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Tuxlar

(Old) 'Super-UV' difficulty?

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Play UV with fast monsters, or UV with respawning monsters, or UV with multiplayer things, but play it alone. And if you want difficulty more than NM, then UV with both fast, respawn (and multiplayer things).. so you don't get the double ammo from NM.

And if you're making your own levels, then you can do the difficulty settings whatever way you want...

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I've proposed a similar thing in a certain mod by myself. Nobody cared about it anyway.

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Jimi said:

And if you're making your own levels, then you can do the difficulty settings whatever way you want...

I guess the question should be: What's the value of an agreed-upon standard for UV? I mean, maps can and do often implement it their own different ways, but the iwad standard seems to keep yanking it back over the years. I guess the ambiguity isn't harmful itself, but I keep thinking there'd be a use to agreeing on a slightly modified "standard".

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You know what you can also do? Place the super-UV difficulty in the place of HNTR (by changing the graphic), I mean above HMP. Count with that when making balance to your maps. UV will be standard, Super-UV (=HNTR) will provide an increased challenge, and ITYTD will be the same increased challenge with double ammo and halved damage (ITYTD is hardcoded to behave like HNTR with these advantages). It would make sense and provide a nice difficulty variety.

Your point might be right, and you can feel free to incorporate such an innovation in your own Doom mod, but better don't expect that it'll become a new standard.

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scifista42 said:

You know what you can also do? Place the super-UV difficulty in the place of HNTR (by changing the graphic), I mean above HMP. Count with that when making balance to your maps. UV will be standard, Super-UV (=HNTR) will provide an increased challenge, and ITYTD will be the same increased challenge with double ammo and halved damage (ITYTD is hardcoded to behave like HNTR with these advantages). It would make sense.

Wait... so ITYTD is a halved 'super-UV'? Wouldn't that just lower it back down to UV/HMP in measurable difficulty? Or are you referring to making a new mode altogether to keep the madness of such a 'super-UV', but with less of the difficulty?

I like it, actually. On that note, I wonder how well toning down UV into a new 'easy mode' to let Nightmare mode exist as more or less the inverse of that idea would work...

Your point might be right, and you can feel free to incorporate such an innovation in your own Doom mod, but better don't expect that it'll become a new standard.

Right. It'd be a tall order to sell this idea, anyway. This is purely for personal/hypothetical decision making.

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Tuxlar said:

Wait... so ITYTD is a halved 'super-UV'? Wouldn't that just lower it back down to UV/HMP in measurable difficulty? Or are you referring to making a new mode altogether to keep the madness of such a 'super-UV', but with less of the difficulty?

I've suggested to take advantage of IDYTD's default behaviour to spice up the choice of difficulty settings. The player would choose between HMP, UV, Super UV, Super UV with double ammo, and Nightmare. In fact, they would be ordered in this sequence:

Super UV with double ammo / halved damage
Super UV
HMP
UV
Nightmare

The mapping would have to be accustomized to that. I meant this idea to be used for custom mapset made with this artificial rule in mind. I thought it would be an interesting variety of skill levels. Just an idea, too.

EDIT:

Tuxlar said:

I like it, actually. On that note, I wonder how well toning down UV into a new 'easy mode' to let Nightmare mode exist as more or less the inverse of that idea would work...

Once I've also been thinking about renaming the difficulties to "reverse them", so that HNTR was in place of UV and UV in place of HNTR. Then, Nightmare would be HNTR with increased challenge, and ITYTD would be UV with milder challenge. :)

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scifista42 said:

EDIT:
Once I've also been thinking about renaming the difficulties to "reverse them", so that HNTR was in place of UV and UV in place of HNTR. Then, Nightmare would be HNTR with increased challenge, and ITYTD would be UV with milder challenge. :)

Heh, I wonder how you'd manage 'reversing' the mode order without some sort of boom-like scripting to manipulate the monster/item availability on the map between "Nightmare" and "UV".

Actually, I think at this point you'd be better off just naming and designing them as if they're distinct, separate modes altogether. Nightmare might be an 'Any %' mode, ITYTD would be a 'Slaughter' mode, etc.

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Tuxlar said:

Heh, I wonder how you'd manage 'reversing' the mode order without some sort of boom-like scripting to manipulate the monster/item availability on the map between "Nightmare" and "UV".

Like before, I've always meant this to be used for a custom mapset, specifically balanced with this innovation in mind.

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A long time ago I actually went and searched for all the wads with custom difficulty names and made a list of them for a possible conversation topic on WXR.

I didn't think I would ever find a use for this. There are probably more wads with custom difficulty skill titles but this was all I could find.

----Doom----
I'm Too Young to Die
Hey Not Too Rough
Hurt Me Plenty
Ultra Violence
Nightmare

----Heretic----

Thou needeth a wet-nurse
Yellowbellies-r-us
Bringest them oneth
Thou art a smite meister
Black plague possesses thee

----Strife----

Training
Rookie
Veteran
Elite
Bloodbath

----DOOM64----

Be gentle!
Bring it on!
I own Doom!
Watch me die!

----Chex Quest----

Easy Does it
Not so Sticky
Gobs of Goo
Extreme Ooze
Super Slimey!

----Alien Vendetta----

Wimp Mode
Hey Take it Easy
Give Me Hell
I'm A Doom God
Hashtag Nightmare

---Perditions Gate---- Partial Conversion for Doom 2 by Wraith Software
Walk in the park
Childs Play
Dear Lord!
Flaming Death to All
YOU WISH!!

---Hell To Pay--- Partial Conversion for Doom 2 by same company
Mommy do i HAVE to??
Hah! That Tickles
Keep them coming!
Wrath of Hell
Extreme Prejudice

---Mike Belchers Doom 2--- crazy Partial Conversion for Doom 2

Fighter in Training
Tough Kid
Bad Dude
Super Big Balls
Freakin NUTS

---Nightmares of Loki--- Partial Conversion for Doom 1
I'm not sure, will I get hurt?
Oh maybe for a little while
Oh Yes I can handle it
I can survive anything!
CALL ME GOD

---chris61.wad--- megawad for doom2 no one should play
I'm a sack of shit.
I'm a little wuss that really sucks
Oh im OK at this
Come on! I'm a man!
Total Insanity

---TNT DM megawads--- Greivance, Bloodlands, Pursuit,
No Plasma 2x Ammo
No Plasma
Any Guns - Altdeath
Any Guns
Any Guns 2x Ammo

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If it does not involve changing the engine code it is just flavoring and advertising. You can call it "you are all going to die mode" but to the engine and editor it is EASY.

Most players see it that way too.
No matter what you call them, no matter what difficulty range the wad may have, it is still going to be EASY1, EASY2, MED, HARD, RESPAWN.
It is the description given before the user downloads the wad that makes the difference in this.

Giving the letters is just confusing. I have not actually read any of those in years, and I habitually use FreeDoom which renamed them all.

More custom difficulty names in:
Phobiata.wad
FreeDoom.wad

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