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Doomkid
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Posts: 1484
Registered: 06-08


Alright guys, Beta 3 is coming up soon, and there's an issue that must be addressed - Map Rotation!

Where does everyone think the maps should go? My original intention was to have the maps get (roughly) larger as the map set progresses, so it would be sort of a journey from duel zones to LMS zones. The only 2 that are 99.99% stuck where they are now is DMR01 at the front, and the Grand Void at the end.

What do you all think?

Old Post 04-20-13 16:23 #
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TheMionicDonut
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http://www.speedyshare.com/FFMse/NoFun02.wad

Just spifing up a few drab areas.

Old Post 04-20-13 16:31 #
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the_miano
formerly doomguy93


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In my opinion, I think the maps should go from smallest to largest. It only makes sense to have good map continuity. Example: You wouldn't want the mario kart level being first and the huge map 17 second.

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Old Post 04-20-13 17:06 #
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Enzo03
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Here's my maps. Tear into them, please.

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u...maps/edmwip.zip

The first one is called ... uh.. actually I dunno what to call it. I wanted to name it as a place it might represent, but I'm not sure what it represents. This map should be vanilla compatible, though there is a small part that is extremely close to a wall which would cause a visplane overflow (as shown by visplane explorer). The only way I can get to it, however, is through idclip, then putting myself about halfway into the wall; suffice to say it's not an issue.

The second one is called Soul Recycler. This one is definitely not vanilla compatible, requiring a limit-removing port. It is also much, much larger, meaning these maps will wind up on opposite ends of the pack.

These maps don't have much in the way of vertically oriented gameplay as I'm still learning the ropes. I'm also not very keen on weapon balance.

The intended skies for these maps are non-nighttime, earthlike skies, just so doomkid knows when he puts this together.

Old Post 04-20-13 18:03 #
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Doomkid
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I think a few items could afford to be added in / switched around, but overall these both look really nice. The second map is a beast! Definitely a suitable LMS zone.

Old Post 04-20-13 18:35 #
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the_miano
formerly doomguy93


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To Enzo03:

Very good maps. I like the detailing a lot. It should be great for deathmatching.

Doomkid92, just wondering, did you check out my latest version of spaceport and shootout 2?

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Old Post 04-20-13 18:46 #
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durian
Member


Posts: 497
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Right. Getting back to this now after a week long travel enforced break.

Did this yesterday on the plane - mostly for my own amusement, but it's actually sort of growing on me.

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/28198906/DW/DM1/Screenshot_Doom_20130420_184815.png

Inside the 'mouth'.

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/28198906/DW/DM1/Screenshot_Doom_20130420_184716.png

Nearly done with it, just difficult to find the time :/

@ Doomkid92 & doomguy93: Check your PMs!

Old Post 04-20-13 18:56 #
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joe-ilya
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Here's a better version of my map: http://www.mediafire.com/?51byan6cdfwmvti

Old Post 04-20-13 19:31 #
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mrthejoshmon
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quick question: how do you get intermission titles (like replacing the map name during intermission, like what was done here in this wad)

Old Post 04-20-13 23:14 #
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Flamen0d
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Posts: 39
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joepallai said:


Hey guys,
I started messing around with this map as I think it has a lot of potential with the opening hall's huge height variations, the intestine mini arena, and just all around old school vibe. I moved the exit to behind the start area, just to clear up some space there; started GSTONing the major walls of the hall to compliment the wood12 texture, detailed the stairs and am thinking about doubling/tripling the size of the start room and adding connections to it via the upper balconies of the opening hall--sort of making it a bi-level combat space using the bookcases as upper ledges. I also think the plasma rifle door should be moved more to the SE corner so that it's accessed from the eastern balcony via jumping and then that triggers a fast moving lift down into the tunnels.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/hfq94sknq...erdm.wad?v=0mcn

Hopefully I'm not stepping on anyone's toes or going against Flamen0d's intended gameplay here.



Sorry I'm really late to reply to this. The improvements that you made and the ones you've mentioned are great. Just some texture alignment issues with the exit but that's easily fixed. Feel free to update it more if you want to.

Old Post 04-21-13 01:44 #
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Omegalore
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Posts: 146
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Doomkid92 said:
I quickly changed a few things in Ogre's 'Crematorium' map, and I really think it brings the map's real potential to life.

http://www.mediafire.com/?ts72qka6boqz36v (warp to 13 to view it)

A copy and paste of my posts at Zandronum:


Anyone online right now want to do some playtesting? :D



Idea? What's up?

Old Post 04-21-13 12:38 #
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joepallai
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Flamen0d said:


Sorry I'm really late to reply to this. The improvements that you made and the ones you've mentioned are great. Just some texture alignment issues with the exit but that's easily fixed. Feel free to update it more if you want to.



I should have more done by Weds. on this map.

With regard to the map order; I don't have any preference other than my map should use that blue sky--I just like the contrast it gives. Maybe the weaker maps should be sandwiched between the stronger maps and move the Mario Cart map to a secret level slot (not that secret levels apply here). Grouping them thematically from smallest to largest could also work. (like I said, I don't have any real preference).

Old Post 04-21-13 14:47 #
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the_miano
formerly doomguy93


Posts: 771
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Here is a link of a new deathmatch level I made on 4/20.

Tell me what you guys think of it :)

http://www.mediafire.com/?ngc1dss6is1ps3w

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Old Post 04-21-13 16:21 #
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joepallai
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Posts: 160
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doomguy93 said:
Here is a link of a new deathmatch level I made on 4/20.

Tell me what you guys think of it :)

http://www.mediafire.com/?ngc1dss6is1ps3w



I really like the texturing here; it's not seen often and feels fresh. The lighting is good; but the item placement seems off--megasphere with BFG secret next to it; the barrels could be placed more stategically (say near the ledges so the players can shoot them into the courtyard or vice-versa). It might be better if this was two courtyards with connecting tunnels and chambers with the exit somewhere between them; just to spread things out.

Overall it looks good and plays fast; I just think it needs some minor tweaking.

Old Post 04-22-13 06:46 #
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the_miano
formerly doomguy93


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Thanks for the input joepallai.

I might add some barrels in other spots and I'm probably going to move the rocket launcher somewhere else. I don't think it would be necessary to add a tunnel to another courtyard, because I want to keep the players in one location for fast gameplay.

I made myself a website with more of my custom deathmatch levels.
Check it out! http://doomwadmaker.webs.com/

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Old Post 04-22-13 07:07 #
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Doomkid
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Posts: 1484
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Okay everyone, a big part of the project is on the way - Due to the huge amount of maps being submitted (about 40), we are going to have to conduct a vote to whitle the number down to about 25. The next beta is scheduled for May 1st, which is also the final deadline for (incomplete) map submissions.

After the beta is compiled, we will conduct this vote. If your map is voted out, don't fret - All unused maps will be compiled into their own wad, which will be released alongside the final product.

This will probably be the toughest part of this whole operation! In one way or another, I really like each map submitted, so it will be hard to say 'no' to any of them, but we can't have this thing be overfilled either. People tend to lose interest if mapsets go on for too long.

Use the next week to make any changes you see fit, tidy up your map or simply continue with it. Although May 1st is the deadline for submissions, it is certainly not the deadlne for detailing, fixing and such.

As always, I hope to hear back from you all soon - This is where things really start coming together for DMR!

Old Post 04-23-13 08:11 #
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joepallai
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Sounds good Doomkid92. I'll have the revised Spatterhouse map playable by Weds. and hopefully another original entry by myself before May 1st deadline.

Which timezone are you going by?

Old Post 04-23-13 15:40 #
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Doomkid
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Although I live in Australia, I'll go with "UTC/GMT -11 hours" just so everyone has that bit of leeway.

Also looking forward to those maps :D

Last edited by Doomkid on 04-24-13 at 04:00

Old Post 04-23-13 15:48 #
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Omegalore
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May work more on that since one of the Critiques said mine was the worst of them all. It's a first alright?

Old Post 04-24-13 02:15 #
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Doomkid
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@shockwave1993attack: Man, I like that little map. Super oldschool, but it looks really balanced - I think it will make a nice addition to the pack. Also nifty is the fact that it was made on 4/20 ;D

My only idea would be to put a few chainguns around spawn spots. All of the weapons will be vanilla, so pistol, shotgun, etc. Just so more players feel comfortable with what they're given. (Also, could you send me another link to Starport on DW?)

@OmegaLore: I know you put a lot of effort into building this thing, I've thought of a few ideas which may sway voters if incorporated. Your map is huge and has a lot of really cool looking rooms, in truth, you could prbably divide this up into 2 or 3 solid DM maps.

These changes are pretty basic, but the ideas might help:
http://imageshack.us/a/img20/7281/omemap.png
A potential spot to split the map into 2 maps, and a few connection points that may help flow a lot.

http://imageshack.us/a/img542/1950/ome1.png
Now, this little doorway looks really cool, but widen the structure so that the 2 compblue beams are totally out of the way of the hall. This makes zipping thorugh with your back turned a lot more fluid. The appearance is nice, just make sure everything is out of the way.

http://imageshack.us/a/img7/5488/ome2.png
More of this - the support beams are there, but the room is large enough for them to be out of the way. Also this just looks cool.

And even if it still doesn't make it, don't worry. You have a map here which could be used for many things - Community projects are always a learning experience, for both the project starter and the mappers involved. This goes to everyone involved :) I can say with confidence your detailing style and overall approach is perfect for a moody, enrapturing SP/Coop experience.

PROGRESSIVE!

Old Post 04-24-13 03:56 #
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the_miano
formerly doomguy93


Posts: 771
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Haha good ol' 4/20! Glad you liked it :D
I love doom levels with a super old school feel to it.
Add whatever you like to my levels. I think certain deathmatch player starts could use some chainguns next to them.

Here is my latest version of spaceport: (SPACEPORT.wad) http://www.mediafire.com/?1m7aj65lfamfo5m

There are more wads on my website: http://doomwadmaker.webs.com/

Also, any skulltag doomers in this forum, test out this DM wad I made a while ago and let me know what you think of it. Just warp to map 02: (COMBAT for DM_revival_MAP02.wad) http://www.mediafire.com/?l0kd57rn44lkb6r

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Last edited by the_miano on 04-24-13 at 04:53

Old Post 04-24-13 04:47 #
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Doomkid
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Awesome, thanks for the links man :)

Over at Zandronum, a few members think that having this map set be plus-size (40 maps) is a good idea, and that is sort of what I had in mind in the first place, but I'm not sure I want to go down that road. As I said over there:


..it's interesting to see everyone's thoughts on this. Doesn't 32 maps seem somewhat daunting for a DM set? I'm not opposed to it, I was just thinking from personal experience. Basically every DM wad that is still played today has about 25 maps or far less - the UDM's, exec/brit, the DWANGO's, etc. Stuff thats 32+ (Sabbat Martyr, for example) seems to be left in the dust every time, but I want this to be a group concensus. Depending on what everyone thinks, we will determine the map number. None of this is set in stone, as of yet.


What do you all think - I want this to be decided by majority rules.

Old Post 04-24-13 05:36 #
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the_miano
formerly doomguy93


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Anytime man :)

Well it depends, having a wad of 40+ levels can work if done right. In my honest opinion, the levels have to flow in some sort of continuity. (Smallest to biggest) or (indoors to outdoors). The levels have to be exciting were the player looks forward to the next one. An overabundance of poorly done wads can make the player lose interest fast. Also, wads out of place can ruin the enjoyment.

I hope my opinion helps :D

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Last edited by the_miano on 04-24-13 at 06:42

Old Post 04-24-13 05:51 #
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Doomkid
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mrthejoshmon said:
quick question: how do you get intermission titles (like replacing the map name during intermission, like what was done here in this wad)

I somehow missed this post - All of that is contained in the MAPINFO lump, they're really easy to whip up.

Nice improvements on your map, joe-ilya. Maybe widen a few of those little hallways to at least 128 pixels, but other than that it looks just fine.

durian, those screenshots you posted look really cool! I like the eyes/mouth on a structure idea a lot.

shackwave, I agree that continuity counts a lot. I'm pretty set on the idea of the maps getting larger as they progress, despite how many maps we end up with.

Last edited by Doomkid on 04-24-13 at 06:42

Old Post 04-24-13 06:34 #
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TheMionicDonut
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Doomkid92 said:
..it's interesting to see everyone's thoughts on this. Doesn't 32 maps seem somewhat daunting for a DM set? I'm not opposed to it, I was just thinking from personal experience. Basically every DM wad that is still played today has about 25 maps or far less - the UDM's, exec/brit, the DWANGO's, etc. Stuff thats 32+ (Sabbat Martyr, for example) seems to be left in the dust every time, but I want this to be a group concensus. Depending on what everyone thinks, we will determine the map number. None of this is set in stone, as of yet.
[/B]


What is UDMX?


...



The answer, certainly not this. No offense to anybody but UDMX leaves these maps in the dust. Id be more for a 16 map pack. Of course nothing is stopping us from a sequel sooner rather than later.

Unless we were to make this Community Chest Deathmatch, which is the vibe I almost get from this.

Old Post 04-24-13 06:38 #
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the_miano
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Hey doomkid92, you want to deathmatch online with one of the beta versions you made sometime?

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Old Post 04-24-13 06:38 #
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durian
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Doomkid92 said:
Awesome, thanks for the links man :)

Over at Zandronum, a few members think that having this map set be plus-size (40 maps) is a good idea, and that is sort of what I had in mind in the first place, but I'm not sure I want to go down that road. As I said over there:

What do you all think - I want this to be decided by majority rules.



My two cents:

The size of the wad is not so important. I agree that, in general, smaller wads are to be preferred, since if a wad has 40 maps in it, the further to the back a map is, the less chance it has of being played - that just seems to be the way these things work, in my experience at least. So, even if there are 40 good maps, it might still be worth splitting them over two wads, perhaps in accordance with some loose theme.

But this brings me to my main point: I'd have thought that, in these situations of compiling community projects that have had a wide call for submissions and lots of submissions, an important operational maxim should be to only include good maps. The number of maps is not as important as the overall quality of the mapset. And if every map that's been submitted is included then I think it's very likely that there will be some bad maps in there, perhaps a significant minority, not just one or two. If - out of the 40, there have only been 30 - or fewer - good submissions, then surely the set should contain just 30 - or fewer - maps. To the extent that weak maps are included, the overall quality of the set suffers - of course, the good maps are still good maps, but the collection of maps that is 'DMR' will be brought down.

I'm not saying this out of some misplaced reverence for my own maps - I'm beginning to seriously doubt that I'll have anything or sufficient quality ready in time anyway, so might have to pull my submissions (they are not, as they stand, of sufficient quality).

Oh, and (perhaps predictably) I'm not sure it's wise to try to make all key decisions by majority rule - majorities can make bad decisions, especially if it's in their interests to do so - don't be afraid of being a little dictatorial :)

Last edited by durian on 04-24-13 at 06:54

Old Post 04-24-13 06:44 #
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Doomkid
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TheMionicDonut said:
Unless we were to make this Community Chest Deathmatch, which is the vibe I almost get from this.

What exactly is the CChest setup, anyway? By that I mean, how do they handle quality-control? Is there some sort of elimination process?

doomguy93 said:
Hey doomkid92, you want to deathmatch online with one of the beta versions you made sometime?

Sure thing. What port, and whats your online name? I'll join in!

Old Post 04-24-13 06:48 #
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the_miano
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I agree with durian. I think it isn't such a bad idea to make a megawad unique out of all the others. I notice that a majority of megawads stop around map 20. I don't think there is much to worry about with the majority of levels submitted so far.

To durian, did you check out my latest deathmatch level "Horto bellatorem.wad"?

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Old Post 04-24-13 06:51 #
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the_miano
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I use skulltag, this version to be exact: http://www.mediafire.com/?05nc7vfeh8oda86

I just set up my server. It's doomguy93 and the port is 10666

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Last edited by the_miano on 04-24-13 at 07:57

Old Post 04-24-13 06:53 #
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