"The Return" - John Romero and Adrian Carmack's Announcement Video

They were bound to harness some nostalgia for their pitch, since that's what makes them notable in the first place, but I didn't get the feeling that they were solely relying on it. They've got an idea, and Kickstarter is a pretty good way to fund it, gauge interest and hopefully be a bit transparent during the development process. I'm excited for this, I think it could be a fun game, and that's all I ask. Adrian's involvement is as key as John's, IMHO.

NoisM said:

700K isn't too small if their choice is UE4 - technicals tools are pretty easy.

So that's the engine they are using? You think Romero might start feeling the engine is starting to feel outdated by 2018?

Touchdown said:

Yup, very much. Another project that they wanted to sell on nostalgia. Both pitches are really weak. I wonder what is their idea of maintaining that campaign. Again, they have no game at all so what else can they show to get people excited?

Even if I ignore everything else, I still don't like the idea of all that holographic nonsense. The concept art is garbage too.

But you know what? This is a very good thing. Let's see if people really want an oldschool FPS or is it just a vocal minority of cynical whiners that complain about DOOM4 and modern shooters in general. And if it doesn't reach the goal, well, that'll be answer as to why they don't make games like that anymore.

+1 this post.

I disagree with the lack of footage shown. I know John Romero and even Adrian Carmack have good intentions but I won't be sold on the kickstarter just because of them.

*Edit* Has anyone reversed the end message? Do we need to kill John Romero again?

Don't lose hope yet!

"Hey everyone, thanks for the continued support and civil discourse here. We've got a few really awesome things to share with you today."

20 min ago

Since I absolutely love to bitch about modern fps games, I decided to put my money where my mouth is and pledge $29, it's a bit of a gamble but I'm interested to see the outcome, and it's the least I can do to show my appreciation to the man that created Doom.

MrGlide said:

more like Doom 1+2+quake 1 showed us right? 3:1 is good odds.(edit) and it's this attitude that pushed john away from our community, Every one wants to be like "OHHH BUT DAIKATANA!!!" The man has done some great things for this community.

Yeah, and most of these people have a short memory when it comes to AAA companies. :P

I'm not going to defend the Daikatana personally... but it was 16 years ago, he has worked on low key projects since then and none of those seemed to be controversial... I believe in second chances, afterall; Romero was a lot younger at the time and he seems to have humbled since, and his new map was pretty good!

Having other talented team members specializing in different departments (including PR haha), as was the case in Doom, we have a potentially great game on our hands, or atleast one that's worth the $29.

Touchdown said:

But you know what? This is a very good thing. Let's see if people really want an oldschool FPS or is it just a vocal minority of cynical whiners that complain about DOOM4 and modern shooters in general. And if it doesn't reach the goal, well, that'll be answer as to why they don't make games like that anymore.

I'm looking forward to both, there's plenty of overlap I'm sure.

Did he release another map? I can't find a thread about it on the forum(?)

https://twitter.com/romero/status/725032002244759552

Played a little, died a couple of times :D

It's a legitimate oldschool map. It has some numbers on the ground flats, didn't pay enough attention to these, I will when I play it seriously when I have more time.

We wanted something where you could be in Boot Hill in a showdown in a Wild West town. A door opens and then you are in a castle and the ceiling is falling. What just happened?

Gore happened?

I laughed out loud when the narration changed from Romero to the scruffy-80's person narrating the game. Aside from the "community driven, hardcore FPS, back to roots of FPS design" aspects that he's trying to push hard for, I don't really see the theme to be anything special or drastically unique.

That's one half of the original id team. Now all we need is John Carmack and Tom Hall to rejoin as well, including American McGee. Sandy Petersen, while he made a few decent Doom and Doom 2 maps, most of them were either mediocre or filler, and the "magic" he worked on Tom Hall's maps was pretty pointless, though to be fair, they were more playable compared to his own maps. Cool to hear Bobby Prince made the music for this cute Star Wars reference skit, now if Lee Jackson (even if he hadn't worked for id) were to make some music for their new game as well, that would triple my nerdgasm cause Lee and Bobby were an unstoppable duo with Rise of the Triad and Duke Nukem 3D.

To give Sandy some credit, he has claimed in a previous interview to have worked on a lot of the balancing in Doom (2?) which, given his large catalog of tabletop games he's worked on, might hold some weight.

Not releasing some kind of footage was a huge mistake on his part.

ChekaAgent said:

I really hope it'd be Sandy Petersen. This guy is master at level design!

If it's gonna be an RPG, most definitely Sandy Petersen will be a good addition.

Looks like they cancelled the kickstarter about 30 minutes ago to focus on building a demo before trying it again. I'd say that's a pretty good move, but I don't know if it'll have that initial push when they relaunch it. Hope what they come out with is more interesting.

This is for the better. Romeros contributions to gaming are legendary but it has been nearly 20 years since Quake... and Daikatana, a game he led did not go well. This isn't like Igarashi who shipped a shit load of solid Castlevania titles and was able to get by on his reputation.

Romero released those maps in an attempt to persuade classic fans that this game will be classic focused and that he hasn't lost touch of the 90's style. Let's wait and see how the gameplay demo turns out and reserve judgment until then.

MetroidJunkie said:

Romero released those maps in an attempt to persuade classic fans that this game will be classic focused and that he hasn't lost touch of the 90's style. Let's wait and see how the gameplay demo turns out and reserve judgment until then.

I don't doubt Romero will make fun maps and that Adrian will make cool art, however the rest of the game still needs to be solid, which is why I'm glad they are postponing and making a demo.
Plus that means we get to check it out real early :D

wheresthebeef said:

I don't doubt Romero will make fun maps and that Adrian will make cool art, however the rest of the game still needs to be solid, which is why I'm glad they are postponing and making a demo.
Plus that means we get to check it out real early :D

Ya I'm excited we'll get to check it out early, this is definetly for the best.

To me this just shows that they are not very smart to begin with. ANYONE could have told them that trying to KS a game based on their names alone is a stupid idea. The fact that people had to tell them that is not encouraging.

MetroidJunkie said:

Romero released those maps in an attempt to persuade classic fans that this game will be classic focused and that he hasn't lost touch of the 90's style. Let's wait and see how the gameplay demo turns out and reserve judgment until then.

While the maps are good they are nowhere near the level of something like Sunlust or Valiant. They do not convince me he still has it.

Sunlust or Valiant
90's style

Pick one.

DooM_RO said:

While the maps are good they are nowhere near the level of something like Sunlust or Valiant. They do not convince me he still has it.

Personally I like the IWAD style a lot so I'm thoroughly convinced he still knows how to design fun environments. It's a matter of taste, you can't just say they're "nowhere near" because personally the new Romero maps are far more up my alley.

DooM_RO said:

While the maps are good they are nowhere near the level of something like Sunlust or Valiant. They do not convince me he still has it.

That's your opinion.

DooM_RO said:

While the maps are good they are nowhere near the level of something like Sunlust or Valiant. They do not convince me he still has it.

Uh, what?

Those maps are a completely different style, you are trying to compare apples with oranges.

I'm convinced that if he was out to make a high-quality ZDoom map with all bells and whistles he'd surely be capable, but he clearly wanted to do a classic Doom map with classic features and classic texturing. And in that category they are very good.

Graf Zahl said:

Uh, what?

Those maps are a completely different style, you are trying to compare apples with oranges.

I'm convinced that if he was out to make a high-quality ZDoom map with all bells and whistles he'd surely be capable, but he clearly wanted to do a classic Doom map with classic features and classic texturing. And in that category they are very good.

Yes, yes we all know E1 and his new maps are amazing but can he do more than that? People have surpassed him in pretty much every way and he's going to have to prove himself all over again. That is IF he intends to use his new maps as an indication of what to expect.

I don't think mapping with Doom is comparable to mapping with a newer engine more than two decades ahead. His recent work was a warm up. If anything you should base it more on the gameplay rather than the visual aspects. If you had fun playing his maps, then hopefully he'll translate this in his new endeavour.

Sunlust and Valiant don't really come into it.

Six said:

I don't think mapping with Doom is comparable to mapping with a newer engine more than two decades ahead. His recent work was a warm up. If anything you should base it more on the gameplay rather than the visual aspects. If you had fun playing his maps, then hopefully he'll translate this in his new endeavour.

Sunlust and Valiant don't really come into it.

I think you're right.

Romero released one map recently, correct? There is a lot of maps, plural, being thrown around in this thread that he made recently. Is there another recent one aside from Tech Gone Bad?

Hellbent said:

Romero released one map recently, correct? There is a lot of maps, plural, being thrown around in this thread that he made recently. Is there another recent one aside from Tech Gone Bad?

ya A E1M4 replacment. https://www.dropbox.com/s/0kw4fqg1tuxpnxx/e1m4b.zip