If ID had made Doom on something like Doom builder and Slade, what would it be like?

I always wondered what Doom would've been like if it was made with software on par with Doom builder and SLADE, if they had access to advanced formats like UDMF.

Any ideas?

Probably very similar to the Doom we already know, as you didn't say that they would also have a more advanced engine at their disposal.

If you're saying GZDoom Builder with ZDoom or other related source ports then that will also depend on their creativity back in the day.

Clearly ID were ambitious and if there was a feature or mechanic they wanted to set their mind on (within an appropriate time frame) they would do it.

So with a modern sourceport and editor... and maybe Slade I would imagine they would of created a superior end Boss for Map 30. And taking into consideration how Doom 1 chapters ended with a bang, they would of probably created more unique situations near the end of chapters such as collapsing terrain, Hell Flame immolating the floor forcing the player to briefly run for his life and some more puzzles.

They probably would of included an inventory system and have moments with ally Marines battling the Hellspawn. You can also get an idea from some interviews with ID developers how they wanted interactive chairs to kick around etc.

Nothing so much different given the engine and the hardware limitations of those years. I don't think they needed a program like Slade, if they wanted something they could already just add it or change whatever they wanted.

I was actually thinking about software like Doom builder 2 and SLADE3.
The kind of easy to use software we mappers have at our disposal nowadays.

And yes, the engine will still be the same.

There would be more curves in the maps, maybe less map-related errors, and idSoftware's attempt to remove unused resources from the IWADs would have been more successful.

For all intents and purposes, they had access to UDMF. It's just that they used their nodebuilder to convert the map's "source code" into a more compact binary format. If they had wanted additional features that couldn't fit in the existing Doom format, then it's not a problem, just change the binary format and recompile the maps. They've done that plenty of time during Doom's alpha and beta development.

The most important difference between their editing tools and those developed by the community is how sectors are approached. In DoomEd, sectors are basically a property of the linedefs, with the actual sectors being generated by the nodebuilder; and that makes certain tricks impossible.

Maybe Petersen's maps wouldn't be as butt-ugly as they are, especially in E2. When you have visual mode with easy shortcuts for various adjustments, there's less incentive to say "fuck it, no one will notice", because the fix is a few clicks away.

Compile times also make a lot of difference.

scifista42 said:

to remove unused resources from the IWADs

There are unused resources in them? Never paid attention to it, but then again, I've never looked through the files thoroughly either.

There are several sprites and menu graphics never used in the game. Ultimate Doom also has some duplicated music lumps and also sprites for relatively many Doom2-only objects.

Maybe they would have made Doom as it was meant to be.

they'd still have been mapping for the 386. restraint would have been key to save everyone from playing the game in postage-stamp-o-vision. when I map for doom2.exe in dosbox, at the back of my mind I'm always wondering if this can be considered "true vanilla" if you're always looking at at least 80 lines and rubbing up against the SEGS shimmer, heh

Da Werecat said:

Maybe Petersen's maps wouldn't be as butt-ugly as they are, especially in E2. When you have visual mode with easy shortcuts for various adjustments, there's less incentive to say "fuck it, no one will notice", because the fix is a few clicks away.

Compile times also make a lot of difference.

Romero's and McGee's maps would probably look completely different, too, since most of their texture choices in Doom2 and E4 were based on "what can I use here that I won't have to do any alignment on?"

They already had something like 3D mode but not autoalign so there would be less misalignments. Not a great deal other than this though as I think the main constraint they had was time.