Hi. I wanna contribute some original music to Freedoom

jupiter_ex said:

freedoom2.mid - volume raised
freedoom3.mid - volume raised, looping fixed
DSSHOTGN.WAV - yet again more punch put to shooting part

Checked in game, the midis are louder (I like that) and the looping is fixed for the second midi.
The shotgun sound, I love it. Do you reckon it's ready for submission? People have claimed before that it was bad, and this is an improvement over that one if you ask me. It certainly is more satisfying. I built a wad for it in Deutex and no problems came by, so it can be added to repo safely.

Btw: https://github.com/freedoom/freedoom/pull/407 Not sure if freedoom3.mid should go in as of yet, so let's go with just C1M5. Once it gets added, the OST of Phase 1 and Phase 2 will basically be complete (as in: it won't require any major work anymore).

63 completely original tracks (!), leaving only FreeDM to deal with. It's had some music updates too but it's still lacking music.

If you're upto to it, c1m6, map11, map20 and map23 could use a boost in volume too. Map10 and map16 might need their volumes decreased a bit.

hm, remember that freedoom2 and 3 were the 'action-oriented' tunes FreeDM needed. I recall we actually agreed to use 'test1' https://soundcloud.com/mrmusica/test1 for C1M5 initially (I'm currently at work and a little fuzzy on all details).
Or actually, assign them as you see fit, but remember we still have that one other track. I was waiting for a moment of availability to finish deploying that one to midi (as freedoom1.mid) and send it over too.

Boosting the volume to raw midis proved extremely tricky for me (I might no longer have the suitable tools. Would have to look for some if I have to). I actually boosted the volume on the original proprietary format track, then deployed to midi. Hence I can't assure you how well it could go if I had to work on other people's songs that are only available in midi format.
I mean I could do some research, but that's time I'd rather use in some more sfx or in trying to deliver 'test1'. It also depends in how much the rush for all that is.

EDIT: feel free to integrate the shotgun sfx. Any further improvements, if any, can be done in future iterations

Everything's subject to change right now, so no worries. The way you phrased how you were unable to export test1 to midi made it seem like it's a lost cause, hence the c1m5 assignment. But if you do successfully export it, it can easily be added and test2 can be moved to FreeDM.

I did say if you're upto it, so no pressure. It's not a priority at the moment.

Gonna check out if the shotgun sound is appropriate for the chaingunners, because apparently the sound used for the chaingunners is the shotgun sound. Hoping chungy can add it to Freedoom himself soon :D

true! the shotgun sound is used for the chaingunners. I forgot that. I remember I went to map07 to see if the plasma sound I was making fitted well the 'arachnotrons', but forgot about that one.
(Kinda related, I've noticed the lifting platforms use the same sound as the opening doors in Freedoom, which is something that doesn't happen in the original Doom. So I've been wondering if it's an engine limitation at all or rather a design decision)

The test1 problem is not a lost cause at all. I only need to sit and do that, when all the rest is done.

I would like give some thought to midi volumes issue. I'm pretty sure the global volume should be a numeric variable if I look at the midi file format so I should be able to simply rise the volume like that. It's important to have the same music volume across the game. That's what would be called 'normalizing' if we were using waveform audio.

And lastly, let me know any criticism you have about the plasma sound (it's not finished, yet I still think I'd have that one over the old one). I can continue working on it but I need to know what direction to take.

I can't say much for the plasma sound as Freedoom's plasma sound was far from irritating (unlike Doom). Quite soothing in fact, which felt unique and appropriate for it.

The main concern to me was the shotgun, super shotgun and bfg sounds. Seeing the new shotgun sound having more punch to it feels great, so doubt about that.

The new plasma sound is still something I'm trying to get my head around to. I keep getting reminded of a railgun whenever I hear it. It has this pow in it that feels like it might make a good bfg sound (specifically the firing part). That's just my opinion.

I think that's precisely the issue: it's a matter of opinions. That's the very reason why I didn't start work on the BFG as you suggested. As a matter of fact, I was pretty much surprised when you mentioned that the BFG fx was atrocious: I thought it was surprisingly good :D. My only concern with sfx were actually the shotgun and the plasma gun. Actually I found the plasma gun to sound quite flat and unappealing :P

I think maybe more people should give their opinion on which if any sfx are the most "hated"/prone to be prompted for replacement.
If you really like, I could begin work on the bfg sound (though, as I said, I thought it was pretty good). Maybe I can just try to add more punch to the old plasma sound, and repurpose what I have for the BFG. I don't know. I don't know which part of the BFG "several-stages" sound it is that you hate the most

If you think you can make the plasma sound better than the current sound, then go for it. Like I said: no one's stopping you.

Btw, the chaingunners now sound like their guns are full of power, which is great tbh.

Just posting to say your music is now in FreeDM and your shotgun sound is in all three IWADs :)

if you're still there, you could also have a look at the SSG sounds, as they don't fit really well the new SSG sprites (at all if you ask me). I'm sure others have also noticed the strangeness of the SSG sounds with the new SSG sprites.

yes I'm here. Anyway...

SSG, SSG... what would be the SSG..? Super shotgun? :D

Yeah. Three sounds

1. Opening sound: DSDBOPEN

2. Loading sound: DSDBLOAD

3. Closing sound: DSDBCLOS (?)

These sounds fit the old SSG, but not with the new one.

Btw, hows test1 coming out anyway?

test1 status: I have to readjust volumes, and recreate some of the percussion, but I have a .mid already.

about the shotgun: the problem with me only updating freedoom ocasionally is, I don't completely remember what the previous SSG was, or how the sfx fitted that one better. Last SSG I remember was a futuristic thing with some red leds on one side, that you reloaded from under the barrels (I liked that idea). It was good but the outline was sketchy.

I'll take a look at the SSG current sound, though to be honest I found it good, and as a matter of fact took it as a reference for the shotgun sound (in order not to surpass it). I really liked the shot sound, the only problem I noticed was the tail of that sound was cut when the reloading sound began.

If you have any suggestions on what is bad, or what would you like to hear in the SSG tell me so I can start from that.

The SSG you mentioned was the one I was talking about. The sounds fit it better, because it actually makes sense with it. The new SSG sprites don't work with it very well.

Well for starters, it doesn't like I'm opening/loading/closing the barrels of a gun. Sounds more like eject/takeout/load, just like the old SSG.

i just remembered someone made an SSG sound once: https://github.com/freedoom/freedoom/issues/250 have a look at it.

Glad to hear you successfully exported test1 to MIDI!

and here it comes:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/u9u0l41y6ltd7nu/freedoom.mid?dl=0

now that I hear it on plain midi I feel it sounds incredibly boring and empty. Perhaps I should think of adding something to it. Anyway, here's proof I actually have the midi.

(NOTE: at some point I think I hear a sustained note sometimes I play this, when the guitar riff begins. May be my midi engine, but check that out)

EDIT: hey, I'm playing phase 2 and I just noticed what you said about the SSG

1 hour ago, jupiter_ex said:

and here it comes:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/u9u0l41y6ltd7nu/freedoom.mid?dl=0

now that I hear it on plain midi I feel it sounds incredibly boring and empty. Perhaps I should think of adding something to it. Anyway, here's proof I actually have the midi.

 

(NOTE: at some point I think I hear a sustained note sometimes I play this, when the guitar riff begins. May be my midi engine, but check that out)

 

EDIT: hey, I'm playing phase 2 and I just noticed what you said about the SSG

That sounds GREAT! I like it

I played c1m5 along with that midi. Something about that midi really scares me in game, but I like it so far.

I'm listening to this at work and it really sounds flat and empty. Will have to do more arrangements

You could make a track for C1M6. Because the music in that level is just too quiet and its been around ever since 1.0 Or older.

16 minutes ago, MrD!zone said:

You could make a track for C1M6. Because the music in that level is just too quiet and its been around ever since 1.0 Or older.

I don't think that's needed right now. Most of the tracks being replaced were the ones that were being cut off in Chocolate Doom and tracks that were serving double duty. C1M5 and C2M6 both share the same track atm.

8 hours ago, jupiter_ex said:

I'm listening to this at work and it really sounds flat and empty. Will have to do more arrangements

In game, it sounds freaky with  Freedoom's genmidi. Lots of oomph, but sure, improve it if you think it needs it.

2 hours ago, Voros said:

In game, it sounds freaky with  Freedoom's genmidi. Lots of oomph, but sure, improve it if you think it needs it.

if you can, send a wad this way so I can hear what you're talking about

http://s000.tinyupload.com/index.php?file_id=77254704701219864857

(Use a port like Chocolate Doom, PrBoom Plus, anything with OPL emulation)

It atmospheric in game, but it can be better if it was a bit more lengthier and with a little more variation. 

Listening on both Fluidsynth and OPL2, I must say that the track is still very atmospheric, if you ask me. Do you reckon it's ready for inclusion?

I've been really not putting further work into this if I got to be honest (job, family, and general life stuff). Just checking the forums now and then for now :(

I'm still looking for a moment to sit down and continue this.

I don't know, if you like it, and are holding it back only because of what I said, feel free to include it. Anyway, we can always ship a more complete version in a future iteration. Idk

ok I listened to this under 'chocolate'. To the low-fi-sound pixel party of chocolate doom (my god I had even forgotten that I had forgotten how long ago I didn't play doom in those resolutions. I'm not a guy that would go for openGL 1024x768 and lighting effects, but still) this does sound good. And if that is what we're aiming for (full vanilla compatibility) then this is ok. I  might even begin thinking of trimming some extra layers of the other tunes, since they may not needed, and be too noticeable under OPL.

A volume boost might be needed. Specially around the end, but I think that is because some OPL instruments are arbitrarily at a lower volume. Yet, if I raise those, anyone playing it on more modern source ports would hear them too loud. Well, 1990s all over again :)

Yet, this post is only to state that I got to hear this under OPL. Like I said if you like it include it right now. It doesn't sound that flat after all. I will probably extend the song later when I find a moment

No rush. You obviously want to make it better.

Looking forward to whatever changes you make.

ok. So, summarizing upcoming work for me: C1M5 music, the SSG sound, and I also want to touch a little the "door up / door down" sound (it sounds too white-noise-y, not too mechanical, and it's the same than the platform up / down). And I think now that I've got hold of both shotgun sounds I'll do some more tests on the single-barreled one, cause I think it could use more punch.

That's all I can remember for now

here's a wad with a new set of SSG sounds https://www.dropbox.com/s/cj6nmprfa61ja93/JEXSGN.WAD?dl=0

I solved the issue in chocolate when you couldn't hear the sounds I put in wads. I had to "convert to doom format" within slade (it did work in zdoom)

I tried these with chocolate

EDIT: another one: https://www.dropbox.com/s/776ctlktpq7ruu9/JEXSGN2.WAD?dl=0

see which one you like better

I can't check out your WADs for 1-2 weeks, so hopefully, others will chime in and give you feedback.

Listening intently, I think the problem is that the sounds make it seem like its wooden rather than metal. It just doesnt sound right. 

The second one seems better, but not enough. And theres this strange "ring" sound in the opening sound.

Thats purely my opinion. 

hows freedoom1 going?

kinda froze everything related to this forum during your hiatus. Pity you didn't like any of the ssg sounds. I think the midi was the least likely for me to work on since unlike making sfx, making a tune takes "inspiration". Beyond some improvements I was going to make to what's already there, I really couldn't come up right now with something to extend the song longer (or add more variety, like you said). Any recommendations as to what could I put into the song to make it longer / more varied?

Relating to the ssg sfx, strange you found it wood-sounding, I actually, if anything, used plastic-related sounds to make it. And, in the opening part yes, there are strange ringing metallic sounds. Possibly not best finnished yet. The idea behind that was to put a really metallic sound on the barrel opening, like when you draw a big knife, or hit one of those old bell-operated telephones (sounds weird put like that I know, but basically the idea was for the ssg to go CLANG along with the standard barrel opening sound, when opening the barrel)

I believe the main problem is consistency between the firing sound and reloading sounds seems strange. But I can't really say if it's an improvement or not, unless others gave their opinions too.

I suppose the SSG sounds can be left alone for now, until more people give their thoughts.

BTW, it seems some sounds are still missing, as shown here: https://www.doomworld.com/forum/topic/93453-is-the-lack-of-dsbspwlk-intentional/

Placeholder sounds were made, but maybe you should have a look at creating some original sounds.