Why is Apple such a piece of shit?

The thing that blows me away is how that's been the key to their success. To add further to my earlier rant, every Apple device I've ever used had a really crappy UI and it blows me away how no one seems to mind. Getting basic shit done is so fucking convoluted, as if they're designed specifically to be different from other devices just for the sake of being different.

I use a MacBook Pro for all my personal stuff and a significant portion of my work. Been doing so for several years now. Feel free to AMA.

Doomkid said:

The thing that blows me away is how that's been the key to their success. To add further to my earlier rant, every Apple device I've ever used had a really crappy UI and it blows me away how no one seems to mind. Getting basic shit done is so fucking convoluted, as if they're designed specifically to be different from other devices just for the sake of being different.

This

I guess Apple in a sense was an introduction to computers to many people? In other words, it's the first time people were enthusiastic about learning and utilising computer software?

I too find it hard for any experienced PC / Microsoft user move to Mac and not get frustrated how it deliberately jumbles all the keys and buttons around just to be different. It can be confusing and easily becomes annoying.

Chezza said:

I too find it hard for any experienced PC / Microsoft user move to Mac and not get frustrated how it deliberately jumbles all the keys and buttons around just to be different. It can be confusing and easily becomes annoying.

It's more likely the result of Microsoft jumbling stuff in an attempt to avoid a "look and feel" lawsuit.

fraggle said:

I use a MacBook Pro for all my personal stuff and a significant portion of my work. Been doing so for several years now. Feel free to AMA.

I think it's definitely just a case of different strokes. I was burned on both iPhones I tried in that they were horribly slow and froze all the time, even when I attempted to optimize power usage as much as I could they still seemed to lock up temporarily all the time and would do things I simply did not want them to do. I also disagree with the way the way their company operates on many fronts, but I'm not one of those crazies who thinks less of people for using Apple or anything like that.

I use an iPhone and while it's a much more stable, powerful and above-all reliable piece of tech than my old Windows Phone (junk junk junk junk JUNK but at least it had a battery life measured in days, not hours) it's definitely something of a walled garden to use. I'd love to customize it more but that'd involve installing iTunes on my PC. Not happening until I break down and just do it.

dethtoll said:

but that'd involve installing iTunes on my PC. Not happening until I break down and just do it.

What exactly is bothersome about installing iTunes? The software update announcements? Otherwise it just sits on your computer.

I never cared for iTunes, I was always for MP3 files.

Avoozl said:

I never cared for iTunes, I was always for MP3 files.

This is a false dichotomy. I use iTunes to organize my MP3 files.

printz said:

What exactly is bothersome about installing iTunes?

The problem used to be uninstalling it. No idea about how it works today, but cleansing your system of itunes in the old days involved bathing your HD in acid.

My big problem with Apple is the significant price increase over your typical PC hardware. $1.5k-2k for an Apple laptop you can get for $700-800 if a PC laptop?

darknation said:

The problem used to be uninstalling it. No idea about how it works today, but cleansing your system of itunes in the old days involved bathing your HD in acid.

I remember this. It was a pain. The computer eventually junked out anyways because we took awful care of it.

Glaice said:

My big problem with Apple is the significant price increase over your typical PC hardware. $1.5k-2k for an Apple laptop you can get for $700-800 if a PC laptop?

13-inch MacBook Pro with Retina display, Core i5, 128GB SSD, 8GB RAM: $1300
13-inch Dell XPS with Quad HD+ display, Core i5, 128GB SSD, 8GB RAM: $1300

Linguica said:

13-inch MacBook Pro with Retina display, Core i5, 128GB SSD, 8GB RAM: $1300
13-inch Dell XPS with Quad HD+ display, Core i5, 128GB SSD, 8GB RAM: $1300

One is for Angry Birds and one is for Steam and every other game ever created.

Use3D said:

One is for Angry Birds and one is for Steam and every other game ever created.

You can get Steam for Mac, so this argument has been pretty weak for years now. (And even before then, you could just virtualize Windows to run the same games.)

It also depends on whether you still play video games.

esselfortium said:

You can get Steam for Mac, so this argument has been pretty weak for years now. (And even before then, you could just virtualize Windows to run the same games.)

Quite a few games aren't available for Mac, even on Steam, and running Bootcamp can be a pain in the ass.

GoatLord said:

Quite a few games aren't available for Mac, even on Steam, and running Bootcamp can be a pain in the ass.

Bootcamp isn't virtualization :)

esselfortium said:

You can get Steam for Mac

Yes, but with a very, very gutted games library.

The Mac version of Steam doesn't even have Commander Keen. There's no excuse for that.

Here's what Apple can do to regain my business in the computer space:

* Make a tower, unlike everyone else, with components I can remove/replace if needed
* Allow other graphics cards to be installed
* Do not lock OpenGL version to the OS to the point where games suffer (OpenGL 4.1? really?)
* Allow current Core i Series to be available


That's about it.

esselfortium said:

You can get Steam for Mac, so this argument has been pretty weak for years now. (And even before then, you could just virtualize Windows to run the same games.)

Ins't that kind of a backwards approach, since a PC can do everything a Mac can without this bullshit? But that virtualization will certainly come in handy when your computer can no longer be updated to the current Mac OS after 2 or 3 versions, forcing you to buy a whole new machine.

Use3D said:

But that virtualization will certainly come in handy when your computer can no longer be updated to the current Mac OS after 2 or 3 versions, forcing you to buy a whole new machine.

What is this nonsense I keep seeing? Every Macbook sold since like 2008 can still run the latest version of OSX.

Linguica said:

What is this nonsense I keep seeing? Every Macbook sold since like 2008 can still run the latest version of OSX.

Not entirely, they are capable of 'running' this operating system partially, meaning many modern features are missing or simply don't work. Is it really worth the trouble since Windows 7 or 8 can be deployed on 10 year old PCs with little effort? The worst is the case is with iphones, where an iOS update makes the phone so sluggish it's barely usable.

Don't get me wrong, like DoomKid I don't disrespect anyone for purchasing a Mac, and they are perfectly capable computers that definitely have their place (though I really, really miss the RISC based architecture). In fact if I were to ever purchase a laptop, it would probably be a Macbook, and I'm certain I would enjoy it.

esselfortium said:

You can get Steam for Mac, so this argument has been pretty weak for years now. (And even before then, you could just virtualize Windows to run the same games.)

kind of defeats the purpose of owning a Mac system if you're going to virtualize a different OS in order to play some games, doesn't it?

i don't particularly care for Apple either way. my family has iPhones, my brother has a Macbook, though i've used Windows all my life and i'm probably not likely to do a switch anytime soon.

printz said:

What exactly is bothersome about installing iTunes? The software update announcements? Otherwise it just sits on your computer.

I got it for my pc and afterwards it fucked up my disk drive and I couldn't use disks anymore and it only worked again when i deleted it

I think the problem is that it's too easy to buy cheap junk products from competitors, giving the impression that Apple ones are superior. There are probably state of the art Android tablets that don't fool the buyer, but you need to look for them carefully.

Use3D said:

Ins't that kind of a backwards approach, since a PC can do everything a Mac can without this bullshit? But that virtualization will certainly come in handy when your computer can no longer be updated to the current Mac OS after 2 or 3 versions, forcing you to buy a whole new machine.

Right now, pretty nearly the only thing I use virtualization for is GZDoom Builder, and performance is good enough that I can just keep my Win7 VM running in the background on a different desktop space, without it ever impacting my ability to do anything else. While it'd of course be more ideal to be able to run GZDB natively in OS X, this is hardly an inconvenience and means I can still use my preferred OS for everything else.

And I don't expect to have to replace my computer after a couple years, since I built it and can swap out the components :) My previous computer was an iMac from early 2009, which was definitely showing its age by the time I finally replaced it in early 2015.

esselfortium said:

And I don't expect to have to replace my computer after a couple years, since I built it and can swap out the components :)

A Hackintosh?! We don't take kindly around here to people who violate their End User License Agreements.

Anybody remember that South Park episode that had the HumancentiPad? I'm waiting for a day when that's an actual thing.

Best Apple product ever.

I have a pretty good Win7 PC for editing and gaming, an 11" MacBook Air i7, an iPad Air 2 and an iPhone 6.

I got the iPhone at the start of 2015 and it will be the only phone I've kept longer than a year. I'll be holding onto it till the iPhone 7 comes out. I also don't currently own a camera, which says a lot about its photographic capabilities. Having loved the iPhone so much, I decided to sell my nexus 10 and Samsung Slate 7 running Windows 8 to get an Air 2 and a Second hand MacBook Air 11". I owned a 15" MacBook Pro with an Nvidia GPU about 4 years ago, and I loved it, but I sold it to fund my photographic additctions. GAS they call it.

The MacBook is my iTunes base for the phone and tablet and I use it whenever I'm doing any serious word processing or typing away from my PC. The iPad Air is a really good device, but there are times when you just need a real keyboard. Sounds a bit excessive to own a MacBook for such things, but it was very cheap and is a real little powerhouse.

OSX is a very streamlined system when you get to know it, and when you switch to another laptop with a regular track pad, it's just terrible. Multi finger gestures are not exclusive, but they work so much better on the MacBooks trackpads it's like chalk and cheese. My wife loves using my MacBook.

iTunes is a pain in the ass the way it duplicates music collections inside the never ending subfolders of users/iTunes/music/media/ etc. Importing a CD into your iTunes library, only to find it disappear because of the embedded info is incredibly frustrating. It's a system that really steers you towards buying through iTunes rather than going through the hassle of importing a CD you already own. Of course my 11" Air has no CD drive, which makes it even more annoying! Once you're used to the quirks though, its a nice elegant way to manage content on your iPad or iPhone. You just need to be sure you have enough time to quickly add some new music, as it might want to sync and backup, which can be torturous.

I have Doom3 on the MacBook and it runs a treat. It's an i7 with 4gb or ram and onboard Intel graphics. It's silky smooth, but chews the battery very quick.

I have Unity and have tried Unreal Engine of it, but Unreal was a slideshow and I'm yet to start anything serious with Unity.

I could never justify paying for a powerful enough MacBook to handle everything I do on my PC. I can't imagine any career that demands a super powerful Macbook, because no doubt your employer would supply you with an iMac. Even if you're self employed, like a photographer or graphic designer, unless you live in coffee shops, your not doing all your work on a laptop somewhere, your at a desk at home in a comfy chair with a big screen.

The rare exception is If you're an elite professional flying all over the globe, sure a killer macbook might be essential. But these people don't have to stop and weigh up costs versus performance. So the crazy price for a specd up MacBook isn't an issue.

The OSX experience is beautiful, but the price makes MacBooks and iMacs a second hand purchase for me, and I'm sure it's the same for many others.

I can understand why some hate apple stuff, but it's really a case of personal taste and budget.

For the $500 AU I paid for my MacBook, I might have been able to get a similar size or more powerful PC laptop, but I simply wanted another MacBook. For me you can't beat the design of the machine, the trackpad and the beautiful simplicity of OSX.

The latest MacBook (the super thin, one port, low powered one), is a technically beautiful thing, but boy it's a very niche product. The guy I bought my MacBook off wanted one real bad, so I saved about $200 on the going used rate.

I would be tempted to sell my iPad Air and MacBook to get an iPad Pro (I want that pen!), but the size of that thing would make it almost impossible to comfortably use in bed (imagine dropping it on your face!) and I certainly couldn't fit it where I can fit my MacBook or iPad Air.

i've gotta be honest, all the talk about Macs this and Macs that makes me wonder if getting a Macbook over other kinds of laptops would be worth it. just for a different experience and all. but it probably wouldn't work so well if i found out half of my applications would be incompatible with it.