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Keeper of Jericho
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ďFive Rooms of DoomĒ is a community project for Doom 2 (Boom-compatible) that challenged various mappers to make the best Doom map they could using no more than 5 rooms per map.

The maps:

Map 01: Hangar 14 (TheMionicDonut)
Map 02: Toxicity (ShadesMaster)
Map 03: Hectic Canyon (Olympus)
Map 04: The Nameless Base (Dragonsbrethren)
Map 05: Prisonbreak (dachauncinator)
Map 06: The Overkill (Agentbromsnor)
Map 07: Dead Quiet (Gebstadter)
Map 08: Carnage Canyon (Egregor)
Map 09: Doom.Inc (joe-ilya)
Map 10: Nabataea (Keeper of Jericho)
Map 11: 82000P (Sokoro)

Map 12: Cyberdemon Heliport (Katamori)
Map 13: Anarchy (Springy)
Map 14: Citadel to Hell (joe-ilya)
Map 15: Hit N Run (ForeverVile)
Map 16: Space Quarry (Scypek2)
Map 17: Blackfire (Cell)
Map 18: Courtyards of Bodycount (Hurricyclone)
Map 19: The Mutiny (ForeverVile)
Map 20: Region X (Shadow Hog)

Map 21: Valhalla (richter3456)
Map 22: Winter Will Be Thy Name (Cacowad)
Map 23: Needles and Pins (Soundblock)
Map 24: Bloody Hell (ForeverVile)
Map 25: Fortress of Magic (BlueFeena)
Map 26: Vileís Lair (Joseph Lord)
Map 27: Baphomet of Trickery (Eonfge)
Map 28: Infinity Nexus (CorSair)
Map 29: Say Than Suspense (Joseph Lord)
Map 30: Echoes of a Forgotten Sin (Cacowad)

Map 31: Crossing the Line (Scypek2)
Map 32: Den of Vespera (Pcorf)


Download:


http://www.speedyshare.com/EjGs4/5room-beta3.zip
https://www.dropbox.com/s/qb3n5e6vn...5room_beta3.zip


How the rooms were counted
This is the kind of question best answered through examples. So thatís what Iíll do.

http://www.majhost.com/gallery/Elpi...m_example1a.png

This is the basic example of one room. You can get from one side of the room to the other without having to open any kind of door.

http://www.majhost.com/gallery/Elpi...s_example1a.png

This, then, is an example of two rooms. In order to get through the other side, you need to pass through a door. However, the rooms in both screenshots are just a bunch of basic squares. Letís take a look at a room with a more complex shape, and how we have to count our number of rooms then:

http://www.majhost.com/gallery/Elpi...om_example5.png

This still counts as one room. You can still go from one end to the other without opening a door, even though the room is irregularly shaped. However, thereís another important thing that marks this as just one room. What that is, will become clear when you take a look at the following picture:

http://www.majhost.com/gallery/Elpi...ms_example5.png

I just added another sector to the room. There are still no doors, both sectors have the same height of floor and ceiling, same texturesÖ And still they donít count as one room. No, here we see an example of TWO rooms. Why two? Because there is not a single point in the entire room where the player can see the entire room. The player needs to pass through the small hall in order to get to the second sector, and once there, he can no longer see any part of the first sector. So, this counts as two rooms. The hall is counted as part of one of the two rooms, itís not a room of its own.

Now take a look at the following example and tell me: one room or two?

http://www.majhost.com/gallery/Elpi...m_example2a.png

The answer is one. True, you canít go to the other side of the room because the fence is in the way, but you can still see it. The fence doesnít really count as a wall, after all, itís only a line, not a sector. So, in cases like these, we still count only one room.

http://www.majhost.com/gallery/Elpi...s_example2a.png

Now in this example, however, we count two rooms. ďWhat?! Why?! We can still see the other side through the window!Ē Thatís true, but a window is basically just a hole in a wall. Imagine the window isnít there, and youíd be looking at a solid brick wall, separating the two rooms. Furthermore, a window isnít like a fence, itís not just one line, itís a sector. So, because we need to split hairs in order to close loopholes, in case of windows we have two rooms. (Add a fence instead of a wall next to the window, though, and we have just one room again.)

The following examples further illustrate the difference between fences and windows:

http://www.majhost.com/gallery/Elpi...m_example6a.png

http://www.majhost.com/gallery/Elpi...s_example6a.png

In the first screenshot, we count just one room, despite the fact that you have to pass through a door in order to get behind the fence. In the second screenshot, we count two rooms.

Now, we take a look at another important thing that is commonly found in Doom maps: stairs and height variation. How do we count rooms then? Well, take a look at this screenshot:

http://www.majhost.com/gallery/Elpi...s_example3a.png

In this example, we count two rooms. While in this particular example, you can still see the other side of the room at the top of the stairs, if the stairs were higher, you wouldnít be able to see the other side anymore. Added to this is the fact that the ceiling of both rooms varies in height. So, in cases of a basic staircase like this, we count two rooms.

http://www.majhost.com/gallery/Elpi...m_example3a.png

In this example, however, we only count one room again, because the ceiling is the same height across the whole room. Let me make it clearer by way of another example:

http://www.majhost.com/gallery/Elpi...m_example3c.png

Here, just as in the previous screenshot, we count only one room. One part of the room has a higher floor than the other, but we can still see the other side, we can still cross to the other side without opening a door, and the ceiling is still the same height on both ends.

http://www.majhost.com/gallery/Elpi...m_example4a.png

This example, too, is still just one room, even though we now have a wall on both sides of the stairs, and the staircase itself has varying ceiling heights. The deciding factor here is the area to the right of the stairs. We can still see the other end of the room thanks to that area. If the fence wasnít there, it would still be one room, because the other side of the room could still be seen.

http://www.majhost.com/gallery/Elpi...s_example4a.png

Now here, however, we count two rooms. The deciding factor is again the area to the right of the stairs. Only now, instead of a fence, thereís a window there. As mentioned above, when counting rooms, we see windows as solid walls. And thus, we have no way of seeing the other side of the room, so we count two rooms.

So, to summarize, we speak of one room when:
- You can get from one end of the room to the other without passing through a door
- You can still see part of the other side of the room no matter where you stand in the room
- The ceiling remains constant throughout the whole room (not counting decoration)

The exception to the first rule is when your path is blocked by a fence (or other obstacles, such as objects), as those donít count as walls (since they're lines or objects, not sectors).

Man, never thought Iíd have to write a book just to explain the concept of a room, ha! If there are any more questions concerning your room count, just ask.

Last edited by Keeper of Jericho on 08-09-14 at 17:38

Old Post 10-19-12 13:21 #
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Memfis
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I always disliked how most 1024x1024 maps aren't really 1024x1024. (also how 32in24 isn't really 32 or in24) IMO if you say "5 rooms" then the maps should really have 5 rooms, no exceptions for secrets or some other stuff.
( And what if I mark all sectors as secrets? хD )

Last edited by Memfis on 10-19-12 at 14:30

Old Post 10-19-12 14:24 #
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Gez
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Your definition of room also provides some loop hole. What if there are windows?

If you look at E1M1, for example, there are only three rooms by your definition in that map.

First room: basically the entire map. The starting area extends to the "tower" area. Its windows allow to look into the courtyard area, and from there to the nukage area, which is connected to the computer area directly, without a door. The secret tunnel is also connected directly to the courtyard without a door. Once you have crossed a linedef, the secret zone behind the imp's platform is also connected; and the hidden tunnel overlooks the nukage area with a door-less passage. All these therefore form a single room.

The second room is right after, with the fences and the barrels.

The third room is the one with the imp and the exit switch.

Old Post 10-19-12 14:56 #
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Jimi
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Maybe one room should be one major area of a level? Like E1M1 could be divided into these major areas:

1) Start Area, including the green armor/shotgunners
2) Computer Hall
3) Nukage ZigZag Bridge
4) Outdoor yard with the nukage puddle
5) Exit Area

Count the corridors connecting areas as one half to one area and the other half to the other area..

Old Post 10-19-12 15:39 #
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Keeper of Jericho
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Memfis said:
I always disliked how most 1024x1024 maps aren't really 1024x1024. (also how 32in24 isn't really 32 or in24) IMO if you say "5 rooms" then the maps should really have 5 rooms, no exceptions for secrets or some other stuff.
( And what if I mark all sectors as secrets? хD )



Well, of course, a secret would have to actually be secret, that goes without saying. I never understood why some of maps in earlier megawads (Hell Revealed comes to mind) flagged their exit as secret, or their start...


Gez said:
Your definition of room also provides some loop hole. What if there are windows?

If you look at E1M1, for example, there are only three rooms by your definition in that map.

First room: basically the entire map. The starting area extends to the "tower" area. Its windows allow to look into the courtyard area, and from there to the nukage area, which is connected to the computer area directly, without a door. The secret tunnel is also connected directly to the courtyard without a door. Once you have crossed a linedef, the secret zone behind the imp's platform is also connected; and the hidden tunnel overlooks the nukage area with a door-less passage. All these therefore form a single room.

The second room is right after, with the fences and the barrels.

The third room is the one with the imp and the exit switch.



I never said it was perfect, hence why I asked for some thoughts first. ^^" But as far as windows in a wall go, I'd count those as seperate rooms. They are, for all intents and purposes, just holes in a solid brick (or metal) wall the player can't pass through, and they're thicker than one segment (the difference with fences).

I see what you mean about E1M1, but to me that just shows you can still make some great maps if you get creative with your 'rooms'. I wouldn't mind a more restrictive limit, but I'm not sure what it should be.


Jimi said:
Maybe one room should be one major area of a level? Like E1M1 could be divided into these major areas:

1) Start Area, including the green armor/shotgunners
2) Computer Hall
3) Nukage ZigZag Bridge
4) Outdoor yard with the nukage puddle
5) Exit Area

Count the corridors connecting areas as one half to one area and the other half to the other area..



I think that's an interesting solution to some of the loopholes Gez mentioned. Each of those areas you mentioned had a shift in texturing and/or decorating style. An added rule to implement could be that a room can have no such texture-shifts, or else it should be divided into two rooms.

Old Post 10-19-12 15:51 #
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Dragonsbrethren
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Keeper of Jericho said:
I never understood why some of maps in earlier megawads (Hell Revealed comes to mind) flagged their exit as secret, or their start...

So that the end tally shows 100% instead of 0%. (If they do that and have other actual secrets, then it makes no sense.)

Old Post 10-19-12 16:17 #
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dobu gabu maru
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Awww you stole one of my ideas for a project! It was a little different, but I was going to suggest it after the new year since people are all trying to get their projects done. Shucks.

I'm interested in mapping for it, as I love abstract guidelines like these that can result in some cool maps. But one of the issues which is highly abusable is that if you remove all the doors on a map, it then becomes "one room". It's a cheap thing to do, but some mappers will take advantage of this fact in order to increase the size of their map probably. I had this same problem when thinking about "what constitutes a room?" for my project, since windows, gates, and false walls kinda throw a wrench into it.

Old Post 10-19-12 16:54 #
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hex11
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Keeper of Jericho said:

I think that's an interesting solution to some of the loopholes Gez mentioned. Each of those areas you mentioned had a shift in texturing and/or decorating style. An added rule to implement could be that a room can have no such texture-shifts, or else it should be divided into two rooms.



That's still pretty vague though. Someone can make a vast network of STAR* areas that are interconneted with open hallways (no doors), and that would only count as one "room". I mean, it could be totally huge, well beyond vanilla Doom limits. And then for his second "room", he could make a huge cratemaze with side-passages everywhere, all decorated with CEMENT textures. It could have a couple dozen or more areas like the one in E2M2, all just connected with open hallways...

Maybe you should impose some hard limits, like maybe each "room" can only be 1024^2 units surface area (any shape you want, doesn't have to be square).

But, like Memfis said, I think the "freebies" areas you can't get to in those other projects are kinda lame. I guess if it's obviously unreachable scenery that's not so bad, but in some cases it's deceiving and it really looks like you can go there, but there's an impassible linedef. :-(

Old Post 10-19-12 17:04 #
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Khorus
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Heh, two more rooms to go! :D

Old Post 10-19-12 17:42 #
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Phobus
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I like the idea of a little mapping challenge like this, as I need something to get me out of my current mapping slump. Is there a target port/compatability? Limit removing tends to be the norm, but it's worth asking.

EDIT: Thoughts on target game (Doom, Doom II, Plutonia, etc.) and if there's any resources to take in mind would also be nice.

Last edited by Phobus on 10-19-12 at 19:25

Old Post 10-19-12 18:13 #
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walter confalonieri
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This sounds like a great project!

Old Post 10-19-12 18:19 #
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BloodyAcid
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5 rooms only.
Might be ok if I have some ideas.


Edit: Nvm, derp'd

Old Post 10-19-12 23:22 #
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Keeper of Jericho
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Phobus said:
I like the idea of a little mapping challenge like this, as I need something to get me out of my current mapping slump. Is there a target port/compatability? Limit removing tends to be the norm, but it's worth asking.

EDIT: Thoughts on target game (Doom, Doom II, Plutonia, etc.) and if there's any resources to take in mind would also be nice.



I think it's best if we aim for Boom compatible and limit removing. Target game would be Doom II. I've made a texture pack people can use, which is basically just the CC4 resource wad, but with a different sky texture for episode 1.

http://uploading.com/files/get/b8d952d6/txtpack.zip
(Not sure if the link works. Hard to find good uploading sites these days.)

If people are really interested in mapping for this, I'd better get my act together and set down some solid mapping rules, especially concerning the definition of a room.

Old Post 10-20-12 14:14 #
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Phobus
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Don't suppose you could just upload the sky1? Most of us already have the cc4 textures and it'd be generally easier to work with.

Also, now I've got a compatability to aim for, I'll do some mapping for this in a bit - see what I come up with. Blood Red was only one room, so I'm sure something quick and easy to put together will come to mind for 5.

Old Post 10-20-12 15:27 #
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Keeper of Jericho
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Phobus said:
Don't suppose you could just upload the sky1? Most of us already have the cc4 textures and it'd be generally easier to work with.

Also, now I've got a compatability to aim for, I'll do some mapping for this in a bit - see what I come up with. Blood Red was only one room, so I'm sure something quick and easy to put together will come to mind for 5.



D'oh, now I feel dumb. You're right, of course. This is the new sky texture:

http://www.majhost.com/gallery/Elpi...nshots/sky1.png

I myself have made 8 unpublished maps using the 5-room principle, and I'm willing to donate some of them to the project should it get off the ground.

I'm now working on an explanation for what counts as one room and what does not, as well as some other rules and limits. Once I'm done with that, I think we can open this to mappers who are interested.

Old Post 10-20-12 15:35 #
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Agentbromsnor
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I feel like doing some mapping for this. Are there some clear rules I can go by? Map-format? Singleplayer? etc?

Old Post 10-20-12 16:06 #
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Phobus
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Orange, eh? Nice, but how does it look when it's not a PNG and is, instead, in the Doom palette?

@Agenstbromsnor: KoJ has said Doom II, Boom compatible and I'd guess we're doing Single Player, given it's the easiest one to test.

Old Post 10-20-12 16:22 #
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Sokoro
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I am interested in this. If it ever start, then I will contribute with a map, just don't expect same quality as Khorus' map.
Five rooms should not take ages.

Old Post 10-20-12 16:39 #
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Keeper of Jericho
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Agentbromsnor said:
I feel like doing some mapping for this. Are there some clear rules I can go by? Map-format? Singleplayer? etc?


Mapping will be done for Doom II, Boom-compatible, and singleplayer, with player starts for multiplayer, I guess.


Phobus said:
Orange, eh? Nice, but how does it look when it's not a PNG and is, instead, in the Doom palette?


Well, I tested it in Doom, and I think it looks good:
http://www.majhost.com/gallery/Elpi.../skyexample.png


Sokoro said:
I am interested in this. If it ever start, then I will contribute with a map, just don't expect same quality as Khorus' map.
Five rooms should not take ages.



That's not a problem. This project will be open for everyone, both new and veteran mappers.

Old Post 10-20-12 17:11 #
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walter confalonieri
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Phobus said:
KoJ has said Doom II, Boom compatible and I'd guess we're doing Single Player, given it's the easiest one to test.


Ok, i'll see to patch something for this....

Old Post 10-20-12 17:13 #
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Agentbromsnor
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I've started my map in normal Doom format.

Old Post 10-20-12 17:35 #
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Keeper of Jericho
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Well, I've updated the first post with the rules for mapping, and the project is now open for joining. If you still have questions, please ask away.

If anybody wants to be a playtester for the upcoming maps, please let me know.

Those of you who've already decided to start mapping, could you just tell me what episode you'll be mapping for, please? Then I'll be able to add you to the list.

Thanks!

(Hope I'm doing this the right way, this is the first time I'm starting a project. I think I'll die of nerves before the day's over.)

Old Post 10-20-12 17:45 #
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Gebstadter
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I'd be interested in this -- I've had an idea for a while that could easily fit into this format, though I'd need to make it MAP07 for it to work right...

Old Post 10-20-12 17:48 #
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Agentbromsnor
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Keeper of Jericho said:
Well, I've updated the first post with the rules for mapping, and the project is now open for joining. If you still have questions, please ask away.

If anybody wants to be a playtester for the upcoming maps, please let me know.

Those of you who've already decided to start mapping, could you just tell me what episode you'll be mapping for, please? Then I'll be able to add you to the list.

Thanks!

(Hope I'm doing this the right way, this is the first time I'm starting a project. I think I'll die of nerves before the day's over.)



I hope I'm mapping with the right configuration actually. Its ZDoom Doom format, so that should be Boom compatible, right? RIGHT?? :P

You can chalk me up for the first episode I guess. Don't know if there's much difference in themes in every episode?

Old Post 10-20-12 17:52 #
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Keeper of Jericho
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Gebstadter said:
I'd be interested in this -- I've had an idea for a while that could easily fit into this format, though I'd need to make it MAP07 for it to work right...


Map 7 is still open for now, so if you want it, feel free to sign up. =)


Agentbromsnor said:


I hope I'm mapping with the right configuration actually. Its ZDoom Doom format, so that should be Boom compatible, right? RIGHT?? :P

You can chalk me up for the first episode I guess. Don't know if there's much difference in themes in every episode?



The biggest difference between the episodes is the different sky textures. They can really influence how your map looks, so that's why I ask mappers to pick their episodes, so their maps get the sky texture that suits them best. The themes are up to the mappers to decide, only episode 3 has the added rule of having to be hellish.

Just for good measure, these are the sky textures:
Episode 1: http://www.majhost.com/gallery/Elpi...nshots/sky1.png
Episode 2: http://www.majhost.com/gallery/Elpi...nshots/sky2.bmp
Episode 3: http://www.majhost.com/gallery/Elpi...nshots/sky3.bmp

As far as map configuration, I think it's safest to map with your configuration set to "Boom". Or, test your map with a Boom-port to make sure everything runs like you want it to.

Old Post 10-20-12 18:06 #
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Agentbromsnor
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Well, I normally only use GZDoom te test my maps haha. Mapping for a software sourceport is new for me, but I like a challenge! :)

I'll test it out, but I'm hoping ZDoom Doom config is alright.

Old Post 10-20-12 18:12 #
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Agentbromsnor
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Update: Yay, Boom runs ZDoom Doom format! It doesn't show the textures from the texturepack though. How do I tell Boom to run the WAD with the texturepack?

Old Post 10-20-12 18:20 #
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Keeper of Jericho
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Agentbromsnor said:
Update: Yay, Boom runs ZDoom Doom format! It doesn't show the textures from the texturepack though. How do I tell Boom to run the WAD with the texturepack?


Best way to do this is to simply load your map and the texture pack (in configuration: add additional textures and flats from WAD file) in Doom Builder (or whatever editor program you use), and set your test program in Doom Builder to Boom. Then it'll load the new textures automatically.

Another way is to save your map in the texturepack, and then run the texturepack.

Old Post 10-20-12 18:24 #
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Agentbromsnor
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Keeper of Jericho said:


Best way to do this is to simply load your map and the texture pack (in configuration: add additional textures and flats from WAD file) in Doom Builder (or whatever editor program you use), and set your test program in Doom Builder to Boom. Then it'll load the new textures automatically.

Another way is to save your map in the texturepack, and then run the texturepack.



I tried that, and it gives me an error saying "R_InitTextures: 3 errors"

I have no experience with this sourceport, so I don't know what to do. But you can take my word for it that it at least runs, haha.

Old Post 10-20-12 18:28 #
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Keeper of Jericho
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Agentbromsnor said:


I tried that, and it gives me an error saying "R_InitTextures: 3 errors"

I have no experience with this sourceport, so I don't know what to do. But you can take my word for it that it at least runs, haha.



I figured out the problem. It's a bug with the texture pack. If you download this new version, that error shouldn't show up anymore.

http://uploading.com/files/get/b2aaa9df/5rtxt.zip

Old Post 10-20-12 18:42 #
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