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Da Werecat
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Phendrena, some textures are blurry. I think it doesn't fit the overall clean style.

Also, the Soul Sphere part was funnier in the first version, IMO.


Membrain said:
The only thing that I wonder is whether we should look for more homogeneity in appearance if we're headed for megawad status.

Although the project is 'monochrome', I don't think it should be monotone.

What bothers me is that some of the maps were made strictly for OpenGL, while others were designed for software renderer.

Old Post 03-12-13 19:28 #
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Phendrena
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Da Werecat said:
Phendrena, some textures are blurry. I think it doesn't fit the overall clean style.

Also, the Soul Sphere part was funnier in the first version, IMO.


Right then, version v0.6.0 has been uploaded. This is my final revision baring and bugs and adjustments from feedback plus other stuff. I have adjusted the Soul Cube so you only get one soul cube joke now, this has meant an adjustment to that secret area though - hohoho :)

I'm not sure which textures are blurry, I know some of the text was anti aliased when I originally did them so I will re-do those and the only other one I can think of, off the top of my head, would be the spray-painted 'X' to mark one of the secrets (that is also a door now rather than a fake wall).

I haven't added anything after the lift down to the Yellow Key door so the key has been moved to a different area - I might move this depending on the feedback.

Have fun, have a play, post your feedback and FDA's :)

I'll wait for full feedback before releasing the WAD as version 1.0.0

Dave




BTW, there are 5 secrets and not 4, it's not flagged as a secret but it is there - it's my 'hidden armoury' and it is very close to the start. The automap might provide a happy clue

Old Post 03-13-13 00:08 #
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Da Werecat
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Phendrena said:
I'm not sure which textures are blurry, I know some of the text was anti aliased when I originally did them so I will re-do those and the only other one I can think of, off the top of my head, would be the spray-painted 'X' to mark one of the secrets (that is also a door now rather than a fake wall).

I was referring to switches. And some text, yes, although it flashed very briefly.

Old Post 03-13-13 00:34 #
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Phendrena
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Da Werecat said:

I was referring to switches. And some text, yes, although it flashed very briefly.

Haha!! I'd forgotten about the switches!! I will be redoing them as they do look out of place and frankly ugly.

**Edit** Quick update, the old switches are gone and have been replaced as are a couple of the text graphics.

Version 0.6.1

Dave

Last edited by Phendrena on 03-13-13 at 15:22

Old Post 03-13-13 00:42 #
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Membrain
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Da Werecat said:
Although the project is 'monochrome', I don't think it should be monotone.

What bothers me is that some of the maps were made strictly for OpenGL, while others were designed for software renderer.



Good point, though I feel as if there should be some element of progression. Not a story or anything like that, but maybe something that keeps similar themes together ala the Doom episodes?

Some maps are definitely playable in native Zdoom using the software renderer, but from the get-go we've had no stipulation against using GL-only features. Adding that in now would make several maps ineligible for inclusion and further limit the accessibility of the project to mappers. Just my two cents, though. :)

Old Post 03-13-13 20:51 #
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schwerpunk
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Membrain said:


Good point, though I feel as if there should be some element of progression. Not a story or anything like that, but maybe something that keeps similar themes together ala the Doom episodes?

Some maps are definitely playable in native Zdoom using the software renderer, but from the get-go we've had no stipulation against using GL-only features. Adding that in now would make several maps ineligible for inclusion and further limit the accessibility of the project to mappers. Just my two cents, though. :)



I agree that we should at least have an agreed upon visual progression, if only to allow us to 'chunk' the different art styles, even if there does end up being some crossover (there is crossover of styles and textures in Doom2.wad, too, after all). Personally, I'm comfortable mapping in any of the styles presented so far. So here's a penciled-in version of what that progression might look like:

code:
_______________ _______________ _______________ | | | | | | |Chapter #1 | |Chapter #2 | |Chapter #3 | |Style [A] |>>---->|Style [A/B] |>>---->|Style [B/C] | |map01 to map11 | |map12 to map21 | |map22 to map30 | |_______________| |_______________| |_______________| Styles: A: CEIL5_1 & FLAT19 B: Da Werecat's textures with shading C: Da Werecat's textures without shading (fullbright tron-style)


This is just an outline to help us visual learners see what we're talking about. Everything is subject to change depending on how our conversation goes.

Old Post 03-13-13 21:16 #
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Membrain
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Another concern is difficulty. I know for a fact that a couple of my maps, using the first episode's theme, are a lot harder than a map in that area should be. Maybe we can come up with a silly story detailing where you are in each map. Maybe the tron-style ones can be various buildings/zones within the differently-styled ones. Or vice versa. Again just throwing ideas out there.

Old Post 03-13-13 22:37 #
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schwerpunk
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Membrain:
Re difficulty: How much would it break your maps if you adjusted the things to be chapter difficulty appropriate? I know you have more open areas than are necessary if there aren't any mancs, etc.

I'm all up for creating a silly story. Something about the bureaucrats in Hell deciding that there's just too much colour in the universe, lol. Heck, who knows. I think gggmork might have some... creative suggestions for something like this. :)

Old Post 03-14-13 16:37 #
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Membrain
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Not particularly much, though limiting the monster choice would make them significantly less interesting and varied. I can certainly adjust at least one of them without worry, though. And hell, if need be, I can retexture them without too awful much fuss.

Old Post 03-14-13 18:18 #
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schwerpunk
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Another option might be to make it a generally harder megawad. My next CEIL5_1/FLAT19 map -- almost finished -- is already too difficult for chapter #1 (although I wouldn't mind removing it from the megawad and just releasing it as a single level)... Maybe it would fit in chapter #2 if I added some of Da Werecat's textures. Anyway, to offset the difficulty, we could also shoot for a shorter megawad - say 15 levels, five per chapter? We would just need to prune / adjust what we have already, and we'd be almost done.

If there's any interest after that we could make a sequel. I certainly don't see myself getting tired of mapping in monochrome for quite a while. It's so nice not to have to fuss with texture alignment.

Old Post 03-14-13 18:30 #
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ducon
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Why not a black map with fullbright (or very bright), or a white one with 0% light (or at least, very dark)?

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Old Post 03-14-13 19:52 #
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Phendrena
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ducon said:
Why not a black map with fullbright (or very bright), or a white one with 0% light (or at least, very dark)?
Black with fullbright is still Black and White with 0% light is also Black!

Old Post 03-14-13 20:55 #
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Phendrena
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Monochromatic Nightmare v1.0.0 is now released. I am happy with the WAD in it's current state and I can't see anything out of place or buggy!!

Enjoy!!

Dave

Old Post 03-15-13 11:06 #
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Phendrena
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Crap Story....


For many years, our brave hero lived happily in a brightly coloured world. All was not well however as a malevolent force had discovered the vista and intended to stamp out brilliance once and for all. The evil minions of hell have moved in to eliminate the spectrum and render all landscapes drab and grey. So jump into your body armour and with the help of your faithful servant the Super Shotgun, defeat the evil minions of hell and restore your brightly coloured world to it's former glory!!

Dave

Old Post 03-15-13 12:25 #
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schwerpunk
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That story works for me. It's cheeky, and makes just enough sense for a text file.

Here's my FDA for v1.0.0. Apologies in advanced for the strange way in which I play. I played it on UV this time, and found it much more challenging, although I was still was able to play around with the mobs from time to time. The semi-secret healing sector was a nice touch. I ended up cheating again (idclip) to get through the the door that "doesn't seem to work," as I'd forgotten what you'd said about it. >_< I picked the yellow door at the end (really liked the yellow fullbright effect in the room!), and man, even with the 'resurrect' command it would've taken me an age to beat that cybie. Are the other doors different? Anyway, I'll definitely be replaying this one.

I did find one bug: If you stand underneath the rising/lowering 3D platform that leads up to the area outside the SSG secret the platform will glitch out, and you'll be incapable of getting up there. Perhaps the edge linedefs of the lift could be changed to BLOCKF_PLAYERS under Line_SetBlocking? Although at the end of the day, it isn't level-breaking deal.

P.S. I added you completed entry to the OP, bringing us to UPDATE #12! :D

Last edited by schwerpunk on 03-15-13 at 14:03

Old Post 03-15-13 13:56 #
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ducon
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Phendrena said:
Black with fullbright is still Black and White with 0% light is also Black!


Except for the mobs?

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Old Post 03-15-13 14:04 #
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schwerpunk
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Something like this, ducon? (From Obsidian's entry - "Good and Evil, Black and White.")

Old Post 03-15-13 14:10 #
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Phendrena
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schwerpunk said:
I picked the yellow door at the end (really liked the yellow fullbright effect in the room!), and man, even with the 'resurrect' command it would've taken me an age to beat that cybie. Are the other doors different? Anyway, I'll definitely be replaying this one.

I did find one bug: If you stand underneath the rising/lowering 3D platform that leads up to the area outside the SSG secret the platform will glitch out, and you'll be incapable of getting up there. Perhaps the edge linedefs of the lift could be changed to BLOCKF_PLAYERS under Line_SetBlocking? Although at the end of the day, it isn't level-breaking deal.

The door you choose decides your fate, so yes, the door you choose does make a difference to what enemies spawn in, however the boss monsters are keyed to the difficulty so playing on UV you will always get the Cyberdemon. I'll have a look at the Line_SetBlocking flag and see what happens!

Glad you liked it and are going to play through it again.

BTW... when you enter the healing sector a switch should've popped up in front of you. This is the switch that opens the unlockable door and also opens the door to the hidden armoury.

Did you find the Rocket Launcher btw?? There is a visual clue in the room that it is in, a clue that suggests your walking over a bridge...

Dave

Old Post 03-15-13 15:06 #
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schwerpunk
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I did get the rocket launcher, but I didn't not notice the healing sector's button come up. Maybe I just missed it.

Old Post 03-15-13 17:51 #
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ducon
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schwerpunk said:
Something like this, ducon? (From Obsidian's entry - "Good and Evil, Black and White.")


Yes, or its complete opposite.

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Old Post 03-15-13 19:06 #
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Obsidian
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Just an update to my map(the other link won't work anymore by the way, I deleted it to make way for this):

Downloab.

Just added some extra decoration and made the side borders impassable so gameplay isn't as bumpy.

Old Post 03-23-13 10:10 #
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schwerpunk
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Obsidian said:
Just an update to my map(the other link won't work anymore by the way, I deleted it to make way for this):

Downloab.

Just added some extra decoration and made the side borders impassable so gameplay isn't as bumpy.

OP has been updated with this info and the new link. I haven't played it yet -- got it on my desktop for later. How far along to being completed do you think it is, or is it actually completed now?

My own map is coming along well. Just working on some final backtracking routes between the second-last room and previous area(s). I think my next entry will be a lot smaller, and a lot less gimmicky.

Old Post 03-23-13 12:50 #
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Obsidian
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I think it's pretty much completed now, but I can touch it up some more if you don't like it. You are the project leader. :P

Old Post 03-23-13 23:28 #
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Death Egg
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Debating whether to switch from Boom to ZDoom, there's a part of my map where I'll pretty much need to use a 3D floor, but otherwise I could get by completely on limit-removing features alone. (Though access to 3D floors could add a whole new level to the map as well.)

Also I think Da Werecat's resource wad's download link is broken.

Last edited by Death Egg on 03-24-13 at 10:18

Old Post 03-24-13 10:05 #
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schwerpunk
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3D floors are fine for entries; however, we haven't decided if the final megawad will be GZDoom exclusive yet (and I think 3D floors require GZDoom, right? If not, just ignore this). So I leave it entirely up to you, Death Egg.

Here's a dropbox mirror of Da Werecat's bw.wad, although the link in the OP still works for me. Anyway, I'll add this one as a mirror for anyone else that's having issues.

EDIT: alright, I guess 3D floors are A-OK, then! :D

Last edited by schwerpunk on 03-24-13 at 16:37

Old Post 03-24-13 13:07 #
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Membrain
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Newer versions of Zdoom support 3D floors, IIRC.

Old Post 03-24-13 16:19 #
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LigH
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Risen3D supports a kind of slanted floors too, I believe. Not certain. Not so common probably.

With all that scripting, the result will be quite picky about supported sourceports anyway.

Old Post 03-24-13 16:27 #
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Phendrena
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Monochromatic nightmare makes heavy use of stacked 3D and my map was designed for ZDoom, so 3D floors do work in ZDoom.

Dave

Old Post 03-24-13 16:35 #
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pfl
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I have followed this a bit. Seems great. Now I wonder if all of the released maps could simply be included in some complete wad. An all-in-one, Pistol start, Monochrome Mapping Project!compilation would be much better than to load all existent entries seperately.

This would HELP much this excellent project idea not to vanish into seperate lost files ...

Old Post 04-14-13 02:38 #
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schwerpunk
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pfl said:
I have followed this a bit. Seems great. Now I wonder if all of the released maps could simply be included in some complete wad. An all-in-one, Pistol start, Monochrome Mapping Project!compilation would be much better than to load all existent entries seperately.

This would HELP much this excellent project idea not to vanish into seperate lost files ...

I agree, we need to cut the umbilical cord and push this baby out the door.

So for now, let's just focus on putting what we've got in order and if we want to include features like map/author names. I'm horrible at packing megawads, so if someone here knows how to, their help would be much-appreciated.

Old Post 04-14-13 15:53 #
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