play every couple of seconds.

It is out of question I ever play that.

Old Post 10-09-12 16:21 #
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Snakes
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Burned out is a good expression of how I felt about Brutal Doom after running it the second time. The novelty wore off quickly and the massive amount of love for it eluded me. That someone could enjoy this mod to extent that they couldn't enjoy "old" Doom anymore is downright ridiculous for a number of reasons, I think.

To each their own, and I know people will try and run the wads I make with it. So be it.

Old Post 10-09-12 16:25 #
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Lizardcommando
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Phml said:
I tried it and within a few minutes I bursted out laughing at how cheesy and childish it is. Taunt straight out of a B action movie dubbed by some dude trying to act tough while recording in his bedroom. Takedowns with crude, ridiculous animations. Ludicrous amounts of blood washing out any emotional trigger it might have, and the cartoonish way in which all that gore happens shattering any immersion into pieces.

Isn't the cheesy brutality and over-the-top blood and gore the main selling point for the mod? I thought you're supposed to be the "RIP AND TEAR!!!!" Doomguy from the Doom comic book.

Last edited by Lizardcommando on 10-09-12 at 18:46

Old Post 10-09-12 18:41 #
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Glaice
formerly Mr. Chris


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If the monster attacks (esp Imp and zombieman, particularly the 3 shot burst and Imp's pounce attack) were vanilla, I would not have to edit the PK3 every single time a new version or test version is out. Same applies to fireball speed and able to climb steps more than 16 units tall/down.

Old Post 10-09-12 18:47 #
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Feniks
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I wouldn't touch Brutal Doom with a ten-foot pole. I've got no idea why it's so popular amongst many Doomers. To me, the mod is just plain ridiculous at best...

I don't even care for the level of gore and violence, but its weapon sprites and sounds don't belong to Doom at all. They just feel too modern, compared with all the graphics and textures that can be called "antiquated" now. Also, the crosshairs, changed game physics... I think that people who've got sick of classic Doom should just take a break from it and start playing some modern shooter instead. They come off as quite hypocritical now.

Well, I can accept, say, the bulletholes and blood on walls in ZDoom, I'd even say they make a nice addition, but going as far as Brutal Doom is godawful, in my humble opinion.

Edit: I forgot the fatalities. Yep, they don't belong to Doom either and they're pathetic rather than shocking...

Last edited by Feniks on 10-09-12 at 19:34

Old Post 10-09-12 19:21 #
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SFoZ911
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Posts: 328
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Brutal doom is great but it's changes gameplay too much for me,
it's much more harder and changes some of the monster's behavior in a way i really can't stand.

Old Post 10-09-12 20:19 #
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chungy
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Yeah... Brutal Doom is just too cartoonish for me to really take it seriously. I tried it, didn't like it.

Old Post 10-09-12 20:29 #
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qoncept
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Wow, I get that Brutal Doom isn't everyone's thing (I'm not crazy about it), but what's up with the hate? Just don't play it. I've played a lot worse.

Old Post 10-09-12 20:39 #
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Optimus
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Interesting that most people so far hate it around here.

Yep, the sounds too loud, I also tried to record a video few days ago and forgot to lower the sound enough, then the video has so much amplified noise now :(

I got used to the new monster balance. I like it if it doesn't go very far away from doom. For me it does not, it just becomes more tough. There are some changes to the better, like lost soul killed by one shotgun which it should, for example. And shotgun is too powerful and sounds so bad ass, sometimes you can kill cacos or mancubus with three shots to the eye/head for example. I don't care about fatalities, don't use them (they stop the action). Don't like new weapons (when I IDKFA for a reason, sudenly the additional weapons are there. It's confusing).

Managed to burn my PSU too from playing too much. PCs fault but lol..

Old Post 10-09-12 22:23 #
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Enjay
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It's a well made mod with some clever features. I like it. I don't feel compelled to use it all the time or anything though.

Old Post 10-09-12 22:50 #
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LkMax
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Posts: 167
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To be honest I really liked the hardened difficulty, specially because I take good AI over stupid number of monsters any day (e.g. Plutonia and most custom maps nowadays), you know, doesn't fell like shooting puppets. The graphic overall is also very well done. On the other hand the excessive blood decals per monster is ridiculous and the zombie sounds are EXTREMELY annoying.

For now I prefer to play my vanilla maps with Particle Fire Enhancer (with the footsteps sounds 'commented'/disabled), a good graphic and sound update, with the -fast paramter (except in really hard maps).


Gez said:
(...)the sounds had to be replaced too, and by the most obnoxious, screechy noises possibles. Zombie screams seem to drown out every other sound (as well as the music), all of them dying with the same cry that seems to last forever, even though the death animation has finished playing.

It's like recording a thousands chalks grating on a blackboard, layering them all over each other, mixing it with modem noise, and cranking the loudness up until the soundwave's shape pushes sound engineers to commit suicide. Then stretching it for twenty seconds and making it play every couple of seconds. (...)


I think this is the main problem I have with this mod right now.

Old Post 10-09-12 23:51 #
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Avoozl
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I like brutal doom for the gore but not so much for the difficulty changes, if a gore only version was made so when you or the enemy dies in a certain vanila way and the gore will appears right after then I would continue to use such a mod.

Old Post 10-10-12 01:57 #
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Technician
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I liked it until it went mainstream.

Old Post 10-10-12 02:26 #
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glenzinho
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I liked after it went mainstream, even though I've never played it.

Old Post 10-10-12 02:49 #
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darkreaver
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I hate it even though I`ve never played it. Saw a youtube video of it for 10 seconds, and that was more than enough to hate it.

Old Post 10-10-12 02:56 #
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BloodyAcid
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I took up Brutal Doom very early on in the Skulltag forums, gave it a whirl, and put it down. At around v.10, I played it again, and although I thoroughly enjoyed it, I prefer the original vanilla Doom more. I mean, that's the whole reason why I'm still playing Doom, right? If I wanted blood and gore, I'd go and play something else. Not saying I hate it, just not my type.

Old Post 10-10-12 04:28 #
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Platinum Shell
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This thread smells like grumpy old fags. The over-the-top hate is really unnecessary, to be honest.

I enjoy the mod for what it's aimed, intended goal is rather than putting it in my vision as a layer over Doom; think of it more-so as the Doom comic gameplay experience.

While some of the sounds may be harsh and obnoxious, I find them quite fitting. I got used to the new zombie sounds and come to think of them in my mind in a comedic style; like they're trying to be serious and tough but they keep getting wiped out by the "Hero". Almost like a different group of enemies distant from the demons' attack.

So far in this thread I've seen a lot of "opinions" that are similar to some angry grandpa complaining excessively over something that's silly to get so bent over. If you don't enjoy the mod, hey great, that's fine. But don't come across as an asshole. That's about it, I guess

Brutal Doom as a whole for me: 8/10

EDIT: Am I converted? Whenever I play something classic doom related about a third of the time I'll use it.

Old Post 10-10-12 05:05 #
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Glaice
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Leave all feedback in this ZDoom thread here

Old Post 10-10-12 05:38 #
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hex11
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Lizardcommando said:

Isn't the cheesy brutality and over-the-top blood and gore the main selling point for the mod? I thought you're supposed to be the "RIP AND TEAR!!!!" Doomguy from the Doom comic book.



That's what happens every time I play E2M2: grab berserk pack, punch all imps in sight... Anyway though, "brutal doom" for me is just plain old NM skill. It's simple, but very effective, and has the advantage of working in vanilla engine (thus all ports).

Old Post 10-10-12 06:21 #
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Ed
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I've never played Brutal Doom, but the number of 1995, vanilla wads outnumber modern styled Zdoom modifications 5,000 to 1. The ratio of non-gameplay modifying wads that come out today greatly outnumber those that do.

If you don't like something, don't play it. If you're burnt out from a mod, play a different one. How is this even a thing?

Old Post 10-10-12 06:23 #
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General Rainbow Bacon
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I played it for a little while, but after I saw all the death animations, the novelty wore off. I don't use it anymore. It kinda took the arcade game aspect of Doom out too, which i didn't really like. With brutal doom, you have to play a level for a while and more carefully, with original, i can spend 10 minutes whizzing through a map that's meant to take 20.

Old Post 10-10-12 13:37 #
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Clonehunter
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I played it for a while, but i got addicted to mouselook with Doom Legacy. I dont play it only rarely now. It was a nice novelty.

Old Post 10-10-12 14:50 #
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Mr. Freeze
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I've been playing Vanilla Doom practically all my life, so I actually burned out on that a year ago or so. Too much exposure, not enough interesting WADs being released.

Then BD comes along, and I was hooked into Doom all over again. I love the increased difficulty, the weapon changes, and most of the sounds. Only problem I have is that the zombie death yells are monumentally aggravating, and the new taunts sound retarded. What was wrong with the old ones?

Old Post 10-10-12 16:07 #
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Harmata
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If you don't like something, don't play it. If you're burnt out from a mod, play a different one. How is this even a thing?

This. When i grew tired of slaughter maps and the first level of Deus Vult almost made me puke, i didn't go to wad's archive page and rate it 0/5 with a comment like FUCK YOU FUCKING FUCK.

Old Post 10-10-12 17:03 #
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