Demon
Register | User Profile | Member List | F.A.Q | Privacy Policy | New Blog | Search Forums | Forums Home
Doomworld Forums : Powered by vBulletin version 2.2.5 Doomworld Forums > Classic Doom > WADs & Mods > Shotgun Symphony -- E1 -- Public Beta
Pages (3): [1] 2 3 »  
Author
All times are GMT. The time now is 02:48. Post New Thread    Post A Reply
SteveD
Senior Member


Posts: 1234
Registered: 04-10


Get it here; http://www.mediafire.com/download/y...a/SGNSYM168.wad

The above is a repaired WAD fixing all the problems found by MarineController. Thanks, MC! This version also incorporates fixes suggested by Veinen and Demon of The Well, primarily fixing the complevel 2 errors they discovered. Thanks, guys! Finally, plums responded to my request for a mapping expert to view the -complevel 2 rising-floor bug in E1M8's Baron area. Plums fixed it. Thanks, plums! So now, all the currently-known bugs are fixed, but I'm sure new and exciting bugs remain to be found, so please keep your eyes open out there. ;)

Shotgun Symphony is an E1 replacement for Ultimate Doom, but more in the vein of Fava Beans and Dawn of The Dead using a mix of E1/E2 themes and the full Doom bestiary except for the Spider Mastermind. The occasional E4 touch is seen as well, such as the obvious sky texture. HMP and HNTR testers are welcomed. All players should anticipate a high level of violence from the very beginning, with a high monster count by the standard of E1 replacements. UV players will see, by last count, 2,537 rompin' stompin' monsters waiting to welcome them to Phobos.

Each map leads directly into the next, and 4 of the maps share a hub, in order to create the impression that you are exploring one giant installation. The exploratory element is also seen in the often extensive secret areas, where you should anticipate being opposed by monsters. In some cases, the toughest fight in a map might be in a secret area.

This mapset was started . . . several years ago. The original design was meant for continuous play, and I've decided to retain those elements, for example, cell ammo in maps that don't have cell weapons -- the first Plasma Gun is in a secret area in E1M5 -- but the gameplay has been pitched for pistol start for those who want a more frantic experience. I have tested each map on HMP and UV with zero-secret playthroughs on continuous and pistol-start. Secrets are not required to beat any map and should be considered as extra gameplay rather than special rewards, though they can serve that function as well.

I've replaced the titlepic and map names, but used exclusively stock textures and, for this mapset, stock music since it's sacred to me. ;) I'm open to suggestions on how to improve the mapset, for example changing map names on the automap (I don't know how to use WhackED).

This mapset should be played on a limit-removing port with infinitely-tall actors turned off, unless you're doing a complevel -2 FDA/Demo, which I will welcome with enthusiasm! :)

The map names;
E1M1 - A Lazy Day On Phobos
E1M2 - Guts In A Blender
E1M3 - Bureau of Bad Ideas
E1M4 - Have Some Fava Beans
E1M5 - Urban Sprawl
E1M6 - Pumping Station Hoedown
E1M7 - This Is My Shotgun
E1M8 - Big Boss Blood Salad
E1M9 - The Miley Cyrus Concert

Some pics;

http://i1329.photobucket.com/albums/w555/steveduff2/Shotgun/E17A_zpsd545298b.png

http://i1329.photobucket.com/albums/w555/steveduff2/Shotgun/E13A_zps496e25d6.png

http://i1329.photobucket.com/albums/w555/steveduff2/Shotgun/E12A_zpse7324174.png

http://i1329.photobucket.com/albums/w555/steveduff2/Shotgun/E11D_zps66a97dd4.png

Last edited by SteveD on 03-03-14 at 20:33

Old Post 02-01-14 04:29 #
SteveD is offline Profile || Blog || PM || Search || Add Buddy IP || Edit/Delete || Quote
Suitepee
Member


Posts: 401
Registered: 03-13


So a new SteveD creation that's not Realms of Chaos SUPER HARD Edition eh?

Methinks I will have to check this out quite soon!

__________________
www.youtube.com/JohnSuitepee = I like to Let's Play doom wads.
http://www.twitch.tv/johnsuitepee/ = Back to Saturn X Episode 2- part 3 stream coming soon....

Old Post 02-01-14 06:37 #
Suitepee is offline Profile || Blog || PM || Email || Homepage || Search || Add Buddy IP || Edit/Delete || Quote
SteveD
Senior Member


Posts: 1234
Registered: 04-10



Suitepee said:
So a new SteveD creation that's not Realms of Chaos SUPER HARD Edition eh?



Not quite so hard as Realm of Intensified Chaos. This is more like Fava Beans Super Hard Edition. ;D Or maybe, Fava Beans, Thermonuclear Edition, especially E1M9. That one is kinda jagoffy, I must admit. So I'm fairly confident this mapset will . . . keep you occupied. ;)

Old Post 02-01-14 08:17 #
SteveD is offline Profile || Blog || PM || Search || Add Buddy IP || Edit/Delete || Quote
SteveD
Senior Member


Posts: 1234
Registered: 04-10


A couple notes for UV Maxers. E1M1 is more or less impossible for 100% Kills. Your Mission Brief states that, "An unusually horrifying and powerful creature from Hell has been imprisoned somewhere in the complex. If you encounter its cage, do not waste your ammo trying to kill it." E1M4 is impossible for 100% Items because, as you approach the exit, you can see a Computer Map on a tall column. This map is actually in E1M5, so what you see is a copy-pasted part of E1M5 with the Computer Map in it.

Old Post 02-01-14 08:23 #
SteveD is offline Profile || Blog || PM || Search || Add Buddy IP || Edit/Delete || Quote
plums
Senior Member


Posts: 1941
Registered: 08-13


What version of GZDoom do you use? Might record some demos in that if you'd watch em.

Old Post 02-01-14 08:54 #
plums is offline Profile || Blog || PM || Search || Add Buddy IP || Edit/Delete || Quote
SteveD
Senior Member


Posts: 1234
Registered: 04-10



plums said:
What version of GZDoom do you use? Might record some demos in that if you'd watch em.


I would certainly watch them! I'm using GZDoom 1.8.2.0. You might have to instruct me on how to play them, though. I'm accustomed to the convenience of PRBoom's extended demo format. BTW, I always use ZDL to launch GZDoom, never the command line.

Old Post 02-01-14 09:06 #
SteveD is offline Profile || Blog || PM || Search || Add Buddy IP || Edit/Delete || Quote
SteveD
Senior Member


Posts: 1234
Registered: 04-10


Some more pics.

E1M5

http://i1329.photobucket.com/albums/w555/steveduff2/Shotgun/E15A_zps4d360d14.png

http://i1329.photobucket.com/albums/w555/steveduff2/Shotgun/E15E_zps1e7924e8.png

E1M6

http://i1329.photobucket.com/albums/w555/steveduff2/Shotgun/E16B_zps745a7b85.png

http://i1329.photobucket.com/albums/w555/steveduff2/Shotgun/E16C_zps2a7e6f7c.png

Old Post 02-01-14 09:24 #
SteveD is offline Profile || Blog || PM || Search || Add Buddy IP || Edit/Delete || Quote
scifista42
Senior Member


Posts: 2051
Registered: 05-12


SteveD, I noticed you have a gift to incorporate height variations in a way that makes for a stunning feel which adds a lot to your maps. And right the start of E1M1 proves it. Played a bit and it's great (I died already), I'll give it a proper go later.

Old Post 02-01-14 10:27 #
scifista42 is offline Profile || Blog || PM || Email || Search || Add Buddy IP || Edit/Delete || Quote
marineController
Mini-Member


Posts: 58
Registered: 08-12


Just finished some testing (with the first version), here are some things you may want to check:

E1M2
Things 149, 150, 151, 152, 153 are blocking each other.
Line 739 has an SR special but no sector tag, looks like the special should be zero.

E1M3
Has 3 player 2 starts and no player 3 and 4 start.
Thing 241 (Teleport Destination) is not present on easy skill.

E1M4
Has 3 player 2 starts and no player 3 and 4 start.
Lines 1999 and 2004 have specials but zero tag.

E1M6
Lines 1263, 1264, 1265 and 1266 are marked 2-sided but have no back side.
Lines 4923 and 4938 have no front side.
Side 4528 references missing texture 'TANROCK5'.

E1M7
Sectors 283, 284 and 887 have no area.
Line 4635 has two sides but not flagged 2-sided (see sector 887).
Thing 443 (Former Human) has no skill flag set.
Thing 832 (Former Human) is blocking thing 501 (Sergeant).
Lines 3295 and 3389 perhaps should be WR just in case.

E1M8
Has 3 player 2 starts and no player 3 and 4 start.
Thing 260 has no skill flags set.
Sides 3766, 3812, 3821 and 3849 reference missing texture 'SNOW01'.

Hope this helps.

I had a quick go on E1M1 and thought it looked pretty good so I will also do some more testing with a playthrough later.

Old Post 02-01-14 11:23 #
marineController is offline Profile || Blog || PM || Homepage || Search || Add Buddy IP || Edit/Delete || Quote
SgtMagor
Newbie


Posts: 9
Registered: 01-14


thx, never can get enough Doom megawads. always preferred them over doom2.

Old Post 02-01-14 13:02 #
SgtMagor is offline Profile || Blog || PM || Search || Add Buddy IP || Edit/Delete || Quote
SteveD
Senior Member


Posts: 1234
Registered: 04-10



scifista42 said:
SteveD, I noticed you have a gift to incorporate height variations in a way that makes for a stunning feel which adds a lot to your maps.


Thank you, scifista! I always try to keep the work of Romero, Birkel and van Der Veken in mind to use as a guide. And let's not forget Ralphis and Rottking, either.

I'm happy to hear you got killed in M1. Considering the number of times you slaughtered me in Space Base 2, I'm pleased to get at least one scalp back. ;)

Old Post 02-01-14 16:51 #
SteveD is offline Profile || Blog || PM || Search || Add Buddy IP || Edit/Delete || Quote
SteveD
Senior Member


Posts: 1234
Registered: 04-10



marineController said:
Hope this helps.



Indeed it does! Well, there goes my day off. ;D To be honest, after seeing your helpful posts in other map threads, I was praying you'd take a look at this one. Just finished fixing E1M2, and those errors were in some cases peculiar, like the Things blocking each other were a stack of multiplayer Former Humans that never should have existed. And looking ahead, I guess I must have used a Whitemare resource to get that Snow01 texture. Hilarity ensues. ;D

Old Post 02-01-14 16:57 #
SteveD is offline Profile || Blog || PM || Search || Add Buddy IP || Edit/Delete || Quote
SteveD
Senior Member


Posts: 1234
Registered: 04-10



SgtMagor said:
thx, never can get enough Doom megawads. always preferred them over doom2.


Here's hoping you'll still be thinking that after playing this one. ;) I'm especially waiting for comments on E1M6 and E1M9 as they are likely to be polarizing maps, and maybe E1M8, too.

Old Post 02-01-14 16:59 #
SteveD is offline Profile || Blog || PM || Search || Add Buddy IP || Edit/Delete || Quote
SteveD
Senior Member


Posts: 1234
Registered: 04-10


Special Note for E1M6.

Once you reach the ginormous pumping room in E1M6, you'll be presented with a few acres of nukage. I didn't want to put a bunch of radsuits in there so that players would run around in a sickly green haze, and I didn't want to keep dying in the nukage, either, so I rationalized a bullshit solution. Basically, because this is nukage emanating from its source, it's "Young Nukage" that has not yet achieved its full toxicity, so it's "variably toxic." At its immediate source, it is as harmless as water, afterwhich it begins to coalesce in dangerous pools, so that as it moves along, there are damaging pools mixed in with the harmless flow. Occasionally you will be forced off the rim and into the nukage, and there will be instances of forced damage. There's only 3 radsuits in the entire area, and one of them is in a secret location, so watch your step! ;)

Old Post 02-01-14 17:09 #
SteveD is offline Profile || Blog || PM || Search || Add Buddy IP || Edit/Delete || Quote
Demon of the Well
Forum Regular


Posts: 917
Registered: 02-13


Fava Beans-inspired, eh? Well, I'm hardly the biggest fan of that particular WAD--outside of the occasional puzzle or story map, I like my DooM levels to contain combat of some description--but I have confidence in you, Steve (that, and I see more monsters in your screenshots than Fava contains in its entirety ;), and am always up for further Duffmaps.

I'll try this out later, hopefully remember to record some FDAs, as well.

Old Post 02-01-14 18:31 #
Demon of the Well is offline Profile || Blog || PM || Email || Search || Add Buddy IP || Edit/Delete || Quote
SteveD
Senior Member


Posts: 1234
Registered: 04-10


Here's the WAD with all the fixes suggested by marineController. Thanks, MC! The OP has also been revised with the new link;

http://www.mediafire.com/download/x...l/SGNSYM107.wad

Old Post 02-01-14 23:55 #
SteveD is offline Profile || Blog || PM || Search || Add Buddy IP || Edit/Delete || Quote
SteveD
Senior Member


Posts: 1234
Registered: 04-10



Demon of the Well said:
Fava Beans-inspired, eh? Well, I'm hardly the biggest fan of that particular WAD--outside of the occasional puzzle or story map, I like my DooM levels to contain combat of some description--but I have confidence in you, Steve (that, and I see more monsters in your screenshots than Fava contains in its entirety ;), and am always up for further Duffmaps.


Good to see you again, DoTW! Well, we all know how it is with me and Fava . . . ;D I still say I can't match the sophistication of Birkel's height variation and interconnectivity, but I definitely have the edge in raw savagery, so maybe it evens out. ;D

You'll find plenty of action here, though I doubt I have the proper forces arrayed to take you down. It may not be as dire as me sailing out in a dinghy to challenge the battleship Warspite, but I have dim hopes. :D If something of that sort should happen, it most likely would happen in E1M8 or E1M9. At least I still have some nastiness up my sleeve with Realm of Intensified Chaos, and I have in mind a series of Amiga Demo Party maps which will be different from my previous work and, I hope, extremely brutal. Those might appear by June. Until then, happy hunting. ;)

BTW, this mapset is my excuse for flunking the Megawad Club this past month . . .

Old Post 02-02-14 00:08 #
SteveD is offline Profile || Blog || PM || Search || Add Buddy IP || Edit/Delete || Quote
Demon of the Well
Forum Regular


Posts: 917
Registered: 02-13


I've dug in, and there's a game-ending problem on E1M2 under -cl 2: the large door near the strange fat octagonal computer kiosk won't open properly (it opens a pixel or two and will do naught else), which prevents further progress. Works fine under -cl 9 and the default PrBooM+ complevel, though.

Edit: This was SGNSYM107.wad.

Old Post 02-02-14 01:10 #
Demon of the Well is offline Profile || Blog || PM || Email || Search || Add Buddy IP || Edit/Delete || Quote
SteveD
Senior Member


Posts: 1234
Registered: 04-10



Demon of the Well said:
I've dug in, and there's a game-ending problem on E1M2 under -cl 2: the large door near the strange fat octagonal computer kiosk won't open properly (it opens a pixel or two and will do naught else), which prevents further progress. Works fine under -cl 9 and the default PrBooM+ complevel, though.



Thanks, DoTW. I think the start of the mess was because I got cute and put a trigger line inside the door sector so that a trap would open behind the player as they walked through. I also found ghost sectors in that room, as sometimes happens when dealing with maps originally made in Hellmaker and then processed through DB2. And finally, the door shared a vertice with the trapdoor sector. A multifunction breakdown. ;D

I fixed the problem, but I'm going to do a -complevel 2 walthrough of the entire mapset to see if there's any more nasty surprises before I upload the fix. Might be awfully discouraging for FDAers as it stands.

Old Post 02-02-14 02:01 #
SteveD is offline Profile || Blog || PM || Search || Add Buddy IP || Edit/Delete || Quote
Veinen
Member


Posts: 424
Registered: 03-13


Same -cl2 (and -cl3 as well) door issue is present in E1M5. Sector 713, a big ass marble door near the end of the map, does not open on those two complevels. This was on SGNSYM9.wad and I didn't test it with -cl9 but the effect is identical to what happens with the door in E1M2 so I'm pretty sure it's the same problem.

I have some FDAs btw and I will post them later once I've finished the thing completely :)

Old Post 02-02-14 10:34 #
Veinen is offline Profile || Blog || PM || Search || Add Buddy IP || Edit/Delete || Quote
SteveD
Senior Member


Posts: 1234
Registered: 04-10



Veinen said:
Same -cl2 (and -cl3 as well) door issue is present in E1M5. Sector 713, a big ass marble door near the end of the map, does not open on those two complevels. This was on SGNSYM9.wad and I didn't test it with -cl9 but the effect is identical to what happens with the door in E1M2 so I'm pretty sure it's the same problem.

I have some FDAs btw and I will post them later once I've finished the thing completely :)



Thanks, Veinen. Problem solved, again by removing the trigger line inside the door. There was also a major error in E1M6 that prevents access to the rocket launcher area, also fixed. Revised WAD below and in the OP. Well, I've learned my lesson. From now on, I will always test maps in cl2 as they're being designed. ;D

Old Post 02-02-14 12:47 #
SteveD is offline Profile || Blog || PM || Search || Add Buddy IP || Edit/Delete || Quote
SteveD
Senior Member


Posts: 1234
Registered: 04-10


Latest revision features fixes in cl2 up through E1M6, so now the doors that didn't open, the computer station that wouldn't come down (E1M6) and a sleepy Caco (E1M5) have been fixed. For anyone playing on cl2, especially continuers and FDAers, please note that I still have to go through E1M7 thru E1M9, so either I'll post a new revision later today or have the glad news that this version is finally up to snuff.

OP has been revised with the new link as well.

http://www.mediafire.com/download/1...2/SGNSYM122.wad

My apologies for the errors, but that's why we beta. ;)

Old Post 02-02-14 12:53 #
SteveD is offline Profile || Blog || PM || Search || Add Buddy IP || Edit/Delete || Quote
Veinen
Member


Posts: 424
Registered: 03-13


Alright Steve, here are my FDAs: https://www.mediafire.com/?588l5i4yzh8ni6n

You'll be happy to see that I manage to survive a whopping one minute before my first death and the deaths just keep coming after that. I don't think there was a single map that I finish in my first go. E1M8 I did not finish at all because of a rather frustrating death scenario in the Cyber fight and E1M9 is a gong show as I played that just after E1M8 and wasn't really in the mood for playing safe. I did finish it after settling down a bit but still, apologies for the terrible quality of play in that map. E1M5 I didn't finish either because of the door issue I mentioned earlier and E1M2 is split into two, sgnsy02_door is an FDA that ends early with the door not working and the other demo for that map is one I recorded immeadiately after that. E1M7 is also split into two with sgnsy07_stuck being a short first glance that ends in me getting into places I shouldn't go and the other demo is the first exit recorded right after.

First five FDAs are recorded with SGNSYM96.wad with complevels 3 or 9, I don't remember which were rec'd with which but I don't think it matters. The rest, from E1M6part2 to E1M9, are recroded with SGNSYM107.wad.

Now about the mapset then. To put it short, it's really good! Plenty of violence as advertised and damn, has secret hunting ever been so fun? The rewards are great too: here's a Plasma Gun for all that effort, now better use it against these dozen Cacos coming from all directions. E1M7 was my favorite one with it's huge layout and convoluted secrets but really there was no map that I didn't enjoy. Great work!

Old Post 02-02-14 19:25 #
Veinen is offline Profile || Blog || PM || Search || Add Buddy IP || Edit/Delete || Quote
Demon of the Well
Forum Regular


Posts: 917
Registered: 02-13


Found another -cl 2 issue, this time in SGNSYM122.wad.

In E1M6, the big computer terminal in the actual pumping area that's supposed to lower into the ground when you approach it to reveal the switch that opens up the wall into the server area where you finally get the rocket launcher is jammed by a former human sergeant--he's placed in such a way that his presence prevents the terminal from lowering very far. Again, this will still work right in -cl 9, although the sergeant looks silly when he insta-phases to the floor from his start position in that case.

Anyway, even on -cl 2 this doesn't fatally break the mechanism--the terminal finishes lowering as soon as the sergeant is killed--but as he's quite high up in the ceiling and difficult to see without mouselook (maybe even with, since there's no real reason to look up there), it may take a player a long time to figure out what's going on (if they figure it out at all), which will of course deprive them of the RL for the entirety of the map. The issue will be visible in my FDA when I finish up (I still have E1M7 and E1M8 to do); I eventually find/correct the problem, but go without the RL for 98% of the map as a result.

Incidentally, wholly apart from this issue, I really think you ought to give out the RL much earlier in the map, perhaps over by the first switch at one end of the pumping chamber, or even on the landing you jump down into it from. The possibilities for crazy rocket-based shenanigans (including gratuitous self-inflicted player-death vs. lost souls and specters) are simply too legion and varied for the weapon to be found that far into the map, and at the end of a sizable optional tangent, to boot.

Old Post 02-02-14 20:40 #
Demon of the Well is offline Profile || Blog || PM || Email || Search || Add Buddy IP || Edit/Delete || Quote
dobu gabu maru
Senior Member


Posts: 1112
Registered: 02-12


Okay Steve, letís give this a shot. After playing Fava Beans I pretty much swore off E1s for good but Iím interested in seeing your growth as Iíve playing nothing outside of your original Realm of Chaos efforts. Iíll be playing on HMP, Zdoom, pistol starts, saves a-plenty.

MAP01: Promising start here! I must say Iím glad your rooms look and feel more fleshed out/modern, although comparing it to your 90s outings feels a little unfair. I like the structures and use of hitscanners hereóspecifically I enjoyed the layout of the blue computer room, where you stick barrels in the middle, pushing the player out to the side where hungry imps await to blast them through wide windows. The pitch black trap did catch me off guard and end me, but Iíve also been running a bit gung-ho through the complex resulting in <30% health for most of the map.

Old Post 02-02-14 21:00 #
dobu gabu maru is offline Profile || Blog || PM || Search || Add Buddy IP || Edit/Delete || Quote
SteveD
Senior Member


Posts: 1234
Registered: 04-10


The latest quickie revision incorporating DoTW's suggestions for the lowering computer terminal in E1M6 plus putting an RL out in the open, just in case. In fact, I put it on the platform leading into the pumping room, so players have it right away.

OP will be revised, natch. ;)

http://www.mediafire.com/download/r...0/SGNSYM124.wad

Old Post 02-02-14 21:38 #
SteveD is offline Profile || Blog || PM || Search || Add Buddy IP || Edit/Delete || Quote
scifista42
Senior Member


Posts: 2051
Registered: 05-12


So, I've played continuously up to E1M5 (including secret map), then my ride was stopped because Zandronum crashed due to unclosed lines problem in E1M6. I downloaded newer version of your mapset and the map worked fine. However I didn't properly play through the rest of maps, just briefly played or took a look. I more or less completed only E1M8 .

Now I'm gonna give you a bit of feedback. But I'm sorry in advance, as I won't be properly describing pros and cons and various aspects of each individual maps, like you do yourself when playtesting maps. No, I'll only share my general thoughts about your work, after my one-only leisure (incomplete) playthrough - I think I've seen enough to get an overall vision. I'll let the proper balance and gameplay testing to others, I don't believe I'm the right person for such things anyway, so sorry again.

Well. I will start frankly. I kinda don't know what to think about this mapset in regard to quality. But I dare to say that I can see how you mean the Fava Beans inspiration, even though I actually played only a little of Fava Beans and heard just a little about it. The thing is, each of the maps is like a mashup of the good and the bad. There are neat areas with well polished gameplay and awesome work with lighting, height variation and shape aesthetics. And there is a lot of these areas, enough to convince me about your mapping qualities. But then, a whole lot of areas don't match this quality and look like an average beginning 199X stuff. Like Fava Beans is. Strange angles, shapes and alignment, flatness, overly large and plain areas suddenly changing to cramped areas, inappropriate texturing, badly highlighted mandatory paths, chaotic structure and uneven enemy encounters (occassional enemy spam which only results in tedious shootage). All I can guess is that you've designed these areas, and intentionally refuse to work on them and polish them further. You could, and you knew it, but you didn't. And why? To achieve the Fava Beans resemblance. That's how it feels for me.

Take E1M1. The map impressed me from the beginning. The gameplay there was very satisfying and even felt kinda newschool. Then I stepped into the final teleporter, and appeared in an area which apparently looked different. By the first look - oldschool. I noticed it clearly, in comparison to previous parts of the map. And then I heard the cyberdemon. This was the breaking moment when I told to myself: "Eh? What's this supposed to be?" As I walked towards the end of the map, I got the impression that you wanted to make your maps in this mapset special, and decided to mix oldschool and newschool elements in them to achieve that effect. Later, after playing maps E1M2, M3 and so on, I realized I wasn't probably far from truth. Except that the "oldschool" design and feel kinda predominated.

Since M2, I viewed the mapset from a whole different perspective and my approach to it has changed. At first I kinda enjoyed exploring the environment and looking for secrets. But soon after, I started to strongly notice the oldie-like unprofessionality, whether emulated or not. The aesthetics stopped to please me, and I no longer was fascinated by exploration of this kind of environments. I just wanted to finish the thing quickly. That's another reason why I did a sloppy run to the further maps.

You must understand me right. I do see a certain "charm" in 199X-like maps, but spending hours by exploring a wonky-looking environment... it eventually becomes too much for me. The over-average looking areas weren't frequent enough, and those that were sometimes didn't play well. E1M6. You know which big area I mean. All the aquaducts with nukage looked awesome, but when it came to gameplay, the subpar oldschool was back and impression kind of ruined.

In E1M8 I rushed the end, didn't feel for getting 100% kills at all and used "resurrect" cheating. I'm not a fan of things like the narrow paths above nukage and excessive caco spams, that again degrades the experience for me. Even though I liked the look of the penultimate area when I was approaching it. I mean the area with a walkway, pillars with sergeants on sides and a switch in a distance which you're gonna press.

OK, that's about it. I'm curious whether you can confirm or disprove my opinion that you've just gave up on polishing certain areas in order to achieve the oldschool feel. Finally, I have to say that I enjoyed a lot of particular fights throughout the mapset. For example E1M9 has a very interesting beginning - you descend, but cacodemons raise up to get you close and you need to jump down. Clever! Well, I hope I'll see more of your great height variation and lighting work in the future, honestly I'm disappointed there wasn't more of it (in such a great execution) in this mapset.

So, again, now please don't get me wrong. I don't want to either criticise or praise you, I don't even know how you'll feel after reading this review. I'm just writing in all sincerity, as I believe it's the best thing I can offer you.

Summary: This kind of (partial) oldschool isn't my thing, but I found a whole lot of the good in this mapset, so good job and good luck for your future maps!

Old Post 02-02-14 22:28 #
scifista42 is offline Profile || Blog || PM || Email || Search || Add Buddy IP || Edit/Delete || Quote
Demon of the Well
Forum Regular


Posts: 917
Registered: 02-13


Another gamebreaking bug here. This is still on SGNSYM122.wad, but I mention it anyway in case it has migrated into the latest version.

This one was a ballbuster for me. Late in my E1M7 FDA, I found the computer area map secret almost by accident.....and then got sealed into it. There is no way out of it once the door closes behind you. I was kicking ass and taking names, too.....

Alas, there are many sordid ways to meet one's doom, some less dramatic than others.

Going to give E1M8 a try now, then I'll post the FDA pack.

Edit: While I'm at it, I suspect that the toxic pit near the soulsphere secret accessed at the end of the long dark tunnel network has no way out of it if the player should decide to jump in, something s/he might rationally do given the 'Computer Station' homage-secrets that appear a little earlier on.

Edit 2: And again, something goes horribly awry in -cl 2 (still on SGNSYM122.wad), rendering E1M8 uncompletable (as far as I could tell). Just what happens in my FDA is difficult to describe in any kind of concise fashion, so I'll just let the demo speak for itself on this one, once I post them.

Edit 3: And here they are. E1M1 through E1M4 (including E1M9) were recorded with SGNSYM107.wad, and the rest were recorded with SGNSYM122.wad. E1M2 is not technically a true FDA, and uses -complevel 9 instead of 2 to get past the bugged door early in the map in that old version (everything after the door is true FDA, incidentally); E1M7 and E1M8 are both "DNFs" on account of the maps breaking (both end in suicide). As a random bonus, the zip file also has an FDA for your map from DooMWorld Megaproject 2013 (which version it was I'm not sure, sorry, but I suspect it was the first release) which I played/recorded quite a while ago and then just simply forgot to upload/post.

Last edited by Demon of the Well on 02-03-14 at 05:58

Old Post 02-03-14 04:49 #
Demon of the Well is offline Profile || Blog || PM || Email || Search || Add Buddy IP || Edit/Delete || Quote
SteveD
Senior Member


Posts: 1234
Registered: 04-10



Veinen said:
You'll be happy to see that I manage to survive a whopping one minute before my first death and the deaths just keep coming after that.


Hey, Veinen, it took awhile for me to respond because I spent most of the day watching your FDAs, along with the Super Bowl, which turned out great for me. Go, Hawks!!! ;D

Yes, it gladdened my heart to watch you get wasted in M1. I think that was the first map I ever designed as a rebellion against the "rule" that first maps are supposed to be easy. It's also the only map I ever drew on paper ahead of time, because I wanted to make sure I got the crossfires right.

The two most fun FDAs for me were E1M9 and E1M6part2. How could I not love the frantic pace of the M9 FDA? That's a total jagoff map, but I hope it's Fun Jagoff for most players. As for E1M6, I was overjoyed when you triggered the biggest Caco/Lost Soul swarm by going the "wrong way" in the pump room. I accidentally did that once and got roasted, so please accept a Total Badass Award from me for your performance. I've played these maps so damned many times I almost wanna puke at sight of them, but your FDA of M6 made it new to me again. I expected this map to be polarizing because of its potential slogginess, but the way you played it, it was a thrill a minute.

Some things that I hoped might be big moments became routine in your hands because your skill is so much higher than mine, such as the secret Cyb reveal in M7. Players with less skill, such as me, will not be able to fade Cybs as quickly or efficiently as you did. I typically use twice as much cell charge -- at least -- but even so, I thought the way the secret was staged required Cybs for the proper drama, and I didn't want to spam them, so I settled with 2.

I was a little forlorn over how you cheesed the final M7 battle. I hadn't considered that I created a Big Trap Fight that could be so easily defused by a classic speedrunner move. Personally, I always fight it from the ground. It's way more fun that way, and not very dangerous, really, all you need to do is ring-around-the-rosie and concentrate on taking out, first, the Sergeants on the ground, the Lost Souls, and the Sergeants above. The heavies can be completely ignored until this is accomplished. I can only hope that most players will find themselves in deep trouble, even though the staging tips off that Something Wicked This Way Comes. I just hope they say, "How bad can it be?", and then be totally shocked. ;)

It's too bad you weren't able to complete M5, since the big final battle is on the other side of the malfunctioning door. For a long time, I felt this was the best map I had ever made because it was a big homage to the sneaky double-sided switch in E1M7 of Fava, which was really lifted from IWAD E2M1. In Fava, one side of the switch opened a path to the rocket launcher in nukage, but you'd never know unless you backtracked. In mine, one side unleashes Pinkies and Spectres, but the back side opens the path to a chain of secrets culminating in the Computer Area Map. You have to backtrack to another Fava E1M7 homage -- the whole rocket launcher area, where the launcher is revealed in a descending pillar -- is basically a recreation of a similar area in the Fava map. So the Fava influence runs deep. ;)

Thanks again for your killer FDAs, Veinen. They turned up a couple more issues I'd like to address. Not biggies, but still worth a fix. Here's hoping I can have you on board for Realm of Intensified Chaos, too, which is even more violent. ;)

Old Post 02-03-14 06:32 #
SteveD is offline Profile || Blog || PM || Search || Add Buddy IP || Edit/Delete || Quote
SteveD
Senior Member


Posts: 1234
Registered: 04-10



dobu gabu maru said:


MAP01: Promising start here! I must say Iím glad your rooms look and feel more fleshed out/modern, although comparing it to your 90s outings feels a little unfair.



Thanks for dropping in, Dobu! You'd be surprised how completely fair it is to compare these maps to my '90s maps, because, in common with Abcess and Realm of Intensified Chaos, Shotgun Symphony is part of "The Hellmaker Chronicles," a pompous title for all the mapsets based on my 90s output that were either never released, or which I want to revise to make better. This particular map was probably started in '97 or '98 and has hardly changed at all since I thought it was pretty successful. I wouldn't have admitted this except for scifista42, but I will say that E1M7, 8 and 9 are completely new maps, while E1M4, 5 and 6 have substantial new sections. A full accounting will be given later today. I didn't want to mention it earlier, because I think it might have prejudiced some people against the maps.


dobu gabu maru said:
I like the structures and use of hitscanners hereóspecifically I enjoyed the layout of the blue computer room, where you stick barrels in the middle, pushing the player out to the side where hungry imps await to blast them through wide windows. The pitch black trap did catch me off guard and end me, but Iíve also been running a bit gung-ho through the complex resulting in <30% health for most of the map.


You know, I have always played the barrels by first firing a shotgun blast to my left to wake up the monsters, then shooting the barrels to take some of them out as they attack, but after watching the Veinen and DoTW FDAs, who used a stretegy similar to yours, I see that it might actually kill more monsters than my approach. ;)

Old Post 02-03-14 16:15 #
SteveD is offline Profile || Blog || PM || Search || Add Buddy IP || Edit/Delete || Quote
All times are GMT. The time now is 02:48. Post New Thread    Post A Reply
Pages (3): [1] 2 3 »  
Doomworld Forums : Powered by vBulletin version 2.2.5 Doomworld Forums > Classic Doom > WADs & Mods > Shotgun Symphony -- E1 -- Public Beta

Show Printable Version | Email this Page | Subscribe to this Thread

 

Forum Rules:
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts
HTML code is OFF
vB code is ON
Smilies are OFF
[IMG] code is ON
 

< Contact Us - Doomworld >

Powered by: vBulletin Version 2.2.5
Copyright ©2000, 2001, Jelsoft Enterprises Limited.