The DWmegawad Club plays: Eternal Slumber Party

6 hours ago, Magnusblitz said:

I'm not understand what you're saying here? You can just close the door from the inside or let it close on its own, and shoot the two shootable switches without waking up the revenants

Didn't seem to work for me, so I opened it and closed while passing underneath like I did.

Speaking of that door, I the revenant inside open it once while I was taking swings at it, feltbadman...

By the way, you're not supposed to just wait until the cybies and revs have taken out one another, you're actually supposed to rocket the revs as quickly as possible, and then finish off the cybies yourself. I find it a bit questionable to complain about the gameplay when you yourself made the choice to just "sit it out" because you could. That doesn't seem particularly "fair" from my POV.

Granted, you can play the waiting game, but that doesn mean you should do that, let alone that it's intended to be played that way.

Get ready for my review dump!

MAP14 - “Split Wide Open”

The only word i can use to describe this map is "awkward". The visual look like a recipe for disaster, but for me, it works! The crazy geometry, detailing that looks like its on weed, is somehow in "harmony" here :P

The gameplay however, is truly the "awkwardness" im describing. Its slaughter just doesnt feel "refined", and the last fight was very easy and cheeseable.

But tbh, the only thing i care about after this map is what i have seen. Truly unique avant garde stuff right there.

Some screenies:

MAP16 - “Be Quiet”

TOD should make a whole episode with this stuff. I can enjoy TOD bfg spam maps and all, but this thing is just slick. From the puzzle, the music selection(yes i like it) to the simple but effective architecture and detailing. Sure, its short, but also sweet!

Yea, and also short review, sorry about that :P

Some screenies:

MAP17 - “Stares”

I like his previous 100lines map better. This one just feels too simple for its own good, with only a bunch of triangles, the only thing saving it is the texture choice, with the cool black blue red colors. The slaughter is also ridiculously easy, a couple of trial and error battles that can be conquered in minutes. All welp, at least it helps me catch up with the club. One thing interesting about the map, hmm, is those bumpy stares things i guess(this is also the source of the title?).

One screenie:

3 hours ago, Nine Inch Heels said:

By the way, you're not supposed to just wait until the cybies and revs have taken out one another, you're actually supposed to rocket the revs as quickly as possible, and then finish off the cybies yourself. I find it a bit questionable to complain about the gameplay when you yourself made the choice to just "sit it out" because you could. That doesn't seem particularly "fair" from my POV.

 

Granted, you can play the waiting game, but that doesn mean you should do that, let alone that it's intended to be played that way.

Well, it took me a little while to even realize you could lower the columns just by pushing them (I was looking around for another switch for quite awhile, especially since the left-hand switch moves a dummy trigger located right behind it which I could hear, making me think I had to run over to it or something) and by that point the cybers had already started taking out quite a few revs so it seemed to make sense. I was still being quiet!

If the intention is for the player to put themselves in harm's way and do a rocket flank with the cybers, then maybe the map should've been designed with a trigger to automatically lower the wall? It's not as if I actively went out of my way to run away and hide in a hole somewhere, or sat and door camped. You find it questionable and unfair to complain about me not playing the map as "intended", I find it equally questionable and unfair to claim that's the "intended" way to play and it's my fault for playing the map wrong, when there's nothing in the map that suggests that - the player is supposed to open up a fight early to make it more difficult on themselves?

23 minutes ago, Magnusblitz said:

Well, it took me a little while to even realize you could lower the columns just by pushing them (I was looking around for another switch for quite awhile, especially since the left-hand switch moves a dummy trigger located right behind it which I could hear, making me think I had to run over to it or something) and by that point the cybers had already started taking out quite a few revs so it seemed to make sense. I was still being quiet!

Haha, fair enough. Yeah the point about the pillars lowering is a thing though, I have to say. It's not obvious that you can just "use" them. But really you're meant to rocket the revs while these pillars block them from invading your personal space.

MAP17: Stares

I'm assuming this is another 100 Lines submission, given the architectural simplicity (even for ToD), relative shortness and the fact I have some inkling of familiarity with it. The start is by far the roughest part, running forward to grab the RL and then dealing with the AV without getting blasted in the back by revenant missiles. Helps if you don't go too far forward and release the imp horde. After that, it's pretty easy to hole up in one of the crevices on the side of the staircase, take out the imps, and then move onward to relative safety. After that it's basically 2-shotting cybers, getting cybers to infight AVs, and some other assorted sniper nests that aren't too much trouble. Had more trouble figuring out where to go actually (pushing on an unmarked black square wall for example). Some clever engine fuckery is used for the staircases to stay under the 100 lines limit, just... run up the stairs and don't try to backtrack lest you be stuck in a inescapable pit of HOM horrors.

On 2018/3/15 at 7:16 PM, Girl of Satan said:

I think there's a demo of that version on youtube somewhere?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AH2cYWO-soE

MAP18 - “64lemons MAP03”

Part of that 64 grid map thingy TOD made. This map is a short and unremarkable one, with enough slaughter gameplay that will satisfy slaughter fans, and length that will be forgiving to people who are not so familiar with it.There are only 2 rooms, and only one of them is worth looking at with the lighting :P 

The "64lemons" as a whole feels like a distilled version of TOD imo.

Darn, i dont have much to talk about these maps, maybe because they go by too fast.

Some screenies:

Stares doesn't play too bad, but similar to the following map it lacks some intricacies. What I do like however is how midtextures are being used here alongside obstacles to create small parts of this map's geometry. Can't say I am in love with this map, but for the restrictions it was made with in mind, it surely qualifies as worth its place in this WAD. Much like Catpho I felt like "forest of undesireables" was a more interesting map to play and move around in. I can't say which of the fights here really stood out for me, maybe that's why I don't have much to say this map. It's easy to wrap your head around the gameplay here, so it is certainly something I believe a lot of people should be able to approach quite well.

64Lemons has some nice aspects to it in terms of how the geometry here works with the revenants in the second room of the map, for example. That was possibly my favourite fight of this map as well.

Overall it plays well, but doesn't offer the sort of intricacies that made "be quiet" so amazing. Progression is straight forward, difficult enough to get lost for sure. It comes with some trademark 2-shotting, though in this case you wanna make sure not to move too far up the steps, because you may end up trying to bite more than you can chew at a time. The map in and of itself is solid, but compared to ToD's more outstanding work it feels a tad undercooked.

Visually there is some moody lighting to be found here. I also noticed the marble stairway has a somewhat unusual texture choice for its sidedefs, but it turns out that it works quite well, all things considered.

All in all these two maps are decent, but they get overshadowed by the quality of "Degrassi", "be quiet", or "dholes" for example.

glboom+ / uv / pistol starts / saves

map32 fda

the uv-max for this map is 52:55 - lol. apparently based on ToD's memories from Eternal Doom, i didnt play much of that before giving up so i only recognised the first map homage. i definitely recognised the odd/obscure progression though, and it doesnt help that im a klutz. for example in the RK room i completely didnt notice that i could ascend the HK pillars and jump onto the balcony - i was trying to race both platforms to somehow get to the RK >.<

the combat in this isnt too hard, but it is unfair. some of the revenant closets if you dont react fast enough are absolutely murderous for example.

map33 fda

MAP17: 64Lemons

First part of this map was easy enough but I got cooked by the segment opening up cybers one by one as I ran out of ammo, wasn't 2-shotting enough cybers earlier in the map I suppose. Even after cheating to give myself from more cells I couldn't figure out how to crack the AV hordes. Can't say it looked like there was anything too interesting after that to miss though.

just realised theres no need to do 31-33 in the middle of the month as this doesnt have secret exits as its a compilation wad. i am dumb.

Eternal Slumber Party: Map18 - "64lemons Map03"
Playtime: 86 mins (prb+ a mess of separate demos and complevels)

When I first got to the wall of a dozen archviles that lower and kill you, I thought this was called "64 Lemons" because there are 64 Archviles on this map.  It turns there are only 36 though.  I read above for what the actual title is from.  It looks like you the best method is to enter the second chamber with 600 cells, and 2-shot every cyberdemon with some spare change for the vile walls.  I don't have much more to add.

Eternal Slumber Party: Map19 - "Cassie Steele"
Playtime: 1 hr (prb+ mostly cl-1 uv-savescum)

HOly crap... it's happneed1!!!   The first ESP map without finding a BFG at all!!!  No BFG and swimming in cells.  Even Brookhaven Hospital had an early BFG, and even it didn't let you escape without spamming down a horde of hellknights at the end.  Cassie Steele is like a typical old-school dungeoncrawl map.  Lots of tight environments where you will have to deal with hitscan ambushes, or revenants in close quarters.  I saw only one cyberdemon.  It's also pretty hard when you don't know what you're doing, and it looks like there is deceptively little health from the beginning so I got worried, but you find more once you carve into the center a bit.  I wasn't sure if I was in the mood for this map at first, but eventually I kicked into the groove and liked it.  You might have to slow down a bit here too to enjoy it.

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2 hours ago, rehelekretep said:

just realised theres no need to do 31-33 in the middle of the month as this doesnt have secret exits as its a compilation wad. i am dumb.

I was saving my Map33 comments for March 31st, but i guess it doesn't matter.

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It looks like there are at least 3-4 long maps left on the horizon.  Real life stuff started getting in the way very recently, but I'm still gonna try to make it to the end.  I also gave up drinking until April 1st, so I'll make sure to celebrate when I get through the other side.

map16 fda

cool little puzzle map. i found it confusing for my tiny brain but got there in the end. nice to have a change from the endless bfg spam as well :) i cheesed the cybers by using the revs to infight as found shooting them with the rocket launcher a little bit annoying/difficult.

1 hour ago, rehelekretep said:

i cheesed the cybers by using the revs to infight

Nice! Don't you love it when a plan comes together!

16 minutes ago, tmorrow said:

Nice! Don't you love it when a plan comes together!

Indeed. I do. ;-)

Got around to accessing my old computer.  The "last modified" date for Degrassi on my copy is Nov. 15, 2011.

Map 19: The telefragging at the start I found memorable.  There's also some extra steps involved in a Max that one will not have another chance to do by taking the easy exit.  ToD shows capacity for making non-linear layouts.

mmm, not very talkative at the moment.  I'll get that Nostril Cavern writeup sometime but it's a long one.

18 onwards are cl 2, but that means no-saves. is there any danger using cl -1 for these maps? only thing i can think is enemies falling off stuff might be an issue (or a positive depending on where they are placed!)

"Cassie Steele"... Who is that? I had no idea until I googled her. Turns out she'd go well with my pillory:

Not sure where ToD would put her, but the map we are looking at here certainly qualifies as pleasant to look at, and it's good he put it in this megawad.

What's to say about the gameplay here? It is mostly small scale combat right off the bat. The telefragging early on sure helped with the pace at the start, and it's a cool way to open up a map to begin with. Can't say I have seen that done in a similar way so far. Once the telefragging is over, it's down to SSG-centric gameplay for basically extensive periods of time, to put it lightly. The map holds a secret BFG though, and it comes with a trademark ToD-2-shot fight against a cybie. I like how you can see the cybie teleport away, makes for a good clue to get people looking for that secret. Armour is scarce throughout the entire map, encounters with revenants or nobles can turn out lethal as a result. Catching a rocket for 80 damage can cripple an attempt easily when it happens in the wrong place, since hitscanners make a regular appearance around here.

Visually one of the strongest outings so far, nice and moody lighting coupled with good use of stock textures make this map quite appealing. Together with the MIDI it is almost soothing in its own way.

Quite fun to explore, punishes mistakes severely at times, lovely environment. Nice map. Where should I put ToD though...?

45 minutes ago, rehelekretep said:

18 onwards are cl 2, but that means no-saves. is there any danger using cl -1 for these maps? only thing i can think is enemies falling off stuff might be an issue (or a positive depending on where they are placed!)

I did cl2 for 20, but i was going through Map21 with cl-1 in prboom+, and stairbuilding broke hard (i double-checked in cl2 nomonsters quickly, and it worked fine there).  I'm stuck and might load to that point and idclip.  To answer your question, yes.

😓 not sure what to do in that case - i cant no-save these maps or ill still be posting FDAs in December

ps @NoisyVelvet ive just realised you have the most fitting avatar for this mapset :D

Map 16: UV maxed in 6:30-something  Demo included

  I beat a map without being a dirty cheater.  This was quite satisfying to puzzle out and once I worked out the solution, put in the effort to record.  I intended to use a super safe approach but then flub it and eat half a dozen rev missiles anyways.  In unrecorded practice attempts, the revenants finish off the cybers; here a cyber is still alive that I take out myself.  For a fast time, one would not wait for the cyber/revenant infight to finish but would need to attack the revanant horde at the same time.

Demo is PrBoom+ -complevel 9

esp16uv_cnr.zip

Eternal Slumber Party: Map20 - "Double Imp Act":
Playtime: 49 mins (prb+ cl2 uv-nosaves)

This was a treat.  Fun all around.  The title is a clever pun, but it hits harder the moment that you find out the map lives up to the name literally.  Also, there are cars, furniture, crates, etc.  But, they actually had functional purpose and you could jump around on half of them too.  Some of the ones that don't have any exploratory purpose were still interactible my favorite part of the map was...

The part I had the hardest time with was this one cyberdemon behind a blue door.  He just gave me a hard time for some reason; open the door, bam i'm dead without response time, etc.

Good map, just short enough to play saveless for me too.  If a map is under 5 minutes par time (in ESP.txt) I will at least try it saveless, at this point.

Eternal Slumber Party: Map21 - "The Room Below":
Playtime: ~1.5 hrs = 27 mins (prb+ cl-1 uv-savescum) + ~1 hr (prb+ cl-1 idclip cheat)
I had stairs break on me in cl-1... woops.  I finished after about another hour of gameplay by idcliping up into the open door above the broken (seemingly) stairs.

This was long and tough.  Lots of cramped spaces with barons, rockets and BFG.  I actually like this sort of gameplay, it's demanding on movement and positioning skills.  Lots of deaths from me though.  I thought the map was gonna wind down with the third, yellow key like the pacing of most maps, but it actually goes on for quite a while afterwards; it takes you further on the long journey of close-quarters cyber/barons encounters.

lol, does anyone notice the weird music that plays in 21?

Eternal Slumber Party: MAP22 - 64lemons MAP02 (from 64lemons.wad)
Playtime: 35 mins (prb+ cl2 uv-nosaves)

Woah, this is the closest I've ever come to beating a ToD map first try.  It wasn't even one of those 'fuck you!' starts where you just die before you figure out what's going on.  I even survived the popup archvile bukakke at the top of the stairs first try.  I've seen enough of those so far this sleepover, that I'm actually anticipating stuff like that.  I died to the second last cyberdemon though.  I choked on his sixth third rocket during my final BFG shot.  I forgot that you were supposed to dodge those, not open your mouth wide and eat them.  Damn, so close, and this will probably be the last time I will be that close.

As far as the map goes, it's pretty standard issue ToD.  Not one of his most creative pieces, but kinda generic and speedmappish.  It plays okay though, and is one I'd recommend saveless at my skill level.  For that reason I enjoyed it a lot - it hits the sweet spot, where it's not too long to the point of being a hopeless endeaver for me, but keeps you tense if you are playing saveless.

Eternal Slumber Party: MAP23 - Nina Dobrev (from ninadobrev.wad)
Playtime: 65 mins = 30 mins (prb+ cl2 uv-nosaves) + 35 (prb+ cl uv-savescum)

This didn't seem so bad at first... but then you realize that ammo matters a lot more on this map than usual.  It doesn't make it apparent at first, but if you use cells in an inefficient way, it will creep up on you out of nowhere and you'll get kinda stuck.  Infighting helped me a lot here.  I got nervous when I thought I had to go around the outside water area and kill all those cyberdemons, but it turns out they are optional.  It also turns out that the similar cyberdemons, the ones that spawn in when you hit those pillars at the end, are also ones that you don't have to kill.  I got nervous here until I saw the light at the end of the tunnel; I floundered around those cyberdemons for a bit until i noticed the exit open up, so I rushed to the exit frantically and left the level.

Hey, so it seems im kinda falling behind, and its all to blame on the handling of my schedule :P

Anyway, no review today either, i just post here to say that i will try to review levels 19+, and Dholes (got so far!!!), and map15 maybe. Will be replaying the others some time (except 32, that thing bores me tbqh)

Welp, at least i got the folks to play ESP >:)

We are now all espers.

That being said.... I did play Nina Dorbev before...

MAP23 - “Nina Dobrev”

This seems like a sorta comibnation of some of TOD's previous tendencies.... His visual style(odd stock texture combination, geometry, lighting,...), his gameplay choice (bfg, slaughter yada yada, but its smaller scale here)... all create a very "kuchitsu" TOD level (if such a thing exists). Im trying to say while its not a level thats easy, but it will be something relaxing for regular TOD fans (that strafe50 lol). A good level... not big on showing off, but gets the job done.

This level is almost vanilla compat btw, also its x rated on idgames, i wonder why (sarcasm, check the standalone and you'll see why).

Some screenies:

3 hours ago, Girl of Satan said:

We are now all espers.

Hello FF6 reference, how are you today?