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hardcore_gamer

If you could create one video game of your choice...

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TheCupboard said:

Nothing glowing, no auras.

I disagree, Diablo needs such things for the magic users and certain demons which happen to be enchanted with certain defenses just like in Diablo 2.

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Are you for real? Did you notice how every character class in Diablo 3 had a bountiful amount of visual rewards (glowing, multi-color dreamy visuals) for simply destroying a group of monsters?


In Diablo, finding a boss was a major event that required a lot of saved games and calculation. In Diablo 2, the door was eased open a little bit, encouraging online play. The thing is, a simple dungeon crawl executed perfectly is all we are looking for in this day and age.

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yukib1t said:

a revamped version of Space Hulk: Vengeance of The Blood Angels

This would be pretty fucking sweet, despite the two Space Hulk games which have kind of filled that void for me.

Doomkid said:

To anyone who says "classic Doom couldn't possibly work with new age graphics", I say PSHAW, expand your mind!

I think the general consensus isn't that it couldn't work, but rather to make it work it would need to be faithful to the look and style of the original game, which would result in something kind of pointless. I can see where these people are coming from, though I don't entirely agree. I'd play this.

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It would basically be a "HD" version of the original game then, such things have been done with games before such as Perfect Dark with its xbox port, although while they did update the model polygons they also changed the designs to an extent.

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DoomUK said:

This would be pretty fucking sweet, despite the two Space Hulk games which have kind of filled that void for me.

I thought those were awesome, despite what the reviews said. What I was thinking of, though, was more of a real-time FPS like the original two video game versions were. They seemed to feel close to what I'd want to see, but they still both sort of miss the mark in various ways.

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I think I'd recreate the three Golden Sun games into a single topdown and third person game in 3D and as a PC game.

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Doomkid said:

To anyone who says "classic Doom couldn't possibly work with new age graphics", I say PSHAW, expand your mind!


Well, first you'd have to define what you mean by "new age graphics". I'll assume it means something within the realm of what they're doing now with games like Crysis(3), RAGE, Battlefield, Star Citizen, whatever.

With that out of the way, have you ever sat down and thought about what this may mean for the rest of the game? Let's say you have top notch graphics that resemble the classic games to a great degree. Would you still want the enemies to zig-zag their way through the hallways? Do you have any idea how stupid/wrong that would look? What about when you're going through E1M5 and cross all that nukage. should that still be a solid floor? I guess the classic response to that would be to make it knee-deep (hehe), but this would still not be enough to sell the illusion. The player has to be affected by the goo in other ways. He needs to slow down while in it.

What about room detail? You can't expect to get new awesome first person shooter graphics without a whole lot of crap and clutter on the floor and walls. This will once again change the way the game plays. First of all you will have to slow down the player because the environmental detail will pose as obstacles and further help to cramp the levels. Now what about sound? Do you expect a full level track to just work alongside the new amazing graphics like magic? What about environmental sounds? Soundscapes? Are computers still just a texture on a wall or? No wait, we're having awesome new age graphics, so I guess we have to make computer rooms. What purpose do these computers serve? Are they related to the level geometry, theme or are they just backdrops? Are we still looking for colored keys in random haphazard locations? Does the ceiling still sometimes start to crush the player for no reason? Why are the various segments of the E2M4 base intercut by nukage? Why is there a crusher in the computer room?

You could go on forever and these are just a really small part of the enormous bouquet of questions and issues you will have to deal with when going "new age graphics". Did you just *once* stop to think about any of those? You're asking people to expand their minds, but it seems to me you should start by expanding your insights about the matter. I mean no offense of course and I do believe a new game based on Doom 1 / 2 could be amazing - taking more visual and audio cues from the originals, but "DOOM WITH MODERN AWESOME GRAPHICS YEAH" will never work and every time someone has tried it has ended in a catastrophe.

Doom belongs in 1993 and "new game" belongs in 2015. You can draw huge inspiration both ways, but what you're proposing is just naive. Graphics in a computer game isn't just a knob you can turn up or down, completely independent from anything else in the product. Changing the graphics will change the game. Changing the graphics fundamentally will fundamentally change the game unless you wish to have a giant disconnect between the visual input and everything else.

An extremely stylized indie game with artsy graphics on the other hand - yes - but that will *never* be Doom with new awesome graphics. That is something else entirely.

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I think youre being a bit closed minded. Semantics aside, Unreal's latest release is pretty competitive as far as visuals go and without compromising the game play too bad.

Things can look new and shiny without being realistic.

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A new PowerSlave that acts as a retelling of the old story, with a lot of the same action feels and weapons, but maybe add that shotgun from the cover art and make the Machete more useful out of water.

The main draw, though, would be making the Cat Statue enemies topless and with some pretty good knockers bouncing around as you spill their guts with a pig. Yep, that's pretty much it.

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40oz said:

I think youre being a bit closed minded. Semantics aside, Unreal's latest release is pretty competitive as far as visuals go and without compromising the game play too bad.

Things can look new and shiny without being realistic.


You're brushing over every single point made with the good old realism strawman. I'm not even sure you read the post. If you're not going to bother addressing some of the questions, issues and concerns I highlighted I won't bother either.

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Doomkid said:

Doom deathmatch with excellent, new-age graphics and ragdoll effects and shit.


For some reason, "new age" makes me think of 60s psychedelic hippie imagery, flower power etc.

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i didnt know shaviro got to decide what awesome graphics means, i guess we will just have to consult him from now on to check if a game has awesome graphics or not

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Apparently you have a hard time reading and understanding, so I'll explain it one more time for the slow:

Well, first you'd have to define what you mean by "new age graphics". I'll assume it means something within the realm of what they're doing now with games like Crysis(3), RAGE, Battlefield, Star Citizen, whatever.

I said he should define what he means by new age graphics, but seeing as he didn't I went with the most common definition of "modern great graphics". This also happens to be the definition typically used in the discussions he referenced.

It all hinges on what he means by "new age graphics". If we are talking about something like this then I'd love to see it as well, but that is far from the common definition of modern great graphics and something that would compete more on freely artistic values than what we're used to.

Like I've said here before I personally think Minecraft has some of the best graphics ever made, simply because they have created a pocket of accept - a contract - with the player which allows for the very simplistic nature of the gameworld to exist and look good. Naturally generated landscape? Looks good. Random building made in said landscape? Looks good. The style is flexible and hits the sweet spot where your imagination takes over. You know, like Doom. Anyone who's seen some of the countless clones will notice just how difficult that is to achieve. All that said, Minecraft is not the common definition of modern great graphics either. See the point?

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Zigzagging around might look good if you get creative with the animations, have monsters kick off of walls when they bounce off of them and look over their shoulders/walk backwards if they happen to go in the opposite direction to the player. Basically hide the fact that they are stupid by making them look smart.

Also, make the nukage really viscous/make the marine a magic martian/make his armor just that good to avoid having to slow the player down.

Oh and this has been said by other people, but good/beautiful/modern does not equal realistic. By that logic, impressionist paintings are all hideous always.

Doom could work very well like this, just make it stylized/surreal and people will accept it. Worked for Mario, worked for Wrack.

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I would love to be able to make something along the lines of Streets Of Rage Remake, but for the Thunder Force series. The idea being that it would be an entirely new campaign, featuring all of the ships from the series selectable with their own weapons and powerups, reinterpretations of some of the game's most famous levels and bosses and something the original games never had - two player co-op. The game would be done entirely with 2D graphics, including the content taken from V and VI, and seeing as it would only ever be a fangame, there would probably be a few "guest fighters" thrown in as unlockables. All of the ships would have an over-weapon, not just the Rynex upwards, andall of the "guest" ships would have their original weapons, but handled via the TF powerup method.

I'd be tempted to try something like this in GZDoom, but coding the Hunter weapon would be the least of my problems ...

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Shaviro said:

stuff

We've already done this before! (Although, I have changed my stance of a few sleect points from that thread. Doom 3 is better than I once thought.)

Shaviro said:

I personally think Minecraft has some of the best graphics ever made, simply because they have created a pocket of accept - a contract - with the player which allows for the very simplistic nature of the gameworld to exist and look good. Naturally generated landscape? Looks good. Random building made in said landscape? Looks good. The style is flexible and hits the sweet spot where your imagination takes over. You know, like Doom.

Now this, I agree with. The picture that DoomUK posted is a perfect example of what I would expect. It would definitely not be mega-super-ultra HD, but more modern than the '93 game we all know, and introducting a few new elements as well. I'd be all over it.

Maes said:

For some reason, "new age" makes me think of 60s psychedelic hippie imagery, flower power etc.

Lmao! "Duuude, this is like, new age shit..."

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WWI tank sim/'rougelike'

Take either a mark whatever brit trapezoid tank or one of the Renault light tanks through a series of randomized battles with randomized objectives to do. Starts off a bit easy as tanks are a new thing, but they'll eventually come up with tactics and weapons to deal with you. Soon you may face captured ally tanks or even the German landships.

Your goal is to survive the war.

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Out of a few ideas I have, a realtime roguelike (Diablolike?) in a first person, Wolf3D/ROTT style engine is probably one of the more interesting/unusual ones.

Although I guess maybe TES Arena might be kind of sort of this already (I haven't played it myself, but I have heard it makes random dungeons and stuff.)

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Shaviro said:

See the point?


Yes, the point is that you need to be contentious about something that wasn't being argued about in the first place. (i.e. porting dooms exact level designs over, integrating environmental obstacles and sounds etc.) He was just participating in the thread by answering the question on the OP. He wasn't asserting that this particular game needs to be made and he's volunteering himself to direct it, but you managed to get the feeling that this was happening before it did and smother the daydreaming aspect of this thread.

There's a word for posting long arguments directed against someone that has nothing to do with what they're talking about but I forget what it is. I'm sure you know what it is.

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I would make some sort of game where you play as a deranged mental patient with a mouth tumor and you can barely be controlled; you can only force him to turn corners. And you get chased by multicolored brown bags down them and you eat everything you see.

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Doomkid said:

We've already done this before! (Although, I have changed my stance of a few sleect points from that thread. Doom 3 is better than I once thought.)


Hehe so we have. Some of the points are even the same.
No need to do it again I guess ;)

40oz was once again:
missing the point


Had you actually read my post you would have noticed that I quoted the specific part of his post that referenced an old ongoing discussion and not his Doom DM idea.

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Maybe there's a problem with my web browser then. I only see you quoting a section of his post that was fantasizing about a modern version of Doom deathmatch which was on topic with the thread, then you start talking about the ridiculousness of porting dooms level designs over to a new age engine like Crysis 3 that no one is talking about except you, while demanding answers to vague problematic questions in a condescending tone. I'm sorry if that's not what happened, but you should see it because really it makes you look pretty ridiculous :)

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Oh come on. He openly poked at that ongoing discussion (which has taken place for years with different contenders) with a slightly provocative tone. You shouldn't dish it out if you can't take a response in kind - which he obviously could. Apparently he already answered similar points in a different thread - which I completely forgot. Why you can't take it and are still going on about it I don't know though.

My tone may be a little condescending at times, but I reason my points and I take the time to read and understand the replies. When I reply I try to take what they said in mind. Do you have anything beyond one-liners and cheap remarks? Right now you're just further derailing the thread with nonsense about "forum manners".

And getting back to the subject;

Doomkid said:

Now this, I agree with. The picture that DoomUK posted is a perfect example of what I would expect. It would definitely not be mega-super-ultra HD, but more modern than the '93 game we all know, and introducting a few new elements as well. I'd be all over it.


I must admit I've never been a big fan of that shot. Don't get me wrong, it's a nicely upgraded scene with almost 1:1 (as much as that is possible) results. The problem as I see it is that it becomes very clinical. Sterile almost. The old low-res pixel mess left plenty of room for the imagination whereas this (very HD) scene does not (or less). It's really difficult to achieve the same kind of imagination-sparking visuals in high definition. This is partially why Minecraft looks so right and Minecraft clones with HD textures look pretty absurd :)

Another approach is to freeze Doom in time and create a very cartooney or stylized take on it. This is the best attempt I've seen so far. If one dedicated some resources to create death splatter animations that resembled the old and added a few upgrades to the way levels are made it could work. That could be a pretty interesting project, but I'm afraid at the end of the day I would be questioning the point of it, like Doomuk hinted at.

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Suddenly!

"How to make a new Doom in 2015" thread.

I don't understand why people need so many games to satisfy their id. Or possibly something else too but not really in the point I'm referring too. If you want some unsophisticated happiness, having sex instead is even better.

(Actually, the game I would make would satisfy BOTH id and superego. It would allow for anything one could but doesn't, and this alone would be a big shock and innovation)

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