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Joseph Lord
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OK, map27 fixed but a have a question first
MAP27: Are sectors 766, 774, 780 etc. really supposed to be damaging? If yes, add radiation suits for multiplayer around this area.
Is necessary the radiation suit?
I put the invulnerability sphere for the next reason:
finish the map in that lapse of time
And about map23, the version in beta VI is my version or one with less problems?

Old Post 03-20-14 01:47 #
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Antroid
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This time I'm fairly confident that map23 from the last beta is the latest version. Eris removed a whole bunch of barrels to fix sprite overflows and then I went and took care of some misalignments and slightly changed that one place with a visual bug where you appear on a lift and ride down and there was a grate and then when you walked off it it closed and opened a wall behind you with monsters - basically the visual bugging on the grating was too unbearable and I just made it a solid wall.

Old Post 03-20-14 07:25 #
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Caleb13
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Joseph Lord said:
OK, map27 fixed but a have a question first
MAP27: Are sectors 766, 774, 780 etc. really supposed to be damaging? If yes, add radiation suits for multiplayer around this area.
Is necessary the radiation suit?
I put the invulnerability sphere for the next reason:
finish the map in that lapse of time


Like I said, this is purely multiplayer measure, the suits won't appear in single player. You see, Zdaemon is pretty choppy by itself (35 fps) and network/internet lag makes it even worse. Therefore, it is very easy to fall off these stone-platform-type obstacle courses. Moreover, invulnerability spheres don't respawn in multiplayer, but suits do.

Speaking of MAP27, are one of the big doors (sector 147) really supposed to open from below the ground level (its floor is at -248)? Also, I once jumped into sector 210, but couldn't get out (make linedef 1698 impassable).

Last edited by Caleb13 on 03-20-14 at 12:44

Old Post 03-20-14 11:51 #
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Alteus
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Posts: 102
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Caleb13 said:

Like I said, this is purely multiplayer measure, the suits won't appear in single player. You see, Zdaemon is pretty choppy by itself (35 fps) and network/internet lag makes it even worse....



Have you tried uncapping FPS in advanced video options and set updates in player options to "Fine: every tick"? Maybe that can help you... I suppose I'm used to that choppyness since I've always played with 35 fps, and when uncapped was introduced it felt so weirdly smooth that I had to change back lol, my rj and 1-on-1 skills dropped to zero.

Sometimes I get strong lag spikes but that's because my wireless sucks and the amount of players in server...

Old Post 03-20-14 14:42 #
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Caleb13
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Here are some minor bugs I spotted during my second run (Zdoom 2.7.1):

MAP30: Remove secret tag on sector 347, it is redundant.

MAP30: Sector 366 should be secret, IMO.

MAP34: Misaligned floor textures on 2 teleporters (sectors 632 and 435).

MAP34: Texture on linedef 4903 moves with the lift (sector 697). I think it shouldn't be lower unpegged.

MAP34: There is big floor texture bleed/HOM around sector 769/770 when you look at it from sector 314.

MAP34: Is sector 566 really supposed to be secret?

MAP34: 4 barons (things 326, 528, 529 and 1167) don't teleport into the playable areas very reliably.

---------------------------
@Alteus: Yes, but during multiplayer, Zdaemon updates actors' positions etc. only 35x per second, so the uncapped framerate makes little difference.

Old Post 03-20-14 16:50 #
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mouldy
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Caleb13 said:

MAP30: Remove secret tag on sector 347, it is redundant.

MAP30: Sector 366 should be secret, IMO.




I think you meant 374, but yes you are right, I'll fix those in the next update

Old Post 03-20-14 18:13 #
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Joseph Lord
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Here is map27 finished

http://www.speedyshare.com/ejr6a/d2ino-map27fix.wad

Now just left map23

Old Post 03-20-14 23:50 #
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mouldy
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I popped into TNS last night just in time to see a pretty massive multiplayer flaw in map 28 which I will sort out. Any other bugs that people noticed?

Old Post 03-21-14 11:16 #
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Antroid
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mouldy said:
I popped into TNS last night just in time to see a pretty massive multiplayer flaw in map 28 which I will sort out.

Out of curiosity, what was it? These things are unexpectedly interesting.

Old Post 03-21-14 14:56 #
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scifista42
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Has MAP19 been complained about? ;p

I guess MAP30 was completed uncommonly quickly.

Old Post 03-21-14 15:06 #
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mouldy
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Antroid said:

Out of curiosity, what was it? These things are unexpectedly interesting.



Man, it was entirely my own stupidity. I forgot that the exit (right next to the start) opens as soon as someone enters the underground section. Of course in single player you can't get back out, but in multiplayer its as easy as dying.


scifista42 said:

I guess MAP30 was completed uncommonly quickly.



Yeah that wasn't really built for multiplayer, but then this was more about checking for game-breaking bugs rather than refining MP gameplay. To be honest I can't say I'm that bothered about refining multiplayer gameplay after seeing what a mess it is with that many players running around. The maps that seem to work best with loads of players are just room by room battles with hordes of enemies.


scifista42 said:
Has MAP19 been complained about? ;p



heh, i stuck around when they were playing with fast monsters and map 19 was impossible to even get past the bridge barons at the beginning.

I have to say that door opening mechanism is quite clever by the way

Last edited by mouldy on 03-21-14 at 17:07

Old Post 03-21-14 16:48 #
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Eris Falling
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I was present for the entire first rotation
MAP19's MP-only Icon gave us a rough time, and a quick bout of Village People.
The start of MAP20 was pretty hilarious
There were a lot of complaints about ammo in both of Antroid's maps. There's not enough to go around for more than 1 player.
MAP28 was extremely disappointing - as noted. I was hoping we'd be on that map for much longer.
I saw a lot of excess sprites in both of Joseph Lord's other maps.

MAP22 lacks a lot of vital WR teleports, and has W1's instead. I could feel everyone getting pissed at me right there. As cannonball pointed out, it's also a reverse of CC4 MAP17 :P There's also that door that needs to be opened from outside as Caleb mentioned earlier. We needed 2 portals to beat that map >:(

EDIT: I actually had to try and get into The Citadel (by crossing the damaging floor) with 5 health. Right at the start of the map
What a massive wait that was :(

Old Post 03-21-14 18:21 #
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Antroid
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Eris Falling said:
There were a lot of complaints about ammo in both of Antroid's maps. There's not enough to go around for more than 1 player.

I elect to do absolutely nothing about this. If anyone feels like putting a moderate amount of MP-only ammo in them be my guest (please do nothing else though), since I have no clue how much I should put there and where and all these aspects. In fact, it seems fairly absurd to me that with the exact same amount of ammo and monsters the number of people makes any difference. Aim better, and look around better! And don't hoard all the ammo and then die, I guess?

Old Post 03-21-14 18:47 #
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Caleb13
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Apart from the things already mentioned, I noticed a few more issues during the TNS session:

MAP19: I looked at that MP-only spawner and I don't see how it could be beaten. Because in order to shoot it, the player has to flip 2 switches (linedefs 10659 and 10661). But the paths/sectors leading to these switches are closed (they have zero height) and they can't be opened because they have no linedef tags. Or is there some new trick around? At any rate, the paths never opened, neither in Zdaemon TNS game nor in my Zdoom MP emulation tests.

MAP19: This is possibly an engine issue, but in case it isn't: If you stand on sector 137 or 156 and try to shoot at barons on the ramparts (sectors 92, 93 etc.), the projectiles disappear. That happens with both hitscan and projectile weapons. It happens in both Zdaemon and Zdoom. I think linedefs 564 and 784 cause this.

MAP19: As Eris mentioned, more MP-only radiation suits around sector 157 would be nice.

MAP21: I've seen some players squeeze through gap around sector 69, allowing them to skip a large part of the map. Make sectors 64 and 69 a bit wider.

MAP23: Make door leading from the blue trap room (sector 419) re-openable.

MAP27: Someone mentioned missing texture on bars - the bars were invisible from the other side. Unfortunately, I don't know which ones.

MAP34: Make door (sector 269) re-openable (by linedef 2613).

Last edited by Caleb13 on 03-22-14 at 13:19

Old Post 03-21-14 20:04 #
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Antroid
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So, the week is over, you goin' through dat list, Eris? ;D

Old Post 03-24-14 18:53 #
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cannonball
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Posts: 2275
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For map21, the best fix would be to squeeze and realign the cavern walls rather than widen the lowering walls. Only needs to be a couple of units. This can be done by myself or eris if he so chooses :)

Old Post 03-24-14 18:58 #
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Eris Falling
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I have so many things going on :O
I'll do MAP21 since I have all those other things to do on the project, it also saves another download.

Old Post 03-24-14 21:49 #
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mouldy
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Here's updates to maps 28 and 30:
http://www.mediafire.com/download/s...dates-mar24.zip

map 28: fixed the exit problem and the other issues. I didn't add any multiplayer stuff as there is probably enough monsters to keep a few people busy.

map 30: fixed the secrets, also added a few more monster spawners for multiplayer and extra ammo. It will probably be over just as quick with an army of players charging through it but at least they will meet a bit more resistance now.

Old Post 03-24-14 23:14 #
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Eris Falling
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Well that was a busy evening. I've just gone and carried out half of the things on the to-do list. Still waiting on the rest of it though for a release of the next version.

Old Post 03-25-14 23:59 #
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Antroid
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CorSair's apparently not appearing, so just stick that map09 fix in there anyway IMO. I sincerely doubt that anyone would be against that little lighting tweak anyway, and I don't want map09 to look worse than it has the potential to just because the author seems to have fallen off the world. I can take full responsibility for this desicion if someone starts complaining about it.

Old Post 03-26-14 14:45 #
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Ragnor
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I wonder where Corsair vanished to. He took Revilution's all-important map 20 and 21, so I do hope he shows up again.

Old Post 03-26-14 15:22 #
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Eris Falling
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To be honest, I was actually going to do that anyway. It's not like the entire map was changed.

Old Post 03-26-14 16:23 #
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Antroid
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So what's the situation now? This thing has been in almost-released limbo for an embarassing length of time...

Old Post 04-05-14 14:27 #
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Eris Falling
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Fault is partially mine for not PM-bumping, but I'm waiting on others, as most of my work with this is done. I may have to and just do the MAP23 and 31 stuff myself.

Old Post 04-05-14 14:37 #
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mouldy
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oh that reminds me, I have one more update for map 28:
http://www.mediafire.com/download/n...map28-apr05.zip

a minor thing, but I added teleports to let you get back down to the underground if monsters are blocking the way

Old Post 04-05-14 15:38 #
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Antroid
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Eris Falling said:
I may have to and just do the MAP23 and 31 stuff myself.

It would be nice, Xaser's taking his sweet time for what is a half-hour job at worst. After this much time if anyone complains that their map was fixed before they did it themselves, well, tough shit, you should've taken less than a month.

Old Post 04-05-14 17:05 #
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Eris Falling
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Here's Beta VII.

I've fixed the vast majority of things that were outstanding. This includes work on MAP31 and 23. I tried my best with the former to not mess anything up, it should be ok though.
MAP09 lighting has been integrated and yeah loads of other stuff too.
I expect this to be the penultimate version, B8 will probably be the finalised WAD.

EDIT: Oh and props to Antroid for giving me a strong kick up the arse to get this done

Last edited by Eris Falling on 04-12-14 at 15:34

Old Post 04-12-14 15:14 #
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scifista42
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The MAP19 MP works, I've just tried it in Eternity Engine (because I couldn't set up ZDoom or PrBoom+ for a MP game with cheats). There's a complicated trick involving doors opened and kept open by monsters - I've used this trick several times throughout the map, I was really proud of myself for discovering the trick at that time. Paths to the switches open after you nuke Cyberdemon and Mastermind.

What did you say I should do about the MAP07 issue, which had occured only in ZDaemon?

Old Post 04-12-14 15:46 #
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Antroid
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Eris Falling said:
EDIT: Oh and props to Antroid for giving me a strong kick up the arse to get this done

Gonna give you another one for leaving a testing player start in 31, and not even fully fixing the sky in there :D You can still clearly see it in the end pit (maybe just fill it with some liquid instead? it doesn't make sense anyway, you don't even get damaged), above the walls if you move (bobbing your head up and down), and, while not sky tiling, those floors you raised on the ramparts in the other place? They have the texture on the inside misaligned on one of the sides, while it is correctly aligned on the other. I say stealthily fix this and keep the version number.

Also, strangely enough, the boss is still a simple SS Nazi... Dunno what's up with that (tried in zdoom).
Edit: Oh wait yes I know, the DEH file still isn't in there apparently. Surely you can do this?


scifista42 said:
There's a complicated trick involving doors opened and kept open by monsters - I've used this trick several times throughout the map, I was really proud of myself for discovering the trick at that time.


I knew it! Now I wish I could be arsed to figure out how it works.

Last edited by Antroid on 04-12-14 at 15:52

Old Post 04-12-14 15:46 #
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Eris Falling
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Antroid said:

Gonna give you another one for leaving a testing player start in 31, and not even fully fixing the sky in there :D You can still clearly see it in the end pit, above the walls if you move (bobbing your head up and down), and, while not sky tiling, those floors you raised on the ramparts in the other place? They have the texture on the inside misaligned on one of the sides, while it is correctly aligned on the other.

Also, strangely enough, the boss is still a simple SS Nazi.



Well I said it could've been better, but at the player start in particular, I have to compliment that with an equally stupid reaction
LOLOLOLOLOL
7B coming promptly. Also, I haven't touched the DEH, you did run it didn't you?
Seems strange, but I can see the bobbing sky-tiling in ZDoom, but not chocolate.

scifista: I'm not sure about MAP07's barrels, seems that it was a ZDaemon only thing, and I'm guessing MAP19 must be the same.

EDIT: I'll add DEH and MAPINFO to 7B :P

Last edited by Eris Falling on 04-12-14 at 15:59

Old Post 04-12-14 15:51 #
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