[RELEASE] Plutonia 1024

@FullMoonDog
Actually, that is pretty good map, both frustrating and fun, I doubt it needs any change in UV. It's just that I think I missed that extra box of shells in that blood trench/canal when time came for that arch-vile. Quite nasty one, if it keeps resurrecting those damn revenants instead chasing me. Dunno about the opinion of rest of the folks, since my level isn't nowhere near pro. :P

Uh, 40oz, you forgot to implement the changes of map12 in this version.

Cool, good job on the release. :)
Up to map 10, nice maps so far. You guys totally succeeded in recreating a smaller-scale version of Plutonia's themes and atmosphere.

A couple notes :

Map 01 :
- Liquid texture usage seems quite random in this map. You have water, blood, brown water ( all these 3 being non-damaging ), and lava. IMHO it would be more cohesive and Plutonia-like to just stick to one kind of liquid for damaging sectors and another one for non-damaging areas.

Map 04 :
- There's no ammo left to kill the last Arch-Vile ( behind the YK door ).

Map 05 :
- It would be cool to have at least 1 secret. Just mark the starting area as a secret and you're good to go.

Map 06 :
- There should be a vine midtexture on the back sides of lines 176 and 177.

Map 07 :
- It would be cool to have at least 1 secret.

Map 10 :
- My favorite so far. :)
- The starting pad isn't consistent with Plutonia : sector 3's floor should be pitch black. Since you're using Boom stuff, you can use a light transfer linedef action to give sector 3's floor a light level of 50 while not darkening the walls next to it.

I've also tried map 32 out of curiosity, as I was wondering how you guys could create a good Go 2 It variant while being limited in space. Turns out Obsidian used a totally different concept, heh, and it works very well. :)
( Aside from the mandatory AV jump, ugh... I think this should be left for speedrunning tricks, not for actual progression or regular secrets )
Also, the water flat on sectors 50, 51 etc. doesn't change to blood later on.

CorSair said:

@FullMoonDog
Actually, that is pretty good map, both frustrating and fun, I doubt it needs any change in UV. It's just that I think I missed that extra box of shells in that blood trench/canal when time came for that arch-vile. Quite nasty one, if it keeps resurrecting those damn revenants instead chasing me. Dunno about the opinion of rest of the folks, since my level isn't nowhere near pro. :P

I think the first Archville is too much, it's only teleport in UV but to me it seems very unfair because it ressurects all the enemies. The revenants also teleported in the area. But if you think it's not a problem I will not change it. It's the layout of the map wich makes the monster placement difficult.

@[WH]-Wilou84:

yeah i was aware the pad was inconsistent (give a look to plutonia to find a pad that only have the floor pad i think saw one in plutonia, not sure since the last time i played plutonia was like 5-6 years ago) and my problem was precisely the walls so i wasnt sure how to fix.

then i know Boom have the feature to change floor and ceiling light level but never found it like "transfer floor" or "transfer ceiling" until today i give it a second try to look for those options and they are called "ceiling brigthness to brightness" and "floor brightness to brightness" if only i would have know before hehe.

I know 40oz deadline for map fixing ended but if he is going to make those small fixes i will post my map here with that small fix with the pad: https://www.mediafire.com/?ym1skdu6kkab94k

Map 11 :
- Awesome map, like most of what I've seen from Captain Toenail actually. Nothing to report here, solid work all around !

Map 12 :
- Start & exit pads are inconsistent with the classic Plutonia pad : sectors 7 and 164's light levels should be at 50.
- Linedefs 200 and 202 have misaligned brick textures.
- Great ending fight. Ammo & health pickups seem sufficient on UV.

Map 13 :
- Cool curvy architecture. :)
- Having at least 1 secret would be nice.
- Ammo is hyper-tight here, particularly at the end.

Map 14 :
- Oh cool, I love this tune. :)
Darkwave0000's map was one of my favorties in PRCP, and now this map seems to be inspired by it more or less. I'm excited to see how it will turn out !
- And it turned out pretty well. The "o"-shaped arena is kinda overdone in 1024 maps, but the fights keep things fresh.
- Bonus points for the pretty cool light gradients here and there. A pity you have many misaligned bricks, but it's a minor nitpick.

Map 15 :
- How come there's no secret in a level occupying the 15th slot ?
- Cool little traps, they work very well. The Revenant behind the yellow door ( Thing #35 ) is quite dickish though, as he'll punch right away without letting any second to react.
- .... Oh, okay, so we got to choose the exit. Fine then. But I still believe that having at least 1 sector marked as secret would be nice.
- You forgot sector 156's light blinking effect.

Map 31 :
- A bite-sized version of Cyberden, nothing particularly new here but I enjoyed it nevertheless.

Map 16 :
- Good map, but way too tight regarding ammo. Killing two Barons with the Chainsaw is not that fun.

Map 17 :
- Linedef 707's texture is misaligned. You may use the "upper unpegged" linedef flag to fix this.
- What about using A-REDROK for linedefs 652, 638 etc. ? As far as I remember, Plutonia didn't have much use for the classic REDROCK* textures, aside from a couple remote spots in maps like 23 and 30.

Map 18 :
- Great map. Nothing to rant on about here, this is all good.

Map 19 :
- Awesome variation of "Speed" here. You even have the popping Chainies that everyone loves to hate... Very nice map !
This episode is turning out to be better than the first one ( which was cool already ).

Map 20 :
- The automap only displays the first part of the level name ( I'm using PrBoom ).
- Great stuff. CRACKLE2 is an odd choice for a Plutonia-themed map, but it still works.

Map 21 :
- Start & exit pads are inconsistent with the classic Plutonia pad : sectors 1 and 22's light levels should be at 50. Obviously you'd better use Boom light transfers here.
- The gameplay is totally out of place within a Plutonia megawad, but hey, it's a Phml map, so what was I expecting.... :)
I still liked it.

Map 22 :
- Decent effort.
- Maybe have the faraway Imp platforms being marked as "block monster", so that the Imps don't fall ( it would then prevent 100% kills on the map ).
- There's something weird about the secrets here. For example, there's absolutely no clue that jumping towards line 48 will teleport you on the Berserk. Moreover, regarding the Invulnerability secret, if you activate only one of the switches, you can grab the sphere but the secret will not be triggered ( as you're unable to actually stand on the secret sector ).

Map 23 :
- A tough and chaotic level, now this screams out Plutonia !
Great job, Phobus.
- Why are these Pain Elementals teleporting in after you pick the yellow key ? They're behind impassible lines and their minions can't reach the player. Cacodemons are fine though.
- It woud have been cool to have at least 1 secret here.

Map 24 :
- Nice, if only a bit out of place thanks to the white sky.
- Some rockets near the exit pad tend to hover in PrBoom.

@ Z0k : Cool, hopefully your update will make it into the final version.

I haven't played the latest beta yet but in the first beta I noticed a tiny issue left over from my work on MAP07 - the incorrect ceiling texture is used on a small sector at the exit. Apologies if this has been spotted and fixed subsequently.

You're doing a grand job putting this together, 40oz!

Thanks for the feedback, Wilou84. Fixed the brightness for both sectors 7 and 164 and fixed some misalignments. Here it is. 40oz, you better include this in the latest beta.


edit: by the way, 40oz, you should put the latest beta link in the OP.

Map 25 :
- Pretty straightforward map. Aside from the automap level name, I don't have anything to report on this one.

Map 26 :
- I still have the huge nodebuilder error that Keyboard_Doomer mentioned. The map is basically unplayable in this state.

Map 27 :
- Start & exit pads are inconsistent with the classic Plutonia pad : sectors 139 and 144's light levels should be at 50.
- This is so far ( and by far ) the most beautiful level in the set. I can't say I'm surprised though, Ed is clearly an expert when it comes to detail. :)
- Gameplay is great too. I was expecting something nastier at the end though, after that pesky Arch-Vile duo, but it's fine as it is.
Some Chaingunners up above may be hard to spot at times.
- The only thing that made me cringe was the music choice, but then again, to each their own. Actually, Grosse's music was one of the many Doom II tunes that didn't make it into Plutonia....

Map 28 :
- ... And another one was Underhalls', of which this map is obviously a tribute.
- A pretty good level too. Good Revenant placement. Difficulty seems alright for slot 28, and it's nice to actually have a lot of secrets to look for.
- You forgot to add a glowing light effect on sector 139.

A solid megawad overall. Good job guys :)
I'll gladly play the remaining maps whenever they're released.

Also, hmm honestly this green ENDOOM screen is terrible.

[WH]-Wilou84 said:
- You forgot to add a glowing light effect on sector 139.

Funny thing... I was lying in bed last night, when suddenly OH CRAP I THINK I FORGOT TO MAKE THAT SECTOR GLOW. I'll go upload a revised version now, but I don't know if it will end up in the final WAD.

EDIT: http://www.mediafire.com/download/bcq0x1on29x116d/pl1024-Surreily2.wad

@wilou I don't think there will be any more maps, which is a shame because we're literally 2 slots from full as it stands. I don't see the need to rush to a sept 1st release, would make sense to get 2 more maps and maybe so one last round of external feedback polishing.

FullMoonDog said:

I think the first Archville is too much, it's only teleport in UV but to me it seems very unfair because it ressurects all the enemies. The revenants also teleported in the area. But if you think it's not a problem I will not change it. It's the layout of the map wich makes the monster placement difficult.

I liked your map a lot FullMoonDog. It was the biggest chore for playtesting purposes for that reason, but for standard playing I really enjoyed it. I wouldn't change a thing. If anything I'd suggest more maps be more like it :)

[WH]-Wilou84 said:

Map 23 :
- A tough and chaotic level, now this screams out Plutonia !
Great job, Phobus.
- Why are these Pain Elementals teleporting in after you pick the yellow key ? They're behind impassible lines and their minions can't reach the player. Cacodemons are fine though.
- It woud have been cool to have at least 1 secret here.

Ooops that was my bad. That was a response to what keyboard_Doomer said about being able to archvile jump out there. Maybe I should unimpassable those lines and make the blood damaging?

Breezeep said:

edit: by the way, 40oz, you should put the latest beta link in the OP.

I thought about it but I'd prefer to keep the betas as internal as possible. No need to advertise that I'm pumping out new versions daily. When it's done there will be a worthy announcement on OP.

Marcaek said:

@wilou I don't think there will be any more maps, which is a shame because we're literally 2 slots from full as it stands. I don't see the need to rush to a sept 1st release, would make sense to get 2 more maps and maybe so one last round of external feedback polishing.

My wife's gonna kill me if I spend any more hours on this :P

Ah, that makes a lot more sense :V I'd still say maybe appointing someone to take over for the last 2 maps would be a thing to consider. I don't want to press it but reaalllllyy it's 2 maps too close to a full set that it'll probably be weird to the players to get to 28 and be like "that's it?"

Marcaek said:

Ah, that makes a lot more sense :V I'd still say maybe appointing someone to take over for the last 2 maps would be a thing to consider. I don't want to press it but reaalllllyy it's 2 maps too close to a full set that it'll probably be weird to the players to get to 28 and be like "that's it?"

I posted a map GRB and I made a few pages back and I've got the makings of an Icon map if anyone thinks they can finish it off. Lemme know if anyone's up for finishing it and I'll post a link.

Depending on if 40oz okays it, I could take a stab at finishing it off. My doom obligations are about to come to an end within the next hour or so, I'll have the free time then heh.

Plutonia 1024: Beta 3

Fixed a lot of issues mentioned by Keyboard_Doomer, WH-Wilou84, and others, and correctly imported the latest versions of MAP10, MAP12, and MAP26. All in the changelog.

ZDoom crashed as soon as I selected a difficulty. :/

According to my count, there are seven unused maps listed in the OP. Joe-ilya posted a MAP30 on the deadline date a little before midnight which was not listed in the OP and then he posted a revision the next day. With Obsidian/GRB's map, and the Icon map Obsidian just mentioned, that makes ten maps. I don't know what shape they're in, but there's got to be two usable ones in there. This close to a full wad, it's like getting fluffed without a money shot. If 40oz doesn't approve, maybe this can be called Project Blue Balls. But it is his project, so he does get the final call.

I started on the first beta, then the second one was released so I started over. I've gotten through MAP17. I was hoping to be done tonight, but we have family in this weekend.

-------
Playing UV, ZDoom

Had a thought. Will there be new PxTEXT entries also? Or will they be eliminated in the MAPINFO by making the whole project one cluster (except maybe the secret levels)?

Because the originals texts between clusters makes no sense here. Except the ones for the secret levels. The originals still work for those. I also assume MAPINFO will specify nojump and nocrouch.

-------
MAP01
-------
Minor visual cleanups.

All the second sidedef railings on the east side are set at y-30, which means they are almost completely underground. Because of the angled nature of the sector edges, when you stand near the edge you can see some of them (or not see, actually). I get it. The textures below the railings were being aligned. I clipped to take this.

http://i.imgur.com/ec6oWnu.png

The only really obvious ones are right in front of the Hell Knight, sector tag 11. Fastest fix is to remove these two railings completely and remove the impassable tags.

http://i.imgur.com/h6gYty1.png

And all the second sidedef railings on the west side are not railings. They are STEPTOP. Again, because of the jagged nature of the sector edges, you can see some of them.

http://i.imgur.com/wgYnGBs.png

---
The water flowing straight down and turning into blood looks a bit odd, but I guess that's author's prerogative. It doesn't affect gameplay.

---
Textures mis-aligned on the GSTONE1 walls inside the Soul Sphere secret.

-------
MAP05
-------
Found a way to skip most of the level. At a full run, you can go from the Blue Key platform across both wood walls and land right in front of the exit.

http://i.imgur.com/JbQ7Fk6.png

---
When you get the Yellow Key, it looks like you should be able to walk through here, since there's no barrier. Feels a little odd that you can't. I'm not fond of lines that are impassable for no reason.

http://i.imgur.com/g3QvTDp.png

Same with the opening next to the Red Key. The crenelated castle walls next to that opening feel okay as impassable because you're not right next to them.

http://i.imgur.com/mz594b0.png

-------
MAP32
-------
Two of the AVs in the starting room didn't get crushed, and they move so quickly that when the crushers opened, they walked into and out of their crushers before they could get caught by them. Maybe those crushers need to be longer so the AVs have room to move, but tagged as monster block so they can't escape them.

-------
MAP17
-------
Texture alignment over the Yellow Key.

http://i.imgur.com/UN1kqD7.png

---
The Arachnos are so much bigger than the sectors they teleport to that they actually land on the edge of the cliff so they can't move or attack and you can walk completely under them. Very cool effect. Don't think it was intentional. Need to move the teleport landing sectors farther away from the cliff.

http://i.imgur.com/xi6kO0V.png
http://i.imgur.com/X9vVEqu.png
http://i.imgur.com/f8vZlkx.png

---
Arrrggh! I can't believe a third beta was released while I was posting this! I need to learn to be faster or less thorough. I have no idea what others have found, so if I've duplicated anything, sorry.

Edit: Forgot to ask - Surreily's wad had some custom textures in it but I didn't see them in the compiled wad. Were they edited out in the map for some standard ones?

Obsidian said:

ZDoom crashed as soon as I selected a difficulty. :/

Same with GlBoom+.

EffinghamHuffnagel is right 40oz, at this point in the game it would be worth the time to fill the final two slots. There are maps available, you might as well use them. Otherwise you are going to be left with a lot of people scratching their heads when they complete map28.

Obsidian said:

ZDoom crashed as soon as I selected a difficulty. :/

any error messages? How do I fix this? I don't even recall touching MAP01.

40oz said:

any error messages? How do I fix this? I don't even recall touching MAP01.

I just had a look with SLADE and the MAP01 marker has 0 bytes. Grab the one from the last beta, I guess.

Reject table accidentally being a map marker? http://i.imgur.com/JNC29sV.png

Disregard beta 3; acquire...

Plutonia 1024: Beta 4


Fixed the MAP01 bug, adjusted offset and arachnatron spawn locations in MAP17, considered the errors in MAP05 to be negligible (I encourage map breaking speedrunning tactics)

Crashes ZDoom...

Is that still beta 3 file?

Ah, it would appear so!

Still crashes GlBoom+ :(

sorry about that, copied the wrong link somehow. link adjusted. (5 posts above)

It's impossible to reach 100% secrets now in map22 without using IDCLIP. It seems like the sector in the ground is tagged as a secret but after it raises up it stops being a secret.

EDIT:

map05: I don't if it's possible that something broke while compiling this beta but this is just fucked up because I UV-maxed this map a few times before and didn't encounter any of these problems:

- on 1st try the Revenant in sector 265 didn't wake up and therefore didn't teleport in.
- on 2nd try as I tried to reproduce the Revenant bug sector 269 didn't lower so 3 shotgunners and 3 imps couldn't teleport in. In additon the Revenant in sector 259 didn't wake up either (I guess the floor there didn't raise there? Sorry, didn't check.) I guess this means some lines might be easy to run pass by with some straferunning...?

(I was about to exit the level in both tries.)

EDIT 2:

Scratching my head on this one: In map15 the two chaingunners in sectors 158 and 159 still didn't teleport in as I was about to exit the map (this haven't happened before either) so I used IDCLIP to look what's wrong... and THEN they teleported... wut?

In map23 the blood in the two alcoves is still not damaging so player can survive and be stuck outside the 1024x1024 box (those thin raised blood strips are also not damaging).