Chaingun tricks/strats

hi

I want to make some maps that prioritize chaingun usage (compared to shotgun, super shotgun, and rocket launcher)

I'm trying to brainstorm some notes to write down to refer to while im mapping. It would really help me if you guys could describe specific and even nuanced situations where the chaingun was preferred to other weapons.

Chaingun sniping and stunlocking are known. The goal is to create a map where in almost all gameplay circumstances, the chaingun is the preferable killing tool even when the other guns and respective ammunition are available. Here's what I have so far

-chaingun gobbles ammunition, so be overly generous with bullet boxes

-sniping off weak enemies over long distances is good.

-stunlocking a dangerous but high pain chance enemy in close proximity is good (pain elementals, mancubus, arachnatron, cacodemon or revenant)

-mowing down hordes of weak enemies is ok but often super shotgun or rocket launcher is better for that.

Thanks in advance :)

Shotgunners and chaingunners that aren't hugging each other and not giving shells like candy.

20 minutes ago, Pegg said:

Shotgunners and chaingunners that aren't hugging each other and not giving shells like candy.

And Willy Wonka an arch-vile that doesn't hang around behind them and reviving them for even more candy ammo.

chaingun is the best weapon through the near-entirety of doom1-esque content. it's easily the most reliable way to handle hitscanners peppered nonchalantly throughout relatively open spaces. Like, if I'm about to enter a new area or trigger a trap in a map that I know is hitscanner-centric, it'll almost certainly be the weapon I have out.

moderately popular changes include bolstering its ammo pool and rate of fire (see: Disturbia, Valiant, probably some others...) which makes it viable (sometimes, optimal) for anything short of full-on slaughter setups.

The chaingun is the best weapon against enemies that are sniping at you from behind a set of narrow bars or shooting through other objects that block projectiles. Having to fight enemies like Revenants, Arachnotrons, and Mancubi in an open area with blocking decorations like trees lets you maneuver into a position where you can block an enemy's projectiles but still shoot it with a hitscan weapon.

-Make rooms with lots of (possibly high-HP) enemies and lots of barrels distant-enough from each other but close-enough to the enemies, so that the chaingun's rapid fire would allow the player to detonate barrels at fast rate and thus hurt enemies at fast rate.

-Make the player shoot through very low-height windows, so that SSG would be impractical, because its vertical spread would prevent too many pellets from passing through.

I really like the chaingun for all the wrong reasons. I like it because, just like the shotgun, you can prolong encounters vs more annoying monsters such as viles and revs.

A while back I had made an experimental encounter with 1 chaingunner, some imps, viles that were released on timers, and finally a cyb to clean everything up at the end. There was no ammo anywhere except for the initial chaingun you get when you start the map. So you have to manipulate the viles to get ammo (farm chaingunner) in order to prevent getting trapped by imps/killing viles while also surviving long enough for the cyb to be released.

Chaingun is also good for sniping AVs for long range vile jumps.

When I think of gameplay with the weaker weapons this kind of stuff is generally my first thought.

47 minutes ago, Killer5 said:

Chaingun is also good for sniping AVs for long range vile jumps.

Like, to get a distant one's attention so you can jump then? 

50 minutes ago, Killer5 said:

I really like the chaingun for all the wrong reasons. I like it because, just like the shotgun, you can prolong encounters vs more annoying monsters such as viles and revs.

This is my exact thought, but from the opposite viewpoint; perhaps itd be more accurate to say this is where my brain zoomed in on: time. 

To OP: from my experience, fun in Doom can be roughly equated to pressure (or kills/frags) vs time; gotta keep that action up. The problem with the chaingun is that it is among Doom's weakest weapons in terms of raw dps, only above the fist, pistol, and regular shotty. The time it takes to kill any pressuring enemy aside from maybe revs is not good, meaning that you would need to either stick to low hp enemies or present players with encounters that incorporate damage from other sources while also still favoring a cg, like as a terrible example off the top of my head: mobs of imps from a couple angles with some higher hp and more pressuring enemies as turrets that slowly die to, say, fast crushers, or lots and lots of barrels, or an av that is the main target with other mobs as support that all get mopped up quickly after the main threat is dissipated. Something to still encourage that cg use while also having the pressure vs time ratio correct would be the goal, at least from my view. It can be done, but that's gonna be a tough nut to crack for an entire map(set).

@galileo31dos01

Yeah.

I like shooting at a few enemies at the same time to keep all of them from attacking.

6 hours ago, Ribbiks said:

chaingun is the best weapon through the near-entirety of doom1-esque content. it's easily the most reliable way to handle hitscanners peppered nonchalantly throughout relatively open spaces. Like, if I'm about to enter a new area or trigger a trap in a map that I know is hitscanner-centric, it'll almost certainly be the weapon I have out.

 

moderately popular changes include bolstering its ammo pool and rate of fire (see: Disturbia, Valiant, probably some others...) which makes it viable (sometimes, optimal) for anything short of full-on slaughter setups.

 

 

Definetly this. Chaingun is most fun when dealing with groups of hitscanners + imps scattered around and then blast them out with the chaingun.

Specifically I would use the chaingun on a Demon/Spectre for example if it's taken AoE damage from a barrel, and there are also multiple other targets around, like Memfis said earlier. If a level is barrel-heavy I find myself using the chaingun much more than usual.

A few others have mentioned that's it's good against low tier enemies mainly, but I want to emphasize the fact that whenever I see a distant enemy, the chaingun is my go-to. Easily the best range weapon in Doom. Taking down lines of far-away Imps perched up on a great wall and watching them fall off is extremely satisfying.

it's also a great alterative to the chain saw when cornered. You can stun lock and push out of crowds with it. Works best with pinkies.

The CG can be decent for picking off lost souls vs. the rocket launcher, especially in situations where there's lot's of tight decor that might catch your rocket (oops). And, as mentioned before, it's great for long distance, and practically required through bars.

I agree that the CG is awfully fun against the former humans, and also cacos and pain elementals, limited in number (to avoid the desire to switch to a more powerful weapon).

Finally, the CG can trigger far away switches (as can pistol/shotguns). Some tricky wall trigger scheme could be made to require the count and speed of the CG, as a convoluted way to require it (why you'd want to, I don't know: destroy all the computers to temporarily disable the forcefield long enough to jump through - heh.)

^ I find shootable switches which require the ssg's vertical spread to be highly entertaining, especially since their nature almost requires them to be placed in slightly more noticeable locations than switches at a more normal height.

On the note of stunlocking higher hp enemies with higher pain chances: arachs would make a good addition to a mapper's arsenal against cg-wielding players, alongside cacos et al.

Good tips. I always underuse the chaingun since i hesitate to use it against larger enemies even tough it's very useful againt them as you said. Just a bad habit i guess, i rely in the shotgun way too much. Similar thing happens to the plasma gun but much worse.

I generally like to have the chaingun out whenever I'm using a lift or getting myself into a claustrophobic situation. It allows me to react faster and stunlock on demand.

I got some good notes thanks to all your input!

-Monsters behind sector bars (as opposed to midtexture bars)

-Tiny shoot switches that require precision aiming

-Hitscan heavy ambushes, where the enemies are spread out

-Pitfalls that keep monsters at a distance (and a place to fall to their death for added effect)

-Stalling a crowd of pinkies before they box you in

-Distributing your shots evenly to stunlock two or three dangerous monsters at once

-Shooting barrels at the right time to deal maximum damage

On 11/11/2017 at 11:53 AM, 40oz said:

I got some good notes thanks to all your input!

Sounds like some fun maps are on their way!

Even though this thread exists, I still think the chaingun is way underrated.

I agree, when I finally realized that the first two shots are always perfectly accurate I learned to love the chaingun. This didn't happen until around 2002 or so; before that I would just hold the button down when an enemy was right in my face and that was the only time I used it.

Then years later, maybe 2013, my older brother was visiting and I was playing Doom, and he asked me why I just tapped the mouse button when using the chaingun instead of holding it down. He had been playing Doom for 20 years at that point and didn't know about that quirk of the chaingun.

Now I use the thing all the time, far more often than the plasma rifle. The single barrel is still my favorite weapon for most situations with low level enemies, it's still pretty damn accurate at medium range. Double barrel for tougher enemies. I don't really care for the rocket launcher due to the slow projectile, it seems like every time I use it the enemy does a zig instead of a zag right before it impacts. But for accurate fire, the chaingun is actually a really great weapon.

On 11/10/2017 at 11:03 AM, Ribbiks said:

chaingun is the best weapon through the near-entirety of doom1-esque content. it's easily the most reliable way to handle hitscanners peppered nonchalantly throughout relatively open spaces. Like, if I'm about to enter a new area or trigger a trap in a map that I know is hitscanner-centric, it'll almost certainly be the weapon I have out.

 

moderately popular changes include bolstering its ammo pool and rate of fire (see: Disturbia, Valiant, probably some others...) which makes it viable (sometimes, optimal) for anything short of full-on slaughter setups.

 

 

LOVED the chaingun in Valiant; made me feel like Jesse Ventura in Predator. Or Schwarzenegger in Terminator 2, if you prefer.

On 10/11/2017 at 11:33 PM, Fonze said:

^ I find shootable switches which require the ssg's vertical spread to be highly entertaining, especially since their nature almost requires them to be placed in slightly more noticeable locations than switches at a more normal height.

You gave me an excellent idea!

I'm sure the same puzzle can be achieved with a chaingun if you have a small hole in a wall with a larger chamber behind, you must shoot with a gun through it, and in this chamber there is a laterally displaced switch.

 +------------------------------------------------+
 |                            |SWITCH.|           |
 |                            +-------+           |
 |                                                |
 |                                                |
 |                                                |
 |                                                |
 |                        ^                       |
 |                        |                       |
 |                        |                       |
 |                        |                       |
 |                        |                       |
 +------------------+----------+------------------+
                    |     |    |
                    |     |    |
                    |     |    |
                    |     |    |
                    |     |    |
+-------------------+----------+-------------------+
                          |
                          |
                          +


+--------------------------------------------------+

EDIT: Have you ever thought of some switch which requires downward spread from the SSG? ._.

6 hours ago, Gustavo6046 said:

EDIT: Have you ever thought of some switch which requires downward spread from the SSG? ._.

It's a cool idea, but only if the player can figure out what needs to be done, and if the gun and ammo are guaranteed to be available at the right time. Otherwise it's an impassible trap requiring noclip, all the while with the player cussing your mapping skills...

Don't get me wrong - I don't want to discourage the idea. It must be done carefully, that's all. Also, it'd be nice if the map had some sort of obvious mechanic/gimmick that explain why you must do this extraordinary action to proceed. A standard-looking switch might not cut it. But a hole in some technology, with some electronics/sparks in it might be suggestive enough, and cool enough, to let the player know what must be done. Does that make sense?