How "new" will the new Doom be?

Does anyone know if Doom 3 is going to be similar to the Doom games of old, or if it is simply going to be Quake 4 with a different name? I've played the Quakes, Half-Life, etc. and liked them, but they just haven't grabbed me like Doom did. In fact, I got Doom for my Playstation a little while ago and I've had as much fun with it as I've ever had with a video game.

I'd prefer a really high-tech, pumped up version of the old Doom. That means no free-looking (which I'm sure won't happen, but I can dream...), similar weapon/character designs, similar level designs, but also with new characters and weapons and, obviously, highly updated graphics. I'd be in ecstasy if ID ever released a game like this, but I'm afraid that the new Doom will have more in common with Quake than with its namesake.

I dunno, I guess Doom has a certain "something" that all of the newer FPS's just don't have. I find it infinitely more gripping than any other First Person game ever made and I think that it would be a real shame for it to be reduced to just another Quake clone. But that's just me.

Do you guys think that a game like this would be preferable to yet another Quake knock-off, or would you rather the new Doom go the way of current First Person Shooters? And do we know which direction ID is going in yet? My prediction is the latter, unfortunately.

I believe id´s aiming to a Half-Life style. A survival-horror with occult touches on a sci-fi enviroment.

For what we have read in the (few) id interviews, they want to make the plot to be a major part of the gameplay.

It´s definitly a change, not like a Quake4 and not like a revamped DooM. Im pleased with that, I´d like to see id working in something different, yet better.

yuo iditot!!!!!!!! DON TYOU KNOWW THAT DOOM£3 HAS BEN DITSHED!!!

TEH FUTUER IS DOOMXP!!!!!

This post was lame.

Zaldron said:

I believe id´s aiming to a Half-Life style. A survival-horror with occult touches on a sci-fi enviroment.

For what we have read in the (few) id interviews, they want to make the plot to be a major part of the gameplay.

It´s definitly a change, not like a Quake4 and not like a revamped DooM. Im pleased with that, I´d like to see id working in something different, yet better.

Well... that's all good and everything, but it's not Doom. I have no quibbles with iD trying something new, but I'd prefer that they not do it with the Doom name. I guess games like Quake and even Half-Life have a sort of laboriousness about them -- they just aren't as free, streamlined, and playable as Doom. I'd prefer something retro -- the same edge-of-your seat, you-vs-a-million-minions-of-hell, fast-paced, breathless, rushing down hellish corridors in adrenaline-soaked horror feel that Doom has, not something like Resident Evil (and that's not to say that I have any problems with the Resident Evil games, it's just that Resident Evil is Resident Evil and Doom is Doom). Doesn't look like they're gonna do this, though. Oh well.

I hope id puts the fun back in their FPS.

I just picked up Serious Sam here in Dallas at CompUSA for 20.00 US and it has been the best money I have spent lately. I can't stop playing it. It is hard to believe that a game of this quality is only 20.00 while others that go for 50.00 or more (No One Lives Forever, a case in point) don't even come close to it in looks and gameplay.

Not only is the engine better than most (how many engines can display these huge open areas, tons of monsters and have superb frame-rate like SS), it is an unbelievable rush to see dozens monsters bearing down on you in a huge open area with tall building all around you. I think the Croteam has rediscovered what the FPS is all about.

I think the game developers should take notice.

I know I´m going to get flamed by this, but... Serious Sam is a step BACKWARDS in the gaming scene.

And the engine is just average, nothing fancy.

ss121883 said:

Well... that's all good and everything, but it's not Doom. I have no quibbles with iD trying something new, but I'd prefer that they not do it with the Doom name. I guess games like Quake and even Half-Life have a sort of laboriousness about them -- they just aren't as free, streamlined, and playable as Doom. I'd prefer something retro -- the same edge-of-your seat, you-vs-a-million-minions-of-hell, fast-paced, breathless, rushing down hellish corridors in adrenaline-soaked horror feel that Doom has, not something like Resident Evil (and that's not to say that I have any problems with the Resident Evil games, it's just that Resident Evil is Resident Evil and Doom is Doom). Doesn't look like they're gonna do this, though. Oh well.

The "Doom" name, just like the "Quake" name doesn´t mean anything. They´re both the same : "Earth is attacked by an extra-dimensional entity and his army of darkness, and it´s up to the world´s military power to defend all that we love"

If id makes a game called "Broccoli" I´m sure they´ll go for the same premise. Let´s not give id a bad idea : "make New Doom retro because the original Dooms are old".

You can´t reduce "Doom" to "earth is attacked by an extradimensional entity..." That is just the base structure of the story, but Doom isn´t just a story. It´s very own feeling is what "Doom" is all about!
But you don´t need retro features to re-create the Doom feeling, like primitive gameplay elements (no free look, dumb slaughtering etc.). I hope they will re-create that very special Doom athmosphere, but realized in a totally new, modern, thrilling shooter game.

Exactly.

DooM´s about demonic invasions, the loneliness, the horrific landscapes and menacing shadows. The fear, the adrenaline, the sound...

What DooM´s NOT : a fixed-head, chest-located weapon, insane runner, fragfest, stupid monsters, 2.5D game.

Those are the FLAWS of the game, due to technical limitations. Why people want to mantain them?!?

I don´t know. Maybe they mix the things up a bit.

Zaldron said:

Exactly.

DooM´s about demonic invasions, the loneliness, the horrific landscapes and menacing shadows. The fear, the adrenaline, the sound...

What DooM´s NOT : a fixed-head, chest-located weapon, insane runner, fragfest, stupid monsters, 2.5D game.

Those are the FLAWS of the game, due to technical limitations. Why people want to mantain them?!?

yeah, if those limitations weren't there, then doom wouldve hads free look and high-res graphics and crap. thost things will only make it better. adn whats taht i heard about not takign a chance with doom? doom was completely new at teh tiem (escept for wolfenstein...but tehy are differetn) and the coolest thing abotu it at the time was its advanced gameplay/ graphics and stuff. the new doom will be the same

It was new at the time, and the new incarnation has to be NEW again. A Serious Sam DooM mod (wich would also get foxed :D) won´t be at par with the gameplay revolution that DooM meant so many years ago...

Zaldron said:

Exactly.

DooM´s about demonic invasions, the loneliness, the horrific landscapes and menacing shadows. The fear, the adrenaline, the sound...

What DooM´s NOT : a fixed-head, chest-located weapon, insane runner, fragfest, stupid monsters, 2.5D game.

Those are the FLAWS of the game, due to technical limitations. Why people want to mantain them?!?

Yeah, Doom is most definitely about its gloomy atmosphere, but to me it's also about its fast-paced intensity. Call the sprite-based enemies and the inability to freelook flaws if you want, but I thought that the game ended up being better for them -- I, at least, think that the view limitations make it scarier and the sheer NUMBER of enemies and fast speed make it far more playable and purely enjoyable than most other games of its ilk. Who didn't love the feel of rushing frantically from room-to-room, dodging fireballs scampering to the nearest open space to avoid thirty of forty imps and sergeants who are hot on your tail, only to see even more in the new place that you've entered?To me, newer games feel slow, dull, and lethargic in comparison. Doom is a pure adrenaline rush. That it also manages to be about its atmosphere as well -- the gloomy, oppressive, unnerving darkness that manages to be very palpable, even though you barely have enough time to stop and sink it in, makes it a masterpiece in my book, by far the greatest first person game ever made. That's what I associate with the "Doom" name and I don't want the franchise to be castrated and turned into something that it's not. I suppose most other people prefer the newer style, with flashier visuals, fewer enemies, and a slower pace, but to me a Doom game wouldn't be "Doom" if its basic gameplay essence was changed.

That's not to say that I'm complaining that the graphics are going to be updated, or that you'll be able to freelook (its a necessary evil, I suppose). I just want it to have that same frantic, high-adrenaline Doom feel. I say again, there's no point in calling it Doom if it doesn't provide the basic Doom experience.

There´s no need for humongous packed rooms filled with unexplainable hordes of mixed content. Sharp AI and a continuous flow of enemies (kinda like AvP) will be total adrenaline, while mantaining sense.

One could think all this "flaws" are what makes the game superb. Is that so? How can we judge something that didn´t happened? Gaming would be a lot different now if id had made freelook, good AI and logical levels for DooM. Would the gaming scene be better? most certainly.

Would the game be better itself? Who knows? I think so, at least...

Zaldron said:

I know I´m going to get flamed by this, but... Serious Sam is a step BACKWARDS in the gaming scene.

And the engine is just average, nothing fancy.

*lights Zaldron on fire*

*feels bad about it*

*tosses a pot of Mac's coffee on him to put out the flames*

You know... I was talking about ANOTHER kind of "flame" Stphrz :D

Zaldron said:

I know I´m going to get flamed by this, but... Serious Sam is a step BACKWARDS in the gaming scene.

And the engine is just average, nothing fancy.

It's a step that needed to be taken. Classic NES-style fun with modern technology, it doesn't get much better than that*.




























*I haven't played the game yet.

You seem to be enloved with the "Enter" Key lately...

And NO, for God´s sake, it´s not about bringing the classical fun and gameplay of NES, it´s about managing this Columbia-based drug lab and defending it from the vampires before they totally dominate the market, and to spice things a little, if you don´t get to the checkpoint BEFORE the time runs out, you´ll have to solve the mistery of Dr. Haskingston death...

Wildman said:

I hope id puts the fun back in their FPS.

I just picked up Serious Sam here in Dallas at CompUSA for 20.00 US and it has been the best money I have spent lately. I can't stop playing it. It is hard to believe that a game of this quality is only 20.00 while others that go for 50.00 or more (No One Lives Forever, a case in point) don't even come close to it in looks and gameplay.

Not only is the engine better than most (how many engines can display these huge open areas, tons of monsters and have superb frame-rate like SS), it is an unbelievable rush to see dozens monsters bearing down on you in a huge open area with tall building all around you. I think the Croteam has rediscovered what the FPS is all about.

I think the game developers should take notice.

Serious Sam was cool at first, but I soon realized that if you took out all the teleporting monsters and time-delay doors, it would take about a minute to beat each level. Make some levels which don't involve those qualities and I'll play them a few times :)

Zaldron said:

I know I´m going to get flamed by this, but... Serious Sam is a step BACKWARDS in the gaming scene.

And the engine is just average, nothing fancy.

No. It's a step forward, towards fun gameplay, and away from crappy realism mods/games like CrapStrike and Project IGI.

Linguica said:

Serious Sam was cool at first, but I soon realized that if you took out all the teleporting monsters and time-delay doors, it would take about a minute to beat each level. Make some levels which don't involve those qualities and I'll play them a few times :)

Let’s see:

Original Doom had low resolution, limited engine, hordes of monsters, automatic doors and you have said on various occasions that it is the greatest game ever due to it's game play.

Serious Sam has an advanced 3D engine, hordes of monsters in wide-open spaces, automatic doors and it is a piece if crap because of it's game play.

OK.

Oh, and isn’t the par time on Map01 30 seconds WITH the monsters and doors? :)

(I'm just having some fun with you. Don't take it personally. What games people play and like is about as important in the grand scheme of things as a fly buzzing across the room; i.e., not very.)

Anyway :

Serious Sam gameplay IT´S NOT THE SAME AS DooM gameplay.

DooM wasn´t about hordes of monsters. That was Hell Revealed and most user-made projects. The original DooMs were hurting enough those old CPUs. Throwing several dozens of enemies at the same time rendered the game completely umplayable.

Zaldron said:

There´s no need for humongous packed rooms filled with unexplainable hordes of mixed content. Sharp AI and a continuous flow of enemies (kinda like AvP) will be total adrenaline, while mantaining sense.

One could think all this "flaws" are what makes the game superb. Is that so? How can we judge something that didn´t happened? Gaming would be a lot different now if id had made freelook, good AI and logical levels for DooM. Would the gaming scene be better? most certainly.

Would the game be better itself? Who knows? I think so, at least...

Well there has to be a reason that so many people like doom over quake and other FPS. What do you think the reason is? The most obvious differences are the 'flaws' (though I like zdoom so I don't think free look would have ruined doom at all). Doom also wouldn't be any worse if you could jump over other monsters, or if you could have true room over room effects. However for a lot of us, doom is by far a better game than the entire quake series, so what is it?

I am sticking to my definition of doom, and I will apply it to doom 3 after it is out. If I can't draw a picture in paint, and turn it into a monster, then it is NOT doom. If I can't record with my microphone myself going "durf!" in a loud and annoying voice, then implanting it to be the final bosses death sound, then it is NOT doom. If there aren't eventually scores of editing tools, it is certainly NOT doom.

When doom first came out, you couldn't do most of that, so I mean that if after a short amount of time, no editing tools came out allowing it. Can you edit everything in quake as you can in doom? Yes, but you need to be a professional hacker. Don't forget about the editing of frames and weapons.

(if we do not get a dehacked for doom 3, then it is not a sequel to doom, and the name has been ashamed.)