Still, its not very 'Doomish'

Don't get me wrong, the 11 minute video is very impressive. It doesn't remind me much of Doom though. More like Resident Evil, what with the stumbling Zombies with the outstretched arms and limp wrists sterotypes. Where are their pistols (Beretta 9mm standard US sidearm was used in the original Doom/Doom2)? The 'Imps' if we can call them that are nothing like I would expect. If the game is to be a re-telling of the original then id will need to spend the rest of the development time trying to bring Doom III more inline with the original Doom in terms of monsters, weapons...to a degree at least.

say I

A Beretta? In Mars, in an outpost, in the future.

I've heard all kinds of "not doomy" comments, but no one seems to be able to describe that feeling. Does it really exists? Or is it just plain nostalgia, product of an excellent game? Can this feeling be replicated in a game 10 years more advanced, where both technology and storytelling have gone so far to keep gameplay compelling?

I´m very happy that id doesn´t remake every monster and every weapon from the original Doom. It seems to be a good mix between monsters / weapons inspired by the original Doom, and new stuff.

And the Zombies don´t carry pistols because they are "civilian zombies"! There will be zombiefied soldiers too, that´s for sure.

Resemblance to Resident Evil isn´t a bad thing IMO, I really enjoyed the creepy athmosphere of RE. And it´s still Doom, because it´s a first person shooter, and youre enemies aren´t only zombies, but hell spawn.
The original Doom was heavily inspired by the Alien movies, and we have the Giger-esque influence again, when you look at the monster designs. Just at higher graphical and artistic level, and that´s great!

Part of this 'doomy' feeling the doom3 footage is lacking is light, I think. Remember areas of e1 when you wonder outside, its all brightly lit by the white sky.. but with their lighting model, I'd be suprised if they could afford large areas bathed in light without making people's computers explode.

The DOOM 3 footage I've seen so far makes me think it's a mix of Q2 and Resident Evil with a touch of DOOM to it. The issue is that we have only seen the weak zombies so far. There will most likely be some *huge* straight-from-hell demons later in the game, and as soon as we see them, it will be just like DOOM again :)

Jon said:

Part of this 'doomy' feeling the doom3 footage is lacking is light, I think. Remember areas of e1 when you wonder outside, its all brightly lit by the white sky.. but with their lighting model, I'd be suprised if they could afford large areas bathed in light without making people's computers explode.

I definitely agree. The sky's what really set the unique mood of DOOM's E1. But since we're on Mars, and they're aiming for higher realism, I really doubt they'll use a bright white/greenish sky this time. DOOM 3 will probably me more like E2 if anything.

The only feeling I remember is disliking the levels. The mixture of colors, lighting and layouts made it a really unpleasant place to be. I hate being in a level. And that's something I'm not sure if I want to feel in D3. ^_^

Zaldron said:

The only feeling I remember is disliking the levels. The mixture of colors, lighting and layouts made it a really unpleasant place to be. I hate being in a level. And that's something I'm not sure if I want to feel in D3. ^_^

Hmm... gotta disagree there. While DOOM was very colorful in the early levels, the colors were perfectly balanced. Lots of PWADs make things worse....

I'm not talking about the levels and/or graphics being ugly. This is a feeling I've been experiencing since ever. It's just an unpleasant feeling in my stomach, not enough to drive me off from the game, but really detracting.

I'm like, severely traumatized by some levels. I will never play, say, E3M2 again in my life.

E3M2? What about E3M3 then? :P

That's another fine example.

Dunno, I don't think I'll even beat Doom1/2 again. I developed some kind of irrational fear to that game in my early gaming years.

" A Beretta? In Mars, in an outpost, in the future. "

Yep! Have a look see at the model in game. Open slide is a dead giveway. Same could be said of the conventional pellet slinging shotgun too.

A few gun toting zombies like the shotgun Zombie will help restore some Doom atmosphere. I get the feeling most of those enemies were fairly early. Even if only a few of the original enemies are a subset of the total monster pool, it would still be cool.

They clearly displayed the weaker zombies. From all of them, I guess the chaingunner is the only one that qualifies as a remake.

I think the guy with the whip is funney. They should have a guy with a chainsaw too. That would rock :P

I think the new weapons r0x0rs (with the exception of that sub machinegun/assault rifle).
When I saw the pistol in the Legacy movie I was like "hm, looks odd", but in this game video, when I saw it in action and getting reloaded and stuff, it began to feel more like the old pistol imo.
And the shotgun is like it's taken directly from out of Doom 1/2 - I only dislike about it that it reloads through inserting individual shells - you'd think that this would be totally obsolete in the future.
I would have preferred it to be clip fed - a small clip with eight small shells (smaller than modern shells) that you slam into the gun from underneath and once it's inserted into the gun, it'd barely be visible.
Also: while the new pinky looks very different it feels remarkably similar to the old pinky in terms of speed, sounds and toughness.
The new imp is just about as great as it could be (My only concern is its toughness, but I'll just wait and see).

And I'm confident that we'll see at least shotgun soldiers too (I hope for assault rifle soldiers as well - pistol soldiers aren't that important anymore).

So as conclusion, I'd say that when I had seen the video a couple of times, I actually felt that the game had a Doomish feel to it after all - there's lots of action, the weapons feel similar, some of the enemies are not totally unlike the old versions in terms of tougness and the like and it has a scary feel to it. I like it.

Btw, the chaingunner is cool - no more fat bastards in ridiculous red armour.

I think the AR is fine.

Fredrik said:

I think the AR is fine.

I wouldn't call it an assault rifle - it's way too short for that. It looks more like a sub machinegun to me (a bit big though).

I think it's odd that we haven't seen any futuristic weapons yet. At least the "sub machinegun" ought to have blinking LEDs and such neato stuff on it :)

Well, it has an ammo counter - that qualifies as "futuristic" in my book.
Besides, I think they're saving all the futuristic weaponry goodness for the final release.

Zaldron said:

I'm like, severely traumatized by some levels. I will never play, say, E3M2 again in my life.

What's wrong with E3M2? It's one of the few consistent themes.

Lüt said:

What's wrong with E3M2? It's one of the few consistent themes.

Perhaps he's refering to the "tap dancers" :P

I think Zaldron needs to see a shrink about his irrational fear of Doom 1.

Erik said:

I think Zaldron needs to see a shrink about his irrational fear of Doom 1.

I ph33r it too. Its eliteness :P

Heh, I like E1. No, scratch that. I love E1. Words cannot describe how I felt when I first loaded up the shareware. There I was all alone, with nothing but a pistol. And not a sound to be heard anywhere. Then there was E1M2 with the blinking lights maze-scared the fuggles out of me when I first ran through its blinking corridors, with zombies and Imps popping up left and right. Then of course there's E1M5 with its perfectly-in-tune suspense soundtrack (I don't know why the rest of the Doom music isn't this moody!) that I kept humming to myself at inopportune times. In fact, I still do. Then there's the Computer Station, E1M7. EXCELLENTLY done level. I also like the music in this level and still do. Then, finally, we have E1M8-quite possibly the best Doom E1 level made by id of them all. It is the perfect end to a perfect level, no ifs ands or buts.
/me steps down from the podium

E1M8 has some flaws, mostly related to walking back and forth between the end area and the first part of the level. I think that's a bit annoying.

Well...IMO it would be a bit lame if, with a decade of advances in graphics, level design tools and AI under their belt, ID just did what was basically a remake - surely a more positive step is to utilise whatever a game can be now, rather than just rehash what they were then...?

The original DOOM looks to me to have a hell of a lot of arcade-style shoot-em-up stuff, because the engines of the time just weren't up to complex lighting and massive levels...since they are, now, I say use these advances and make the best game you can at the time, without feeling a need to look back all the time.

I agree with the above post.

So do I.

So far the impression I get is that Doom III comes close to the mood of Ultimate Doom's Episode 2. I know one thing for sure: if id don't remake E2M2 somehow, I will :)

FlatHead said:

So do I.

So far the impression I get is that Doom III comes close to the mood of Ultimate Doom's Episode 2. I know one thing for sure: if id don't remake E2M2 somehow, I will :)

Unless I beat you to it :P

RRROOOAAARRR said:

Well...IMO it would be a bit lame if, with a decade of advances in graphics, level design tools and AI under their belt, ID just did what was basically a remake - surely a more positive step is to utilise whatever a game can be now, rather than just rehash what they were then...?

The original DOOM looks to me to have a hell of a lot of arcade-style shoot-em-up stuff, because the engines of the time just weren't up to complex lighting and massive levels...since they are, now, I say use these advances and make the best game you can at the time, without feeling a need to look back all the time.

Are you saying that you find it lame that id makes a new Doom?

I think that it couldn't be more fitting. The old Doom introduced what *could* be considered lighting/shadowing effects (first fps to have dark rooms and blinking lights) giving it a perfect sense of horror at that time - the new Doom 3 introduces a realistic, dynamic lighting engine unlike anything seen before it, giving the game a whole new sense of terror to it.

Actually, I don't think the gameplay in Doom 3 is that vastly different from Doom 1 - you're still just running about, gunning down enemies, lots of enemies (although they come in waves in the new game due to limitations, whereas the old Doom could throw scores of monsters at you at once), you're still running around in cramped, darkened corridors and the theme, while at first not easily recognizable, is still the same old theme.

I'm glad that id took the step to retell the Doom story - I have wanted a new and improved Doom game since Doom 2 in 1994.