One God or two?

OK, my question is, if Satan is NOT as powerful as God, as basically any Christian would have you believe, then why doesn't God just DESTROY Satan outright and rid the world of all the trouble.

That sounds like a challenge!

Lk 10:18

"I saw Satan fall like lighting from heaven."

This in connexion with the previously quoted Isaiah 14:12
"How art thou fallen from heaven" makes it believable to think Lucifer and Satan are one, since both have fallen from heaven.

There are many names for Satan mentioned in the bible:
the devil, the wicked one, Satan, the serpent, Lucifer, the dragon, king of Tyrus, the prince of the power of the air, the annointed cherub

I think that anyone who has the time to state biblical references in their exact context is a fucking moron. Oh well. Heh...

No, Satan is not considered a God since to be a God you must be (among other things that I won't bother stating) worshipped and there is no formal religion based solely on the worship of Satan. 'Nuff said.

Black

Linguica said:

OK, my question is, if Satan is NOT as powerful as God, as basically any Christian would have you believe, then why doesn't God just DESTROY Satan outright and rid the world of all the trouble.

This is a good question, but one easily answered. You see, when God created mankind, he made us in his image, spiritually. That means that unlike other animals or plants, we have a mind, a spirit, and can think and make choices about our future, etc.

The one thing that mankind, as a whole, values most, is freedom, the freedom to choose our destiny. God knows that if he did not give us the chance to choose between good and evil, that we would resent him, for not granting us that freedom. He gives us the choice, because he knows that we want it that way.
There are many, many souls, that have yet to inhabit a physical body, and so long as they have not yet been born and ben given the opportunity to make the choice between good and evil, then, the struggle will continue. The Bible tells us that when all the world has heard the Word of God and been given the chance to walk the pathways of righteousness, God will end the struggle, by sending his son back to earth, with an army of angels, to vanquish Satan and evil and banish it forever, from the face of the earth. So, yes, God is all-powerful, but he is all-good, as well, and will wait, until we all have at least one opportunity to choose between His way and Satan.

IMJack said:

I really wish people would read the question before replying. Ah well.

I did read it, I replied that way because I thought the argument is a waste of time. And if you're going to have it why not 3 gods? Jesus, his daddy, and satan? Point is I don't really care about it that much since it seems... silly.

Black said:

No, Satan is not considered a God since to be a God you must be (among other things that I won't bother stating) worshipped and there is no formal religion based solely on the worship of Satan. 'Nuff said.

Black also said:

I'm part of the official Satanic religion as I'm sure others are so in either case it seems reasonable to post for whatever reason.

Make up your mind, man. :P

The concept of a Satanic religion was actually invented by paranoid Christians, people who wanted to invent an adversary, scapegoat, and general bad example to hold up as what they were talking their members into working against. The greater part of modern Satanists are in it for the trendiness or shock value, or got suckered into it by some smarmy silver-toungued mortal jerk.

Linguica said:

OK, my question is, if Satan is NOT as powerful as God, as basically any Christian would have you believe, then why doesn't God just DESTROY Satan outright and rid the world of all the trouble.

I once read somewhere (yeah, yeah, it was a story of some kind) that if there is no evil, good cannot exist either.
Destroy all evil, and you'll destroy all good.

No, Satan is not considered a God since to be a God you must be (among other things that I won't bother stating) worshipped and there is no formal religion based solely on the worship of Satan. 'Nuff said.

Satanism may not be a "formal" religion, but does it have to be?
Satanists worship Satan - thus he's their "God".

Linguica said:

OK, my question is, if Satan is NOT as powerful as God, as basically any Christian would have you believe, then why doesn't God just DESTROY Satan outright and rid the world of all the trouble.

Because sin had entered the world, and into the very nature of man through Adams transgression, then for God to destroy Satan, he would also have had to destroy the man he loved. But God had a better way. A way of Redemption.

the kid who called me a fucking moron said:

I think that anyone who has the time to state biblical references in their exact context is a fucking moron.

"Judge not, that ye be not judged. For with what jugdement ye judge,ye shall be judged; and with what measure ye mete, it shall be measured to you again.
And why beholdest thou the mote that is in thy brothers eye, but considereth not the beam that is in thine own eye?
Thou hypocrite, first cast out the beam of thine own eye; and then thou shalt see clearly to cast out the mote of thy brothers eye."
-Matthew 7:1

"Speak not evil of another, bretheren. He that speaketh evil of his brother, and judgeth his brother, speaketh evil of the law, and jugdeth the law, but if thou judge the law, thou art not a doer of the law, but a judge.
There is one lawgiver, who is able to save and destroy; who are thou that jugdeth another?"
-James 4:11

I think that anyone who has the time to state biblical references in their exact context is a fucking moron.

Hmm why? If he likes participating in a discussion about elements within Christianity, then it's a good thing to quote these references since it's relevant.

IMJack said:

Make up your mind, man. :P

The concept of a Satanic religion was actually invented by paranoid Christians,...

That cannot be correct, as Satan is not a product of the New Testament, but the OLD Testament, pre Christianity in fact.

Black stuttered stupidly:
I think that anyone who has the time to state biblical references in their exact context is a fucking moron. Oh well. Heh...

What the fuck? I didn't take a symmester of Bible as Lit with a bunch of Fundamentalist tards and Mormons to be insulted.

fodders said:

That cannot be correct, as Satan is not a product of the New Testament, but the OLD Testament, pre Christianity in fact.

You misunderstand me. I agree that the character of Satan first appeared in the OT. The modern concept of the "organized Satanic church/conspiracy" that's supposed to stand against everything good and Christian is a recent invention by paranoid American Christians. Here's the screamsheet on Teh Stanic Evil!!!1

the_Danarchist said:

What the fuck? I didn't take a symmester of Bible as Lit with a bunch of Fundamentalist tards and Mormons to be insulted.

Yet they took it with you and you're insulting them.

With so many different interperetations(Spelling?) of the bible and the religeon itself, there's no one right answer. Just like most other things discussed in R&P, people beliefs can't be proved right or wrong and only speculated. However, since the point of R&P is to argue and flame, I guess this has no relevance to any of body here. However, I'm not sure if there's a Good God and an Evil God. Maybe God himself punishes those, probably by throwing them back into the hext life in a really shitty position. Then again, after death there might exist only oblivion. Who's to say?

JavaGuy said:

With so many different interperetations(Spelling?) the religeon itself,

interpretations religion :)

orion said:

Yet they took it with you and you're insulting them.

Nah, I'm insulting them for completely different reasons.

Actually Satanism doesn't believe in God or the Devil. It is named Satanism in spite of Christianity. Just an informational comment. : )

Black

Err...that doesnt make any sense. The only Satanism I ever read up on was one about how God sucks and the Devil rules or something like that, not that I care.

Black said:

Actually Satanism doesn't believe in God or the Devil. It is named Satanism in spite of Christianity. Just an informational comment. : )

Black

Like I said, there are different kinds of satanists.
Glad to see that you're obviously one of the "sane" and decent ones, 'cause the sickos believe in Satan afaik.

You're all wrong, Maynard is god. :p

Rellik said:

You're all wrong, Maynard is god. :p

Apart from being a bald headed guy, who the fuck is he?

http://www.maynardhomepage.com/

Did mommy take you to meet him?

Is that guy any relation to Maynard James Keenan? Cuz they kinda look alike.

Yup, that's Maynard James Keenan.

Thought so...

oh, by the way...I'm on song 888/924 on my Winamp list: SOber, by Tool. Only 36 songs to go.

I am sorry that I offended you and for that I formally apologize. I do not mean to insult anyone that does not deserve it and apparently on that particular day I was feeling destructive. I just have this form of 'mundane' hatred for Christians and their pseudo-teachings.

I was initially attacking the Christian religion NOT NECESSARILY you as an individual. It just came out that way. So again, sorry.

Black

Black said:

I am sorry that I offended you and for that I formally apologize. I do not mean to insult anyone that does not deserve it and apparently on that particular day I was feeling destructive. I just have this form of 'mundane' hatred for Christians and their pseudo-teachings.

I was initially attacking the Christian religion NOT NECESSARILY you as an individual. It just came out that way. So again, sorry.

Black

If you are addressing this to me in reference with the post of your opinion on stating biblical references then I gladly accept your apology.
: )

Heh. I'm actualy an atheist, but I have this perverse interest in religion. The thing that interests me the most is how someoen could possibly get into the mindset that such stuff they have been taught is real. I mean, I tried to become a Christian once, but I couldn't bring myself to believe any of it, so I gave up.

Well you can't really blame people for wanting to be a christian. Science and ratio do not bring inner peace like christianity.
example 1:
Science tells us that we have the same ancestor as apes. Wouldn't you feel much happier if you could believe that you were created in the image of the almighty? It brings more inner peace.
Christianity is a much more happier way of life.
example 2:
Let say (god forbid) your mother came to demise. Science and ratio would tell you that she is dead and you'll never meet her again. Christians however we tell you that you will meet your mother again in a perfect paradise and will be together for eternity in the presence of the loving Father.
Christianity puts your mind at rest and lets you live in peace with yourself. If you are able to be a christian you will probably be happier than rational people. Can we really blame people for wanting to be happy?
I've also tried being a christian (first 16 years of my life) and also for me it didn't work out. I quess I must find some other way to reach happiness.