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Scientist
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Hellbent said:
[...] You gotta do naughty on the demon with your most fallic weapon. :D


Hellbent said:
Hellbent slobbers

I'm guessing you're typing with one hand...
:o

BTW hi Kim Kitten, I'm Scientist. Welcome to the forums.

Old Post 07-12-02 00:02 #
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BlackFish
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Thanks for the gesture RG, but that link doesn't work for me either, sorry. :(

Dont worry. Go here and download eternity engine for windows.
use that instead of doom95 engine. :)

Old Post 07-12-02 00:07 #
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BlackFish
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Well, if I can't find those in a shop, I can always see if there's a download at Kazaa, my friend downloads all kinds of stuff from there. :)

dont blabber about downloading games that are still being sold. it's called warez. doomworld will ban you if you talk about those things. dont leave a link.

Old Post 07-12-02 00:10 #
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Liam
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Kim Kitten said:

Yep, I was able to download it this time, thanks. :) Um, what does this program do again though? Is the the source code thing? And does that mean I can/could make my own levels and stuff?



ZDoom is a port of the Doom source code (read: someone took the original Doom code and spruced it up to make things go faster, work better, and look nicer). Basically, it's like a replacement .exe for Doom, if you're using it you'll be able to play Doom in hi-res, you'll be able to jump, mouselook, etc.

You don't need ZDoom or any sourceport to do that (although they do allow some nifty editing features that wouldn't be there otherwise, that's another issue entirely). If you're interested in making your own maps for Doom, you'll need a map editor and practice. Personally I recommend using WadAuthor to make maps, it's very easy to learn and comes with a built-in tutorial. There's a download link here but remember, while not as challenging as say, Quake or Unreal editing, making your own Doom levels takes time and dedication (you may just find yourself coming back here to ask quite a few more questions if you decide to undertake Doom mapping).



Well, if I can't find those in a shop, I can always see if there's a download at Kazaa, my friend downloads all kinds of stuff from there. :)



WORD. ILL. DOWN WITH THE RIAA.


Railgunner said:
dont blabber about downloading games that are still being sold. it's called warez. doomworld will ban you if you talk about those things. dont leave a link.


Eh, No they won't. They'll ban her if she posts a link to a warez or asks for warez, but mentioning warez is A-OK last time I checked. It's like the difference between saying 'goatse.cx' and posting 'http://goatse.cx'.

Last edited by Liam on 07-12-02 at 00:34

Old Post 07-12-02 00:14 #
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Hellbent
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Hellbent said:
[...] You gotta do naughty on the demon with your most fallic weapon. :D




Hellbent slobbers



I'm guessing you're typing with one hand...
:o


Scientist: This is the kind of thing Journalists get in trouble for. :P

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What if software archaeologists unearthed levels from the original DooM 1 that had somehow been lost and never made it into the original release of DooM? Project Doom the way id did explores what those levels might look like.

Old Post 07-12-02 00:32 #
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Kim Kitten
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Ultimate DooMer & Liam the Bard: ZDoom is a port of the Doom source code (read: someone took the original Doom code and spruced it up to make things go faster, work better, and look nicer). Basically, it's like a replacement .exe for Doom, if you're using it you'll be able to play Doom in hi-res, you'll be able to jump, mouselook, etc.

I thought you might like to know that I downloaded it and finally figured out how to get it to work. I changed the monitor setting thing to 1024x768, which kinda surprised me with how much it improved the graphics, I've yet to experiment with the rest of the settings though... A little reluctant actually - Will changing anything screw up the WAD files?


BTW hi Kim Kitten, I'm Scientist. Welcome to the forums.

Hi Scientist, :) Thanks for the welcome. ;)


dont blabber about downloading games that are still being sold. it's called warez. doomworld will ban you if you talk about those things. dont leave a link.

Sorry, I didn't realise that kind of thing was frowned upon; from the way my friend takes about it I just just assumed everyone downloaded things from places like that. Good job I didn't link to it actually, huh? :)


If you're interested in making your own maps for Doom, you'll need a map editor and practice. Personally I recommend using WadAuthor to make maps, it's very easy to learn and comes with a built-in tutorial. There's a download link here but remember, while not as challenging as say, Quake or Unreal editing, making your own Doom levels takes time and dedication (you may just find yourself coming back here to ask quite a few more questions if you decide to undertake Doom mapping).

Oh, I'm SO interested in creating my own Doom levels, I have been for a long time, I've even got 'maps' drawn out on A4 paper, lol. I'll check out that program you mention too. :)

Also, I'd just like to say thanks to everyone who's tried to help me out, it makes a nice change. :) Haha, if any you need help with the Tomb Raider games, I'm your girl. ;)

PS. Sorry my posts are kinda long! :)

Old Post 07-12-02 00:45 #
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The Ultimate DooMer
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The other options are mostly gameplay (eg. no monsters, fast monsters) and display (which can change the look of the game, but you can always put them back to what they were. If you're wondering why the sky is stretched, you can set 'stretch short skies' to off, then the sky will appear normal, unless you look up).

If you're going to make your own levels, do remember that it takes time, effort and patience. (I found that out myself) WadAuthor is the best editor to use, as it's windows based, easy to use (I'm no programmer but I got used to it fairly quickly) and has nice features like auto-stair building, it's own error checker etc.

Old Post 07-12-02 01:14 #
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JoelMurdoch
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Kim,

Don't worry - you won't get any BS from me. I'm far too old for you :-) Just posting to clarify a few things on ports and add a bit more insight.

The Doom source code was released a few years ago (Decemember 1997 if memory serves). As the guys have said, a bunch of people have hacked it around since then and created some nice source ports. Doom 95 and the original DOS exe can't really cut it these days (let the flamming begin). Even if the levels use no advanced editing features offered by the source ports, they're generally too big and complex for the old exes to handle reliably. Doom port coder Lee Killough once told me the original Doom was so full of bugs "it's a wonder it worked at all".

ZDoom is pretty good. It's got a lot of sophisticated editing features and is required by some of the WADs you'll find lying around the Net. Eternity is probably the best allrounder for running the older levels "pure" plus it has a lot of promising editing features too. It's decendant of an older port called MBF, which is renowned for it's stability. If you've got a 3d accelerator then JDoom is worth trying too. All three are Windows based. Messing around with setups like the screen res won't affect the WADs. These three ports will generally play standard Doom levels pretty well, but it goes without saying that Doom originally lacked jumping, so turning it on and using it in a level not designed for it could affect the game flow. Anything else is just window dressing you can turn on and off as it pleases you.

http://zdoom.notgod.com/
http://www.doomworld.com/eternity/
http://www.doomsdayhq.com/ - for JDoom

Joel.

Last edited by JoelMurdoch on 07-12-02 at 03:21

Old Post 07-12-02 02:10 #
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Hellbent
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Oh, I'm SO interested in creating my own Doom levels, I have been for a long time, I've even got 'maps' drawn out on A4 paper, lol. I'll check out that program you mention too. :)


* Hellbent drools some more *

Do you have a scanner? I'd love to see what you've done on paper!

DeepSea is the editor you want, not WadAuthor. :P It might be a little retarded, but given the options, it is the obvious choice. http://www.sbsoftware.com

__________________
What if software archaeologists unearthed levels from the original DooM 1 that had somehow been lost and never made it into the original release of DooM? Project Doom the way id did explores what those levels might look like.

Last edited by Hellbent on 07-12-02 at 05:34

Old Post 07-12-02 05:27 #
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JoelMurdoch
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Hellbent said:

* Hellbent drools some more *



/me throws Hellbent into a cold shower



Mods actually answer me



Ten points and a gold star to whoever came up with this :-)

Last edited by JoelMurdoch on 07-12-02 at 10:13

Old Post 07-12-02 10:08 #
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Naked Snake
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Ok guys, back off the new chick, you all don't have a chance (well, maybe you brits, but then again, she = 14 you guys are like...old...like 20 and shit). Anyway...Legacy EDGE Boom PrBoom Vavoom Jdoom ZDooMGL ZDooM and Eternity are all good ports to download.

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Old Post 07-12-02 12:51 #
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Kim Kitten
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JoelMurdoch - "Mods actually answer me" - Ten points and a gold star to whoever came up with this :-)

Thanks for all the info up there Joel. :) I didn't make that signature up though, it must have been an Admin or Mod.


Hellbent - Do you have a scanner? I'd love to see what you've done on paper! DeepSea is the editor you want, not WadAuthor. :P It might be a little retarded, but given the options, it is the obvious choice.

Unfortunately I don't have a scanner, no. I could always try and do a basic floorplan on Paint, or something like that, but I don't know how accurate I can get it with that. I'll check out that editor you mentioned too, thanks. :)

Old Post 07-12-02 12:56 #
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Kim Kitten
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bigbadgangsta said:
Ok guys, back off the new chick, you all don't have a chance (well, maybe you brits, but then again, she = 14 you guys are like...old...like 20 and shit). Anyway...Legacy EDGE Boom PrBoom Vavoom Jdoom ZDooMGL ZDooM and Eternity are all good ports to download.

LMAO! Haha, maybe I like them that old!? lol Seriously though, I don't mind the attention, it actually makes a nice change. ;) Do I really need all of those port things? Or am I ok with ZDoom, I'm kind of getting burned out on suggestions here, lol. :)

Old Post 07-12-02 13:00 #
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Naked Snake
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Kim Kitten said:

LMAO! Haha, maybe I like them that old!? lol Seriously though, I don't mind the attention, it actually makes a nice change. ;) Do I really need all of those port things? Or am I ok with ZDoom, I'm kind of getting burned out on suggestions here, lol. :)



Haha, you don't need them if you don't want them. Lemme tell you about one brit you should watch out for. Fodders, he is like 51 but still an ol' horn dog....wait...I'm 15...and I'm a horn dog too. Anyway, all of those ports are the most popular. My favs are EDGE, ZDooM and Eternity. BTW, get your webcam section up :)

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Old Post 07-12-02 13:03 #
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sirjuddington
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Do I really need all of those port things? Or am I ok with ZDoom, I'm kind of getting burned out on suggestions here, lol. :)

I'd say stick with ZDoom, and if you have any problems, you can visit the ZDoom forum.

As for the editor, I'd recommend WadAuthor if your just starting, although I use ZETH, since I'm used to the old DOS editors ;)

(heh, I don't know the link for WadAuthor or the ZDoom stuff for it :P)

Old Post 07-12-02 13:10 #
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Hellbent
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Don't listen to them, they're trying to trick you. Maybe WadAuthor is easier to learn, but it's not nearly as powerful or as good. And you're not gonna feel like switch from WadAuthor to DeepSea once you're comfortable with WadAuthor.

All I have on my computer that's DOOM oriented is DeepSea, the doom and doom2 IWADs and Zdoom. So if you wanna keep all this shiznet simple, just get those. :P

Oh, and if you are going to be DMing in ZDOOM (seems Zdaemon is the most popular) make sure you have a copy of Zdoom 1.22 as that's what people use for DMing in it.

__________________
What if software archaeologists unearthed levels from the original DooM 1 that had somehow been lost and never made it into the original release of DooM? Project Doom the way id did explores what those levels might look like.

Old Post 07-12-02 14:29 #
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sirjuddington
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Deepsea is all good, but with one drawback. You have to PAY for it...

Old Post 07-12-02 14:40 #
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Kim Kitten
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I'm immensely proud of myself, I just figured out how to get the WADs I downloaded to run in ZDoom, hehe. :) And believe me, it's a miracle I figured it out, lol.


bigbadgangsta - Haha, you don't need them if you don't want them. Lemme tell you about one brit you should watch out for. Fodders, he is like 51 but still an ol' horn dog....wait...I'm 15...and I'm a horn dog too. Anyway, all of those ports are the most popular. My favs are EDGE, ZDooM and Eternity. BTW, get your webcam section up :)

Lol, I get enough letchy old men at school, they're called teachers. ;) I'll know to keep up my guard around that one then. :) Anyway, what exactly is the difference between these ports, don't they all just do the same thing, but under a different program title? I'll have my cam up reasonably soon, I hope. :)


Hellbent - Don't listen to them, they're trying to trick you. Maybe WadAuthor is easier to learn, but it's not nearly as powerful or as good. And you're not gonna feel like switch from WadAuthor to DeepSea once you're comfortable with WadAuthor. Oh, and if you are going to be DMing in ZDOOM (seems Zdaemon is the most popular) make sure you have a copy of Zdoom 1.22 as that's what people use for DMing in it.

I've downloaded both WadAuthor and DeepSea, and to my computer illiterate mind, they both look way complicated, I can't even figure out how to make my own maps yet, although I can look at ones already made for the games. Are they free programs, or am I going to have to buy them at some point, or beg my dad to anyway?

I forgot which version of ZDoom I downloaded, but it the one that was linked to earlier in this thread. Is ZDoom Zdaemon? Or are they different things?

Oh, and one more thing, on the PlayStation I could link the Doom games up with a second player to play Co-operative and Deathmatch scenerios, how do I do that with a PC? Can you play online like with Quake?

Questions, questions, questions... lol ;)

Old Post 07-12-02 14:50 #
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Hellbent
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Doom Connector is a good place to play ZDOOM online. BTW, the version you want for DM, 1.22, is gotten at this site: http://zdoom.notgod.com

Somebody else will undoubtedly reply with detailed explanations on the Multiplayer bit. You could check out the Multiplayer Forum. You'll see there is a thread at the top of the forum dedicated to helping people who want to start DMing. :)

From what I understand WadAuthor is free. DeepSea is free as long as you don't want to make huge levels. Some of its features are also limited in the shareware version. But I think the shareware version is still better than WadAuthor except for the fact you can't make big levels with it. By the time you are good enough at making levels in DeepSea to be making levels larger than it will allow you to, you will probably know whether or not you want to keep the program. About 5 years ago I bought it and have upgraded once since. I think I'm gonna upgrade again soon. =)

Right now I'm using the shareware version and the only thing that I'm having problemes with is it not being able to make large levels. I haven't noticed any real limitations with its features.

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What if software archaeologists unearthed levels from the original DooM 1 that had somehow been lost and never made it into the original release of DooM? Project Doom the way id did explores what those levels might look like.

Old Post 07-12-02 15:30 #
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Naked Snake
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Legacy can do split-screen multiplayer.

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Old Post 07-12-02 15:49 #
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JoelMurdoch
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Kim Kitten said:
exactly is the difference between these ports, don't they all just do the same thing, but under a different program title?


No, they're all different. Always check the text files of WADs you download to see if they need a particular port. You've given me a good idea for a new article on my site that explains all the key differences and similarities. I'll post a link later on.



Are they free programs, or am I going to have to buy them at some point, or beg my dad to anyway?



DeepSea costs money, WAD Author is free I think.



I forgot which version of ZDoom I downloaded, but it the one that was linked to earlier in this thread. Is ZDoom Zdaemon? Or are they different things?



ZDaemon is an offshoot of ZDoom designed specfically for playing over the net.

Old Post 07-12-02 16:28 #
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ReX
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Kim Kitten said:
Are [WadAuthor and DeepSea] free programs, or am I going to have to buy them at some point.....

Is ZDoom Zdaemon? Or are they different things?

Do I really need all of those port things? Or am I ok with ZDoom, I'm kind of getting burned out on suggestions here...

WadAuthor and DeepSea are shareware. In other words, you try before you buy. They use different approaches to shareware -- with WadAuthor, you get a 14-day trial period, after which you are supposed to be unable to use the program. With DeepSea you get no time limit on all aspects of the program except map-making (i.e., graphics, sound, etc. can be managed for free indefinitely). The shareware version allows you to build simple and small maps for free indefinitely. If you want to build more complex maps you'll have to buy the program.

Another very good Windows-based editing and wad managing program is XWE. It's completely free, but it lacks documentation and is really meant for a seasoned wad author. Of these three programs, DeepSea has the best user support, as the program's creator (Jack Vermeulen) continues to enhance and improve it. Also, he often visits these forums and answers questions. Csabo, the creator of XWE, also visits here and answers questions.

ZDooM is not ZDaemon. ZDooM is a source port (i.e., a program that is a modification of the original DooM/DooM2 executable files). ZDaemon is a client/server port that allows multi-player gaming. Here's a quote from their page "ZDaemon: a multiplayer DOOM port that will allow you to play multiplayer over the internet via client/server with in-game joining."

Source ports are obviously not essential for you to enjoy playing DooM. However, they are intended to improve various aspects of the game, and different ports offer different features. The most popular ports with on-going development appear to be ZDooM, Legacy, and JDooM. There are other ports (e.g., EDGE, MBF, BooM, etc.) for which many levels have been created, but I don't believe those ports are under on-going development. As a result, fewer levels are being developed for them.

A few of ZDooM's most widely used features are scripting (i.e., a single action can trigger multiple and sequenced reactions), slopes, deep/swimmable water, 3D bridges, "security"-type cameras, etc.

Legacy and JDooM both offer graphics comparable to games being developed today (i.e., OpenGL standard). Legacy allows room-over-room structures, which is a very important element in creating realism and challenging gameplay.

It's difficult to say, but I think that the most levels have probably been developed for ZDooM, then Legacy, then JDooM. As you already have ZDooM, your best bet is to play ZDooM levels first. As you get more experienced you can begin playing Legacy and JDooM levels, as well as levels for other source ports (I recommend EDGE, which also has room-over-room).

Enjoy.

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Old Post 07-12-02 16:47 #
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Kim Kitten
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Thanks for all the inforama guys :) But guess what, I've run into an interesting problem, lol.

Ok, I downloaded the ZDoom 122, I think it was that was mentioned a post or two ago, and while all but, I think three, WADs work fine on it, the original Doom WAD is refusing to work properly, for some reason when I try to use it, it loads in the Doom 2 game, but with distorted graphics. What's even weirder is that the Doom WAD will work fine when I run it through the original Doom 95 exe it came with.

I've also downloaded all the internet stuff mentioned in the 'Multiplayer' forum, and as far as I know it works ok, except ZDaemon crashed for some reason... BUT, how do I join one of the games? Do I need to be invited, or, as I'm guessing, check one of the boxes by a game (providing I have that WAD) then select 'Start Game'?

Old Post 07-12-02 17:54 #
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Liam
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Kim Kitten said:
Ok, I downloaded the ZDoom 122, I think it was that was mentioned a post or two ago, and while all but, I think three, WADs work fine on it, the original Doom WAD is refusing to work properly, for some reason when I try to use it, it loads in the Doom 2 game, but with distorted graphics. What's even weirder is that the Doom WAD will work fine when I run it through the original Doom 95 exe it came with.


Do you have doom2.wad and doom.wad in the same folder...?

Since you're using ZDoom 1.22 and not one of the 1.23 betas, I expect that ZDoom will load doom2.wad by default... if you want to play Doom 1, TNT, or Plutonia, open the Run prompt (windows start menu > run) and type...

c:\*location of zdoom*\zdoom.exe -iwad x.wad

Where x.wad is doom.wad, doom2.wad, tnt.wad, or plutonia.wad.

The -iwad parameter works with every port and allows you to select which game iwad you want to play with. If you try to load one of the main game wads with the -file command you'll probably run into a problem or two.


I've also downloaded all the internet stuff mentioned in the 'Multiplayer' forum, and as far as I know it works ok, except ZDaemon crashed for some reason... BUT, how do I join one of the games? Do I need to be invited, or, as I'm guessing, check one of the boxes by a game (providing I have that WAD) then select 'Start Game'?


Hoo boy... in the future you may be better off asking multiplayer questions in the multiplayer forum, heh, but I can answer you here because I'm a jackass*coughwheeze*, er, because I'm nice that way.

Well heh, ZDaemon is buggy coding garbage unfortunately... there may be some servers you just can't join, or you may have to rejoin a few times before you can get in without ZDaemon crashing. I guess you're using the Internet Doom Explorer frontend? Er, no, the checkboxes are for selecting multiple servers to refresh... to join a game, just double-click it. No invitation needed. If you don't have the wad the server's running, just highlight the server and press W... if the server admin provided a valid link to the wad in the serverinfo, it should download it for you (or link you to a page you can download it from).

Old Post 07-12-02 18:05 #
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Kim Kitten: you need the latest version of Zdoom (1.23 beta 33), you can download it using the link I put up earlier. Some of todays wads need it to run them.

Old Post 07-12-02 18:25 #
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Kim Kitten
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I've just tried running the Doom wad the way you suggested Joel, but keep on getting this error message - http://uk.geocities.com/kim_kitten14/error.htm but that's definitely where ZDoom and the wad file are.

Anyway, I'm about to try and get the internet thing to work for me, lol ;)

Old Post 07-12-02 18:31 #
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Kim Kitten
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Ultimate DooMer said:
Kim Kitten: you need the latest version of Zdoom (1.23 beta 33), you can download it using the link I put up earlier. Some of todays wads need it to run them.


Thanks UD, that's got the original Doom working again, I'll check the rest later :)

Old Post 07-12-02 18:38 #
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Liam
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Kim Kitten said:
I've just tried running the Doom wad the way you suggested Joel


::cries::

I'm Liam.


, but keep on getting this error message - http://uk.geocities.com/kim_kitten14/error.htm but that's definitely where ZDoom and the wad file are.


O_o

Heh, nice pathname there. IF you're using win98 then your Hard Drive is in FAT32 format and those spaces won't do. Try renaming 'Doom 1, 2, TNT, Final and Ultimate', to something short with no spaces, then give it another shot.

Old Post 07-12-02 18:41 #
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Kim Kitten
Mods actually answer me


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You guys are gonna be getting pissed off with me soon, lol.

Ok, I just tried to join an online game, but my game screen ended up looking like this - http://uk.geocities.com/kim_kitten14/error2.htm - any ideas?

Old Post 07-12-02 18:52 #
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Kim Kitten
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Posts: 32
Registered: 07-02


Sorry I got you confused with Joel, Liam, it's just a little confusing with so many people trying to help. :)

My system uses Windows Me, but I'll give that a go. :)

Old Post 07-12-02 18:55 #
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