DUMP Episode 2: Dump Harder [RELEASED]

https://www.dropbox.com/s/y7ilrs33d6ga1ut/BloodLakeRec.zip?dl=0

Version 1.5 of BloodLakeRec is out! Why 1.5? I don't know man, I'm just trying to make this sound legit.

CHANGELOG:
---------------
-Added room before final room (well it's actually moreso a little preparation room but, same thing)

-Fixed wrong texture in secret
-Changed a bit of placement-related things, added some enemies
--------------------------------------------------------------------

Double post, SO SO SORRY but 1.5.1

CHANGELOG
--------------
-HOM THAT NO ONE TOLD ME ABOUT HAS BEEN FIXED
-haha can't jump to that pesky key now
--------------------

https://www.dropbox.com/s/y7ilrs33d6ga1ut/BloodLakeRec.zip?dl=0

Sorry for the shitty music, Term. Any suggestions for what I should swap it out for?

Alright, I updated Defecation Foundation. I made it more fair, AND I added in new music. Hopefully it's not as *shitty* as it was before.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/y4dg1f6sluy8yz9/Defecation%20Foundation.wad?dl=0

This map is cursed.

I removed a lot of 3D floors and sectors and the fps actually lowered half way through.

The scripts I had for crushing the player when the lifts come down just stopped working (maybe voodoo doll issue). I don't know another way of doing it.

I'm changing the name of the map to just PinchTech because I want to put together all of the building insides I made for a single map release as Pinchtech Enterprises later for GZDoom.

PinchTech

Alright, here's the first batch of feedback. . Each map was played on a GZDoom dev build from earlier in March 2016 from a pistol start on UV. I'm also jumping and crouching freely, since term did that when he streamed the entire wad. I'll add more in the coming days until I finish the whole wad.


MAP01: It's a hub. Map numbers would be nice, but I know it's a work in progress. I'm looking forward to the finished product.

DNF. Please complete.



MAP02: Pretty meh. I think the first half's better than the second. Having to jump up to grab the shotgun was a little different for someone like me used to playing in boom without that. I also got the chainsaw, but couldn't find the second secret.

The canyon with everything trying to kill you was fun to run around in. That was my favorite part. Then it got boring. I know you gave me enough shotgun ammo to do it mapmaker, but baron meat? It's just not well used in the red key area. I wanted to go to sleep during that part.

Also worth noting is that you can jump up on the ledges in the red key area. There doesn't appear to be a way out of the lava below.

50/56 Kills
1/2 Secrets
0 Deaths



MAP03: Fun to explore. Maybe the one secret gives a little too much. I'd reduce it to a backpack, 200 plasma, and the gun. You have enough armor, shells, and bullets lying around already imo. Climbing through the vents was fun.

64/65 Kills
1/1 Secrets
0 Deaths



MAP04: The secret has a problem with it. Set the door tracks to lower unpegged. I like the start. It's a little tough, but if you prioritize, you'll live. The blood in the map is inconsistent. When you're in the red key room, it hurts. When you're fighting for the yellow key, it doesn't. I think you should keep it consistent one way or another.

In addition, the yellow key section is awfully simple for the number of monsters in there. I'm okay with it though. People talk a lot about large battles being won purely by circle strafing. This is one of those battles, but the map does other things well, so it's alright with me.

129/129 Kills
1/1 Secrets
0 Deaths



MAP05: Please set your door tracks to lower unpegged. Map design seemed alright. I think the return teleporter should have its floor texture and height reverted to default. I got a little confused with it being there, and generally destinations aren't marked. Is there an SSG in the other secret? Because otherwise I'd replace the baron in the map with a hell knight.

41/41 Kills
1/2 Secrets
0 Deaths



MAP06: Pretty good. Mandatory nukage, but done right with one more rad suit than you should need in each part. There's goat meat in the form of hell knights, but you get a rocket launcher. Section with the mancubi left me with exactly one rocket: tightly balanced, but good. I had shells too.

I see the author was thinking about texture variation in the corridor with the red/blue key doors. Maybe some of the metal light texture would improve it further.

31/31 Kills
1/1 Secret
0 Deaths



MAP07: Mixed feelings. I think the visuals here are the best I've seen so far. The gameplay frustrated me with hitscanners placed specifically to restrict my movement, little health, and the SSG apparently locked away in a secret when I really needed it in the map's latter two thirds. The idea of alternate versions of one area is cool though. So is the use of the mancubus and arachnotron tags to reveal two keys. The lack of orthogonal lines looks great.

100% Kills (PEs added to it)
2/6 Secrets (got an invuln AFTER I needed it in a useless location, was only able to reach it after everything in the area was dead)
4 Deaths



MAP08: Where's the ammo? Starting at the red key room, I had to run for the objectives because I didn't have enough to fight back. I know I missed one box of rockets in the lava pit. That's not enough for all the hell knights and mancubi I left behind.

ZDoom features are used well here, on the other hand. I noticed a slope, a 3D room, and a camera. Good job with that.

98/111 Kills
0/1 Secrets
0 Deaths



MAP09: If the quote at the beginning hadn't tipped me off, I would've sworn the first two thirds of it was made by someone else. It's much better than the last part. I wouldn't mind seeing more of Kinsie mapping at his best, but because of the letdown ending, the map gets an overall "meh" from me.

Specifics? I like how there's a bit of a scramble in the first part. The hell knight's formidable your first time through, but avoidable. I ran around him, tagged the switch, and moved on. I also like the echo effect the indoor areas there use. If I didn't already know about reelism, I'd make a remark that Kinsie knows his zdoom effects well. It's still impressive, though. I've never played the mod. Maybe this'll change my mind.

Besides how bland the last third looked compared to the earlier parts, the gameplay felt monotonous. I blasted through most of it exclusively with the plasma doled out, and even had nearly enough left to fight the predictable cyberdemon at the end. The handful of rockets I had finished him off with a few to spare.

Last note: I got the slot machine secret. That was great.

100% Kills (forgot the count)
3/7 secrets (I got the funny one!)
0 Deaths



MAP10: Pretty good. I didn't need the BFG. Ammo's a little tight, but I managed okay. First use of the computer map and deep water I've seen in the wad. Stepping out into the outdoor area for the first time was fun. Lots of stuff flying at you keeps it interesting.

The one knock I have against this map is the way the author hemmed in the circuit texture on the inside. Whatever that gray wall texture is on the edges of the circuits needs to be changed. It's an eyesore.

41/41 Kills
3/3 Secrets
0 Deaths



MAP11: Since I know the author's posted a newer version on DW than the one that's included in the main wad (probably), I'll review the latest one instead.

It's pretty strong in terms of the traps compared to others I've played in this wad. The ammo's reasonable and I got a megasphere I didn't need toward the end. I'd replace that with a soul sphere.

81/81 Kills
3/4 Secrets
0 Deaths



MAP12: Currently broken. The marines don't do anything when you reach the teleporter and you get mobbed by unlimited imps.

Other than that, I thought the map started very slowly. Giving a shotgun sooner would be nice. So would making the beserk pack a little easier to straferun over to. Try raising a temporary bridge or something. It's pretty difficult to reach even after you shoot the switch.

DNF. Please revise.



MAP13: Cheeky quote. I like it. The map's pretty good too, both visually and gameplay-wise. Having to crouch to survive the archvile got me once. Not shooting the hot tub imps with the pistol got me the other time. I couldn't fight the HK with them around.

100% Kills
100% Secrets
2 Deaths



MAP14: there's not enough ammo, and I didn't even attempt to fight the skeletons guarding the red key. I like the lighting, but it may be too dark for people playing in software mode. You should brighten everything by at least 32 units.

DNF. Please revise.

I wasn't completely sure if I should bump the thread with additional feedback since no-one else has posted since my last message. I decided to go ahead with it since the project is still in progress. I don't think it counts as a necrobump since it's ongoing. The maps are getting longer as I go along. So much for reaching 30 tonight.

MAP15: That improved a lot. I really didn't like the beginning, but once the author took things indoors, it got better. I had a little trouble after getting the yellow key. I couldn't get out without noclipping. Later I found the pushable wall from the other side of an area, but I'm not sure if you can open it from the other side, since I jumped off the 3D bridge to reach the key.

100% Kills
3/4 Secrets
0 Deaths



MAP16: You align textures with the arrow keys when the flat is selected in visual mode. Other than that, I thought the level was pretty good. Even though I got hosed by RNG hitscanners in the second room, the secret had more than enough health in it to compensate. The level of detail in the sectors was great too. I also LOVE doom furniture.

37/37 Kills
1/1 Secrets
0 Deaths



MAP17: Pretty good. Someone knows their traps. I especially like the archvile sitting on the blue armor. I activated it a little earlier than I should have, I think. I still survived.

74/74 Kills
3/5 Secrets
0 Deaths



MAP18: Compartmentalized. Each section does its own thing. With all the open space in the red key area, more monsters would've made it more interesting. I had way too much space to run around in. Still, pretty fun.

308/354 Kills
3/6 Secrets
0 Deaths



MAP19: Does this ever end? I took 4 deaths by hitscanner mobs and gave up in the yellow key wing. This reminds me of some of the worst maps in TNT with all the globs of enemies. Check the doors in the red key wing. Some of them need the sides set to lower unpegged. If I hadn't found tons of health in secrets I would've given up sooner. It was the nukage river with all the guys that made me give up.

DNF
5/9 Secrets
4 Deaths



MAP20: Uhhhh...what was I doing again? I started the map, wandered around, got the yellow key, ran out of ammo, wandered around some more, found a yellow door, barely survived a spider demon, and it was over. Where's the ammo? The colored lighting was nice. Putting the guns I needed to fight the mastermind at his feet was NOT nice. I'm lucky I survived picking them up. The colored lighting looked good.

33/106 Kills
No Secrets
0 Deaths



MAP21: I like the concept of being underwater. The gameplay's pretty simple. More challenge would be great. Maybe an archvile or two after you open the path down by the river instead of a single imp? He could raise the demons down there.

56/56 Kills
1/2 Secrets
0 Deaths



MAP22: Mmmmm. Tastes like ribbiks lite. Frantic start, screaming skeletons, everything being trapped, and harmful secrets are all things I've grown to like in doom. The skybox is broken, but other than that, the map is great. This is easily my favorite level so far.

88/154 Kills
2/2 Secrets
1 Death



MAP23: Fun! I oouldn't flip the keyed switches. I also couldn't kill the IoS at the end. The lift seemed to be a one-time thing and I couldn't reach it fast enough. Great start, though.

The cyberspace concept in this map reminds me of Icarus. That wasn't quite as polished as the offering here, though.

DNF
3/4 Secrets
1 Death (2 cyberdemon deaths 2 maps!)




MAP24: Where's the ammo? I managed to get through the level, but it's a little tight for my liking. Getting a foothold in the room behind the yellow door killed me twice. Autoaim puts you at a disadvantage there with the chaingunner high up and the spectre below. I couldn't rocket him easily.

Visually, the map's one of the most impressive I've seen since Ijon's level. I also like the invuln blitz at the end. It may not be the hardest one I've played, but it was fun. It's also a great contrast to the very slow play of the rest of the level.

Kills: No idea. I ran when my ammo went dry at the end.
1/2 Secrets
2 Deaths



MAP25: Tough start. I had to run around for a bit before I got everything, and even after that, I wasn't comfortable with my ammo situation until about halfway through. I like the Powerslave textures. Epic 2 isn't one of my favorite wads, but the visuals are used well here. The final fight is easily resolved by circle strafing and infighting. I got hit by a stray rocket my first time playing it, but I never really had to make an effort to win. Just waiting the bad guys out worked perfectly fine.

177/180 Kills
1/2 Secrets
1 Death



MAP26: I like the idea of parts of the map floating in the void. I also like that I can't fall into it and take an instant death like one or two prior maps have done. Gameplay's pretty good. The author looks like he's trying to set up crossfires a lot of the time. I got beat up quite a bit, so he did a pretty good job, considering that's how I think when I map, too. The amount of health I found made it pretty forgiving, though. Ammo was plentiful too. I had fun.

92/93 Kills
2/5 Secrets
0 Deaths



MAP27: Can't progress beyond the courtyard after you break out of prison.

DNF.

@SoundofDoomDoors

there is no ssg in my map (MAP07) - that was a conscious design decision, as I wanted to focus more on the rocket launcher and plasma rifle in the later areas

plus, a super shotgun in the hell area would just annihilate the cave and techbase areas, even more than the plasma rifle does - at least with plasma you have to moderate its usage in those areas, which balances out its power in an area where the toughest enemy has 500 hp (and most are under 200), and an area where the toughest enemy has 150 hp (and most are under 100)

---

which hitscanners are you talking about? the 'turret' hitscanners in the cave area are set up in such a way that a single rocket will dispatch each batch

while the hell area doesn't allow for that, I count only 11 hitscanners in that entire area, four of which are chaingunners - only a couple of the shotgunners should even be able to see you at any given time, and they go down in a couple chaingun taps, so it can't be that bad

and if you're talking about the techbase area, there's only so much you can do with zombies, imps, and demons, and if I just placed them in front of you they'd be dead before they could do anything, so iuno

---

edit: the invuln is there to make the archviles that spawn in easier to deal with (as if they need to be any easier to deal with), but if you have other parts of the map left to clear then feel free to rocket straight through them with the invuln too

SoundofDoomDoors said:

I wasn't completely sure if I should bump the thread with additional feedback since no-one else has posted since my last message. I decided to go ahead with it since the project is still in progress. I don't think it counts as a necrobump since it's ongoing.

Yeah, most of the activity has been on the ZDoom forum--going on almost 30 pages. Which I guess I'm not really surprised about, given that this is a ZDoom mapset, but there you have it, ah-hah.
Next time, I'll probably keep it on just the ZDoom forums. It's almost embarrassing the disparity in forum activity.

Suitepee said:

It's good to see NOVA inspiring other newbie mapping projects to step forward!

I suppose if there's one thing that will be constant in my life, it's people attributing my inspiration to things completely unrelated to the project. :P

Alrighty, BloodLakeRec is updated to its (hopefully) final version. I'll also go through and play some of these maps, as I feel kinda spoiled for having all this information and feedback available (thanks, SoundofDoomDoors) while not having posted feedback myself. (possibly) expect a post later, in case anyone wants any final feedback or changes to make.

CHANGELOG
-----------
-Blood does not hurt you.
-Secret door is fixed.
-Fixed a really embarrassing error in my map that hopefully no one noticed.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------

https://www.dropbox.com/s/y7ilrs33d6ga1ut/BloodLakeRec.zip?dl=0

@SoundOfDoomDoors - since you'd stopped just before my map (MAP28), I'd recommend using this version of it instead. The version in DUMP-2-test0.pk3 is outdated.

I mean, technically this new version is outdated too, since I've already started to revise portions, but since my latest revision isn't done, this'll have to do.

The map name in this version is "SHADWHOG", tho.

BloodLakeRec FINAL


So i forgot that this whole thing is mainly on the Zdoom forums, and I hopped on over. JUICY FEEDBACK, YAY

CHANGELOG
-------------
-too many things to count
-----------------------------

https://www.dropbox.com/s/y7ilrs33d6ga1ut/BloodLakeRec.zip?dl=0

Yeah I'm posting here because I'm too lazy to register over there. I follow the thread though! The revised version of Blood Lake Rec is covered here. I just played it before 32. I also played the revised version of shadowhog's map. I didn't see too much different with it, but I did try it. Here's 28 - 37.

MAP28: Boxed in after an imp ambush. I was most of the way through the map and was waiting for it to end. The hitscanners at the beginning are annoying. So is being pitted against several arachnotrons with only a single shotgun. The platforming's executed well, but it just isn't my thing.

Also, you should add at least 1 secret to the map. If I recall correctly, failing to have at least 1 secret results in a 0% secrets count at the end of a map. Don't make players not watching the secrets counter in the HUD as closely as I do think they've missed something!

DNF. The above was based on an old build of the level. I've played the newest one independent of the dump 2 test build and see little in the way of changes, except perhaps the lighting. I still can't complete the map and every issue above still appears.



MAP29: Hi John. No, not really, but this does remind me a lot of knee deep in the dead. It's a tribute played straight, and very well done. There's even a D2 monster or two roaming around. I think it's a little on the easy side, even compared to its inspiration, though. Some areas felt larger than they needed to be, like there was a lot of empty space.

136/136 Kills
2/3 Secrets
0 Deaths



MAP30: Wow. I'm impressed. You got a little bit of Duke in my Doom with the underwater parts + sticking ammo under it. The opening was visually stunning, but I did find myself a little bored in the latter half. I took a break after getting killed in the factory section. That part was not fun. I'd cut it and just have the courtyard area, which I liked because I had freedom to run around, connect to an elevator that leads straight up to the area with the key.

The cyberdemon at the end was predictable. Getting him to kill all his buddies was satisfying, if a little easy.

363/398 Kills
1/6 Secrets
2 Deaths



MAP31: Where's the rocket launcher? I gave up at the end of the map because I never found it and kept running into more archviles than I could manage with the SSG alone. It's in the one secret, right? Take it out of there and put it in the main area somewhere. If I missed it and it isn't in a secret, disregard my complaint.

DNF



Blood Lake Rec Revision (squeezed in, forgot what map number it was): Interesting. I don't remember if there was a way to avoid the opening where hitscanners took potshots at you in the first version, but here you're free to go to the next room and leave them alone. Just don't take the shotgun ammo in the starting area and you won't get shot. The map also seems brighter overall than I remember. The blue key door still needs to have its sides set to lower unpegged, though. Good improvements!

129/129 Kills
1/1 Secrets
0 Deaths




MAP32: Ammo famine! That was all I could think about for the first half of the level. It's possible, though. More outside of secrets early on would be great. I don't know how you intended for me to get by the cyberdemons without getting one of the two invulnerabilities I tried. Running for the teleporter without one got me killed twice. Pretty good map overall, though. The floating at the end was cool too. It's like Xen from Half-Life, but doesn't overstay its welcome. Good choice.

334/379 Kills
8/13 Secrets
2 Deaths



MAP33: That's a lot of dead bodies. I died once at the beginning because I played too aggressively, but once I got out of the first room, the rest of the map REWARDED my aggression with ludicrous gibs in every area (thanks smooth doom). The last map was an ammo famine; this is a feast. Maybe there are too many hitscanners, not because of difficulty, but because of all the ammo I left lying around.

I also noticed the map was very boxy. Try placing some lines at angles other than 90 degrees. You might like it!

I had fun, but in a "turn your brain off and admire the gore" kind of way.

100% Kills
50% Secrets
1 Death



MAP34: At first I was thinking it was a good original idea, different from anything I've seen in the wad so far. Then I saw the end area and quit. No amount of health, or even an invuln, could convince me to do that.

DNF.




MAP35: Dev commentary time! It's always easier to write on something you've played a hundred-plus times as opposed to once.

This is my second exitable level. The first time around, I wanted to make a map I could get out of. With that hurdle out of the way for this map, I went for difficulty this time around. The end is truly above my normal skill level. Even knowing the map as well as I do, all five of my deaths were during the archvile blitz at the end.

Health is fairly generous. So is ammo, except if the archies pin you down at the end. Then you die. Kill the cyberdemons faster to live. Also try taking advantage of the fact that the viles are deaf. You can walk behind the first one and point blank him for a cheap opening kill. When I was working on the map, I did that by accident, but I loved it so much I never "fixed" it.

Jumping to reach the goodies on the throne won't be fixed either. It does more harm than good to take them early in my mind, unless you're playing from a carry-over. In that case, have fun BFGing the skeleton mob. From a pistol start, have fun being defenseless against the viles when you find out you've used your ammo for the easy part.

Something else I'd like to do is open up the side corridors before I release the skeleton mob. Term had no idea what hit him on stream, even though he sarcastically noted "Gee I wonder what's going to happen in this room" when he saw the megasphere. He knew he was going to get mobbed, but had no idea how I expected him to live, judging by how he tried to stay in the main area. Revealing the side passages before you flip the switch will fix that. I noticed one opening up out of the corner of my eye when I turned to face the enemies this playthrough, but I don't think that's enough for people without foreknowledge of the map to have a fighting chance.

210/218 Kills (last few enemies are bugged!)
1/1 Secrets
5 Deaths



MAP36: That was an amazing contrast with my map. Where I was going for superfast action, this is much, MUCH more deliberate. Props to term for arranging them like this.

Design-wise, I think somebody likes their Doom64. But it's not just D64 that came to mind when I played this level. It was almost like there were more demons on the space station once, but then a Lovecraftian horror swept through and left a few stragglers behind because they were beneath its notice. That's how amazing the atmosphere is. Even with the number of enemies and the challenge low, the map still maintained my interest. Great job. This is one of my favorite levels of the wad.

63/63 Kills
1/3 Secrets
0 Deaths



MAP37: Where are the guns? I can't get beyond the first few rooms without a weapon! I did find the alternate way out after hitting two switches, but it's a dead end. I even switched on iddqd after a few deaths to try and find a gun. I managed to kill a chaingunner in the acid falls room, but then I kept going and ran into a wall of baron meat. Something's missing from this map.

DNF

SoundofDoomDoors said:

MAP28: ...being pitted against several arachnotrons with only a single shotgun [is annoying].

That was my attempt at blocking off an area with monsters stronger than the weapons you have can handle. There's a SSG on the other path, by some chaingunners (and, by extension, a chaingun, too) which makes the Arachnotron fight more straightforward. I'm not exactly pleased with that fight even after that, however; not sure how to best revise it.

SoundofDoomDoors said:

Also, you should add at least 1 secret to the map. If I recall correctly, failing to have at least 1 secret results in a 0% secrets count at the end of a map. Don't make players not watching the secrets counter in the HUD as closely as I do think they've missed something!

I don't think secrets are mandatory, though. Still, don't fret it, the next build already has a few.

SoundofDoomDoors said:

DNF. The above was based on an old build of the level. I've played the newest one independent of the dump 2 test build and see little in the way of changes, except perhaps the lighting. I still can't complete the map and every issue above still appears.

The changes mostly applied a little bit after where you died, or if you were playing in Zandronum 2.1.2 (where the scripts were horrifically broken).

Anyway, that still leaves the hitscanners-at-start complaint to handle, though I'm not sure how/if I will; maybe lessen the amount, but the idea was to have enemies with the consistency of wet paper to start off with there.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/io1py7ymv6kd9vr/DUMP-2-test2.pk3?dl=1

Here we go! Second test build is ready to go! Only five days after I expected it to be!
I think I've included everyone's updates, fixes, and quotes, and a lot of the credits are implemented too. The hub is implemented as well, as well as the final map and the final battle.

This will be the last test build. If you have any last-minute fixes, make them count. If you have any last-minute criticisms, make them count. If you have anything you want to address or correct, let me know now, before it's too late!

Aaaand it's out. First post updated.
Fucking finally. Almost two months of work. I have a newfound appreciation for community project organizers.

It was a thrilling ride, from start to finish. It was fun, and a nice learning experience for all of us. Lots of folks learned how to map. I learned things to do differently (have a more efficient update system, keep track of what's changed for changelogs in additional test builds, HAVE A CAVEAT FOR IF I GET 192481-23 MAPS). And deep down inside, we all learned how to love, a little more.
For the folks that mapped, pat yourself on the back. Good or bad, making something is always worthy of celebration.

For the folks that want to play, well. Have fun.

Phew. That was a pain in the ass of hunting down everyone and beating them until they fixed stuff, but here we go.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/5nwgk3mt4qudpqu/DUMP-2v2.pk3?dl=1
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B4p2zWkJEFFtU2szX0ZkRXpQSVU/view?usp=sharing

And with that, DUMP 2 is officially completed! Almost three months after the fact, fucking hell. I'll be pushing both DUMP 1 and DUMP 2 to /idgames sometime on Monday or Tuesday. Hopefully they'll be accepted soon-ish.
Still, it was fun. And for everyone that contributed, congratulations. Hopefully we've all learned a lot.

I know I have. For DUMP 3, I'm planning:
- Update logs for each iteration of test builds, saying what changed what.
- Contingency plans for 64+ maps.
- A co-host helping out with managing everything.
- A not-as-long warm-up/preparation period, so people aren't sitting on their thumbs so much.
- Zandronum 3.0 compatibility rather than 2.1.2.
- CASTRATE ANYONE WHO USES THE SWITCHES LUMP AND RECOMPILES THE ENTIRETY OF TEXTURES

But when will DUMP 3 be announced?
Hmmmm...

Let's say next week? The 29th.