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lilith.pk3

   (32 reviews)

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About This File

i like to keep my doom 2 installation floppies attached to my computer with magnets so i don't lose them

some can experience seizures when exposed to flashing lights or other visual stimuli. even if you've never been diagnosed, please be stop playing this wad if you encounter disorientation, lightheadedness, altered vision, involuntary twitching/jerking movements, or momentary loss of awareness/consciousness. i tried very hard to avoid anything that would cause physical discomfort but everyone is different

this wad does not work with qz/gz/zandronum as it relies on the old zdoom software renderer and other quirks specific to zdoom (or zdoomLE). you need 2.8.1 or newer


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Herefornow

  

We need a full remake of doom 1, but in a doom 3 style.

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nelguy

·

  

hmm I think you're correct

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Xyzzy01

  

Cartridge-tilted Doom best Doom.

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antares031

  

This is something I would imagine with Doom, if someone dumps my PC into a giant Caco-Cola tank, marinates it for a whole day, and seasons the PC with monosodium glutamate. This is a good stuff.

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Edward850

  

An interesting concept that works well if you read the readme file. Not naming any names *cough* @NuMetalManiak *cough*.

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NuMetalManiak

· Edited by NuMetalManiak

  

so I cheated with this one due to not figuring out exactly how to start it laziness by playing each wad individually with the resource pack...

 

this is definitely abstract art in a way that would seem as if Pablo Picasso was a Doom modder. distortion is key for what it offers, every single thing from the menu screen to the level design to the sprite replacements to the apparent game crashes on MAP03, everything is made in an elitist fashion, preventing the use of more common source ports and limiting it to a specific ZDoom software rendering port.

 

while the glitches are the main name of the game and the artistry is there, the gameplay is not, which prevents this from being a truly good Doom mod as a whole. sure, there's bound to be some good combat every now and then, but only in a few areas, MAP07 and MAP08 having the best gameplay overall. but the rest is kinda lame gameplay-wise. it has just enough levels to show the glitch gallery, but from a gameplay standpoint many often are over quick (at least in my gameplay style, I'll run through areas as fast as possible). the scripting only makes things weirder.

 

gameplay matters more than artistry in my opinion. great wads have both. this mostly has artistry and elitism.

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Marcaek

  

One of the few truly bold and adventurous concepts for a levelset, breaks the rules and does it well.

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Li'l devil

  

True art is incomprehensible!!!!

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mrthejoshmon

· Edited by mrthejoshmon

  

Lilith as an idea is interesting and appealing as an outside viewer, it mirrors the glitched horror of a creepypasta game (more successfully than most) and is quite the spectacle, so eerie is it with the distorted world and the odd game behaviour, it's something worth watching a play through of at least.

 

However, actually playing it is different, playing Lilith is easily summed up in one word: insufferable. Lilith plays awful, it's an interesting piece but good lord is it deeply unenjoyable. You know when you see someone struggling to deal a glitchy mess just to show off how fucky it gets? You can live that life with Lilith, not that you'd want to (unless you are masochistic, or pretentious), not only that but it drags on for much much longer than it should.

 

Great art piece, bad mod.

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Grain of Salt

  

Sorry lilith haters, the war over avant-garde art was fought several decades before you were born, and your side lost. Womp womp.

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Doomkid

·

  

I like glitchy stuff. I used to mess with Game Genie codes on NES to achieve visual/gameplay distortion. It’s nice to have something like that for Doom.

 

In my opinion, something has to be a little ugly to be truly beautiful.

 

On top of everything else, it causes controversy despite having no inherently controversial substance to it. Seeing people have such visceral reactions - hate, love, and everything in between - that’s just awesome. I’d be stoked if something I made received such a wide array of reactions.

 

The content itself is enjoyable and the fervor surrounding it is interesting. 4 stars from me, a good score that is well earned.

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Volerm

· Edited by Volerm

  

It's like the Doom equivelant of vaporwave, but instead of sounding somewhat pleasing it's just a fucking eyesore and I have to take xanax afterwards.

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Asking4Id

  

Even worse than monochrome wads (some design choices are wrong).

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ReaperAA

· Edited by ReaperAA

  

Interesting for its Avant Garde nature. But is an unplayable mess otherwise.

 

"The Sky May Be" is much much better than this. Shame that The Sky May Be is regarded as one of the worst wads while this is a cacoward winner. It should be the other way around.

 

EDIT: Ok grandma a.k.a "Grain of Salt". I have nothing to do with the "so-called" war, just stating my opinion. Enjoy your "victory".

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DRMman

  

So quirky that it made graf zhal go reeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee.

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dominykas progamer

·

  

all play freedoomI tried in gzdoom

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Noiser

· Edited by Noiser

  

I love when glitch art is used to evoke fear. That sense of insecurity when everything is prone to fall apart and you can't rely on logic or usual conventions to stay alive. This is awesome!

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Koutana

  

This wad hurts in the best way possible.

I've always loved glitchy stuff. That sense where something mangled beyond recognition is faintly - and terrifyingly - familiar. Things you recognize being ruined, merged with the technological moshpit of garbage data.

Lilith hits that spot perfectly. This wad is a horror wad - a proper horror wad. No scares, just an unknown familiarity and an amazing sense of unease that I haven't felt in years.

This wad feels as if it was born out of something unnatural. While playing, any notion or thought that this was made by a human goes straight out the window. There's a sense of true randomness accompanied by an eerie sense of order and control.

 

This wad also brings up an opinion that I've had for a while: more experimental wads. In my entire life, I have never seen something as experimental and unique as this, even beating out The Sky May Be as one of the oddest, most interesting things I've played. Most wads nowadays are the same browns, reds, and blues in boring patterns that bring nothing new to the table. This brings something new to the table and irradiates the area surrounding it.

 

The wad itself runs well, and creates some incredibly unique effects. Only one problem, however: the GZ/QZ/Zandro lockout. While I do agree that warning people that it won't work in newer engines is necessary, I feel like it might be a bit too harsh as-is. Maybe something like a few thousand warnings and some sort of prompt would have sufficed.

 

Either way, I love this wad, and I would kill to se m';;;re li!::ke it0x00000?0-

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Player Lin

· Edited by Player Lin

  

Copy 'n Paste my post on ZDooM forum.

https://forum.zdoom.org/viewtopic.php?p=1031309#p1031309

 

Quote

While I already said on the Doomworld's cacoward topic about I silly ruined the fun myself and this is not my cup of tea, I decide to give a other chance as in fact I actually like this kind of idea(especifically glitched TAS/gameplay videos), and after played all levels...
(except Map08, I HATE that spinning-glitched-overlaying-walls trap, after have enough about the meh gameplay, I just burn out, sorry)

...well, I didn't changed much about my mind, but I still like the whole idea, and something in this mapset, like wall/floor/sky textures/actor sprites goes apeshit & funny, abuse enging bugs and make levels looks so glitched and broken with some aesthetics, random sounds playing when Doomguy get killed, and his XDEATH state may spawn a revenant and fight other monsters, I love this one!

And the nice designs about glitched visuals and monsters, I would give it 4 or 5 but only on joke/mockwad reasons, but the gameplay just made me want to give up after Map03, even though I still try to complete the mapset, until Map08. I guess it may because the nature of designs for glitched mess, sometimes shit just hardly to see...keep got murdered because the glitched monster just get me as I think it was dead, and get lost on some mazes due to glitched textures and decorations.

Well, I still not say this is bad or even some worse wording but just can't have too much fun with it for me. And glad this mapset got a cacoward, congratulations! But it should be Mockaward!

 

Yes, I give it 3 here even I said I would give 4 or 5 but, no, gameplay part is this mapset just meh so I think 3(or 3.5?) is enough.

 

But I still like such idea, I hope it won't be taken as negative and started flaming drama decreasing interests to make this kind of things. Really, dramas in DooM communities just sucks ass and it will affects everyone, even whose not in it. :P

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Obsidian

·

  

Ah, this little lovely point of contention...

 

I'll freely admit that when Lilith first hit store shelves the forums I didn't really "get" it: the idea seemed neat but at the time the concept wasn't one I could immerse myself into. Recently though I've given it a play through to the end and I'm definitely a bit more positive towards it. What I like is that the concept plays on the preconceived notions people have of Doom: it adheres to the core principles of the game but absolutely screws with everything else in order to generate an atmosphere that I can only describe as....well, uncomfortable.

 

And "uncomfortable" really is the word: there's a profound sense of unease as you play through the maps, which is only increased by the unconventional architecture and occasional DECORATE addition that pops up and then pops right back down again before you can get used to them. It even stretches to the sound effects and music: to be honest the music feels kinda Silent Hill-esque, which I dig a lot.

 

It also helps that the Silent Hill soundtrack literally used dental drills as an instrument, but I digress.

 

If I were to level criticism it'd be at a few things: the gameplay can be a bit of a hodgepodge at times, with some ideas being barely explored (such as the DECORATE additions mentioned earlier) while others can drag on a bit overlong. The architecture, while somewhat fitting for the theme, does feel like the effort of someone not completely comfortable with mapping (which the mapper has admitted is the case, to be fair). I'd be interested in seeing what a steadier hand with the mapping tools could accomplish: after all, you can only really break all the rules once you know them.

 

The last is somewhat subjective: personally I wouldn't have had the glitch aesthetic be present in the entirety of the wad. It'd be present in most of it, sure, but I would've had snatches of sanity in all the chaos to create a sense of juxtaposition and increase the feeling of unease that the experience is built around. The worst way to steal the mystique out of an experience is to make it routine and while Lilith doesn't quite manage that it does border close, at least for me. Then again, this is just my take: it's possible that I wouldn't have been able to dream up an idea of this magnitude in the first place. :P

 

At the end of the glitch-riddled day, Lilith is an imaginative piece of work with ambitions that I think it met. It's weird, sure, but I honestly don't view that as a bad thing.

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Ajora

· Edited by Ajora

  

For some people, this is a technically masterful work of unbridled genius. For others, it's an aggravating test of endurance. I belong in the latter category. 

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Pavera

  

This wad perfectly matches the intensity and surreality of the dreams I used to have about Doom as a kid. A beautiful slice of an artist's personal vision of hell. 5

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Juza

  

Boring, repetitive, even if deliberately ugly... It's just hard to look at it for more than 5, maybe 10 minutes. Gameplay is slow primarily because you don't know where to go as everything is just a mess, and every area looks the same as the previous area.

But it sure is refreshing to see something look so bad after playing so many visually pleasing wads, I was getting bored of them - 10/10 Definitely worth a Cacoward

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EmotionalFelineinaMadstate

  

When a Doom mod causes controversy, mixed feelings, and making a dev of a certain port angry, you'll bet i'll give it a good score.

 

Not saying because it caused controversy, it has a good score.

It was a weird trip to go through, and is a really neat idea, but of course, a star had to be removed, due to my headaches and immeasurable pain this thing gave me.

 

Love and hate you, anotak.

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Jonathan

·

  

The Sky May Be gets called the worst WAD ever, while this is feted with awards... What the hell's wrong with this community!?

 

Kidding.

 

After so many years of refinement and improvement in editors' skills, a lot of Doom maps are so exquisitely crafted that it's almost too much. Like admiring some ornate Gothic church, there's a part of your brain that rebels against the perfection on display, and wants something messier and uglier. Lilith.pk3 is, in its own way, just as intricately made as those other maps, except the craft is directed towards making something more experimental, corrupted and obtuse. Sprites, textures, music and sounds are all heavily modified, and engine bugs leveraged, to create the impression of a game world that is twisted and wrecked beyond repair. That player must navigate through a colourfully discordant environment that both does and does not conform to their expectations of a typical Doom game.

 

The mod's aesthetic is not totally unprecedented, either in Doom modding, wider gaming, or art in general. Glitch art, as the style is known, has enjoyed some success over the past few years, purposefully employing the kind of analogue and digital corruption that occasionally affects regular media for stylistic effect. The same criticism that could be levelled at glitch might also be raised here: that it is style over substance. When you strip away the confrontational aesthetic, is there anything left? E.g. would you play these levels if they were presented in a more conventional manner?

 

I would argue that, on balance, there is. While the gameplay is not quite as daring or original as the presentation it's wrapped up in, there are some cool ideas there. And the aesthetic is used to enhance these ideas, not disguise them. Towards the end, it does become a little needlessly frustrating, as the player must dance around moving and frozen projectiles over a series tiny platforms in a damaging floor. After reloading for the umpteenth time, you may wonder exactly why you're bothering to continue. But overall, lilith.pk3 admirably achieves what it sets out to do, and is well worth your time. Even if it ultimately turns you off, we should be glad that the Doom community still produces work as different and challenging as this.

 

 

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  • File Reviews

    • By Forli · Posted
      I'm just writing this review to let everyone know that you are supposed to run this choosing the original plutonia as the iwad and not doom2, or else (on zdoom at least) the plutonia textures will be shown as black and the midtextures will not be drawn at all, causing confusion since the blocking lines are still there. I made that mistake the fist time I played this wad.
    • By Herefornow · Posted
      We need a full remake of doom 1, but in a doom 3 style.
    • By kfpopeye · Posted
      Expected more from the makers of Plutonia. The use of an all black texture almost everywhere didn't do much for me and the use of player blocking lines just made it confusing when running from a horde. Couldn't pass level 29 without using no clipping because the final steps were too high.
    • By 666shooter · Posted
      [HMP, Continuous w/ pistol-start mindset, regular saves]   I went into Requiem with relatively low expectations. Having not been thrilled by the Memento Mori series and having just come off playing the superb Alien Vendetta, I expected a solid if relatively forgettable megawad with desgin concepts in the old school. In many ways I was pleasently surprised: solid map design through about the first 20 maps, a Quake homage in Map 31 that made me smile, a few obnoxious encounters due to tight spacing and poor distribution of the Sshotgun, okay, but better city levels than the IWAD, so that was nice. Map 15 was frustrating to navigate and Map 18 actually forced me to restart since I saved after the red key, but no real bs otherwise. But then came Map 21: Be warned, it is possible to softlock yourself out of the lift in the X room if you are backtracking; upon restarting I found the switch to lower the panel in front of the red door did not work and remained "active" and non-function despite repeated Uses. I would recommend an updated version of this map because this simply wasn't acceptable. (For reference, I was running this with GZDoom 4.1.3; your mileage may vary.) Nor was Map 24, as commented below. After the grueling and frustrating Map 23, this almost made me want to stop playing the Wad or at least skip this one, which would be a first for me. Not enough ammo, revenants and a few more revenants, the only nice thing I have to say about this debacle is you will learn just how effective (of often inneffective) that stupid chainsaw can be against enemies that can do over 40% damage in one hit. Not. Good. Design. But there is hope, as Map 27 is one of the nicest vanilla Maps I've seen in one of these older Wads (The Labs of MM 1 notwithstanding), and its winding journey almost redeems the package to the finish. The unfortunate and clumsy Icon of Sin encounter at the end of Map 23 aside, I found the final map mercifully short and I appreciate the little bit of lore in the text file giving us a semblence of an "alternative" final boss. Overall, worth checking out for several of the maps here. A compliment to map 20 while I'm here- short, sweet, and nice outdoor environment design w/ vanilla assets not unlike Scythe meets Plutonia. A few bumps with the weapon placement and some points off for 21 and 24, but a solid recommendation going in forewarned.  
    • By spd7693 · Posted
      Oh, Requiem... What to begin with...    Outstanding frst 15 maps and if that design, gameplay and combat was more consistent in the further levels, I would have given 5! But it drops off quite a bit from map 16 onwards and becomes a jumbled mess of maps. Considering the difficulty I faced in Memento Mori 2 I expected Requiem to be even more difficult than that. It was, but only until map 15 and from then on it became a relative cakewalk. Well, not completely though. There are a few tough monsters and still maps are difficult from pistol start. The second time I played it I felt like I liked it more, but rage quit on map 27. Iikka Keränen, please put more ammo!    The lack of ammo frustrated me from map 22 onwards. The wad intends a lot of infighting, which is in a lot of cases impossible, because of big groups of monsters of the same kind and/or often presence of arch-viles. There also aren't many crushers that can help the player kill monsters easier and there are a lot of long-distance enemies. The lackluster of ammo is definitely map 24. It has only 40 shells, a couple of rockets and a small patch of plasma while 60% of the enemies are revenants and there are a few imps and hell knights. It has no single corner where infighting is possible on top of that. Oh, and it comes after map 23 which is an ammo eater due to the presence of an Icon Of Sin fight. It's manageable until map 27, but no further than that. Compare that with how many shells the player was spoilt with in Memento Mori 2. In MM2 the rule is that if you have no shotgun ammo, you're dead.    Fighting was OK. I expected a harder wad, but still the fights were OK. Some were forced, some were tedious. Basically the problem was again, you can't really infight beefier monsters.    Yeah, map 24 Procrustes Chambers is my least favourite. In fact I hate it more than I hate The Chasm! Hey, another time I don't like map 24. Coinsidence? Is it that I hate this number or this number hates me? Speaking of The Chasm, map 19 is also bad. Not to mention the design flaws, but also that twisted cubic staircase platforming in The-Chasm-style? Will there ever be an end to ledge walking as a gameplay gimmick?    Visuals were perfect and very interesting. This is one thing they did well.    Maps ranking:    Hatred - 23  Cursed Kingdom - 27 - next time I play it I may be more careful with the ammo  Last Resort - 15  The Black Gate - 10  The Portal - 14  Den Of The Skull - 21  Town Of The Dead - 13    A lot of levels though had the impossibility to get 100% kills and/or secrets. And Den Of The Skull is unique in that aspect. 100% kills - impossible, 100% items - impossible and guess what - 100% secrets impossible! People, when creating maps, please make everything the player can take accessible. I found out you actually can make 100% kills possible, but you have to use a map editor. And if to fix one map, why not fix all of them? I don't think it's legal.    Bottom line: What could have been. I don't care about the visuals. If this wad was harder than MM2 and had all kills and secrets accessible, I would have given 5. And of course, if it had better ammo balance. I must give three. I gave MM 4 and I gave MM2 5.    PS: Mark Klem, if so many designers left the team, why the heck didn't you create a single map in this wad? Base Exposure is one of the best maps I've ever played and I definitely would have asked for more of the same! 
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