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dew
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Memfis said:
If the next maps will be as annoying on -fast I'll probably stop playing.

then try what i did and switch from -fast to regular UV with complevel 12. monsters tend to be more aggressive, but things are not ridiculously fast.

Old Post 05-04-13 19:23 #
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SteveD
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Memfis said:
04 - no demo because I suck.


Suck? You? Hah, no way! Please don't quit, I love watching your demos. Doom poetry in motion, they are.

Old Post 05-04-13 19:44 #
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SteveD
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@Suitepee

Dude, fantastic job on your play/commentary videos. I just watched 4 & 5, since I've already played both. Very good playing, John. You keep a really cool head while commenting, but it's hilarious when things get rough and you start bitching and swearing. :D I've also learned a lot about Doom from listening to you. For example, I never knew Berserk packs gave you extra punching power for the whole level. I don't punch that often, but it's a nice thing to know!

Thanks also for the link to the UVMax for Map05. Nice to know how that [SPOILER ALERT] Megasphere is obtained. I've never executed that particular move in Doom, even though I've played the game since shortly after planet Earth cooled from the primordial gas cloud, yet I still learn something new all the time. Remarkable!

Old Post 05-04-13 20:06 #
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Capellan
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MAP05 - Control
This predominately-brick map features only a few highlights of TEKGREN, and has a grimier, more industrial feel as a consequence. There are still plenty of computer consoles and screens on the walls, but it's easy to imagine them as disused and dusty.

In terms of gameplay, this is also the first map to make notable use of teleport traps. As previously discussed, there's a very small one in map01, but this level dishes out three separate instances, including the exit battle. That last is really the only one that's likely to take much health off you, even though you know it is coming. The others are mainly sergeants and imps, which isn't too scary as opposition goes.

Overall, gameplay in the level is solid, but not exceptional. I think scaling the size of the areas up might have helped. If the exterior were wider, with bigger windows overlooking it, there would have been more chances for crossfires. Currently, the relatively compact nature of the level means it is relatively easy to control an area from one point. That lets the player decide the terms of engagement.

Old Post 05-04-13 20:58 #
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Memfis
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05 - demo. Whew, this was crazy. Basically this time I took the extremely cautious approach that I was too lazy to take yesterday. And I still barely survived. This is because there are hitscanners shooting from every damn window and sometimes there is no safe way to take them out, you have to break in the room, exposing yourself to their attacks. Thank god the rocketjump worked, I was so worried about that moment.
Also thanks for the suggestion dew, I guess -cl 12 enables that "monsters help friends" thing that makes NUTS.wad unplayable on high complevels? Sounds interesting, for now I'll continue torturing myself with -fast but I might try it at some point.

Old Post 05-04-13 22:56 #
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walter confalonieri
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MAP05: Now the level changes theme again from the TEKGREN to a plutonia brick map style, i suppose this is the way this map pack was concept by the good old (?) Matt Tropiano.

Anyway, level starts to be a bit more harder here (although when i started this one i have already killed 15 of 190+ monsters in HMP when i was the courtyard...

However the is centered on the above known court and this tower that hides a important artifact for the mission (in our case, the blue keycard), place is surrounded by corridors and stairs that leads to another staircase plataform that you can reach via jump, making it looking similar to Doom 2 MAP11 or even better to the Yellow Key (if i remember good) circular section before the exit of Eviltion's MAP03...

Whatever the puzzles is very nice and easily understandable (don't read the spoiler if you don't want to know how to find secrets in this map!)

spoiler - highlight to read:

There's something with the computer screens all around this level

Also this corridor section here reminds me of Plutonia MAP01 mechanics somewhat...

Reached MAP05 and died like a stupid.... Saved after my death without guns, yay!

Old Post 05-05-13 00:21 #
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cannonball
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@memfis, I look forward to your fda of map06, you are going to be in for a world of pain :P
Anyway....
MAP05 - Control
Cramped brown with added plutonia bricks. The cramped space meant that the vast amounts of zombies and imps cannot get a sight of you all at once which means you are not completely pummelled. There are two staircases to the side near the start which I felt posed the greatest danger due to being shot at from both sides, but found a solution to this by going to another area and taking one side out making my passage safe.
I remember for TNS trying to get the megasphere secret via rocket jumping, I managed to hilariously gib myself in the process. Nothing like this today. Disappointingly I then found a now completely worthless blue armour secret.
Good map though the difficulty is reduced a lot by the cramped conditions.

Last edited by cannonball on 05-05-13 at 00:43

Old Post 05-05-13 00:26 #
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SteveD
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Map05 Ė Kills Ė 100, Items Ė 98, Secret Ė 96. Time 30:40. End Health 118, Armor 190. Death Count Ė 4

Another fairly easy map, at least by my standards, because I expect to be killed fairly often in maps with lots of Revvies, Chaingunners and Archies. I only view maps as difficult when I reach 10-death territory. However, itís becoming clear at this point that the difficulty progression is hitting pistol-starters much harder than those of us playing continuously.

This map starts off nicely with a big fight at the first doorway. This time, I like the look of Plutonia brick, and I greatly appreciate all the window-snipers who keep me moving at a brisk pace lest I be pureed by bullets. Overall, this is a very nice-looking map with really good action right from the start.

I donít remember all the places where I was killed, but the first trap that released Pinkies, Revvies and HKs is a good candidate. This was a cool area because it led to some nasty fighting upstairs with Chaingunners, Sergeants, Zombieboys and Imps. Iím sure I was killed once there, because I didnít use mouselook or Always Run at all in this map, so I just charged up there, all guns blazing, and after that was finished, there was the 2-Revvie teleport trap which killed me for certain on the first try. But man, Iím having some fun on this map. There is some really nice battling going on.

The layout for this map felt much more fluid to me, because I was able to jump to lower platforms, enter other buildings, and enjoy some really nice height variation. My favorite map so far, and a very nice follow-up to the outstanding Map04. This mapset is beginning to fulfill the expectations I had after the very fine Map01.

The next really nasty fight was in the red key area, because I could never quite get the HKs and Chaingunners to infight, so I had to drop down there and was promptly blasted to atoms by Chaingun Charlie. It took some doing, but I finally managed to shotgun the Chaingunners to death, which made the HK nothing more than a big, ugly victim of some SSG work.

The end-map trap, as usual, was a teency bit toothless, although the shock value was excellent with the HKs arriving with a full load of Chaingunners. It was easily dealt with, though, and, like Suitepee, I was certain that something really unpleasant was behind the exit door, so the RL was ready when Archie made an appearance. That made at least 4 Archie fights in this mapset with no deaths for me, a very unusual occurrence! ;D

I spent a lot of time after this looking for secrets, which were kind of obtuse in this map. I found most of them, but never reached the Megasphere because I have never rocket-jumped, so it didnít occur to me to do that. The map also had some violations of the floor-texture rule, such as use of Floor7_1 as a border texture on the same plane as the main floor texture. Iím sorry, but this doesnít look good. Also, the bridges that raise at the first trap change their floor texture to Floor7_1, matching the floor the walking trigger points into. Matt also provided Floor7_1 borders to the rooms adjoining the bridges, each room having a different floor on the same height, so it was a really obvious, and clearly deliberate, discontinuity. I think it would have looked better if it was all one texture.

Apart from the usual floor gripes, I found this map attractive and a real blast to play.

Old Post 05-05-13 01:54 #
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SteveD
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vdgg said:
I guess I'll reveal my stats, the SteveD way and explain how I'm playing.




I have to give BaronofStuff credit for inspiring me to reveal my stats, because he takes a screenshot of the final tally at the end of each map. I don't do that, so I just write it out. Might be helpful for mappers, in case they want me coming out with lower health and armor stats. Gotta pump up the difficulty a bit, doncha? :D

I should mention that I'm once again using Risen3D 2.2.18, with default gamma, and alas, I forgot to check Basic Doom Mode, so I'm accidentally using some of the fancy effects, which has 2 drawbacks -- all the corpses vanish, and all the fireball monsters, except Barons and HKs, use the same weapon graphics, so Caco and Revvie fire looks like Imp fireballs.

vdgg, do you pump the gamma that high so nothing can hide in the dark, or so you can play the game in daylight? I always wait for night.

Old Post 05-05-13 02:10 #
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Memfis
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vdgg is a daltonist so I suppose high gamma somehow helps him to see?

Old Post 05-05-13 02:23 #
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SteveD
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Memfis said:
vdgg is a daltonist so I suppose high gamma somehow helps him to see?


That's something I never considered. It'll be interesting to see what vdgg says.

Old Post 05-05-13 03:12 #
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vdgg
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Nothing spectacular to write about I suppose, PrBoom+ has only five settings, I think "4" (the brightest) is actually the default one. Considerably brighter than Doom2.exe default, nothing compared to ZDoom possibilities.

Yes, it helps me playing in daylight, but, with a window facing west behind my back, I can't play close too sunset unless the shutters are down. And colour-blidness, I never thought it would impede or help in something, and has nothing to do with gamma, however in the below picture the normal people probably see a striking colour difference between the texture with decorations and the rest. For me, they are like shades of the same colour, if you place the middle one without decorations, I may not notice it.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v345/wojtunio/dalton_zpsdd9e70dc.png

MAP05 (played yesterday so I can have a break today)

Kills - 100, Items - 48, Secret - 0. Death Count - 5. Total Time ~28:50, Final Time 14:51

I liked this even better than MAP02. Very, very good. Symmetry didn't bother me. Hitscanners were crazy, especially chaingunners walking up and down the stairways :) An interesting setup with these steep stairs leading to a big pile of imps, chaingunners and zombies - you can't just play carefully, I have to expose yourself.
Now to the nitpicking:
I really disliked the final trap, with commandos and hell knight appearing out of nowhere. I survived it, but I felt this was shit.
One recurrent motif in the WAD I see are these Wolf3D-style exits, a small room with monster(s), I expected an arch-vile this time and yes, it was him!

Old Post 05-05-13 04:18 #
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Crusader No Regret
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Playing Coffee Break blind on HMP. Recording FDAs unless stated otherwise. No complevel set using PrBoom 2.5.0

Map 1: 100% kills, 50% secrets, 0 deaths Time: 11 minutes and change

Straightforward survival tactics: shoot hitscanners if they wander too close otherwise I let infights do the killing for me. Halfway through, I go for no damage. It gets dicey with the key trap with the chaingunners but the RNG decides to let me complete things without a scratch. Forgot I had berserk. Spend a minute or two looking for a way to reach the mega armor secret before giving up.

Map 2: 100% kills, 50% secrets, 0 deaths Time: 12 minutes and change

One distant chaingunner does a lot of damage early which leads to exiting with single digit armor. Got a vibe of Doom 2's Map 3 in the rocket launcher area. Cleared out the monsters behind the columns before grabbing the RL so popped off some rockets at demons for laughs. Ran out of shotgun shells a time or two. Found the rocket cache secret but not the other one.

Map 3: 100% kills, 0 secrets, 0 deaths Time: 19+ minutes
Early demo derp with me taking 3-4 shots to drop a shotgunner. At the red key, one chaingunner is alerted much later than the rest of the ambush. I was ready for it and easily henpecked it with my chaingun. The last area can chew up the impatient but is easily handled taking it slow. The hitscanners milling in the lower area bump each other off. My health goes down somewhat low when the blue key ambush as I'm trying to get the cacos killed by infights; hiding on the lower level works well for dealing with the mancubi. Ya, completely dull demo for this one.

Old Post 05-05-13 08:12 #
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Melon
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MAP05: Control

It's at this point the obvious dawned on me, the maps all seem to be different takes on "techbase" themes, something I'm sure everybody else figured out two maps ago. This one is a fetching dark brown affair although I wasn't a huge fan of the low thin metal strips with red lights on them. I probably won't go in depth about the detailing of each level any more unless something completely different pops up.

Anyway, I thoroughly enjoyed this map which was a partly non-linear romp based around a large almost circular corridor and the buildings on either side. There were lots of imps sniping from windows which forced me to not hang around and was nicely populated with monsters throughout. I actually died at one point after trying to clear most of the level without coming across the SSG or RL and ran out of ammo, my attempt to berserk an imp went south when his buddies disapproved and joined in.

My second attempt went much more smoothly as I explored a different direction and ran past the HKs to get the big weapons sooner. Ammo was still all-round tight despite that but that's something I enjoy and I felt my riskier approach rewarded me with not needing to punch anything.

Overall a very good map. My favourite so far.

Old Post 05-05-13 08:17 #
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Demon of the Well
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Dew, if you're reading this, would you care to say a little more about how complevel 12 alters monster behavior? That one doesn't seem to be used so often, and so I don't know what it really entails, but it does sound interesting.

Map 05 -- Control - 100% Kills / 100% Secrets
The setup of several separate, discrete brown buildings with dark gray computer trappings in this map really, really reminds me of some other specific map, but hell if I know which one, exactly. Also, you're right, Melon, each map in the first episode (including the next one) uses a different texture scheme, and each is a take on the broad category "bases", although if we want to split hairs I'd say that most of them are not "techbases" per se, but tend to be in a more military-industrial/garrison style--but that's a silly semantic aside! Incidentally, and interestingly, the second half of Coffee Break is more thematically unified in terms of texture use, but less so in terms of the types of structures depicted. Anyway, "Control" is the bloodiest map thus far, with an even mix of scripted brawls and incidental combat against many zombies and a steady supply of mid-tier demons evenly interspersed with them. The windows of each building tend to be well-staffed by chaingunners and imps, to keep the player from holding still for too long, although the firing ports tend to be narrow enough that there's not too much of a factor of random/unavoidable damage. I like the understated but persistent usage of height variation in this map. There's always a pronounced interplay between ground level and the second level; for example, early in the map, you're running around in the yard itself with monsters constantly attacking from the windows in an attempt to distract you from the immediate opposition down on the ground with you, while the second half of the map features navigation of raised walkways (including some simple jumps) and often sees you firing from a superior position, but against heavier monsters than before. Most of the map is satisfying, but my favorite single fight is the multi-pronged trap early on that ultimately lets you into the the first of the buildings--after clearing out the first switch's defenders, the walkways rise up with the side effect of turning the proceedings into a pit fight, which is fun to fight with just the basic shotgun. The additional demons that teleport in after the heavier monsters have been dispatched are a nice finisher, although I kind of wish there'd been more of them. The final trap might have some crying foul, but it's pretty easy to deal with if you react quickly--if all else fails, you can jump into the moat to find some shelter. Oh, and hey, rocketblast secret! I think these are neat, they generally don't get my dander up the way obtuse vilejumps sometimes do. The first secret is unusually wall-humpy, though, given that it's essentially just the same setup as the second, but lacks the second's visual tell. My only other complaint is a small one, that being that I don't think the chosen piece of TNT music fits the map very well at all. Fun map overall, arguably the best one in the first episode.

No deaths for me yet, but of course I have the considerable advantage of having played these maps once already.

Old Post 05-05-13 10:15 #
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Suitepee
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@SteveD: Cheers for the compliment man!

Map 5: Control (100% Kills, 98% Items, 66% Secrets, played on UV, Death Count = 1)

http://youtu.be/T0NLKO0fAMA = my playthrough of Control.

Ooooh, Kama Sutra wad title music! And a most gory opening room, with hung corpses in the corners.
The medpack in here proves to be most useful, as through the door lies several shotgunners that come from the side, and up above there's a chaingunner or two shooting down on you alongside some imps. There's also a chaingun to pick up straight away. This proves to be a most hectic opening salvo and I die once whilst trying to grab some health, only to be sniped by a shotgunner from another window.
Some clips lie next to an odd arrangement of grey walls and lights. Around to the left lies an area with a mixture of monsters, and through the arch here lies some armor and another overhanging window with chaingunners in it, as well as a switch. I'm noticing a lot of windows around here!
Grabbing the armor raises two platforms to enclose you into the area (as well as serve to allow you access to the central building). Oh boy, I wonder if flicking that switch will activate some kind of trap meant to try and kill me. The brick wall lowered behind me reveals pinkies, two hell knights and a Revenant. Whilst one HK and a Revenant settle their differences over a game of Punch Out, I take out the other one with the shotgun comfortably. Flicking the second switch opens the side doors and more Pinkies spawn in to get shot near the arch.

Going inside proves how useful mouselook is in Doom; it allows you to negate nastily placed chaingunners in overhanging positions near staircases, allowing you to take them out whilst infighting among the rabble occurs. When the staircase is cleared a nicely lit area is shown, only to be ruined a moment later when in the middle of it the billion and oneth Revenant corner ambusher appears. Did I mention I was getting tired of this trick? Well I'm getting tired of this trick, so there!
As I clear out the other staircase side of this building, I notice a rocket launcher and a Megasphere nearby, of which the Megasphere looks to be awkwardly out of reach.
Flicking the switch on the middle pillar (where the Revenant was) teleports in two more Revenants, which nearly kill me but I use close-range punch kiting and the pillar to fend them off on low health. Now I have access to the central building on the map over the bridges.

Good thing I peek around the corners of this next building, since (shock horror!) chaingunners hide in corners waiting to shoot bullets into me. Nice to see an indoor cacodemon also. A berserk pack lies on a console in here, which proves handy only for a forgotten chaingunner to take off half of its healing benefit immediately. Down below an area with a Hell Knight and some more zombie marines awaits, alongside a barriered red keycard. I decide to run over towards another building and notice an interesting area to my left that has health potions, darkness and imps that seems to indicate some kind of exit area. (which it is)
A Super Shotgun is acquired nearby this new building, and a nice mixture of monsters lies within. A not light flickering computer reveals the first secret of megaarmor nearby.
Grabbing the blue keycard in here teleports in some monsters down below (mostly shotgunners), which are easily dealt with. Helps to have the high ground advantage for once!

I head over to the area past the bridges that can be lowered. I notice a Revenant in the darkness towards the finale area, as I deal with more chaingunners towards the yellow keycard room. I also notice that the imps in that finale area are able to throw long-range fireballs at you from various angles, making for a nice threat that you'll be glad to deal with eventually. There's also shotgun shells and a rocket pack on either side of the level overlooking this finale area, tempting you to grab them at the risk of a Revenant rocket blasting into your face.
In this new building a red keycard barrier blocks one switch, and the other way contains the yellow keycard. At this point I've noticed that all the indoor rooms in this map have a lot of corpses in them, even before I add to that count with Hellspawn deaths. An interesting tone change.
The Megasphere really teases the player here being right next to the window as I acquire the yellow keycard, which teleports some Imps in nearby. After they perish, I pull off a run off the high platform over to the rocket launcher. I then attempt to acquire the Megasphere but no luck, so I press on.

Through the next door lies the previously scouted red keycard barrier, which lowers thanks to the yellow keycard switch nearby. The armor nearby overlooks the finale location with water below, revealing there were actually two Revenants in the darkness. The red keycard triggers no trap, and I use my rocket launcher to clear the impressive looking finale area of annoying pests before activating the red barrier from earlier, then a blue keycarded switch that raises the bridge to the finale area I've probably mentioned a dozen or so times now!
Stepping past the green pillars triggers a nasty teleport trap of chaingunners on the flickering light platforms, and two Hell Knights. A somewhat obvious trap, but still not pleasant and I'm forced to retreat back to the red keycard room to pick them all off. Using rockets on chaingunners is fun! Some platform running is then needed to activate two switches behind the pillars, whilst some health potions atop them top up your health.
The exit door is now accessible, and I guess an Archvile is lerking behind it to close out the level. I open the door and to my surprise, there's an Arachn.....no wait it's the predicted Archvile and I rocket it to death.

I then spend the rest of the time secret hunting, finding the second secret by pressing one of the computers near the double Revenant teleport switch trap, revealing a backpack and some health potions. I then fail to acquire the Megasphere despite several attempts (I assume this would be the third secret, just like the berserk pack in Storage counted as one earlier) and close out the level. I can only assume you need to do some kind of 'rocket jump' to acquire the Megasphere.

Overall this level was quite alright; although it had a hectic opening and some nicely executed traps, it wasn't as stressful as Toxic for me. I like the atmosphere of the level with all the corpses everywhere. There seemed to be a bit more open-endedness to this level compared to the others so far also. Although I'm noticing a lot of brick/grey tech textures used so far in Coffee Break, the levels so far feel unique and interesting each time. Next time, it's time to hit the half-way marker.....

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http://www.twitch.tv/johnsuitepee/ = Doom livestreams here!

Last edited by Suitepee on 05-07-13 at 06:30

Old Post 05-05-13 11:13 #
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Demon of the Well
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Yep, you get the megasphere in the same way you access the secret exit in the original game's E3M6. Simple as that, although I guess this one is maybe a tiny bit harder to execute. Easy if you use the automap to 'aim' your ass end in the right direction, though.

Old Post 05-05-13 11:27 #
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Alfonzo
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So this post was supposed to contain a link to the latest streamthrough of Matt's Coffee Break -- all of it, in fact -- but twitch has decided not to archive the blasted thing in any listing despite what appeared to be a successful recording (we had a host of people watching at the time).

Sufficed to say that we'll still be talking about it come the end of the month, just as was with the case with the previous podcast, but this is all kinds of irritating. If it crops up somehow I'll be sure to let you know, and if not... we'll be back for Fava Beans!

Happy playing!

Old Post 05-05-13 11:57 #
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Capellan
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st.alfonzo said:
So this post was supposed to contain a link to the latest streamthrough of Matt's Coffee Break


Looks like it's at http://www.twitch.tv/st_alfonzo/b/399157579

Actual game-playing starts about the 2:40 mark in the video.

Old Post 05-05-13 12:02 #
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Alfonzo
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Well yes, there is that, heh... the failed first run that demanded we return on the following day to try again after I'd selected HMP and had a proper breakfast.

Old Post 05-05-13 12:08 #
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dobu gabu maru
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Shame about that lost footage guys :(

MAP05: Didnít like this one as much. Due to not having the SSG for the majority of the map, it really becomes apparent how obnoxious the chaingunners are, especially at the part where you climb the stairs and thereís four surrounding you (or three if you shoot one out at the window). I really liked the visuals/detail and dug the layout, not minding the symmetry and thought it was neat how the weapons were obtained by the player. But the sheer amount of hitscanners really wore down my appreciation to where I was thankful that it ended. Also, yet another AV needing to be kept in his den or GG, which I am not a fan of.

Old Post 05-05-13 18:35 #
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SteveD
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st.alfonzo said:
Well yes, there is that, heh... the failed first run that demanded we return on the following day to try again after I'd selected HMP and had a proper breakfast.


I will have to watch that, then, because going without the alfonzo/Tarnsman show is unthinkable at this point, so I'll take what I can get. I frankly have too much fun listening to you guys flip each other shit. This is a dimension of Doom entertainment that I never envisioned back in the early Devonian period, but having been exposed to it, I'm now officially addicted. ;D

Old Post 05-05-13 19:59 #
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Ven
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I'm back!

Map03 - Outpost | 7:20 | 100% kills, 100% items, 100% secrets | 0 deaths

A fun map with some of my favorite texture use - Tekgren and Plutonia textures. The music fit well to the map, and it had some neat traps. The Berserk pack at the beginning I saved until the last part, and boy did it save me. The final fight was pretty easy with the RL given, though it could've been pretty messy.
Not much to say about this map, other than "shit's starting to get serious".

Map04 - Toxic | 9:24 | 100% kills, 100% items, 75% secrets | 1 death

Yay, my first death! Well, it didn't exactly count. I rushed a bit at the beginning and got done in by the hitscanners.
Now the main thing I can say about this map is pretty much "baaaaarreeeeeeeeels!". Although, it had a clever use of them and they saved me a couple of times. Some of the fights could've been actually really hard without them, such as the first keycard.
Other than the first part the map was mostly easy, but the 4 secrets got me wasting plenty of time trying to find them all, but I gave up looking for the last one. Overall a really fun map, although it didn't really stand out much.

Map05 - Control | 9:14 | 100% kills, 100% items, 100% secrets | 1 death

Brown plutonia textures with some more TNT music (map16 to be exact), which fits extremely well to the tense scene this map gives you. Very cramped with a lot of sniping/teleporting hitscanners, and as you can see by the one death, I got done in by a revenant and a couple of chaingunners, but that was before I had the SSG.
The last fight could've been much more annoying if you couldn't just run backwards after the chaingunners and hellknights teleported, and if the Archvile could've been less.. well.. harmless.

Can't wait to romp through the rest of this, I'm having a great time with this wad.

Old Post 05-05-13 20:11 #
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Capellan
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MAP06 - Checkpoint
The transition from TEKGREN to brick textures is complete here. This is a brown and grey level, which largely eschews the previous maps' theme of mixed indoor and outdoor areas. Almost everything here is indoors, with only a very short courtyard section at the end where we venture under open skies. Frankly, I thought that section looked a bit odd tacked onto the end of this, as it came with a very strong shift in texture use. But maybe we'll be seeing a wood and zimmer map07, which would explain the sudden 'medieval' stylings of the exit compared to the industrial and computer theme of earlier.

Visually, the level works well. I think the author shows an understanding of when it is OK to mix floor textures at the same height level, as I think the various floor borders look good. I also liked the devoted stairs with lights in the middle, as well as the ornate roof and the 'curved' light fixtures on the spiderdemon's lair.

Yep, the old brain on legs makes an appearance here, though not a very dangerous one. Unable to move very far, and easy to get an angle on while staying near cover, it'll soon be Marine 1, Spiderdemon 0.

Honestly, on continuous HMP most of the level is about as threatening as the neutered spider. Lost souls and pain elementals are zero threat when you can get an impassable line between you and them, and the map has plenty of options for doing that. With most of the rest of the enemies being lower tier stuff, the only dangerous moment is the chaingunner trap near the exit. Looking at the monster count in wadspy, it appears that there are a lot more chaingunners on UV, which probably makes life considerably more difficult!

Old Post 05-05-13 20:16 #
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Memfis
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06 - demo. Quite lame level in my opinion, obviously my main complaint is the total symmetry of everything. The two side rooms are totally identical both in design and in how they play so there is absolutely no reason to have two rooms instead of just one. The spiderdemon battle is pointless too: shoot and hide, shoot and hide, where's the fun? Zzzzz, at least spawn some more enemies so I can make them infight or something... Oh well, at least ornaments on the ceiling are cool.
Difficulty-wise it wasn't that bad cannonball. :) Sure, the beginning is quite dangerous but replaying it a few times isn't a big problem for me. And the rest is perfectly manageable. The blue armor also helps a lot.

Old Post 05-05-13 22:48 #
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walter confalonieri
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MAP06: Oh yeah, here we have a good pre-boss map, with the usual trend of two levels of a kind (Metal techbase, Green techbase and brick plutonia base now...), i had to quote memfis with the way too symmetric layout, but it make good it's work of... uhm, refueling base for players (if you play this map continuously, otherwise you found in some part without any ammo)?

Although i just asked to myself how the f++k i could kill that bloody spider mastermind with the few ammo i had (you known, i was killed in the map beginnings like a idiot...).

You know what? This looks like in e1m8 from doom where if you die after playing with all the guns and you found to defeat bosses with lower firepowers and not that delicious, powerful rocket launcher? Here, this is the same fell i have i about this map...

Saved at map07, and finished the first section of the episode...

Last edited by walter confalonieri on 05-05-13 at 23:56

Old Post 05-05-13 23:50 #
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Magnusblitz
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MAP05: CONTROL

I'm surprised to see people describing this as "easy", I found it to be pretty difficult and frustrating, but maybe chaingunners just hate me. Chaingunner snipers in the windows at the start force the player to play a lot of hide and seek and keep moving, which was fun. Not fun were the assorted hitscanner at the top of the stairs, I tried charging up and killing them quickly, but after dying 4 or 5 times gave up and just cheesed it by sitting at the bottom of the stairs and slowly sniping them down with the chaingun. Not fun. The chaingunner teleport trap at the end too is pretty frustrating and leaves you entirely at the hands of the RNG gods. At least the megasphere secret was fun (I assume you're supposed to RL jump to it, that's what I did).

MAP06: CHECKPOINT

Unlike Memfis, I wasn't bothered by the symmetry of it given that it's a small level, but of course variation would always be an improvement. The mastermind battle is pretty boring, just keep popping out and throwing a rocket or SSG barrage at her. Like many of the other levels so far, the hardest part is the start.

My main like of this level was in the architecture, like Capellan, I really liked the stairs with the lights in them, the curved light fixtures and the skylight. The gameplay always feels like it's close to being good but then never quites get there, and throws it off with frustrating overuse of chaingunner snipers or a boring boss battle.

Old Post 05-06-13 00:39 #
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Suitepee
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Late-night posting before I sleep for work in the morning.

Map 06: Checkpoint (100% Kills/Items/Deaths, played on UV, Death Count = 2)

http://youtu.be/fRdJSxPwJF8 = my playthrough of Checkpoint.

The monster count is back down to double figures for the half-way marker of Coffee Break.
The Super Shotgun lies in front of me alongside two small health kits. A mixture of enemies turn their backs to me in the large symmetrical opening room, including most notably a Baron of Hell and an interesting number of pistol zombies. A rocket launcher and several rockets also linger on the centre floor here. I try to get the chaingunners attempting to snipe from the windows on either side to infight some of the enemies for me, but to no avail so I blast down the shotgunners and off I go!
Chaingunners come around both corners, they lerk in the windows and I get killed by a window chaingunner for my troubles on the first attempt! I find the influx of chaingunners rather irritating already. I'm forced to waste some rocket ammo on disposing the Baron here on my second attempt as I also try to kill all the numerous chaingunners, and two Pinkies around the corners of the curved light structure don't help either. Although they also don't damage me either, but I am forced to punch one out w/o berserk power due to having spent all my ammo.
This has been the most hectic yet annoying opening salvo to a Coffee Break level yet, to which I do not approve due to the overuse of chaingunners.

Going through the left door reveals a chaingunner corner ambusher on the left, and a mixture of hitscans around to the right as well as two Cacodemons and some Pinkies. The first secret of the level is revealed through the monitor wall where the corner chaingunner was, disclosing an useful backpack upon me. Finally nice to get one of these backpacks when I can actually take advantage of it!
The switch down here lowers an elevator, taking me up to a nice armory of chainguns, shotguns and armor! As well as another switch that teleports in chaingunners, shotgunners and imps below. Thankfully they largely infight each other, to much relief from me.
As I go back down the elevator a pain elemental reveals itself! This time thankfully I possess guns, so the chaingun makes short work of this cretin. Two advancing Hell Knights and a Pinky rush down the stairs towards me, making for a somewhat awkward encounter.

The room on the right hand side has exactly the same symmetrical monster and trap layout for the area on the left side, except for one key difference; activating the switch on this side's armory lowers the walls in the main room to reveal....a Spider Mastermind! Boss monster time! I die to its super chaingun one time largely due to screwing up with the Pain Elemental/Hell Knight combo and then trying to rocket the SM on low health.
Although the Spider Mastermind is kind of limited in its movement area, I don't have any weapons (i.e. BFG9000 to the face!) to deal with it quickly and thus a tense hide and peek battle occurs when I run out of rockets, especially since I'm on 15% health fighting it the second time (yes I screwed up with the Pain Elemental/Hell Knight combo again!). After shooting at it a heck of a lot with the shotgun from distance, the big boss spider finally concedes defeat and reveals a berserk pack which I'm very grateful for!
This was a nice boss monster reveal that I wasn't expecting, and proved to be a somewhat tricky opponent also given the circumstances.

But oh the level isn't over yet! Past the dead SM lies a long elevator to ride upwards. At the top lies a Hell Knight and some imps in a small room to deal with. Awkward. Opening the wooden door reveals a Pain Elemental in the way, but even more awkwardly two chaingunners appear from behind and start pelting away! As if I hadn't seen enough chaingunners already in this level! (at least this was a clever use of them for once) Good thing the medkit in this small area proves useful.
A lone Revenant lies behind the final door, easily dealt with. I notice that there's a texture transition here from grey bricks and military steel to wood and brown bricks in the final building, which looks nice.
I go back to check for secrets and discover the second secret on the right hand side room, located through the wall lowering where the Pain Elemental enters the fray. Strangely enough the sound cue of an activated demon alerted me to this rather subtle secret, within which lies the Megaarmor. Time to clear this checkpoint then, and back to my 100% everything ways!

Overall, this level leaves me with a divided opinion. While I liked the boss monster reveal and the ending chaingunner trap, I also heavily disliked the opening with its chaingunner influx; although it was by far the trickiest opening room of the wad so far, I also found it the most annoying to boot. I think the positives outweigh the negatives, as I personally dislike the overuse of chaingunners.

An interesting if not brief text box appears after the end of level stats. I guess this might mean a tone/texture shift in general for the second half of Coffee Break, given the texture transition at the end of the level?

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Last edited by Suitepee on 05-07-13 at 06:30

Old Post 05-06-13 00:51 #
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cannonball
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MAP06 - Checkpoint
Very symmetrical and lots of hitscanners, the start to this map is complete chaos. Once you get a foothold and take out one side you should be ok. Playing consecutively resulted in me never dropping below 80 health.
This map is ok and short enough to not cause any aggravation.The spider mastermind feels fitting for the end of this mini episode of sorts before we tackle a different level theme.
The chaingunner trap will bother most first timers at the end. As I've played and maxed this level before I know how to handle it, poor pain elemental becomes a glorified meat shield.
There are some nice visual highlights here including the skylight and I really like this plutonia texture which pretty much covers this map like a rash.

Old Post 05-06-13 01:15 #
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SteveD
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Map06 Ė Kills Ė 100, Items Ė 100, Secret Ė 50. Time 14:30. End Health 96, Armor 96. Death Count Ė 1

This map starts out with its best fight, with a rocket launcher tempting you while a bunch of monsters stand around with their backs turned. So naturally I opened fire with the chaingun and charged in. Intelligent use of Chaingunners chopped my health down to 64%, but because I play continuously, I had relatively few problems. A good bit of infighting helped me, and after that it was easy enough to pick off Chaingunners and Imps at the windows.

As others have noted, the map is entirely symmetrical, right down to the monsters. This didnít bother me. The little PE/HK traps were easily dealt with, though in the second one I had to hoof it upstairs to avoid Queen Spideyís bullet barrage. Ah yes, we meet a boss monster at last, and sheís stuck in a helpless position. I have to agree with Memfis that this led to little more than a boring slaughter, but probably the purpose is to drain your ammo. However, the map is loaded with ammo, though I would have liked more bullets, not so much for this map, as for the next. ;D

I think this map looks great, though I must disagree with Capellan about Mattís border textures on the floor. Mattís go-to texture for this is still Floor7_1, which is great if monkeyshit brown is what you like as a border. :D Given the excellent design work throughout the rest of this beautiful map, including wonderful ceiling work and the decorative excellence of the three concave Light towers, this choice is really surprising. Iíll also join fans of the lighted stairways, using that Boom trick again. Really cool.

My only death occurred because Matt psyched me out at the end. I was ready with the RL for another Archie surprise, but instead it was a PE for distraction with Chaingunners appearing from the sides to murder me, which they did, because everything was too close for the RL and I was dead before I switched weapons. Matt got the better of me that time!

So yes, itís another easy but good-looking map, and once again the use of height variation is excellent. Nice-sized rooms, nice bite-size map.

Old Post 05-06-13 02:08 #
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