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Capellan
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Suitepee said:
This is either a serious playtesting bug that wasn't caught, or something to do with the GZDoom engine


I played it with gzdoom-bin-1-7-01 and had no issues.

Old Post 06-30-13 20:45 #
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cannonball
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Capellan said:


I played it with gzdoom-bin-1-7-01 and had no issues.


Have to agree this must be an engine bug as I had no issues. I would be interested to know whether Suitpee has issues with map22 as well as Alfonzo did.

Old Post 06-30-13 20:48 #
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CorSair
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First and foremost: I really appreciate the feedback thrown in here, probably first thing in my life where I've received that much of detailed info. Thank you, folks.

Few things to say on my part on this affair:

I can't offer any excuses for the quality of my map, except that I was already over the deadline. And I am person who respects too much to be on time.
For the record: The gameplay and the playtest came on the same day as I released the map. And that terrible switch hunt came on the previous day, since I felt it was too quick.
So in short thoughts how I would judge my own creation:
Mediocre at best. Apologies for those who suffered in my map. :(

At least happy that visuals and architecture pleased some folks, even if gameplay deflated the pleasant feeling like balloon.

Old Post 06-30-13 21:52 #
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Suitepee
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R.E previous map comments: I'm using the latest version of GZDoom (1.7.1 r1526, ZDoom 2.6.1 r4129 Feb 10 2013) for my Let's Play, if that helps.

Now that this part is out, Jaws In Space can complete his updated version of the map!

Map 19: Up Town (UV/Pistol start. 95% Kills, 60% Items. No secrets. Death count = 1.)

http://youtu.be/h0tDLjfqMoQ = my playthrough of Up Town.

And so Jaws In Space ends with something of a soft bang.

So it seems this time Jaws took inspiration from Industrial Zone/Downtown (mainly the former), as the black/grey texture level plays out in a very downtown-ish style map with monsters in roof alcoves all over the place, lifts here and there to run across towards other platforms in the level and so on. The skybox here adds to an interesting atmosphere of a dusk/dawn setting for the map, and combining this with the (apparently unintentional according to a Jaws comment on part 18 of my LP) monsters not being "awake" despite facing the player half the time, gives the map an interesting atmosphere of 'waking up the monsters while they are sleeping' motif to the entire level. Intentional or not, I kind of like this idea.

Gameplay-wise the challenge is pretty standard here, with some early ammo woes (on the route I took anyway) giving way to a comfortable stroll past the first few minutes of the map. Some of the 'doors' aren't immediately obvious at first glance, but you'll soon be checking out lifts and doors you missed the first time around. Heck I replayed the level and found things I missed during my playthrough, such as the backpack and remaining monsters I missed. A nice mixture of monsters keeps the level somewhat interesting.
Of particular note here is the inclusion of both boss monsters on the map; the Spider Mastermind locked in a small room (that does overlook one corner of the map) that's not too hard to deal with, and the Cyberdemon in a small pit atop one of the buildings that guards the BFG. Both bosses can be ignored for the most part and aren't necessary to slay to beat the level; grab the yellow keycard, go through the door and stroll around the final cacodemon spiral cage room that reminds me a bit of the ending of....Industrial Zone!
I die once on the map due to not reacting quick enough when revisiting the 'Cacodemon' building for exploration's sake on low health post-Cyberdemon victory.

Overall this map was alright, and it was nice to see a not silver/grey map from Jaws this time around visually. That being said, this map wasn't all that impressive despite having some open-endedness to it with the level design, although I did like the dusk/dawn skybox combined with the 'sleeping' monsters motif. Jaws' best maps were Brown Room and Town Hall for me.

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Last edited by Suitepee on 06-30-13 at 23:45

Old Post 06-30-13 22:00 #
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Demon of the Well
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About map 18, I'm not sure whether or not what happened to you is the same as what happened to Alfonzo, but what happened to Alfonzo wasn't a bug--he just didn't do the right thing. Getting that door to open is a semi-obtuse puzzle. I say 'semi-obtuse' because if this were a normally-textured map, the solution would probably be immeasurably easier to spot: the switch in the lower level of the red-locked building isn't supposed to open that door; instead, it lifts a wall that you can reach by taking the lift in the first room (there are two mancubi in the room on UV) and moving to the end of the walkway, where you can turn a corner and walk over a small 3D bridge to a couple of third-floor rooms. One of these rooms has a large 'plus' sign on the floor in one corner. Walking around on this causes a plate to open, revealing a switch on the wall--near as I can tell, that switch opens the exit (although it may be just moving around on the plus sign that actually does this), and it also temporarily opens that off-textured wall in the basement, which leads to a secret goody stash.

I reckon you and Alfonzo both missed this because, given the white-on-black texturing of that building's interior, it's very difficult to actually visually spot the change that the first switch in the basement activates, and the 3D nature of the building defeats Doom's automap (as they often tend to do). When I played, I think I only got clued in to what was going on because I'd heard something move nearby.

Edit: Oh, and map 22 didn't bug out on Alfonzo, either. Again, he missed a switch--the one in the upstairs apartment (you have to ride a small lift to get there) near the southern entrance of the eastern street. It's by a sector-toilet in the bathroom. Kick in the groin, that--he found the all-but-secret switch in the lecture hall, but missed this fairly obvious one, probably attributable to apathy and fatigue. I guess there's some commentary on the gameplay in this map, right there.

Edit 2: Yeah man, I just watched your stream of map 18, and it's indeed the same for you as for Alfonzo. After you hit the switch behind the red door in the basement, you make a comment about thinking you hear crushers somewhere, but aren't sure because the BGM is loud--that sound you heard was the wall in front of that white arrow on the upper walkway (the one you looked at and chainsawed earlier in the video) rising up.

Last edited by Demon of the Well on 07-01-13 at 06:39

Old Post 07-01-13 05:59 #
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Suitepee
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I did a quick runthrough of map18 after reading your post Demon, and I did indeed see what you had to cross to proceed with the level normally with the bridge next to that arrow after flicking the red room switch.

However, I then checked my recording of the level and I went to that same area post-switch flick (around 27:16 into my video) and the thing hadn't raised up for me! So I guess something had happened in my playthrough to prevent me from seeing that bridge rise up, since it seemed somewhat spottable when done normally as I checked just now. So I guess there's a bug that doesn't allow the thing to raise up sometimes?

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Old Post 07-01-13 07:26 #
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Demon of the Well
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Yeah, I just finished the video. Apparently there's something in the map that can cause the wall to close off again....maybe it's something to do with the baron-pit secret, dunno. Anyway, it DOES open for you the first time. It's hard to see, because you're spinning around and talking, but if you pause the video at 23:44, you can see in the upper-right corner of the screen that the wall has just finished opening (notice that there is no more solid vertical white line visible along the edge of the walkway).

If the switch in the basement isn't repeatable, I guess that would break the map, after all (although Alfonzo still doesn't have this excuse ;)). I wonder what causes it to close again?


Just underscores the point that the WAD needed more playtesting, I guess.

Old Post 07-01-13 07:55 #
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Capellan
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Demon of the Well said:
I wonder what causes it to close again?


Going back to the entrance to the whole north-western section, if I'm reading the map right. Zdoom isn't my thing :)

Old Post 07-01-13 08:26 #
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Magnusblitz
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Okay, time to finish this up, even though it's late.

MAP14: Shortwave

Very similar to MAP09, so not much to say here I couldn't say here. I liked the central objective of the (radio?) tower, but the map never really progressed to any interesting gameplay - just a lot of shotgunners/imps throughout, with only a couple token hell knights and arachnatrons at the end. All shotgun/chaingun play, which gets a bit boring after awhile. So, like MAP09, could make a good map with better monsters/items and normal texturing, but nothing to exciting on it's own merits. 3/5

MAP15: Whiteroom

Another map that could go in the "might be a decent map with normal texturing" category. Very old-school layout, albeit with larger rooms and "sharper" angles/design. For example, you can beat the level without investigating the northern area, which is nice. Not always perfect (the doors are hard to distinguish sometimes), and ammo shortage can be very difficult if you don't find the secret beserk or secret chainsaw. Also didn't like how many of the monster closets had monsters and no items to pick up, just a personal pet peeve. 3/5

MAP16: Town Hall

Definitely my favorite of Jaws in Space's maps so far. The open courtyard at the start provides plenty of enemies for blasting away in a fun fashion, before eventually devolving into the Narrow Corridor Hell that is so unfortunately pervasive in his maps. Others commented on the strangeness of the invulnerabilities here, but I actually like them, as they make the fights a lot more fun rather than forcing the player into the much more tepid hide-and-seek. Other parts of the level are somewhat weird (such as the giant imp horde box room) but nothing egregiously bad. The chosen texture here is also easy on the eyes, which helps. Too easy to run past all the stuff at the end. 3/5

MAP17: ZdLightCrap

Hmm, what to say about this? I've never played a mork map before so wasn't sure what to expect. The central area is certainly interesting and impressive in the technical sense, but gameplay-wise doesn't do much. The rest of the level has some decent fights but nothing great, and the end is a sort of weird jokemap bit that is hit-or-miss (I actually enjoyed collecting the bouncing keys, though I wish the keys didn't respawn, I spent way too much time in that room waiting for something to happen). I'll give it a 4/5 just for originality.

MAP18: Monochromatic Nightmare

Like MAP05, this one tries to actually use the monochromatic look to create a sharper, non-Doom look. It doesn't look quite as nice - the outlines on the ceilings/floors are good, but it really needed some outlines on the walls too. Also, do you really need to write DOOR on all the doors when using a custom texture? Sure something else could've been used.

Gameplay is pretty boring, lots of small monsters in small groups, and even the larger ambushes are fairly plodding since there's nothing better than a shotgun/chaingun (and maybe a RL you can find late). The constantly spawning monsters is a pet peeve, too. The finale finally provides some decent teeth, and the rooms do seem to have some variation (blue room had all hitscanner zombies, red room had imps/demons/cacos, etc.) 3/5

MAP19: Up Town

Like JIS's other maps, this one adhered to the "one flat, one wall texture" rule, and it shows. He actually tried for a decently impressive outdoor "Downtown" sort of level, which are confusing under normal circumstances and EXTREMELY confusing with the one texture here. Even the doors have nothing to differentiate them, so I just started hitting stuff at random. Easy to skip the level by grabbing the yellow key and running through the Caco maze, and I didn't really feel like exploring the level that much. I also had the monster sight issues as well, for whatever reason. 2/5

MAP20: Monochromatic Affinity

Lots of large hallways and some very nice design cues (such as the huge staircase facing into the horizon), but that's about as many nice things as I can say. Oh, and I suppose the button that swaps the colors of the map was cool.

So, like others, I wanted to like this map, but the gameplay is dreadful. Lots of empty hallways with the monsters spread in clumps. Then there's the designed arenas, which are functionally impossible. The SSG ambush happily unleashes Arch-Viles without providing cover, as if Pain Elementals and Chaingunners and Revenants weren't bad enough. There's also almost no health and no ammo - I managed to finally beat it with 5 hp and zero ammo. But hey, at least I have a super shotgun! The plasma gun arena was similarly unfair - very little cover, except this time with sludge that's easy to fall into and hard to get out of. I also wasn't a fan of the teleporting staircases - in the right setting, they can be fun, but here they don't really provide anything except confusion. [/b]1/5[/b]

(I can see from reading the thread that Cacowad made some much-needed changes after the feedback, I'm just grading the map as I played it.)

MAP21: Paint the Town Red

Like MAP05, this map goes above and beyond and turns the monochrome "limitation" into it's own special style. It felt like being in a Gameboy game! Really impressive stuff.

Gameplay is kinda meh, but nothing too frustrating, thankfully. The only bad point was not realizing I needed to kill the Cyberdemon, as I walked back and forth through the map trying to find the blue key. Finally I decided to kill him, and sure enough, it opened up the exit. I'll be generous and give it a 5/5 just for the novelty of the design.

MAP22: Ultramarine Kingdom

Really nice color scheme and design, and I really was expecting to see more of this throughout the project (maps of all one color, instead of just one texture or black/white). The layout feels like a Hexen or even Hexen 2 level, being in some sort of castle with lots of little rooms, a throne room, a market, etc.

But poor gameplay rears its head again, as it has all too often in this megawad. Item placement is poor, as all of the ammo is in the western "market" area, and almost none anywhere else. This creates the problem of going door to door, trying in vain to find weapons/ammo and often being put in situations like "kill these 5 hell knights with 90 bullets and 6 shells". Not fun. Even after I found ammo, I never found an SSG, making a lot of the fights somewhat tedious. Not a fan of the switchhunt, either. The cyber/AV fight was tough - I basically had to plan my escape to a column (which is impossible to see once the AVs start aiming at you) and hope Mr. Cyber would be nice enough to draw aggro.

So, good job visuals-wise, but really needs help on the gameplay aspect. 3/5 just because I like blue.

MAP23: Good and Evil, Black and White

Follows the tradition of MAP05 and MAP18 of having the clean, one-pixel look, which is nice and appreciated. A bunch of small but fun battles into a literally impossible Icon of Sin fight. Took me awhile to figure out why I was constantly being telefragged, and never did figure out where I was supposed to shoot. The skull looks nice though.

OVERALL THOUGHTS

Very...eclectic. As dobu points out, we were basically beta-testing this, so shouldn't be surprised at the quality and wildness of it. I think overall, the set really did suffer from a lack of vision and a strong central idea. From reading the thread, it seemed originally that the concept was "use one (or two) flats, and one (or two) wall textures, forcing the player to create interesting maps by focusing on gameplay, lighting, height variation, item placement, etc."

Very few of the maps tried to do that. Some of the maps feel like normal maps with no textures (somewhat like the custom "orange/grey" maps in Counter-Strike). Some are literally just bad maps with no texturing (such as JIS taking a Doom beta map and recreating its layout perfectly... why? What does that have to do with the challenge??) Others actually tried to take the monochrome theme and making something visually striking, such as MAP05, MAP21 and MAP23. I liked those the best since they provided something novel and interesting, but this was mainly due to the extreme dearth of interesting gameplay across the WAD. Even the best maps had tepid gameplay at best, so in a way, I have to say the experiment was a failure.

Still, there's some nice gems here and there, and while I know a lot of the authors took it on the chin, I think there's promise here. Hopefully it can be useful as a learning opportunity for everyone.


Jayextee said:


These two points are why I personally didn't map for the project; felt like it, and lord knows I love to map with limitations, but in the end I don't want to have to aim at a moving and/or indistinct target. This is also why I have not, and will not play Monochrome Mapping Project despite it looking very far up my alley.

I would recommend for the team to prepare a set texture pack and go for Boom/Limit-removing for the sequel. And Dobu's other points, they're good too. :)



I think this really hits the nail on the head. If there's a sequel, it definitely needs a stronger target/idea, and I would recommend sticking with a set texture set and sticking with Boom for the sequel.

Old Post 07-02-13 05:36 #
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Suitepee
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Time to necro this thread after a week's absence (from me), to begin finishing the monochromatic fight!

Map 20: Monochromatic Affinity (96% Kills, 95% Items, 25% Secrets.)

http://youtu.be/dDijNGaQl_M = my playthrough of Monochromatic Affinity.

Cacowad brings some interesting visuals to the monochromatic template in his map.

I played the patched version of this map (thanks for that Cacowad!) which apparently fixed the spawning tubes balance (among other stuff) that seems to have plagued the other posters. This map follows the style of FractalXX, Membrain, schwerpunk etc in the default monochromatic texture set. Cacowad makes good use of the architecture to create an interesting level to explore; the highlight in particular being the outdoor 'coastal pillars' area (including a nice 'chair' at the bottom) that while lacking in enemies, was an impressive visual design to behold. I also REAAAAAAAAAALLLLLY liked the one switch that changed the B/W colours around on the map, which can change the atmosphere of some parts of the map (combined with the good ambient lighting). That must have taken a while to test and implement, good job on that Cacowad! The looping staircase/pain sector floor was interesting to see, although a tad pointless?

Gameplay-wise, I didn't find this map to be very challenging compared to the last few I've played. Aside from a somewhat frantic opening with several chaingunners and some Hell Knights, the rest of the map was a comfortable stroll for me. The interesting thing of note on this map are the "spawning tubes", which happen in two rooms on the map. Not 100% sure if these are timed or happen infinitely, but they spawn random enemies atop their pads which was a neat concept. Luckily I was able to be in the right spots to not wake them up immediately when I encountered them; handy considering I had to deal with 3 Pain Elementals from said spawns across my playthrough! (I can imagine people dealing with multiple PE's/Archviles from these to be quite the pain) Not exactly sure how you open the barrier to progress to the end of the map, but there's a few pressure pad switches to step on, and a long run across a pain sector floor towards a teleport at one point. The last room had a nasty reveal with an Archvile and a Revenant lowering down whilst the rest of the room opened up with platformed chaingunners and Revenants bearing down upon you.....thankfully you can just back out and pick them off one by one after dispatching the Archvile. Ammo and health is generous throughout the map, and I didn't even use the Plasma gun provided as I was expecting a boss encounter at the end. Only found one secret which I honestly thought was a regular door (guess I've been trained after Up Town to check for not-so-obvious 'doors' in these MMP levels), no idea where the rest of the secrets could be.

Overall this was a good level from Cacowad, despite not being all that challenging. I liked the use of the architecture here to create an interesting level to explore.....and the colour invert switch I REAAAAAAALLLLLYYYYYYY like! I guess the original version would prove otherwise, however. This, Coagulation and White Room are the kinds of levels I want to see more of using the monochromatic textures if there's ever going to be a MMP2...

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Old Post 07-08-13 18:02 #
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Suitepee
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Once again keeping this thread alive with my late reviews!

Map 21: Paint The Town Red (UV/Pistol start. 93% Kills, 12% Items, 33% Secrets. Death count = 39!!!)

http://youtu.be/gagpCa_u--M = my playthrough of Paint The Town Red.

"I've seen things you people wouldn't believe. Lost Souls on fire off the shoulder of Plain Avenue. I watched Archviles glitter in the dark near the library gate. All those Doom moments will be lost in time... like tears in a Let's Play... Time to die. (a lot)"

And so Death Egg ramps up the challenge quite significantly for his contribution. A nicely detailed monochromatic neighbourhood (reminds me of Bad Toys 3D) is blighted by the legions of Hell, including an over-abundance of Pain Elementals spamming their fiery damned at me forever more! Worse still, Death Egg seems to encourage the player to use the rocket launcher given to me at the beginning (I couldn't find the plasma rifle/BFG on my run) a LOT in this level, which is hardly ideal for dealing with Pain Elementals. The music was also a nice choice.

The level starts out with a claustrophobic Hell Knight and chaingunner encounter in your "house", meanders out to a lane full of enemies and nice details (like a lot of garden gnomes!), and once over the bridge all hell breaks loose (whether there's spawning tags involved I will never know) as the entire town consisting of all kinds of monsters are upon you immediately. The level is nicely detailed and encourages some minor exploration, but sadly I didn't have all the time in the world to appreciate it as I was too busy trying to leave town as quick as possible. You'll need three keycards ultimately to leave, and then you'll have to down a Cyberdemon to book town as well. You'll end up having to dodge many many Lost Souls and annoying Pain Elementals along the way. Ammo supplies are plentiful, health/armor not so much.

The miserable highlight of the level is the town hall library. Invisible Archviles....3 of them. Fuck you Death Egg, fuck you royally. Challenge is one thing, 3 invisible Archviles in that building is something close to Doom torture. Somehow I managed to beat this level without cheating, but certainly not without dying many many many many times over! (mostly to those damn Archviles!) I haven't had a level this frustating and challenging since Coffee Break's 'Stalker'. (thankfully this level isn't as badly designed/Revenant spammy as that.....) I also didn't appreciate that the Revenant rockets (as well as some other projectiles) could be somewhat invisible against the skybox/sky for some reason when aiming at the player up front, leading to only their smoke trails being visible. A minor complaint though.

Overall, this was a nicely detailed yet frustrating level. I remain somewhat on the fence with this one due to lack of spawning knowledge; as to whether it's finite or infinite, and if any spawning tags are involved. Regardless, this is a challenging level that will test any Doomer in my opinion. I both like and dislike this level personally however, since it comes across as both cleverly executed and extremely frustrating. If the spawns are finite however, then my lack of patience can disregard most of the criticisms levelled in my video.

EDIT: I decided to revisit this level just now. Turns out the spawns are limited and based off where the player triggers certain "linedefs" or whatever throughout the level. I also found the plasma/megaarmor secret in the water (that I assumed was pain sectored), which would have helped a bit. Regardless of this, the level is still quite frustrating due to the sheer number of enemies and the bloody Pain Elementals! But I now lean more towards the level being deliberately designed to be frustrating & challenging, rather than being unfair with unlimited respawns. Those invisible Archviles can still fuck right off though!

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Last edited by Suitepee on 07-10-13 at 19:17

Old Post 07-10-13 13:12 #
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Suitepee
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Once again my laziness causes me to revive this thread!

Map 22: Ultramarine Kingdom (UV/Pistol start. 100% Kills, 98% Items, 0% Secrets. Death count = 17)

http://youtu.be/rAd2minowAs = my playthrough of Ultramarine Kingdom.

CorSair's kingdom of blue makes me feel like the colour.

Nice exploration feel to the level, decent architecture and room variety. Blue everywhere, get used to that. Don't know how much design is based off Warhammer stuff, never played it myself. There's a lot to explore and discover if you take the time. Too bad if you don't discover the right ammo route you will struggle like I did for most of the level. The switch hunt wasn't too bad an idea for the level, although I can imagine how some people would get frustrated by it. I got more frustrated at the lack of ammo (due to picking a poor route) and spending most of the level seeking supplies whilst attempting monster infighting. The music is a nice fit. I also liked the 'Baron' backalley trap. I died a lot on this map. The map was great for its exploration theme, but also felt like a slog at times.

I can also imagine some people not spotting the blue skull key straight away; luckily I did earlier when pondering where to go. The final room is an absolute bastard of an Archvile/Cyberdemon trap (not invisible Archviles though, thankfully!) and I'm surprised it only took me a few deaths to clear it. I assume having the Cyberdemon aggro the Archviles is the best strategy for it. Spider Mastermind at the end made me use "Checkpoint" from Coffee Break tactics (i.e. sniping it with a shotgun), level done. Didn't find any secrets despite exploring the level well.

Overall I kind of liked the idea of this level, but be damn sure to pick a better route than I did if you play it yourself! The exploration factor may tire some people, and perhaps CorSair could have given the player a bit more at the beginning in case they pick a bad route. But this was an interesting change of pace. Onto the finale!

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Last edited by Suitepee on 07-24-13 at 14:05

Old Post 07-24-13 11:59 #
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CorSair
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I wrote some things earlier (on this page, even!), but I still like to point some things.

this doesn't have nothing to do with Warhammer. It's more about the color, y'see. :P

If you think why the monster/item placement is really out of the place, or generally sucks balls, it's because I did one playthrough with "If I can beat it without secrets, then it's fine" - mentality. On the final day when deadline chopped in. And I prefer to do it on time, rather than leave project slugging.
Originally, I was thinking of doing slow spawning monsters, only very few placed enemies. Rooms would be only supplying points, with various amounts of ammo. But had to scrap that, because surprise, holier-than-thou-deadline.
Guess what I thought about my creation? ... You can probably guess. (Hint: it's not optimistic.)

Only places that had thought item/monster placement, was that soulsphere, mega armor + those barons, and the throne room fight (now later, needs readjustment on the pool exiting side.)


Maybe I will finish this some time. Or maybe leave that as a punishment/memento of my newbie mapping skills.

Anyways pal, big thanks on the feedback, in here and especially in the the video. Enlightens quite lot, hopefully what you said about the map still rings between my ears in future...
Thanks, bow, and apologies. :P (I still think that switch hunt is terrible idea, or needed some heavy thinking.)

If you are curious about secrets (I bet you're not gonna do second run :P) here's how you get them:
Spoiler:
Two secrets in that bazaar area, two in throne room:
On the higher market ground, or the upper portion, those stalls can be jumped on. If you look carefully, you should see distortion on wall; Get good lining, jump and immediately crouch. It's bit wonky, but worth for it; more ammo, and that watery pool? It's healing pool.
Second is in that construction site. Look automap, you should see southern part look solid, even if it is not. If you place yourself carefully, you should be able to get that switch working, opening wall opposite of you, revealing megasphere, with my tags. So close pal! :P
The throne room secrets opens when you activate switch; jump into pool, there's two crouchable passages, leading for health, armor, ammo and BFG. Those are separate secrets.

Old Post 07-24-13 21:28 #
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Getsu Fune
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I don't know if Suitepee saw my write-up of MAP22 or not, but I did note that CorSair's map was the only map that enabled jumping and crouching in MMP.

Just saying.

Old Post 07-24-13 21:52 #
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Suitepee
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Hurricyclone said:
I don't know if Suitepee saw my write-up of MAP22 or not, but I did note that CorSair's map was the only map that enabled jumping and crouching in MMP.

Just saying.



Heh I point out in my video at the beginning that it's the only map to allow jumping/crouching. Which is an odd novelty in itself. Guess I forgot to mention that in the writeup.

So the pool was a healing one eh?

Anyways hopefully won't keep the thread waiting too long for my final writeup, and then this thread will stop being necro'd by my lazy self!

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Last edited by Suitepee on 07-24-13 at 23:03

Old Post 07-24-13 22:54 #
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Suitepee
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Here's Joooohnnnnnyyyy (Suitepee)!!! Time to wrap up this writeup at long last!

Map 23: Good and Evil, Black and White (UV/Pistol start. 84% Kills, 66% Items, 0% Secrets. Death count = 9.)

http://youtu.be/93tNwsNuxqw = my playthrough of Good and Evil, Black and White.

Obsidian ends my wonderful adventure in the Monochrome Mapping Project with a somewhat simple "Icon of Sin" map.

The textures here are nicely used and remind me of something I'd see in Monochromatic Nightmare. I liked how the 'supply' part of the map contained several devious traps, including an Imp surround opener (with good lighting used to make them look like shadows!), Revenants/Barons on the other side of the corridor and an Archvile attempting to resurrect things. And a Cyberdemon which you run past if you're smart. Kind of interesting to see monsters being used WHILST the player is getting their weapons and ammo for the big IoS fight to come, instead of only being thrown at the player once the big fight begins. I didn't really notice the music at all here honestly, guess it didn't stand out enough for me. (it's from Lufia on the SNES)

After a megasphere and a brief respite room, it's time to destroy the GIANT WHITE SKULL of Sin! (with 4 monster spawners, two coming from each eye...) It might take a few attempts to figure out what to do here, but basically you shoot the eyes (which contain Keen dolls that I failed to spot in my commentary!) then the 'brain' is exposed at the top. Ride the tower up and pump rockets into its brain, GG. The staging area is quite small for this battle, but it's quickly over once you know what to do. Autoaim may prove an obstacle in itself here, but BFG spam and rockets suffice in a very brief IoS encounter. Falling down does damage you gradually, but you're as good as dead down there since I didn't see a way back up.

Overall a nice, brief finale. Just the way I like IoS maps since I'm inexperienced at tackling them, and dread the thought of a puzzle switch onslaught just to approach the Romero head to kill it off. And now I'm finally done with the Monochrome Mapping Project! Sorry it took me this long to conclude!

OVERALL THOUGHTS ON MONOCHROME MAPPING PROJECT:

3/5 overall.

I liked how each level was its own entity. (for the most part) I liked the creative use of limited textures on all the maps, and the great architecture & monochromatic custom textures used; my problem was that some maps didn't have a creative playthrough in them. It's one thing to make a map look nice, it's another for me to want a bit more from it gameplay-wise. Some levels just felt lacking in anything interesting or standout, and some even began to feel like one another due to the lack of interesting gameplay drawing attention to the poor use of limited B&W textures.

Some maps hit the mark perfectly; The Primitive, ZDlightcrap (more of this please!), Town Hall, Abusive, Monochromatic Affinity and Tessel Dose come to mind.

Other maps needed more playtesting or something to make them play better; Monochromatic Nightmare ruined by one switch, Paint The Town Red ruined by lack of balance testing, Ultramarine Kingdom ditto.

The worst maps were those that offered nothing interesting to play through at all; two out of three of Membrain's maps (only Coagulation was any good in my opinion), Mono Asbest, most of Jaws In Space's offerings.

Next time around I'd like to see a consistent monochromatic theme if there's going to be a MMP2, and more effort made to make each individual map interesting WHILST having a visually pleasing use of monochromatic textures. As an experiment, the Monochrome Mapping Project was a worthwhile endeavour. But now it'd be nice to see a more organised sequel that contains 23 (or more) varied & visually interested maps.

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Old Post 08-06-13 15:39 #
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Da Werecat
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Suitepee said:
Sorry it took me this long to conclude!

It's not your fault. It's just me being lazy.

Anyway, thanks for your playthrough. I still haven't watched it all, but I will sometime.

Old Post 08-06-13 16:05 #
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