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Ragnor
I do see the humour in a mod sneakily changing my title


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I wonder if Breakdown will have a super-secret like the original was planned to have.

Old Post 02-27-14 03:42 #
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Onslaught Six
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axdoom1 said:

Nightmare Imps could also be recreated and Lost Souls could be made more aggressive. TCs generally use dehacked patches that change the behavior of certain elements of the game, so I can't see what's the problem with it.


On the contrary side, doing these maps with Doom II stuff is also a total waste of an opportunity to do a faithful Doom 64 conversion for vanilla Doom.



If I wanted to play a "faithful conversion," I would play Absolution, or Doom64Ex. I, for one, am interested in this project because it presents Doom64's levels in a Doom 2 context.

Plus, it's 2014. I'd rather not see people using god damned Dehacked to kludge crap together for new monsters. The very idea of *replacing* instead of *adding* monsters kind of makes me throw up a little bit. In my opinion, if you're going to do drastic stuff like that, we might as well port all the levels over to GZdoom and add dynamic lighting, colored sectors, and 3D floors.

Having played through all the levels available in the thread: Quite a few of these would benefit from some Revenants replacing a Hell Knight or two. Midway loved using those damn things but it gets boring seeing them all the time.

Old Post 02-27-14 08:08 #
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Avoozl
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If you would want to play a faithful conversion then Absolution is an invalid choice. :P

Old Post 02-27-14 08:27 #
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Ragnor
I do see the humour in a mod sneakily changing my title


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You can always take these levels and then make them more D64 authentic after release. Obsidian might still have the dehacked patch he made for this before the goal was 100% set in stone

Theres already plans to PSXify them to get a full set of official levels after release, so I doubt it'll be barred.

How much is left to do for this project anyway? I know theres the soundtrack.

Old Post 02-27-14 08:50 #
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_bruce_
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Ragnor said:
I wonder if Breakdown will have a super-secret like the original was planned to have.


Interesting - what was this secret supposed to be?

@ProjectLeader: Is there a dead line for the project?

Old Post 02-27-14 10:16 #
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Ragnor
I do see the humour in a mod sneakily changing my title


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The people who made Breakdown put little secret tags all over the level, there was supposed to be some ultimate secret that was really hard to find. It never got finished though, theres still traces of it lying around the original. The Absolution TC "finished it" in their own vision iirc

More info: http://tcrf.net/Doom_64

Old Post 02-27-14 11:22 #
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Jayextee
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axdoom1 said:

On the contrary side, doing these maps with Doom II stuff is also a total waste of an opportunity to do a faithful Doom 64 conversion for vanilla Doom.



I've used up my daily allowance of "what the fuck" on this statement alone. A few of points why:

- Faithful? On vanilla Doom? Ain't happening, as compromises will have to be made in a lot of places with the layouts.
- Also, it's not really in the project's mandate to do so.
- And what is the point anyway, with Doom 64EX essentially offering exactly what you want?

Me, I'd love to see it changed up a bit. "Doom 64 the way Doom 2 did" or similar sentiment. Familiar, and yet completely new in some respects, like a cross-platform Switcheroom project.

Old Post 02-27-14 12:18 #
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BaronOfStuff
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Jayextee said:
"Doom 64 the way Doom 2 did" or similar sentiment. Familiar, and yet completely new in some respects, like a cross-platform Switcheroom project.

This. This is exactly the impression I got from day one of this project idea being thrown around. Any ideas for half-assed Dehacked porting of Doom 64 exclusive stuff just seems redundant in the face of Doom64 Ex and The Absolution TC.


Ragnor said:
I wonder if Breakdown will have a super-secret like the original was planned to have.

We'll have to wait and see what _bruce_ has up his sleeve.

Time for some lists. I'm sick of going back-and-forth to see who's doing what, and of course because I can't edit the OP, it wouldn't be updated properly any time soon.
So here's the current list (in Doom 64 order) of who's doing/done what:

MAP01 - Death Egg
MAP02 - Doomkid92
MAP03 - schwerpunk
MAP04 - Da Werecat
MAP05 - Z86
MAP06 - Sniper109
MAP07 - Da Werecat
MAP08 - Da Werecat
MAP09 - Scet
MAP10 - Z86
MAP11 - Doom64Marine
MAP12 - Sniper109
MAP13 - Avoozl
MAP14 - Z86
MAP15 - Sniper109
MAP16 - BaronOfStuff
MAP17 - C30N9/_bruce_
MAP18 - Pedro VC
MAP19 - BaronOfStuff
MAP20 - _bruce_
MAP21 -
MAP22 - BaronOfStuff
MAP23 -
MAP24 -
MAP28 - Fisk

Features:

MAP25 - BaronOfStuff
MAP26 - BaronOfStuff
MAP27 - BaronOfStuff

Secret Maps:

MAP29 - BaronOfStuff
MAP30 - Death Egg
MAP31 - Fisk
MAP32 - Jimi



And here's a preliminary maplist as planned for the project (main order by Ragnor, while map slots MAP05 - MAP11 have been fucked around with/semi-decided by myself):

MAP01: Staging Area (Originally MAP01)
MAP02: The Terraformer (Originally MAP02)
MAP03: Main Engineering (Originally MAP03)
MAP04: Holding Area (Originally MAP04)
MAP05: Outpost Omega (Originally MAP29)
MAP06: Tech Centre (Originally MAP05)

MAP07: Even Simpler (Originally MAP09)
MAP08: Alpha Quadrant (Originally MAP06)
MAP09: Research Lab (Originally MAP07)
MAP10: Final Outpost (Originally MAP08)
MAP11: Cat and Mouse (Originally MAP25)

MAP12: The Bleeding (Originally MAP10)
MAP13: Terror Core (Originally MAP11)
MAP14: The Lair (Originally MAP30)
MAP15: Altar of Pain (Originally MAP12; make use of its existing secret exit for MAP31.)
MAP16: Dark citadel (Originally MAP13)
MAP17: Eye of the Storm (Originally MAP14)
MAP18: Dark Entries (Originally MAP15)
MAP19: Hardcore (Originally MAP26; would need extensive editing to be hellish instead of metal staircases.)
MAP20: Blood Keep (Originally MAP16; placed here to provide a gap between cybers.)

MAP21: Watch Your Step (Originally MAP17)
MAP22: Spawned Fear (Originally MAP18, secret exit will need to be repurposed/removed.)
MAP23: The Spiral (Originally MAP19)
MAP24: Breakdown (Originally MAP20)
MAP25: Playground (Originally MAP27)
MAP26: Pitfalls (Originally MAP21)
MAP27: Burnt Offerings (Originally MAP22)
MAP28: Unholy Temple (Originally MAP23; had an interesting code sequence thing that will need a workaround.)
MAP29: No Escape (Originally MAP24; map ended upon the deaths of two cyberdemons, this will need reworking/reimagining.)
MAP30: The Absolution (Originally MAP28)

MAP31: Hectic (Originally MAP32)
MAP32: In the Void (Originally MAP31)

List isn't necessarily final! Once everything's ready for testing we can decide on a better progression or whatever. All things considered, it does already seem suitable enough though.

And yes, I will update this post to include download links for finished maps where possible.

Last edited by BaronOfStuff on 02-27-14 at 17:18

Old Post 02-27-14 16:57 #
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Da Werecat
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I did MAP04 (Holding Area) and MAP08 (Final Outpost).

Old Post 02-27-14 17:14 #
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BaronOfStuff
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Thanks, list updated.

Only three slots to go then? Might have to take another one if I get the time.

Old Post 02-27-14 17:20 #
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axdoom1
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Absolution and Doom64Ex use advanced engines. I'm a purist, so I like to use vanilla Doom. They both fail to recreate the feeling I expect from Doom 64.

When the compilation of these levels will be complete and final, I'll take the levels and edit them to remove Doom II monsters, and I'll make them work with the DeHackEd patch that can be found here in the tread. I didn't test it yet, so I hope it will work correctly with the new Mother Demon sprites.

I'll add textures, sprites, weapons and sounds in the wad. The only thing that may be impossible to recreate is the Unmaker, but I don't care about it, because vanilla doesn't support scripting so I can't make the three secret pentagrams.

I won't be able to publish it on /idgames because it will use Doom64's ressources, so I'll post a link on the thread when it will be finished.
By that time, I'll wait for this project to be released. I like the idea of a Doom 64 version using Doom II monsters, I only want a TC to be made out of it.


Onslaught Six said:
In my opinion, if you're going to do drastic stuff like that, we might as well port all the levels over to GZdoom and add dynamic lighting, colored sectors, and 3D floors.


DeHackEd is not drastic, it's still vanilla compatible and Chocolate-Doom supports it.

Last edited by axdoom1 on 02-27-14 at 17:59

Old Post 02-27-14 17:49 #
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Jayextee
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If you were such a purist, you'd emulate Doom 64. Or play it on an actual N64. Just saying.

Furthermore, Kaiser has attempted to make D64EX as close as possible in gameplay terms. Also just saying.

Old Post 02-27-14 17:53 #
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_bruce_
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Thanks for clearing up the secret issue - I already have a vague idea of what I'll put into it.
Is there a deadline - how long before the next milestone/proof pf progress?

Old Post 02-27-14 18:01 #
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Da Werecat
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axdoom1 said:
Absolution and Doom64Ex use advanced engines. I'm a purist, so I like to use vanilla Doom. They both fail to recreate the feeling I expect from Doom 64.

Umm, what exactly do you expect from Doom 64? It's quite different from vanilla Doom.

Quite literally, Doom 64 itself is using an advanced engine, which was recreated for PC in the form of Doom64 EX.

Old Post 02-27-14 18:03 #
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axdoom1
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Jayextee said:
If you were such a purist, you'd emulate Doom 64. Or play it on an actual N64. Just saying.
If I want to play Doom64, I'll play on my Nintendo64, but I want to play a Doom64 TC for vanilla Doom.



Furthermore, Kaiser has attempted to make D64EX as close as possible in gameplay terms. Also just saying.

I know, I played and I really like what he did. I use it when I want to play, because I'm not a Doom64 purist. Though, I'll play on the N64 to get a feeling of nostalgia.


Da Werecat said:

Umm, what exactly do you expect from Doom 64? It's quite different from vanilla Doom.
Quite literally, Doom 64 itself is using an advanced engine, which was recreated for PC in the form of Doom64 EX.

Thanks for asking. I'm a vanilla-purist (someone who uses vanilla Doom or Chocolate-Doom because he doesn't like ports with new features), so I want a vanilla-compatible TC to play on a vanilla engine. Some people don't understand purists, or simply hate them.

Old Post 02-27-14 18:17 #
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BaronOfStuff
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_bruce_ said:
Thanks for clearing up the secret issue - I already have a vague idea of what I'll put into it.
Is there a deadline - how long before the next milestone/proof pf progress?


Nothing strict, so there's no rush. Gameplay-wise, I think we could easily wrap this up in a couple of months (including testing) to be honest, but I'm not going go out of my way to push for that. Music is still a big ugly shadow looming over the project, however.

Old Post 02-27-14 18:36 #
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Ragnor
I do see the humour in a mod sneakily changing my title


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BaronOfStuff said:
And here's a preliminary maplist as planned for the project (main order by Ragnor, while map slots MAP05 - MAP11 have been fucked around with/semi-decided by myself):



I love you. I put a few hours into that order, so its great to see it almost entirely used.

Old Post 02-27-14 18:45 #
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Pedro VC
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Wasn't Unholy Temple being made by Fisk? If not, I would like to take it please.

Old Post 02-27-14 20:15 #
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BaronOfStuff
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Was it? I'll fire off a PM to double-check, if the slot's clear then it's yours.

Old Post 02-28-14 12:43 #
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Doom64Marine
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I've made plenty of progress, just checking in to let everyone know I'm not dead or abandoning anything. :)

Old Post 02-28-14 19:07 #
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PRIMEVAL
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I see a lot of talk about music. Perhaps I can be of some help and make dark, moody, ambient pieces? While I doubt I could cover the songs exactly, I can still make original pieces in such a style.

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Old Post 02-28-14 19:36 #
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Da Werecat
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E2 sky. Full version.

http://i981.photobucket.com/albums/ae293/da_werecat/Doom/sky2tall.png


PRIMEVAL said:
While I doubt I could cover the songs exactly, I can still make original pieces in such a style.

The wad would benefit from some slow atmospheric tracks.

Many megawads with original scores suffer from what I call "videogame music syndrome". It's when any of the music tracks, no matter how good, would equally fit into Rise of the Triad and Sonic the Hedgehog.

Old Post 03-02-14 16:05 #
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Brewtal_Legend
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I'm really looking forward to this. I always wanted to play doom 64 levels in vanilla doom. Although I would love to see it with doom 64 textures personally. THe stock textures sounds good too. Maybe an alternate texture pack could be made afterwards?

I also agree about the video game music syndrome comment. I tend to play almost all wads using the console doom music replacement.

Old Post 03-02-14 16:28 #
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PRIMEVAL
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Da Werecat said:
E2 sky. Full version.

http://i981.photobucket.com/albums/...om/sky2tall.png


The wad would benefit from some slow atmospheric tracks.

Many megawads with original scores suffer from what I call "videogame music syndrome". It's when any of the music tracks, no matter how good, would equally fit into Rise of the Triad and Sonic the Hedgehog.



Excellent sky.

And I can definitely see your point, there. I enjoy making dark, atmospheric tracks, though seeing a brightly lit tech base would make the inspiration for such a track harder to achieve x)

I can probably get to work on a track or two relatively soon for this if need be.

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Old Post 03-02-14 18:35 #
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Sniper109
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Brewtal_Legend said:
I'm really looking forward to this. I always wanted to play doom 64 levels in vanilla doom. Although I would love to see it with doom 64 textures personally. THe stock textures sounds good too. Maybe an alternate texture pack could be made afterwards?



I've already begun work on such a texture pack, although, I'm trying to make doom64 versions of doom2 texture's, so it won't be exact and will be some-what limited in colour. The textures follow the same geometry as the doom2 textures, but are based off of doom64 textures, for tiling purposes.

By the way, how many levels are actually complete? Is there a downloadable wad somewhere on this thread with all of the currently submitted maps?

Old Post 03-03-14 02:57 #
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BaronOfStuff
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Sniper109 said:
By the way, how many levels are actually complete?

Many of them. Almost all in fact.


Is there a downloadable wad somewhere on this thread with all of the currently submitted maps?

There would be, but:
1) I am being incredibly lazy at the moment.
2) I'd rather not upload a half-finished pack of WADs.

In other news, I've done the tedious and mind-numbing task of creating all the CWILV text images and Dehacked work to display mapnames in the Automap. For space/string length reasons however, the level number isn't displayed in full when using the Automap, instead being cut down to a 'Lxx: Levelname' format. They all fit this way, although it does now mean that the map order is now probably final.

Old Post 03-03-14 13:13 #
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_bruce_
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@Werecat - wow, your sky pic looks top notch!

Since I'm not a Doom64 pro like some others here - please put ideas regarding the SUPER-secret(TM) in "Breakdown" into this thread or pm.

Note that I probably can't fulfill all requests, so be aware that the result may differ from your inspiration!*


*my lawyer fled to the Bahamas so I have to be careful.

Old Post 03-03-14 15:02 #
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Sniper109
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Would you be able to upload such a file? I'd like to test out my textures pack on this. Also, although I hadn't started map12 until recently, I will tell you that its coming along and should be playable soon.

Old Post 03-04-14 00:21 #
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StalkerZHS
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There are a very few midis of actual doom64 song, I'm thinkin it would be a good idea to use them, and to try to make more midis of the original doom64 songs.

Old Post 03-05-14 20:04 #
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Running in the 90's
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You know I just tried that first map today and I have to say that's really some fine work.

I look forward to the full mapset!

Old Post 03-08-14 12:04 #
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